Visualization in Prayer

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Mar 17, 2021
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The Bible never says to pray wearing trousers or polyester. Is it forbidden to do so?

I already gave an example, that the Bible commands rejoicing, which involves the emotions. Regarding visualization,
Matthew 23:37 says,

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Another twisting of Scripture to prove a weak point. Twisting Jesus' words could be seen as blaspheming Him. As we can see through Jesus' experience with Satan in the wilderness, how Satan quotes Scripture out of context.
 
Mar 17, 2021
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Trying the spirits is not the same as saying there shall be no spiritual manifestations to try.



Your line of reasoning was childish, and I was responding to that. A balanced interpretation of scripture recognizes that God can warn men through dreams, that in the last days the Spirit is poured out upon all flesh, which results in prophecy, dreams, and visions, and that the Spirit gifts members of the body of Christ with prophecy and other manifestations of the Spirit as He wills.
The Scripture says that the AntiChrist will arise and deceive through false signs and wonders, so how are we going to distinguish the true from the false?
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
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What you are describing is Hindu mind power which is the basis of New Age mysticism.
And what she/he is describing has absolutely no place on a Christian site. This kind of post needs to be gone, disappear, eliminated.
 
B

Blackpowderduelist

Guest
What you are describing is Hindu mind power which is the basis of New Age mysticism.
She will illogically attack this accurate assessment of her practices. It's absurd really. She will say you shouldn't call her paganism what it is.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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I would test all, What good is a manifestation if there are no words attached?
Prophecy is a manifestion of the Spirit. So is the word of wisdom and the word of knowledge.

Even dreams, prophecies, visions etc. need to be tested. Haven't you noticed that it is the false teachers that get most wacked out when challenged?
I agree that they need to be tested, but your previous post seemed to treat them as in opposition to scripture, and that certainly is not always the case.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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If a dream has to be interpreted to work out its symbolism, then it is not from the Holy Spirit. All the dreams in the New Testament were clear messages and did not require interpretation. Dream Interpretation is atheistic, New Age, and Freudian.
Read Genesis. Read the book of Daniel. The baker, the winetester, and Pharoah's dream needed to be interpreted. Nebucadnezzer's dream needed interpretation as well. One man interpreted another's dream in the Midianite camp, too. Visions need to be interpreted. Christians still disagree over how to interpret the visions in the book of Revelation.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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Another twisting of Scripture to prove a weak point. Twisting Jesus' words could be seen as blaspheming Him. As we can see through Jesus' experience with Satan in the wilderness, how Satan quotes Scripture out of context.
I am not twisting scripture. The ability to picture and see things in our minds is part of the function of our mind. Some people are strong with that. I am not. I am stronger with the verbal and conceptual side of things. It is not something evil. God gave us these intellectual abilities.

Newagers happen to drink water. That doesn't make drinking water evil. Canaanites made alters out of unhewn stone. That doesn't make the practice evil. God even required that of the Israelites. If New Agers make much of the idea of picturing something with the mind, that doesn't make it an inherently pagan practice. And if Christians picture what they are praying about with their minds, that doesn't make it evil. There is no commandment against it. You should not invent one if none exists. Do not lay heavy burdens on people, and for some people who think in pictures, forbidding visualizing would be a heavy burden.

I am not in favor of emphasizing it as something important, since the scriptures do not. But nor would I forbid it, because the scriptures do not. The scriptures describe certain things in great detail as if the reader were to picture it, for example the Cherubim under the throne in Ezekiel with the wheel within the wheel, the tabernacle.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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The Scripture says that the AntiChrist will arise and deceive through false signs and wonders, so how are we going to distinguish the true from the false?
The Bible does not specifically say that the man of sin or the beast of revelation is 'the AntiChrist'. Aside from that, that is a valid question unless the intention behind your question is to present an excuse to reject all signs, wonders, visions, whether they are from the Spirit of God or some other spirit.

