Was the Garden of Eden, literally Heaven on Earth? Was the Earth already fallen except for the Garden?
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Yes, and he may have been one of those "certain people" whom Jesus was referring to when He said that some people have been viewed as gods. As said, Adam could very well have been one of these people, but we know for a fact that Moses was viewed as God, and God Himself states it (which is unbelievable).
Exodus 4:14-16 NKJV - "So the anger of the LORD was kindled against Moses, and He said: "Is not Aaron the Levite your brother? I know that he can speak well. And look, he is also coming out to meet you. When he sees you, he will be glad in his heart. 15 "Now you shall speak to him and put the words in his mouth. And I will be with your mouth and with his mouth, and I will teach you what you shall do. 16 "So he shall be your spokesman to the people. And he himself shall be as a mouth for you, and you shall be to him as God."
Exodus 7:1 NKJV - 1 So the LORD said to Moses: "See, I have made you as God to Pharaoh, and Aaron your brother shall be your prophet.
Exodus 4:14-16 NKJV - "So the anger of the LORD was kindled against Moses, and He said: "Is not Aaron the Levite your brother? I know that he can speak well. And look, he is also coming out to meet you. When he sees you, he will be glad in his heart. 15 "Now you shall speak to him and put the words in his mouth. And I will be with your mouth and with his mouth, and I will teach you what you shall do. 16 "So he shall be your spokesman to the people. And he himself shall be as a mouth for you, and you shall be to him as God."
Exodus 7:1 NKJV - 1 So the LORD said to Moses: "See, I have made you as God to Pharaoh, and Aaron your brother shall be your prophet.
the apostle John seems to also be saying that God does not dwell in everyone
He who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; he who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed the testimony that God has given of His Son. And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.
(1 John 5:10-13)
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we say Jesus is the last Adam because as Adam was the origin & federal head of humankind, whoever is in Christ becomes a new creation - and as sin entered all of us, who were in Adam's loins, being descended through him ((cmp. Hebrews 7:10)), so too if we are reborn in Christ, the Spirit of Life resides in us.
it's of particular interest here that He was born a man not through the seed of man, but by the Holy Ghost through a chosen woman. she was descended from Adam, but the blood of Christ did not come from man; an embryo does not receive blood in the womb, from the mother.
it's of particular interest here that He was born a man not through the seed of man, but by the Holy Ghost through a chosen woman. she was descended from Adam, but the blood of Christ did not come from man; an embryo does not receive blood in the womb, from the mother.
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God is not limited in that He needs some kind of conduit to 'access' our hearts.
Christ did not come because God didn't understand us or couldn't reach us. Christ was sent in order to redeem us. He is not ignorant of anything nor is anything too far from Him, and nothing is obscured from Him. such characterization of Him is impossible; IMO you're anthropomorphizing
Christ did not come because God didn't understand us or couldn't reach us. Christ was sent in order to redeem us. He is not ignorant of anything nor is anything too far from Him, and nothing is obscured from Him. such characterization of Him is impossible; IMO you're anthropomorphizing
God doesn't "access" our sins . . . rather, He controls them. Consider king Abimelech and how God prevented him from "touching" Abrahams wife:
Genesis 20:01-6 NLT - "Abraham moved south to the Negev and lived for a while between Kadesh and Shur, and then he moved on to Gerar. While living there as a foreigner, Abraham introduced his wife, Sarah, by saying, "She is my sister." So King Abimelech of Gerar sent for Sarah and had her brought to him at his palace. But that night God came to Abimelech in a dream and told him, "You are a dead man, for that woman you have taken is already married!" But Abimelech had not slept with her yet, so he said, "Lord, will you destroy an innocent nation? Didn't Abraham tell me, 'She is my sister'? And she herself said, 'Yes, he is my brother.' I acted in complete innocence! My hands are clean." In the dream God responded, "Yes, I know you are innocent. That's why I kept you from sinning against me, and why I did not let you touch her."
