Why does God only offer salvation on this side of the grave? Why is faith important?

[DevotiontoBible]

Ok, so educate me on how the genre makes this a historical narrative. Regardless whether the fruit is an edible product that upon consumption caused guilt or is merely guilt generated by being taught the difference of right and wrong, the sacrifices animal or Messianic psychologically relinquishes it, and restores us to the Heavenly Father.

A historical narrative is about real people, places, things, and events. Jesus and the Apostles spoke of the characters and events and places in Genesis as being real not allegories.

Let's examine what you claim God supposedly revealed to you. Does the Word of God teach that the emotional feeling of guilt keeps us from God so the sacrifices of animals and Jesus eliminated that guilty feeling? No! Here it says people still have the guilty feelings but can have a relationship with God because of faith in Christ:

If they could have provided perfect cleansing, the sacrifices would have stopped, for the worshipers would have been purified once for all time, and their feelings of guilt would have disappeared. let us go right into the presence of God with sincere hearts fully trusting him. For our guilty consciences have been sprinkled with Christ’s blood to make us clean, and our bodies have been washed with pure water.
Hebrews 10:2*, ‬22 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/heb.10.2-22.NLT

 

[garee]

A historical narrative is about real people, places, things, and events. Jesus and the Apostles spoke of the characters and events and places in Genesis as being real not allegories.

Let's examine what you claim God supposedly revealed to you. Does the Word of God teach that the emotional feeling of guilt keeps us from God so the sacrifices of animals and Jesus eliminated that guilty feeling? No! Here it says people still have the guilty feelings but can have a relationship with God because of faith in Christ:

If they could have provided perfect cleansing, the sacrifices would have stopped, for the worshipers would have been purified once for all time, and their feelings of guilt would have disappeared. let us go right into the presence of God with sincere hearts fully trusting him. For our guilty consciences have been sprinkled with Christ’s blood to make us clean, and our bodies have been washed with pure water.
Hebrews 10:2*, ‬22 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/heb.10.2-22.NLT

Amen The Jews in respect to their outward flesh were used as a historical true parable. The history is true the parable provide the hidden spiritual understanding called the hidden manna .The word manna literally means (what is it) In that way we could say the whole Bible is the poetic language that God chose to reveal himself to us Hiding the understanding from those who have not the born again Spirit as the incorruptible seed.

In that way we have a better idea what it means that without parables Christ, the Holy Spirit of God.... spoke not

The time of reformation has come. It is marked by the words "last days".

From my experiences many do not acknowledge the time reformation has come and the Jews are no longer used as shadows as a parable for the time then present . The use of the word pattern below is the word (3850 parabole {par-ab-ol-ay'} used 50 timesamd the word signifying is what parables do give the unseen understanding


The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. Hebrew 9

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Amen The Jews in respect to their outward flesh were used as a historical true parable. The history is true the parable provide the hidden spiritual understanding called the hidden manna .The word manna literally means (what is it) In that way we could say the whole Bible is the poetic language that God chose to reveal himself to us Hiding the understanding from those who have not the born again Spirit as the incorruptible seed.

In that way we have a better idea what it means that without parables Christ, the Holy Spirit of God.... spoke not

The time of reformation has come. It is marked by the words "last days".

From my experiences many do not acknowledge the time reformation has come and the Jews are no longer used as shadows as a parable for the time then present . The use of the word pattern below is the word (3850 parabole {par-ab-ol-ay'} used 50 timesamd the word signifying is what parables do give the unseen understanding


The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. Hebrew 9

That is only referring to the tabernacle as a parable not to the whole history of the Bible and the Jews.

 

[Hungry]

A historical narrative is about real people, places, things, and events. Jesus and the Apostles spoke of the characters and events and places in Genesis as being real not allegories.

