The prodigal son?

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Mar 28, 2016
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#41
I demand you refute it before dismissing them. You ignore that when it was written in 312 with the earliest writing of it from 390. There was only a few Bibles since they were hand copied and thus were extremely expensive. This document defined what a Christian must believe and defined anything contrary to be heresy, so much for your assertion about heresys. There were many different issues outside of the creeds that were then agree to disagree.

Creedal statements like this along with some scriptures memorized were how the concepts of the Bible were spread among an illiterate people and literate ones who didn't have a Bible.

You ignore the historical background of that time. Memorized scripture and creedal statements were used to spread the gospel. Thus the Apostles Creed, both Nicene creeds, the Athenasian Creed along with selected memorized scripture is how the gospel message was spread. During that time people memorized much information of all sorts. Literacy and documents were in short supply. Elders then made sure all creeds and other doctrinal statements were Biblical.

Creeds can be helpful but never become a law that men can build their new faith on

Historical background based on which sect (the Greek word heresy) ?

The Cathilics who destroyred the meaning of heresy as they did with the word apostle by adding their own version ?

Remember during the reformation they called who ever did not beleive their creeds of the fathers, heretics and accused them of having private interpretation which in the end of the matter was in respect to their own private interpretation. Every man has a personal commentary (private interpretation) as to what they think the scriptures are teaching . Or like with Paul in Acts 24 they tried to prove all things written in the law and the prophecy was heresy (opinions of men ) in exchange for their law of the fathers (laws of men)

Acts 24:14But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Again heresy is the same word as sect or denomination... pertaining to a group of people who beleive a certain creed.

1 Corinthians 11 inform us their must be opinions of men as heresies seeing the kingdom of God is not of this world and therefore we seek the approval of God not seen

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

Opinions are not damnable unless they clearly deny the grace of God that bought them as those who do, do despite to His grace.

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#42
You use the term "always", but the parable mentions the prodigal son having returned home once and being received by The Father only one time. Had the prodigal son decided to leave home again after having earned some money by working at his father's house for a few years, and then returned again, would the father receive him with open arms once more? And if the situation had repeated itself oncce every few years, would the father keep receiving him back?
I would title the parable "The Waiting Father" as with a open door policy .

When the son to had come to his senses. He referred to the kind of servants that did not live on the grounds but came and left as independant from his parents but still honoring their word.

And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger! Luke 15:17

The other son never entered the door of fellowship.
 

Lucian_Hodoboc

Junior Member
Dec 28, 2017
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#43
I would title the parable "The Waiting Father" as with a open door policy .

When the son to had come to his senses. He referred to the kind of servants that did not live on the grounds but came and left as independant from his parents but still honoring their word.

And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger! Luke 15:17

The other son never entered the door of fellowship.
I don't understand your point. :confused:
 
Oct 31, 2015
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#44
I would like it if you saints would give a brief summary on this well known story.
Traditional teachings would have it captioned as the prodigal son or lavish son.....is there more to it??

Yes there is.

The Son became lost because he wandered away from the father, becoming unreconciled.


A close honest examination of these scriptures teaches us the truth.


Do the lost need salvation?



JPT
 

Seeker47

Active member
Aug 7, 2018
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#46
While this is not a direct summary, you may enjoy Henri Nouwen's little book The Return of The Prodigal Son. Nouwen uses a Rembrandt painting of the same name to go deeper into the story. Interestingly, he focuses much attention on the "Older Son" and what decision he made to his fathers urgings.
 

MattforJesus

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
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#47
I would like it if you saints would give a brief summary on this well known story.
Traditional teachings would have it captioned as the prodigal son or lavish son.....is there more to it??
I see it as the loving Father and His forgiving of sins if we go enjoy the world for a little bit that we can always repent and come back to the Father and be restored again.

As simple as that.

Luk 15:32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

1Jn 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
1Jn 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
1Jn 2:17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

1Jn 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1Jn 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#48
This father did not look for his son. Jesus said he would seek out the one that strayed.
hmm
But while he was still a long way off, his father saw him
(Luke 15:20)

how far away is "
a long way off" ?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#49
I was hoping that more saints would post there findings. It is traditionally taught with the focus on the son that left and came back.
But....there are two sons.....let's focus on the one that stayed.
This is like a Paul Harvey moment......the rest of the story😋
‘My son,’
the father said,
‘you are always with me, and everything I have is yours.'
(Luke 15:31)

why does he say, '
everything I have is yours' ?

the man had two sons, and the inheritance would have been split between them. one son demanded his inheritance early, took it and went away squandering it.
what was the situation with the other son? everything that remained would have been his inheritance - did he mean to take it early as well? it would have passed to him when the man died. is it possible this other son plotted to kill him, to seize the inheritance? he is outside, and angry, when this conversation takes place ((v.28)). he has his servant with him ((v.26)). what is his intention?
in type - because Christ is teaching in parable what is happening even as He speaks it - the other son is unbelieving Israel, who was in fact plotting to put Him, called "
Everlasting Father," to death.
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#50
The Son became lost because he wandered away from the father, becoming unreconciled.
The son left the father's home and traveled in a far country (Luke 15:13).

He spent all his money, joined a citizen of that country, and fed swine in the fields owned by the citizen (Luke 15:14-15).

He was starving (vs 17) and decided to go home to his father in abject humility (Luke 15:16-19). And note in vs 18, he thought to himself I will arise and go to my father, which suggests he was not lost (as you claim) and he knew his way back to his father.

He arose and came to his father (Luke 15:20).