Genesis 20:01-6 NLT - "Abraham moved south to the Negev and lived for a while between Kadesh and Shur, and then he moved on to Gerar. While living there as a foreigner, Abraham introduced his wife, Sarah, by saying, "She is my sister." So King Abimelech of Gerar sent for Sarah and had her brought to him at his palace. But that night God came to Abimelech in a dream and told him, "You are a dead man, for that woman you have taken is already married!" But Abimelech had not slept with her yet, so he said, "Lord, will you destroy an innocent nation? Didn't Abraham tell me, 'She is my sister'? And she herself said, 'Yes, he is my brother.' I acted in complete innocence! My hands are clean." In the dream God responded, "Yes, I know you are innocent. That's why I kept you from sinning against me, and why I did not let you touch her."
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in the law it's not the thing with the sin that is sacrificed in order to atone for sin. it's a sinless substitute -- something which has never been touched by corruption
in the law anyone who touched a leper became unclean. but Christ-God touched a leper and made him clean ((Matthew 8:3 -- compare Haggai 2))
in the law anyone who touched a leper became unclean. but Christ-God touched a leper and made him clean ((Matthew 8:3 -- compare Haggai 2))
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i wish you wouldn't. Dino while he may sometimes be blunt or even crass, is an insightful & discerning man, and ideas that cannot stand up to scrutiny are not worth holding. this is the sharpening of iron with iron. if you can prove your doctrine against criticism, both you and your critics are edified - but if you shut your ears to them, what is added to you, or to them?
i don't block people, even the ones i most strongly disagree with. all of us here are comparing what we hear with scripture and seeking to know the truth. the process of testing & analysis is of necessity violent toward ideas. like the threshing of wheat to remove the chaff, or the burning away of impurity in an ore, it's not gentle.
we must find a way to be gentle towards each other while stern towards what may be disproven
i don't block people, even the ones i most strongly disagree with. all of us here are comparing what we hear with scripture and seeking to know the truth. the process of testing & analysis is of necessity violent toward ideas. like the threshing of wheat to remove the chaff, or the burning away of impurity in an ore, it's not gentle.
we must find a way to be gentle towards each other while stern towards what may be disproven
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Finally someone talking sense. Father Adam, is the head of the Mankind race not was the head, is the head. Father Adam is the Son of GOD.. (Luke 3:38). And the Son of GOD was given a mission of this father. And his mission to set the altar for the alteration of his supernatural body to migrate to the mortal state where procreation is possible. And also to subdue the systems of the earth, water and air, and to transfigure the earth into a celestial planet. Father Adam is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world, which means the migration of his physical body from immortality to mortality is what set the foundations of the world; of the terrestrial earth.
We are all born in sin because we are all born in the state that can die, the state that fell short of the glory. The Glory in question, is called Shekinah glory; the glory raiment of the celestial body. The body that GOD coupled for Father Adam and Mother Eve is the image that man and women will conform to in transfiguration.
Jesus His Pre-Eminence came through the door into the earth. And that door is the womb of a woman. That is why a baby kicks in the womb, the baby is knocking before they baby enters. The body that HE took from her womb, was not built by semen or egg, but by the Word of GOD HIMSELF. GOD incubated on her womb and coupled the body HE would take from her womb. GOD has HIS body. The body HE took from her womb is not HIS body, which is why HIS body represented the church; the body of Christ. And he looked exactly like father Adam did in the fall, who is HIS son. That is why at a time lucifer was saying: If thou be the son of GOD, command these stones that they become bread. Because lucifer has seen Adam before. And Father Adam Prophesied that he would return, that he would resurrect and return.
The body that Jesus His Pre-Eminence took from the womb of the Blessed Virgin Mary, was not mortal. It did not have blood in it. HE was born in a body that was at the Hem of Bethel, which is just before immortality. And when the time of HIS ministry started, HIS first miracle was at a wedding, where HE changed 6 pots of water into Wine - showing the negative metamorphosis that Father Adam experienced in the fall. The fall was a migration to mortality in stages. Glory to water, water to wine, wine to blood. This is why it was at the Last Supper that HE took on the sins of Man, which means HE had reached mortality, where HE can now even be killed.
Jesus His Pre-Eminence walking on water, and commanding the winds, and the miracles HE did was preaching to the people that the kind of body HE had was not bound by the laws of this earth; that it is a different kind of body entirely. And also that HE has the authority in the earth because HE is the earths owner.