Let's examine what you claim God supposedly revealed to you. Does the Word of God teach that the emotional feeling of guilt keeps us from God so the sacrifices of animals and Jesus eliminated that guilty feeling? No! Here it says people still have the guilty feelings but can have a relationship with God because of faith in Christ:

If they could have provided perfect cleansing, the sacrifices would have stopped, for the worshipers would have been purified once for all time, and their feelings of guilt would have disappeared. let us go right into the presence of God with sincere hearts fully trusting him. For our guilty consciences have been sprinkled with Christ’s blood to make us clean, and our bodies have been washed with pure water.
Hebrews 10:2*, ‬22 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/heb.10.2-22.NLT

Literally every creation story in every culture ever told have been spoken in historical narrative. Using actual names and places they explain their origins. Take the first name of every first son of Adam onward and translate the meaning. You will get a prophetic message. Believe what you want about guilt. You misunderstood what I explained to you. You are looking at things to try to prove my thoughts false. When your brain accepts something as fact, it automatically rejects everything else to the contrary. If you aren’t seeking you won’t find. We will not agree because I was where you are and believed as you do. Nobody could sway me either. Instead of accepting unexplained things as the workings of a mysterious God, I took Him up on His promises. Nothing is mysterious, just hidden. You have to seek Him.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Literally every creation story in every culture ever told have been spoken in historical narrative. Using actual names and places they explain their origins. Take the first name of every first son of Adam onward and translate the meaning. You will get a prophetic message. Believe what you want about guilt. You misunderstood what I explained to you. You are looking at things to try to prove my thoughts false. When your brain accepts something as fact, it automatically rejects everything else to the contrary. If you aren’t seeking you won’t find. We will not agree because I was where you are and believed as you do. Nobody could sway me either. Instead of accepting unexplained things as the workings of a mysterious God, I took Him up on His promises. Nothing is mysterious, just hidden. You have to seek Him.

I will always reject someone's "revelation from God". There is only one revelation from God and that is the 66 books of the Bible. If your "revelation from God" isn't a principle in the Bible then you are not speaking for God.

 

[Hungry]

I will always reject someone's "revelation from God". There is only one revelation from God and that is the 66 books of the Bible. If your "revelation from God" isn't a principle in the Bible then you are not speaking for God.

It’s not new it is just explained different. They rejected Christ also.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I will always reject someone's "revelation from God". There is only one revelation from God and that is the 66 books of the Bible. If your "revelation from God" isn't a principle in the Bible then you are not speaking for God.

What people sometimes mean is that they have received a fresh insight into something already stated in Scripture. There is nothing wrong with that. It is only when someone claims to be a prophet and makes certain statements or predictions that one should be wary. For example, date-setting for the Second Coming of Christ is completely nonsensical.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

What people sometimes mean is that they have received a fresh insight into something already stated in Scripture. There is nothing wrong with that. It is only when someone claims to be a prophet and makes certain statements or predictions that one should be wary. For example, date-setting for the Second Coming of Christ is completely nonsensical.

However, this Hungry guy claims to have "hidden" "revelations" for which I can't find in Scripture and in fact contradict Scripture by saying Genesis is not literal history and other kooky stuff.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

It’s not new it is just explained different. They rejected Christ also.

There is no new explaination. The NAR movement claims to have "new" explanations that the church hasn't known for the past 2,000 years.

 

[Hungry]

However, this Hungry guy claims to have "hidden" "revelations" for which I can't find in Scripture and in fact contradict Scripture by saying Genesis is not literal history and other kooky stuff.

I didn’t say emphatically that everything in Genesis is make belief. It just appears to be an over simplified version of creation, a lot of archeological discoveries that are unaccounted for some of the words are mistranslated and taught wrong. Some Christians want to believe that the only truth ever penned has been all collected complete, perfectly translated and divinely preserved, in a book called the Bible. That is what we are taught. The big fear is that if one thing could be wrong then the whole book can’t be trusted and Christianity would collapse and we would fail Christ. Some believers think if they question the Bible then it makes them non-believers and off to Hell they go. The Bible tells a very different story when you connect the dots. The power of guilt is one of these truths that becomes obvious when you discover it. God explained it very simply. Christ tried to explain things simply. People weren’t stupid, they just committed to believing exactly what they were taught by men. That is why you need to
become like a child, because children are good students. They are teachable, not like adults who blindly follow traditions unaware why.

I’m not saying I am a prophet in the traditional sense but one of the spiritual gifts is prophecy. Whether you want to accept it or not everything taught is accurate. It is often written correctly just not translated perfectly. Whether I am right or wrong you won’t know because you won’t even consider it.

 

[Nehemiah6]

However, this Hungry guy claims to have "hidden" "revelations" for which I can't find in Scripture and in fact contradict Scripture by saying Genesis is not literal history and other kooky stuff.