If you think lying signs and wonders will be done by one end-time antichrist, then it does not make sense to reject the rest of the signs and wonders in history between the twelve apostle's and the end time man of sin's.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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I am not twisting scripture. The ability to picture and see things in our minds is part of the function of our mind. Some people are strong with that. I am not. I am stronger with the verbal and conceptual side of things. It is not something evil. God gave us these intellectual abilities.
I concur that you are strong on the verbal side :D I have long very much enjoyed reading your
stories, and that is really saying something for me because I more often than not skip reading
lengthy posts. Yours are generally very well articulated, quite personal, and fearlessly detailed :)
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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I concur that you are strong on the verbal side :D have long very much enjoyed reading your
stories, and that is really saying something for me because I more often than not skip reading
long posts. Yours are generally very well articulated, quite personal, and fearlessly detailed :)
Thank you Magenta. I did not even mean to say that I am a good communicator, just that my mind leans far more toward thinking in words than pictures.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Thank you Magenta. I did not even mean to say that I am a good communicator, just that my mind leans far more toward thinking in words than pictures.
You are welcome, and no worries... I get that some are more prone to think certain ways or be more adept in one form of ideation or expression over another. I was just wanting to show some support for what you are saying without jumping into the fray :D While also letting you know that even though we hardly ever speak to each other, I have been among your audience for quite some time :)
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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Prophecy is a manifestion of the Spirit. So is the word of wisdom and the word of knowledge.
All prophecy must be tested as there is much deception out there. (Just take a look at YouTube).

I agree that they need to be tested, but your previous post seemed to treat them as in opposition to scripture, and that certainly is not always the case.
I agree that they need to be tested, but your previous post seemed to treat them as in opposition to scripture, and that certainly is not always the case.
That was your perception (assuming I was a cessationist?)
There are true words spoken which accord with Scripture and there are lying prophets which contradict Scripture.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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All prophecy must be tested as there is much deception out there. (Just take a look at YouTube).
I apologize if I misunderstood you. This, "Dreams have no authority compared to God's Word." seemed like a false dichotomy to me.
Sometimes continuationists can be a bit too skeptical of the idea of God speaking through a dream, also.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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I apologize if I misunderstood you. This, "Dreams have no authority compared to God's Word." seemed like a false dichotomy to me.
Sometimes continuationists can be a bit too skeptical of the idea of God speaking through a dream, also.
Apology accepted (but not needed)
Dreams and God's Word was a comparison. What dream is equal to God's Word? The fact that it ought to be tested is evidence it is less than, or do you believe every dream without testing it?
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
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She will illogically attack this accurate assessment of her practices. It's absurd really. She will say you shouldn't call her paganism what it is.
If we imagine a green pasture or a still water when we repeat the 23rd Psalm, you are labeling us pagans.

You are practicing what Christ spoke against when Christ gave us instructions about not murdering.
 
B

Blackpowderduelist

Guest
If we imagine a green pasture or a still water when we repeat the 23rd Psalm, you are labeling us pagans.

You are practicing what Christ spoke against when Christ gave us instructions about not murdering.
I'm not angry at you at all. And there is certainly cause for what i have said. So not what Jesus said don't apply.
There is a difference between visualizing something being described, and creating images in your imagination of God, which you said that you do.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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If we imagine a green pasture or a still water when we repeat the 23rd Psalm, you are labeling us pagans.

You are practicing what Christ spoke against when Christ gave us instructions about not murdering.
No, the problem is that you labeled it'visualization'. That's been the problem with this thread from the beginning. Would you like to tell us why you labeled it 'visualization? Was it naieveté or an agenda?
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
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No, the problem is that you labeled it'visualization'. That's been the problem with this thread from the beginning. Would you like to tell us why you labeled it 'visualization? Was it naieveté or an agenda?
You can look up a quick definition of 'visualization' on Google. https://www.google.com/search?q=vis...hUKEwjbiKKfw-fvAhXwVTABHaDwA4kQ4dUDCA0&uact=5


Here is 'Wikipedia'. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visua...tion (see spelling,since the dawn of humanity.

It is not an exclusively New Age word.

People in the New Age movement drink coffee, too, but drinking coffee does not make you a New Ager.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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Are you that dense? Here is the OP's definition...

"
Our Father who art is heaven, hallowed be thy name: Psalms gives us pictures of the Father. He is spirit, creator, all powerful. Visualize what scripture tells of Him.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven: Visualize an earth with no sin in it!"


This is not the innocuous definition YT and Google put forth. This borders on the occult, which attempts to change reality through the mind. I still stand by my assertion that 'visualization' was a poor choice of words.

Your worn out coffee analogy is true and cute but it does not apply in this case.