FreeGrace2 said:
This verse is about fellowship with the Lord in order to bear fruit. iow, a believer cannot bear fruit for the Lord unless he/she is in fellowship with the Lord.
Explain WHY Paul admonishes believers to stop GRIEVING the Holy Spirit and to stop QUENCHING the Holy Spirit.
You have confused fellowship for relationship. They are not the same.
Perfect example: marriage. In God's economy, marriage is PERMANENT. However, within that relationship, the husband and wife may be in fellowship with each other or at one another's throats. I hope you can see the point.
Is there fellowship in a loveless marriage? No.
Relationship is permanent. Fellowship is dynamic. It is lost when one spouse offends the other. It is restored when the offending spouse confesses their error to their spouse. 1 john 1:9 tells the believer how to restore fellowship with the Lord.
Believing isn't fellowship. Believing results in relationship.
No it's not. You need to explain WHY Paul admonishes believers to stop grieving/quenching the Spirit. There is NO WAY a believer can be in fellowship with the Lord while at the same time grieving/quenching the Spirit.
As Biden would put it, C'mon, man.
This could not be more wrong. You really have no idea about these deeper doctrines.
And that is...relationship. A permanent relationship.
But, just go try to offend your spouse and see how much fellowship you will experience.
I differentiate between fellowship and relationship. And marriage is the perfect example of each.
It is EXACTLY the same thing. Sin OFFENDS the Lord and God the Father. And fellowship is LOST. How did the father describe his idiot son? "He was LOST...he was dead". But the son knew exactly where he was and where is father was. And he didn't die.
So Jesus was teaching about fellowship. When the idiot son left, he left out of fellowship. While our western minds have no clue about this parable, 1st Century Jews sure did. For a son to ask for his "cut" of the inheritance while the father was still alive was akin to telling the father that he wished dear old dad was DEAD. It was a HUGE insult and offense to the father. Just ask anyone who is an expert in 1st Century Jewish culture, customs, etc.
You really have no understanding of any of this, obviously. When God's children sin, they LOSE fellowship with the Father.
Aren't you aware of this verse? Psa 66:18 - If I had regarded sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened;
Does that sound like fellowship to you? He ISN'T LISTENING when you pray. That's why the Bible tells us to confess our sins. So we will be cleansed/purified. Which restores fellowship.
YES. Haven't you read Romans 7 and Paul' present stuggle with his own sin? Then read 1 John 1:8,10.
I said:
"Now explain WHY God would scourge (skin alive with a whip) EVERY son? What would be the reason, other than SIN?"
Seriously? It is a figure of speech describing God's discipline as PAINFUL. Now take a peek at Heb 12:11.
I think it is very inaccurate.
When someone hears the word "disposable", most liekly the first thing they think of is trash.
You don't understand. When God disciplines one of his sinning children, and their pain is seen, it is a teaching moment at least for the one who sees it. It should be a teaching moment for the sinner.
We certainly don't. I use biblical words and concepts.
The Bible clearly teaches that everyone will physically die ONCE. Heb 9:27 But everyone's soul will live forever. The saved souls will have a resurrection body, glorified, immortal, and imperishable. All these words are biblical.
Unsaved will get their old carcass back for the GWT judgment and then cast into the lake of fire, where their old carcass DIES physically AGAIN. Which is why the lake of fire is also called the "second death".
Yep. The unsaved will be cast into the lake of fire in their resurrected old carcass, just to DIE again.
Annihilation is Biblical.[/QUOTE]
Then you should cut Rev 20:10 out of your Bible, because it REFUTES you totally. In fact, it ANNIHILATES your view.
I don't understand your question.
This verse is about fellowship with the Lord in order to bear fruit. iow, a believer cannot bear fruit for the Lord unless he/she is in fellowship with the Lord.
Explain WHY Paul admonishes believers to stop GRIEVING the Holy Spirit and to stop QUENCHING the Holy Spirit.
You have confused fellowship for relationship. They are not the same.
Perfect example: marriage. In God's economy, marriage is PERMANENT. However, within that relationship, the husband and wife may be in fellowship with each other or at one another's throats. I hope you can see the point.
Is there fellowship in a loveless marriage? No.
Relationship is permanent. Fellowship is dynamic. It is lost when one spouse offends the other. It is restored when the offending spouse confesses their error to their spouse. 1 john 1:9 tells the believer how to restore fellowship with the Lord.
Believing isn't fellowship. Believing results in relationship.
No it's not. You need to explain WHY Paul admonishes believers to stop grieving/quenching the Spirit. There is NO WAY a believer can be in fellowship with the Lord while at the same time grieving/quenching the Spirit.
As Biden would put it, C'mon, man.
This could not be more wrong. You really have no idea about these deeper doctrines.
And that is...relationship. A permanent relationship.
But, just go try to offend your spouse and see how much fellowship you will experience.
I differentiate between fellowship and relationship. And marriage is the perfect example of each.
It is EXACTLY the same thing. Sin OFFENDS the Lord and God the Father. And fellowship is LOST. How did the father describe his idiot son? "He was LOST...he was dead". But the son knew exactly where he was and where is father was. And he didn't die.
So Jesus was teaching about fellowship. When the idiot son left, he left out of fellowship. While our western minds have no clue about this parable, 1st Century Jews sure did. For a son to ask for his "cut" of the inheritance while the father was still alive was akin to telling the father that he wished dear old dad was DEAD. It was a HUGE insult and offense to the father. Just ask anyone who is an expert in 1st Century Jewish culture, customs, etc.
You really have no understanding of any of this, obviously. When God's children sin, they LOSE fellowship with the Father.
Aren't you aware of this verse? Psa 66:18 - If I had regarded sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened;
Does that sound like fellowship to you? He ISN'T LISTENING when you pray. That's why the Bible tells us to confess our sins. So we will be cleansed/purified. Which restores fellowship.
YES. Haven't you read Romans 7 and Paul' present stuggle with his own sin? Then read 1 John 1:8,10.
I said:
"Now explain WHY God would scourge (skin alive with a whip) EVERY son? What would be the reason, other than SIN?"
Seriously? It is a figure of speech describing God's discipline as PAINFUL. Now take a peek at Heb 12:11.
I think it is very inaccurate.
When someone hears the word "disposable", most liekly the first thing they think of is trash.
You don't understand. When God disciplines one of his sinning children, and their pain is seen, it is a teaching moment at least for the one who sees it. It should be a teaching moment for the sinner.
We certainly don't. I use biblical words and concepts.
The Bible clearly teaches that everyone will physically die ONCE. Heb 9:27 But everyone's soul will live forever. The saved souls will have a resurrection body, glorified, immortal, and imperishable. All these words are biblical.
Unsaved will get their old carcass back for the GWT judgment and then cast into the lake of fire, where their old carcass DIES physically AGAIN. Which is why the lake of fire is also called the "second death".
Yep. The unsaved will be cast into the lake of fire in their resurrected old carcass, just to DIE again.
Annihilation is Biblical.[/QUOTE]
Then you should cut Rev 20:10 out of your Bible, because it REFUTES you totally. In fact, it ANNIHILATES your view.
I don't understand your question.
