the Sabbath

[glf]

Yet Paul separates them

1 Cor 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

Because God did.

What number do you see here?


Exo 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Deut 4:13 So He (God) declared to you His covenant which He (God) commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He (God) wrote them on two tablets of stone.

There is a law that defines sin and a law that was added because of sin- so no not all the laws are the same. God's law didn't start in Mt Sinai, it was a sin to commit murder with Cain. Without law there is no sin Rom 4:15 so obviously God's law started before sin because it defines what sin is. Sadly many get the different laws confused but they are not the same. The Ten Commandments is part of the law of Moses, its part of everyone's law because God is King and A King has laws, God didn't leave it up to man to write His holy and righteous law, that is perfect converting the soul, He wrote them and called them God's commandments, not the law of Moses. Moses is not God. Just like Paul is not above God t countermand anything God commands.

To bad that there's no scripture regarding two seperate Old Testament laws in place. And Heb 10: 1-4 referring to all of the OT law tells us:
For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
This is referring to all of the law and the prophets, not just the ten commandments which is the corner stone of what followed.
Whereas the New Testament lets us know that once we have faith in Jesus as our Savior, we are no longer under the law. I challenge you to show us how the ten commandments are exempt from being our schoolmaster...
But regarding the New Testament, we're told in Heb 9: 14-15:
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
The law, including any part of the law, is unable to purge our consciences from dead works; whereas the New Testament made alive in us by faith in Jesus' sacrifice, makes us inherently able to serve the Lord in Spirit and in truth since we've thereby obtained justification, redemption, and a clear conscience. When a priesthood has been changed, there is of nescesity a change in the law. So in Christ we no longer use the standard of an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, and a life for a life; but rather turn our cheeks seventy times seven. No longer are we only not to commit adultry, but rather we're not to look on another with lust or we've committed adultry in our hearts. No longer are we not to murder; but if we hate another, we've committed murder in our hearts. The standard for following the Holy Spirit transcends the standard contained in the law much as the Spirit of the law transcends the letter of the law. Our standard becomes "whatsoever is not of faith, is sin," and our consciences becomes a tool used by the Holy Spirit to bring us to righteousness.
Regarding the saboath itself, Jesus said that: "the sabaoth was made for man and not man for the sabaoth." By the Holy Spirit who indwells us, a greater than the sabaoth is here. We've become living temples of the Lord, holy as he is holy by the Holy Spirit who is now within us. One might say that, in Christ, every day is a sabaoth unto the Lord, and a good day to do good by serving those whom the Lord loves, by following the Holy Spirit's leading, and to worship the Lord in Spirit and in truth.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

To bad that there's no scripture regarding two seperate Old Testament laws in place. And Heb 10: 1-4 referring to all of the OT law tells us:
For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
This is referring to all of the law and the prophets, not just the ten commandments which is the corner stone of what followed.
Whereas the New Testament lets us know that once we have faith in Jesus as our Savior, we are no longer under the law. I challenge you to show us how the ten commandments are exempt from being our schoolmaster...
But regarding the New Testament, we're told in Heb 9: 14-15:
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
The law, including any part of the law, is unable to purge our consciences from dead works; whereas the New Testament made alive in us by faith in Jesus' sacrifice, makes us inherently able to serve the Lord in Spirit and in truth since we've thereby obtained justification, redemption, and a clear conscience. When a priesthood has been changed, there is of nescesity a change in the law. So in Christ we no longer use the standard of an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, and a life for a life; but rather turn our cheeks seventy times seven. No longer are we only not to commit adultry, but rather we're not to look on another with lust or we've committed adultry in our hearts. No longer are we not to murder; but if we hate another, we've committed murder in our hearts. The standard for following the Holy Spirit transcends the standard contained in the law much as the Spirit of the law transcends the letter of the law. Our standard becomes "whatsoever is not of faith, is sin," and our consciences becomes a tool used by the Holy Spirit to bring us to righteousness.
Regarding the saboath itself, Jesus said that: "the sabaoth was made for man and not man for the sabaoth." By the Holy Spirit who indwells us, a greater than the sabaoth is here. We've become living temples of the Lord, holy as he is holy by the Holy Spirit who is now within us. One might say that, in Christ, every day is a sabaoth unto the Lord, and a good day to do good by serving those whom the Lord loves, by following the Holy Spirit's leading, and to worship the Lord in Spirit and in truth.

