Why Moses and Elijah were at the transfiguration.

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
F

F2F

Member
#221
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#221
@cv5

As a side, other than his sin, the second reason he could no longer go in and out of the tent of meeting was God told him he could no longer do so...if you were thinking it was due to his age you would be wrong! Moses was burning with desire to take them over and pleaded with God many times to do so.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#223
Mar 1, 2022
18,728
6,437
113
62
#223
F2F said:
Did you look up the verse which was referenced?
2 Corinthians 13:4
Try speaking to it...
Click to expand...
Weakness there just means He submitted Himself to God. It doesn't mean He wasn't able to do anything He wanted to do.
 
F

F2F

Member
#224
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#224
Cameron143 said:
Weakness there just means He submitted Himself to God. It doesn't mean He wasn't able to do anything He wanted to do.
Click to expand...
So you believe submitting to God is being weak? Interesting.
 
cv5

cv5

Well-known member
#225
Nov 20, 2018
22,546
8,105
113
#225
Cameron143 said:
Christ was meek. He wasn't weak.
Click to expand...
And He had some devastating backup. At His beck and call....

Mat 26:53
Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
 
V

VARob

Banned
#226
Dec 21, 2020
1,825
474
83
#226
F2F said:
Such precision is not "time and chance" or fate or coincidence - a man of faith would see the Hand of God and accept its working. Enoch was no different - we are given the days of his life which have a start and and end! How God ended that life is for Him to know...we just accept the record (Gen 5:23-24)
Click to expand...
No record in the Bible says that God killed Moses.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#228
Mar 1, 2022
18,728
6,437
113
62
#228
cv5 said:
And He had some devastating backup. At His beck and call....

Mat 26:53
Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
Click to expand...
Agree. Or He could have done it Himself.
 
cv5

cv5

Well-known member
#229
Nov 20, 2018
22,546
8,105
113
#229
F2F said:
The Word of God does not contradict itself CV5, only provides us with information we need to interpret. It's true his time as shepherd (Psalm 77:20) was coming to an end and this text you posted is on his 120th birthday! You know from Deut 34:7 Moses still retained full vigour and if you were honest you would acknowledge what this meant in terms of his capabilities. Did he feel the weaking affects of aging, of course! And would this lessen his ability to lead the people of course it would! But the record wants you to know that before his life was taken he was mentally & physically fit with a strong vision for Israels future. The reason the Word records him in this condition is to show Israel it was according to Gods Word Moses die precisely at that time and in that place on that day!

Such precision is not "time and chance" or fate or coincidence - a man of faith would see the Hand of God and accept its working. Enoch was no different - we are given the days of his life which have a start and and end! How God ended that life is for Him to know...we just accept the record (Gen 5:23-24)

F2F
Click to expand...
Moses @120 yo was certainly past his prime and he knew it, and said so.
As was (eventually) his servant Joshua @110 yo, who also had to likewise retire from his leadership position.

Jos 23:1
And it came to pass a long time after that the LORD had given rest unto Israel from all their enemies round about, that Joshua waxed old and stricken in age.
Jos 23:2
And Joshua called for all Israel, and for their elders, and for their heads, and for their judges, and for their officers, and said unto them, I am old and stricken in age:
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#230
Mar 1, 2022
18,728
6,437
113
62
#230
cv5 said:
Moses @120 yo was certainly past his prime and he knew it, and said so.
As was (eventually) his servant Joshua @110 yo, who also had to likewise retire from his leadership position.

Jos 23:1
And it came to pass a long time after that the LORD had given rest unto Israel from all their enemies round about, that Joshua waxed old and stricken in age.
Jos 23:2
And Joshua called for all Israel, and for their elders, and for their heads, and for their judges, and for their officers, and said unto them, I am old and stricken in age:
Click to expand...
That's the same thing my kids have told me since we studied the book of Joshua together...dad, you are old and stricken in years.
 
F

F2F

Member
#231
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#231
Cameron143 said:
Yes. When I am weak, He is strong. That's how God accrues glory and we become more than conquerors.
Click to expand...
Okay getting closer...you say when you are weak God is strong...in what way was Jesus weak?
 
F

F2F

Member
#232
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#232
cv5 said:
Moses @120 yo was certainly past his prime and he knew it, and said so.
As was (eventually) his servant Joshua @110 yo, who also had to likewise retire from his leadership position.

