The word of God is not a secret code that needs unlocked.

[Pilgrimshope]

It works for those who like the freedom to have their subjective analysis appear to be correct.... (since the archaic language leaves much to the imagination)

Enjoy your own little tax free kingdom....
As the Word of God stops for no one, and passes you by.

Lol what ?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Correct. Only some portions of the OT may be regarded as poetic. The Psalms and the Song of Solomon. Possibly some portions of Job.

Right no one ever claimed the whole Bible is a poem ….I had mentioned to someone else the op actually , that I like the poetic nature of the old English the rest is gaslighting and creating a straw man issue to argue about

 

[JohnDB]

Right no one ever claimed the whole Bible is a poem ….I had mentioned to someone else the op actually , that I like the poetic nature of the old English the rest is gaslighting and creating a straw man issue to argue about

EVERYTHING God and Jesus is quoted as saying (with very few notable exceptions) is poetry and said in a poetic fashion.

It's not an argument....it's just what it is.

But you have to speak Hebrew to get the poetry. All of the modern forms of poetry were first found in scriptures....including Shakespeare's sonnets, French poetry, Spanish poetry, and Middle Eastern poetry.

All are recorded in Scriptures....thousands of years before they were "recreated" today.

 

[JohnDB]

Possibly, because of the practice of oral tradition of passing on a message without anything written in front of them...
Got to keep in mind that teaching the Scriptures was to have some entertainment value, considering they had no radio or TV back then.
At times, the Torah would also use a play on words in the Hebrew that becomes totally lost in the words we see in translation.

I remember my pastor telling us how he laughed his head off when exegeting a passage that he could not find a way to convey it to us other than tell us technically what was written.... how "humor" was at times injected into the passage that we do not get to see.

grace and peace ............

Well yes,
In those days ONLY Levites were allowed to "handle" scriptures. In order to be Barmitzvah-ed you were to recite the entire 5 books of Moses without flaws. Being poetry was obviously helpful.

But basically you could write your own copy of scriptures but not give them anyone else. You also were not allowed to recite the scriptures to anyone else either....especially a Gentile. The poetic nature helped with the poetry being an earworm.

 

[Nehemiah6]

2/3 minimum of the Old Testament is Hebrew poetry. The Torah, Samuel (both) Kings, and all prophecy is poetic.

No it is not. That may be a common misconception, but it is not the truth. Read those portions you listed once again. Read the Gospels. Nothing poetic there. Just a plain narrative. So let's stop promoting such ideas.

 

[Genez]

Hebrew literature is poetic by its nature job for instance ….is a poem, the psalms are songs and poems ….All I said lol was I like the poetic language of the kjv

And that most of the available translations of the bible are going to impart the same message of faith in Christ

abut since you mentioned it job is a poem some of the psalms are as well as hymns

King James is not poetic....

Its "flowery" like poetry sounds, yet even when it was never intended to sound flowery.
It places the reader into an alter reality, not reality.

 

[Genez]

2/3 minimum of the Old Testament is Hebrew poetry. The Torah, Samuel (both) Kings, and all prophecy is poetic.

Where did you get that from?

 

[Genez]

Well yes,
In those days ONLY Levites were allowed to "handle" scriptures. In order to be Barmitzvah-ed you were to recite the entire 5 books of Moses without flaws. Being poetry was obviously helpful.

But basically you could write your own copy of scriptures but not give them anyone else. You also were not allowed to recite the scriptures to anyone else either....especially a Gentile. The poetic nature helped with the poetry being an earworm.

At my Bar Mitzvah I read from what is called a "Haftarah.."
Far from the entire 5 books of the Moses.

That could mean Saturday morning service would have lasted all day if there were several Bar Mitzvah candidates for that day.

He was to recite "all the five books?" Sounds like uninformed Gentile folk lore to me.
The bar mitzvah ceremony is much shorter than what that could not allow for.

I was bar mitzvah'd. Never seen what you described, unless it takes place with Hassidic Jews.

 

[JohnDB]

No it is not. That may be a common misconception, but it is not the truth. Read those portions you listed once again. Read the Gospels. Nothing poetic there. Just a plain narrative. So let's stop promoting such ideas.

Ummmmm
You really need to step outside that echo chamber you are living in.

Get an expositional commentary that discusses the Hebrew language and grammar.