Can you point to where in the Ten Commandments is the sacrificial system? There is the law that defines sin Rom 7:7 Mat 5:19-30 1 John 3:4 James 2:10-12 and the law that was added because of sin Gal 3:19 Deut 31:24-26 Heb 10:1-22 so obviously not all laws are the same.

The Holy Spirit is given to help us keep God’s commandments, not break them John 14:15-18

 

[glf]

Can you point to where in the Ten Commandments is the sacrificial system? There is the law that defines sin Rom 7:7 Mat 5:19-30 1 John 3:4 James 2:10-12 and the law that was added because of sin Gal 3:19 Deut 31:24-26 Heb 10:1-22 so obviously not all laws are the same.

The Holy Spirit is given to help us keep God’s commandments, not break them John 14:15-18

If I'm striving to follow the Holy Spirit's leading, such as not to look on another with lust, how is that commiting adultry?
If I strive to turn the other cheek, how is that an eye for an eye? If I strive to love others, how is that committing murder?
I live by a completely different standard that transcends the standard which is contained in the OT law.
Rom 8:2:
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
The letter of the law kills because the law is weak through the flesh. The law of Spirit of life imparts life because of the Holy Spirit's indwelling presence.
Jesus was obedient to the law of the Spirit of life, which also allowed him to keep the Old Testament's lesser standard!

 

[SabbathBlessing]

If I'm striving to follow the Holy Spirit's leading, such as not to look on another with lust, how is that commiting adultry?
If I strive to turn the other cheek, how is that an eye for an eye? If I strive to love others, how is that committing murder?
I live by a completely different standard that transcends the standard which is contained in the OT law.
Rom 8:2:
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
The letter of the law kills because the law is weak through the flesh. The law of Spirit of life imparts life because of the Holy Spirit's indwelling presence.
Jesus was obedient to the law of the Spirit of life, which also allowed him to keep the Old Testament's lesser standard!

The spirit of the law is greater than the letter not lessor. The Ten Commandments is so we can see our sin 1 John 3:4 Rom 7:7 James 2:10-12 and so we are not depending on our righteous standard of living but on God’s Psa 119:172 Isa 56:1-6 which is everlasting Psa 119:142 so if we are breaking the least of the these commandments we are not living in the Spirit but living in the flesh

Rom 8: 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

The Ten Commandments were never suggestions, nor were they multiple choice But should be kept faithfully by loyalty and love. John 14:15 Rom 3:31 Rev 14:12

 

[vassal]

Yet Paul separates them

1 Cor 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

Because God did.

What number do you see here?


Exo 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Deut 4:13 So He (God) declared to you His covenant which He (God) commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He (God) wrote them on two tablets of stone.

There is a law that defines sin and a law that was added because of sin- so no not all the laws are the same. God's law didn't start in Mt Sinai, it was a sin to commit murder with Cain. Without law there is no sin Rom 4:15 so obviously God's law started before sin because it defines what sin is. Sadly many get the different laws confused but they are not the same. The Ten Commandments is part of the law of Moses, its part of everyone's law because God is King and A King has laws, God didn't leave it up to man to write His holy and righteous law, that is perfect converting the soul, He wrote them and called them God's commandments, not the law of Moses. Moses is not God. Just like Paul is not above God t countermand anything God commands.

 

[vassal]

Paul taught to NOT keep the commandments of the first cov which does not contradict any teaching of Jesus because Jesus taught during the first cov while Paul taught during the second cov.