Jos 23:1
And it came to pass a long time after that the LORD had given rest unto Israel from all their enemies round about, that Joshua waxed old and stricken in age.
Jos 23:2
And Joshua called for all Israel, and for their elders, and for their heads, and for their judges, and for their officers, and said unto them, I am old and stricken in age:
Click to expand...
According to God's Word he died...he didn't pass over and was buried by an Angel in a secret place where he could not be worshiped! it really is that easy you know.

Its a paradigm shift for you...I get that.

Enoch, Elijah, Moses etc all taken by the Lord.
 
F

F2F

Member
#233
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#233
Job understood this truth! Job 1:21 cmp Job 42:11 ;)
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#234
Mar 1, 2022
18,728
6,437
113
62
#234
F2F said:
Okay getting closer...you say when you are weak God is strong...in what way was Jesus weak?
Click to expand...
I just told you...He was weak because He submitted to God.
 
F

F2F

Member
#235
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#235
@cv5

Consider with me the wonder of Deut 31:2

1. It's his birthday.
2. His life was divided into three equal parts of forty years: the first in Egypt being educated to rule (Acts 7:22-23); the second in
Midian, learning the principles of shepherding (Exod. 7:7); the third in the wilderness, ruling and pasturing the
people.
3. It's the when he spake to the full assembly of the nation's representatives (Deut. 1:3)
4. And the day of his death (Deut. 34:7)
5. And Moses' age covered the same period given to Noah for preaching (Gen. 6:3).

Such perfection only the Divine hand can weave such a wonder!
 
cv5

cv5

Well-known member
#236
Nov 20, 2018
22,546
8,105
113
#236
F2F said:
@cv5

As a side, other than his sin, the second reason he could no longer go in and out of the tent of meeting was God told him he could no longer do so...if you were thinking it was due to his age you would be wrong! Moses was burning with desire to take them over and pleaded with God many times to do so.
Click to expand...
Strong's NT 1525:εἰσέρχομαι, and Thayer's Lexicon under 1a:

" the phrase ἐισέρχεσθαι καί ἐξέρχεσθαι, to go in and out, (the Hebrew וְצֵאת בּוא or reversed וּבוא צֵאת, usually denotes one's whole mode of living and acting, Deuteronomy 28:6; 1 Samuel 29:6, etc.;..... figuratively, of moral pursuits unimpeded by difficulties, John 10:9. " Source: here​
 
V

VARob

Banned
#237
Dec 21, 2020
1,825
474
83
#237
F2F said:
Enoch, Elijah, Moses etc all taken by the Lord.
Click to expand...
Moses was not "taken by the Lord." He died.

For that matter, you're mistaken about Enoch and Elijah, too. God did move Enoch from one place to another to prevent his premature death, but he did die, as Heb 11:5, 13 say. Elijah was taken into the heavens where the birds are, not to where God is. God moved him in rather spectacular fashion from one place to another to underscore the transfer of leadership from Elijah to Elisha.

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

If Moses, Enoch, or Elijah could be taken to heaven before the work of Jesus Christ, then anyone could, and the things he went through for us were not necessary.
 
cv5

cv5

Well-known member
#238
Nov 20, 2018
22,546
8,105
113
#238
VARob said:
For that matter, you're mistaken about Enoch and Elijah, too. God did move Enoch from one place to another to prevent his premature death, but he did die, as Heb 11:5, 13 say. Elijah was taken into the heavens where the birds are, not to where God is. God moved him in rather spectacular fashion from one place to another to underscore the transfer of leadership from Elijah to Elisha.
Click to expand...
What?

Heb 11:5
By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

2Ki 2:11
And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
 
F

F2F

Member
#239
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#239
Cameron143 said:
I just told you...He was weak because He submitted to God.
Click to expand...
Okay let's go a little deeper shall we.
I'm trying to get you to see how you and Jesus share a certain weakness.

"God made the one who did not know sin to be sin for us, so that in him we would become the righteousness of God."

In what way was Jesus weak and made sin for us? 2 Corinthians 5:21

F2F
 
F

F2F

Member
#240
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
#240
cv5 said:
What?

Heb 11:5
By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

2Ki 2:11
And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
Click to expand...
True, Enoch did not "see death" like you are I because he was taken. It's possible Elijah was the same! His life is recorded though with a beginning and an end like all others.

It's an interesting study if you have the time.

F2F
 
You must log in or register to reply here.