It does not appear the son was lost and perhaps this is why there is no statement that anyone went searching for him. However, we do know the father was waiting for his son to return and the father was watchful because vs 20 says the father saw the son when he was yet a great way off and the father ran to him.




justpassinthrough said:
A close honest examination of these scriptures teaches us the truth.
Yes and let our examination of these scriptures be "honest" and not filled with preconceived doctrine not intended by God.
 

Jewel5712

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2018
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#51
Do the lost need salvation?



Can you please define “lost” according to Luke 15:4-32



JPT
Did i MISS something? What does your question bout lost n salvation have to do with potterz statement?
 
Oct 31, 2015
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#52
It does not appear the son was lost

It was right that we should make merry and be glad, for your brother was dead and is alive again, and was lost and is found.’ ” Luke 15:32


Those who wander from God become lost.


Lost = Sinner in need of repentance. Spiritually dead. Unjust.


Found = Reconciled to God. Spiritually alive. Justified.


Those who are lost must repent of face eternal death.


The lost need repentance.

The lost need to be reconciled to God.

The lost need justification.

The lost need salvation.



Very simple.



JPT
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#53
Lost = Sinner in need of repentance. Spiritually dead. Unjust.
In our day and time (after Day of Pentecost), the born again believer is no longer "spiritually dead".

When the born again believer strays (sins), he/she knows the way back to Father ... just as the son in the parable in Luke 15:11-32 knew his way back to his father.

The born again believer is not "spiritually dead" when he/she sins. When the believer sins, he/she is not living in light of who he/she is in Christ, but the born again believer is no longer "spiritually dead".

Do you know what it means to be "born again"?


 
Oct 31, 2015
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#54
In our day and time (after Day of Pentecost), the born again believer is no longer "spiritually dead".

Sinners do not have eternal life in them.


Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins. James 5:19-20


he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death​



JPT
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#55
Sinners do not have eternal life in them.
Born again believers are established in Christ, anointed, and sealed:

2 Corinthians 1:

21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God;

22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.



Please note that it is God who establishes, anoints, and seals.


If/when the born again one sins, he/she is to turn to God and confess. God is faithful and just to forgive (1 John 1:9).

When the born again one sins, it does not mean that he/she is no longer born again. The born again believer does not have to be born again over and over and over each time he/she sins.

It appears to me that is what you are saying ... that each time the born again believer sins, he/she is no longer born again and he/she must be born again over and over and over. That simply is not true.

 
Oct 31, 2015
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#56
It appears to me that is what you are saying ... that each time the born again believer sins, he/she is no longer born again and he/she must be born again over and over and over. That simply is not true.

Since I never said any such nonsense then you are making up a scenario that I never said, and applying what I didn’t say to this discussion.


I stated what the scripture says.


Sheep who wander away from Christ and become lost, are sinners in need of repentance.


The 100 sheep belong to the shepherd, as they are His sheep: Born again - Children of God.


  • What man of you, having a hundred sheep


4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. 6 And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and neighbors, saying to them, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’ 7 I say to you that likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance.
Luke 15:4-7


However, we see from this teaching of Jesus, that His sheep can indeed become lost.


  • ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’

  • likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance.


The 99 are said to be "just"; Declared by God as right with Him - Righteous


The one who becomes lost, is described by Jesus as a sinner [unjust; not reconciled to God - unrighteous] in need of repentance.


These are the words of Jesus.


Now comes the question to you -


Based on the actual words Jesus uses, is a sheep [born again Christian] who wanders away and becomes lost, a sinner or saint, saved or unsaved, just or unjust?


JPT
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#57
The 100 sheep belong to the shepherd, as they are His sheep: Born again - Children of God.

...

Based on the actual words Jesus uses, is a sheep [born again Christian] who wanders away and becomes lost, a sinner or saint, saved or unsaved, just or unjust?
At the time Jesus spoke this parable to the pharisees and scribes who murmured at Him because He received publicans and sinners and ate with them, there were no "Born again - Children of God".

The parables in Luke 15 were spoken to those who were children of Israel before Day of Pentecost when the outpouring of Holy Spirit was first given.

You are misapplying that which was written for our learning.


Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.


We are to read what was written to Israel and learn from it so that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope, but to claim that it is written to us is not proper interpretation of Scripture.





 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#58
At the time Jesus spoke this parable to the pharisees and scribes who murmured at Him because He received publicans and sinners and ate with them, there were no "Born again - Children of God".
But those who believed on Christ were certainly saved by grace and deemed to be righteous (saints). And this parable is certainly not limited to Israel, but has a universal application.
 
Mar 23, 2016
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#59
But those who believed on Christ were certainly saved by grace and deemed to be righteous (saints).
Yes ... All who are saved are saved by grace through faith. That includes believers before Day of Pentecost as well as believers after Day of Pentecost.

When I read posts submitted by justpassinthrough, I have a hard time determining whether he believes there is a difference between the born again believer who sins and the unbelieving natural man who sins. I don't know if he knows what it is to be a born again child of God, established in Christ, anointed, and sealed by God, having the pledge/guarantee of the Holy Spirit (Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts - 2 Cor 1:21-22).




Nehemiah6 said:
And this parable is certainly not limited to Israel, but has a universal application.
Yes. That is why I indicated that what was written aforetime (before Day of Pentecost) was written for our learning that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope - Rom 15:4)


.
 
Oct 31, 2015
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#60
At the time Jesus spoke this parable to the pharisees and scribes who murmured at Him because He received publicans and sinners and ate with them, there were no "Born again - Children of God".

Do you have scripture to prove this?



JPT