Any genuine insight or "revelation" received by any Christians CANNOT be at variance with the plain Scripture record. So to go back to the Genesis account, we must be in agreement that:

1. It is a GENUINE, literal,historical, chronological summation of Creation and the Fall, given by Divine inspiration to Moses.

2. There are NO myths, legends, fable, allegories (unless so noted), or fairy tales in the Bible. It is God's truth.

3. The tree of "the knowledge of good and evil" was a literal tree in the Garden of Eden, but we do not know the nature of the fruit it produced. It was certainly NOT an apple tree. And the tree of life was also a literal tree.

4. The knowledge of good and evil was A PRODUCT of sin and disobedience, and sin always produces guilt. Until Adam and Eve ate of the forbidden fruit, they had no experiential knowledge of sin and disobedience, thus no knowledge of the difference between good and evil. The minute they ate of that fruit, that knowledge entered their souls. So it was not only guilt but also shame, and then as we see later, the desire to pass blame for our sins on others. Satan blamed God, Eve blamed Satan, Adam blamed Eve, and today we have the "victim culture" where everybody else is responsible for our own sins and failures.

 

[Hungry]

Any genuine insight or "revelation" received by any Christians CANNOT be at variance with the plain Scripture record. So to go back to the Genesis account, we must be in agreement that:

1. It is a GENUINE, literal,historical, chronological summation of Creation and the Fall, given by Divine inspiration to Moses.

2. There are NO myths, legends, fable, allegories (unless so noted), or fairy tales in the Bible. It is God's truth.

3. The tree of "the knowledge of good and evil" was a literal tree in the Garden of Eden, but we do not know the nature of the fruit it produced. It was certainly NOT an apple tree. And the tree of life was also a literal tree.

4. The knowledge of good and evil was A PRODUCT of sin and disobedience, and sin always produces guilt. Until Adam and Eve ate of the forbidden fruit, they had no experiential knowledge of sin and disobedience, thus no knowledge of the difference between good and evil. The minute they ate of that fruit, that knowledge entered their souls. So it was not only guilt but also shame, and then as we see later, the desire to pass blame for our sins on others. Satan blamed God, Eve blamed Satan, Adam blamed Eve, and today we have the "victim culture" where everybody else is responsible for our own sins and failures.

1. Where is it written that all of Moses writings were a completed text of human origins, 100% divinely inspired and that he never used allegory to teach a nation of nomadic shepherds aimlessly wandering through the wilderness. They needed a better understanding of who this God was who just liberated them from Egypt. They needed somewhere to start from. We all want something to believe in. They didn’t need confusion. Stories are an amazing way to convey information in a memorable way. Memory hacks often involve weaving information into pictorial stories. The renaissance artists mingled Greco theological imagery with Bible stories causing our minds to perceive Our Creator in a certain way. If you told those same stories untainted with preconceptions, the Bible tells a different story.

2. Says who? The Church of Rome?

3. Again, says who? Where is it written that there were actually two real fruit trees? If Christ is trying to teach the Jews, He isn’t going to rewrite their Torah. Carnal minds perceive carnal things, spiritual minds perceive spiritual things. They needed carnal teachings because the were spiritually blind.

4. Without being taught there is a good and an evil you have no sin. It is the knowledge that makes it sinful. Think of dogs. We are similar to them. In the wild they only fight to determine leadership and kill for food. We train them and it overrides their God given programming. We teach/train them that there IS a right and a wrong. We give them the knowledge of good and evil. Then we reprogram them to kill for sport. They feel guilt/hide when they get in the garbage because it is a sin to them. We are born into a society that is perpetually teaching right and wrong, or sin. This is how we are born into sin. We are trained to desire unreproductive sex and lavish meals. Spiritually minded people shake off this training. That is how you can be sinless. There is a connection to God that is reached when you desire only Him.

 

[Nehemiah6]

1. Where is it written that all of Moses writings were a completed text of human origins, 100% divinely inspired

If you believe that Jesus is God, you should also know that He confirmed that the Torah was inspired by God. If that does not suffice for you, then you don't really believe that Jesus is God.

2. Says who? The Church of Rome?

Not the Church of Rome, but Christ, who is God.