 

[Genez]

 

[JohnDB]

At my Bar Mitzvah I read from what is called a "Haftarah.."
Far from the entire 5 books of the Moses.

That could mean Saturday morning service would have lasted all day if there were several Bar Mitzvah candidates for that day.

He was to recite "all the five books?" Sounds like uninformed Gentile folk lore to me.
The bar mitzvah ceremony is much shorter than what that could not allow for.

I was bar mitzvah'd. Never seen what you described, unless it takes place with Hassidic Jews.

Not currently....i was talking about times back before 60AD. (It wasn't just a simple ceremony) That was what happened in order to graduate Bethgashepher....before bethmidrash.

Hasn't happened for 2000 years. Today it's like you said.

 

[Genez]

Ummmmm
You really need to step outside that echo chamber you are living in.

Get an expositional commentary that discusses the Hebrew language and grammar.

God always knew how it would be communicated in our day.
Its for our consumption as we are now being today.

Imagine asking someone for directions and they gave it in the context of ancient thinking?

 

[Genez]

Not currently....i was talking about times back before 60AD. (It wasn't just a simple ceremony) That was what happened in order to graduate Bethgashepher....before bethmidrash.

Hasn't happened for 2000 years. Today it's like you said.

You sure it was not for a young man who was to be a candidate for rabbinical school?

It hardly seems that Peter would have been bar mitzvahed that way.

 

[JohnDB]

Where did you get that from?

It's an edumacated guess from my studies. Every time I turn around I'm chest deep in more Hebrew poetry. (I do a lot of OT studies)


And in response to your latest reply....

In order to understand scriptures we must take an originalist point of view. The writer had a specific known audience he wrote to for them to understand the meanings he was conveying. Where we don't personally know the author or the audience we can know some things about culture, history, geography, anthropology and Topography. So we try to understand as a person that would be in receipt of the letter in the time period it was written.

 

[JohnDB]

You sure it was not for a young man who was to be a candidate for rabbinical school?

It hardly seems that Peter would have been bar mitzvahed that way.

Peter, like all the Apostles except for Paul and Matthew/Levi dropped out due to economic concerns. They were competent in reading and writing but they weren't scholars by a long shot. It was only the best of the best that went on to bethmidrash.

 

[daisyseesthesun]

The bible is the most complete puzzle that's ever been made.

 

[Genez]

In order to understand scriptures we must take an originalist point of view. The writer had a specific known audience he wrote to for them to understand the meanings he was conveying. Where we don't personally know the author or the audience we can know some things about culture, history, geography, anthropology and Topography. So we try to understand as a person that would be in receipt of the letter in the time period it was written.

That is called "Isagogics."

This pastor studied eight hours a day, taught 6 days a week, and always staying with that discipline having become his second nature.
R. B. Thieme, Jr., Bible Ministries

I have been trying to let others know about him. It seems, if the Spirit is not guiding them to do so? They will not want.

 

[GaryA]

It places the reader into an alter reality, not reality.

The KJV bible is not some kind of modern mind control agent - it has been the most recognized and accepted English translation of the Word of God for the past four centuries. And, if you want the best-and-most true-to-life ("reality") bible translation there is in existence (in the English language) - then the KJV is the one to have! You cannot "do better" than the KJV where proper translation of bible truth is concerned - with the only possible exceptions being a few of the bibles that preceded it.

 

[Genez]

The KJV bible is not some kind of modern mind control agent - it has been the most recognized and accepted English translation of the Word of God for the past four centuries. And, if you want the best-and-most true-to-life ("reality") bible translation there is in existence (in the English language) - then the KJV is the one to have! You cannot "do better" than the KJV where proper translation of bible truth is concerned - with the only possible exceptions being a few of the bibles that preceded it.

How well do you understand it? That's the problem.


I said nothing about mind control.
You do not even understand what I said....

You speak like a propagandist...
And, one who wishes to make me see the KJV as you want it to be seen, not as it really is.

.....

 

[Genez]

It only makes sense...

Satan is going to promote a translation that will not have us to understand properly what the Hebrew and Greek
contains and intends to express, yet at the same time makes the reader feel convinced that he has all that is needed.

Ancient men used to bow down to idols and be moved by the religious feelings that such an act will cause them to experience.
Same applies to how reading a certain translation can cause such a feeling in those so inclined...

grace and peace .................