What are the differences in the old and new covenant according to the old testament? they are clearly defined.

 

[ewq1938]

What are the differences in the old and new covenant according to the old testament?

So, ignore what the NT has to say about it? No.

Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
Heb 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
Heb 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

The first covenant had so many faults, it needed to be replaced by a better covenant upon better promises.

 

[ewq1938]

Can you point to where in the Ten Commandments is the sacrificial system?

That is called the Argument from Silence fallacy.

You know the sacrificial system comes from elsewhere in God's law so this is an invalid question.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

So, ignore what the NT has to say about it? No.

Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
Heb 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
Heb 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

The first covenant had so many faults, it needed to be replaced by a better covenant upon better promises.

First you might take note what the Covenant is established on- Better Promises.

You seem to be making the argument it is established on new laws but its not scripture says

The New Covenant has God's law now written in the heart, so instead on focusing on new laws, we should be focusing on the better promises.

If we don't cut off the context, it tells us where the fault was....

Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord.

So God instead of disregarding His people, because He loves us so much established a new covenant based on better promises.

The old covenant was based on the people doing

Exo 19:8 Then all the people answered together and said, “All that the Lord has spoken we will do.” So Moses brought back the words of the people to the Lord.

Who is the one doing in God's New Covenant

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

In the New Covenant God is the one doing- which is why it is established on much better promises, not on new laws. God still has His law in the New Covenant but based on His strength John 14:15-18 if we don't rebel Rom 8:7-8

Thats why its still a sin to break any of the Ten Commandments in the New Covenant 1 John 3:4 Rom 7:7 breaking one we break them all James 2:10-12 and why Jesus taught not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19-30 because God's people keep God's commandments, His version through love and faith Exo 20:6 John 14:15 1 John 5:3 Rev 14:12 which reconciles us Rev 22:14

 

[SabbathBlessing]

That is called the Argument from Silence fallacy.

You know the sacrificial system comes from elsewhere in God's law so this is an invalid question.

There is no argument from silence, its not there....see for yourself.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus 20&version=NKJV

Please point out the animal sacrifice and feast day laws in the Ten Commandments

The Ten Commandments
20 And God spoke all these words, saying:

2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of [a]bondage.
3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor [b]serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting[c] the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”


Exo 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Deut 4:13 So He (God) declared to you His covenant which He (God) commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He (God) wrote them on two tablets of stone.

After God wrote and God spoke the Ten Commandments , He added no more

Deut 5: 22 “These words the Lord spoke to all your assembly, in the mountain from the midst of the fire, the cloud, and the thick darkness, with a loud voice; and He added no more. And He wrote them on two tablets of stone and gave them to me.

 

[ewq1938]

There is no argument from silence, its not there.

LOL. Not being there is why it is an argument from silence.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

LOL. Not being there is why it is an argument from silence.

You are the one making the argument from silence. As proven there is nothing in the Ten Commandments that has to do with the animal sacrifices or food or drink. If its not there it means its not true.

 

[Sipsey]

Yet Paul separates them

1 Cor 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

Because God did.

What number do you see here?


Exo 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Deut 4:13 So He (God) declared to you His covenant which He (God) commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He (God) wrote them on two tablets of stone.

There is a law that defines sin and a law that was added because of sin- so no not all the laws are the same. God's law didn't start in Mt Sinai, it was a sin to commit murder with Cain. Without law there is no sin Rom 4:15 so obviously God's law started before sin because it defines what sin is. Sadly many get the different laws confused but they are not the same. The Ten Commandments is part of the law of Moses, its part of everyone's law because God is King and A King has laws, God didn't leave it up to man to write His holy and righteous law, that is perfect converting the soul, He wrote them and called them God's commandments, not the law of Moses. Moses is not God. Just like Paul is not above God t countermand anything God commands.

I call them “God’s Standard.” His standard is perfection, He can accept nothing less. It convicts us of sin, but also has a threshold so high, we need a Savior in order to meet this standard.