3. Again, says who? Where is it written that there were actually two real fruit trees?

If you believe that the Bible is the Word of God, it is written in the Word of God. Read it for yourself.

And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil. (Gen 2:9).

Without being taught there is a good and an evil you have no sin.

Now you are ACTUALLY CONTRADICTING THE BIBLE. No one "taught" Adam and Even anything before they sinned. They were simply commanded to obey a very simple and easy commandment, but they deliberately disobeyed. Read Genesis 2 over again and understand.

Now you are concocting your own ideas which means that you do not really believe Christ, God, or the Bible.

 

[Hungry]

If you believe that Jesus is God, you should also know that He confirmed that the Torah was inspired by God. If that does not suffice for you, then you don't really believe that Jesus is God.

Not the Church of Rome, but Christ, who is God.

If you believe that the Bible is the Word of God, it is written in the Word of God. Read it for yourself.

And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil. (Gen 2:9).


Now you are ACTUALLY CONTRADICTING THE BIBLE. No one "taught" Adam and Even anything before they sinned. They were simply commanded to obey a very simple and easy commandment, but they deliberately disobeyed. Read Genesis 2 over again and understand.

Now you are concocting your own ideas which means that you do not really believe Christ, God, or the Bible.

Inspired does not mean literally occurred.

If Christ wrote the Forward on the King James Bible, sorry I missed it.

Read Romans 7. It explains what I am saying. Adam was taught right from wrong when he was told not to eat from the tree. I understand that this is all foreign. Just like the Jews didn’t understand Christ because they thought the words were more important then their meaning. Just do me a favour and pray about it. Ask The Creator to open your eyes as to whether I am a heretic or whether my words are inspired. Until He answers you, be blessed brother. Whatever insight He shares with you please pass it on. Rebuke me if it is required by Him.

 

[Ahwatukee]

I've read the whole bible, I must have missed something.

Obviously when people finally meet God they will have no choice but to believe.

Why does God only allow us to believe in Jesus for forgiveness on this side of the grave?

An answer just came to me.. because of faith. Why is faith so important to God for salvation?

Greetings claysmithr,

The main reason is because, God told Adam the following:

"You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.”

And Satan said:

"You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

Since then, God has been looking for those who will believe in His word, i.e. have faith.

Consequently, you don't need faith after death, because at that time you'll know the truth.

 

[Nehemiah6]

If Christ wrote the Forward on the King James Bible, sorry I missed it.

If this lame response if the best you can come up with, then you know you do not have a case. In fact you are already treading on thin ice by claiming that *my words are inspired*.

 

[Hungry]

If this lame response if the best you can come up with, then you know you do not have a case. In fact you are already treading on thin ice by claiming that *my words are inspired*.

The fact is that Christ never endorsed the King James Bible and it is intellectually dishonest to declare He did. If you think the Holy Spirit doesn’t teach people today then you can’t apply anything from the Bible to modern society. Go ahead and pick up your stones. Christ never told anybody He would send a text to guide us. He said He would send the Spirit. I read the Bible but pray earnestly for hours a day in Christ’s Name. With a greatful heart I pray for wisdom and understanding. He teaches me on many things, not just scripture. If I am delusional then I have no way to explain all of the other things that He teaches me that I discover to be true. Regardless, thin ice makes no difference. When you are with Christ He makes you able to walk on water.

 

[claysmithr]

I think I have found an answer for myself: Faith is the mechanism God uses to give us his righteousness through Christ. It's basically what separates a Christian from a non-christian.

 

[louis]

I've read the whole bible, I must have missed something.

Obviously when people finally meet God they will have no choice but to believe.

Why does God only allow us to believe in Jesus for forgiveness on this side of the grave?
An answer just came to me.. because of faith. Why is faith so important to God for salvation?

What you believe in your heart, will be displayed in your actions.
If you believe in love, truth, and justice, your actions will jthen display these beliefs.
On the other hand, if you believe in hate, lies, and getting whatever you want by any means, your actions will display these beliefs.
In short, you are either not for this world, or you are for this world.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

I think I have found an answer for myself: Faith is the mechanism God uses to give us his righteousness through Christ. It's basically what separates a Christian from a non-christian.

Rom ch 9 is all about God choosing faith not works of the law for Salvation. Just because He can do that. It has something to do with trusting in God verses trusting in ourselves.