And Finally, GOD does not lack body. GOD does not need to dwell in any persons body to have a livlihood. GOD is the Supreme Spirit Being. GOD has HIS throne, which is not a chair, it is HIS Physical body. GOD does not live in any persons body... Are you trying to tell me that GOD can be dwelling in you, and yet you can still sin? But you told me that GOD cannot be near sin? Are you trying to tell me, that GOD had nowhere to live before HE made Man? This is delusional.
We are all born in sin because we are all born in the state that can die, the state that fell short of the glory. The Glory in question, is called Shekinah glory; the glory raiment of the celestial body. The body that GOD coupled for Father Adam and Mother Eve is the image that man and women will conform to in transfiguration.
Jesus His Pre-Eminence came through the door into the earth. And that door is the womb of a woman. That is why a baby kicks in the womb, the baby is knocking before they baby enters. The body that HE took from her womb, was not built by semen or egg, but by the Word of GOD HIMSELF. GOD incubated on her womb and coupled the body HE would take from her womb. GOD has HIS body. The body HE took from her womb is not HIS body, which is why HIS body represented the church; the body of Christ. And he looked exactly like father Adam did in the fall, who is HIS son. That is why at a time lucifer was saying: If thou be the son of GOD, command these stones that they become bread. Because lucifer has seen Adam before. And Father Adam Prophesied that he would return, that he would resurrect and return.
The body that Jesus His Pre-Eminence took from the womb of the Blessed Virgin Mary, was not mortal. It did not have blood in it. HE was born in a body that was at the Hem of Bethel, which is just before immortality. And when the time of HIS ministry started, HIS first miracle was at a wedding, where HE changed 6 pots of water into Wine - showing the negative metamorphosis that Father Adam experienced in the fall. The fall was a migration to mortality in stages. Glory to water, water to wine, wine to blood. This is why it was at the Last Supper that HE took on the sins of Man, which means HE had reached mortality, where HE can now even be killed.
Jesus His Pre-Eminence walking on water, and commanding the winds, and the miracles HE did was preaching to the people that the kind of body HE had was not bound by the laws of this earth; that it is a different kind of body entirely. And also that HE has the authority in the earth because HE is the earths owner.
And Finally, GOD does not lack body. GOD does not need to dwell in any persons body to have a livlihood. GOD is the Supreme Spirit Being. GOD has HIS throne, which is not a chair, it is HIS Physical body. GOD does not live in any persons body... Are you trying to tell me that GOD can be dwelling in you, and yet you can still sin? But you told me that GOD cannot be near sin? Are you trying to tell me, that GOD had nowhere to live before HE made Man? This is delusional.
It is because Man was born before all of creation. Man is a Spirit Being. And they were in a place called the Fathers Bosom. And they stay there until GOD sends Man into the womb of a woman to be born into this earth. All except the principal Ancestors of the Mankind Race, Adam and Eve who were not born of a woman, but whose bodies were coupled by the Most Holy Hands of GOD.
this is relevant, i think:
He says they wouldn't have sin if He had not become a testimony to them.
the idea seems to be that it's not so much in order to 'reach' sin, but as evidence entered into a court, it's demonstrating the wickedness of sin.
remember how that John says, this is the condemnation, that Light entered the world but men loved darkness?
the point wasn't for light to be able to reach darkness in order to condemn it, but so that the evil of choosing darkness might be exposed.
If I had not come and spoken to them, they would have no sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin. He who hates Me hates My Father also. If I had not done among them the works which no one else did, they would have no sin; but now they have seen and also hated both Me and My Father. But this happened that the word might be fulfilled which is written in their law, ‘They hated Me without a cause.’
(John 15:22-25)
seems it's not in order to 'access sin' that He comes, but in order to 'make sin all the more sinful' ((re: Romans 5:19-20, 7:13 etc))(John 15:22-25)
He says they wouldn't have sin if He had not become a testimony to them.
the idea seems to be that it's not so much in order to 'reach' sin, but as evidence entered into a court, it's demonstrating the wickedness of sin.
remember how that John says, this is the condemnation, that Light entered the world but men loved darkness?
the point wasn't for light to be able to reach darkness in order to condemn it, but so that the evil of choosing darkness might be exposed.