 

[Magenta]

I call them “God’s Standard.” His standard is perfection, He can accept nothing less. It convicts
us of sin, but also has a threshold so high, we need a Savior in order to meet this standard.

It is telling that they deny this.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

I call them “God’s Standard.” His standard is perfection, He can accept nothing less. It convicts us of sin, but also has a threshold so high, we need a Savior in order to meet this standard.

True, thats why He gives us the Spirit of Truth so we can keep them John 14:15-18 what the better promise is in the New Covenant- He is the one doing based on His strength, we just need to cooperate with Him.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

It is telling that they deny this.

Since you disagreed with my post do you care to show me where the sacrificial system is in the Ten Commandments. That’s what we were discussing.

The Ten Commandments
20 And God spoke all these words, saying:

2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of [a]bondage.
3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that isin the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor [b]serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting[c] the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

I don’t see anything about animal sacrifices, or food and drink offerings. Can you point out the verse for them in this unit of Ten that was written by the finger of God. Exo 31:18 could our perfect God write an imperfect law? I don’t believe so.

 

[Magenta]

Since you disagreed with my post do you care to show me where the sacrificial
system is in the Ten Commandments. That’s what we were discussing.

Other issues had entered into the convo. Such as our need of Jesus Christ...

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Other issues had entered into the convo. Such as our need of Jesus Christ...

That wasn't what was being discussed - of course we need Jesus Christ, we are nothing without Him and all things are possible through Him Phil 4:13 even obedience to Him John 14:15-18

 

[Sipsey]

True, thats why He gives us the Spirit of Truth so we can keep them John 14:15-18 what the better promise is in the New Covenant- He is the one doing based on His strength, we just need to cooperate with Him.

That wasn't what was being discussed - of course we need Jesus Christ, we are nothing without Him and all things are possible through Him Phil 4:13 even obedience to Him John 14:15-18

Paul doesn’t dismiss the moral essence of the Decalogue. In several places, like Romans 13:8-10, Paul reiterates commandments like not committing adultery, murder, stealing, or coveting, but he connects them to the broader principle of love. He says that love fulfills the Law because it encompasses all these commandments.

Paul views the Decalogue as part of the broader Law that reveals sin but cannot justify anyone. He emphasizes that righteousness comes through faith in Christ, who fulfills the Law’s requirements. Paul upholds the moral teachings of the Decalogue but sees them as expressions of a Spirit-led life rather than a legalistic obligation.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Paul doesn’t dismiss the moral essence of the Decalogue. In several places, like Romans 13:8-10, Paul reiterates commandments like not committing adultery, murder, stealing, or coveting, but he connects them to the broader principle of love. He says that love fulfills the Law because it encompasses all these commandments.

Paul views the Decalogue as part of the broader Law that reveals sin but cannot justify anyone. He emphasizes that righteousness comes through faith in Christ, who fulfills the Law’s requirements. Paul upholds the moral teachings of the Decalogue but sees them as expressions of a Spirit-led life rather than a legalistic obligation.

Agree, although we might have a different definition on a few things. What you are stating has never been an argument I have made. What the argument we are discussing is people claiming God's Ten Commandments is not part of the law written in the heart and we no longer need to keep them, including the Sabbath, but that's not something taught through scripture. Of course love fulfills the law when keeping the commandments. When we love God we would only worship Him, we would not bow to idols, we would not use His name in an unholy manner, nor would we break His holy Sabbath day. If we love our fellow man we would not steal from them, or murder, or covet and Jesus taught on the Ten Commandments what the law is really about a heart change, He relates our feelings to how they affect God's law and if He changes us from the inside out, feelings of anger would turn to love and compassion and thou shalt not murder wouldn't even be a consideration. This is what it means to walk by the spirit of the law which is greater than the letter. If one is breaking the letter,, they are not keeping the spirit of the law.