Why the king james?

[eternally-gratefull]

In other words, it used the Alexandrian Texts and when they differed from the KJV, they would make slight changes to try and make it sound like the KJV. You know, like Satan did in the garden. Close is not good enough.

"The reader is permitted to make up his or her own mind about the correct reading."

There's the danger, making man the final authority on what God has said.

yet when you hold the KJV above all others. You hold that man (the interpreters of said bible version) has The final authority on what God said.

the problem with trying to hold to a view which is not biblical. is your own arguments start to work against themselves. Because your left with secular arguments, which are always flawed

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

John146,

Have you ever checked one of these out?



Thomas Nelson's KJV / NKJV Parallel Bible is the only center-column reference Bible of its kind. This Bible allows KJV users to experience the readable and accurate New King James Version[SUP]®[/SUP], and it gives NKJV users a direct way to connect with the KJV for detailed study.
Celebrating 400 years of the King James Version, 1611-2011
Features include:

• The full text of the KJV and NKJV, the two best translations for study, in parallel columns
• Easy comparison of the time-honored wording of the KJV with the up-to-date, readable text of the NKJV
• The full translators' notes of the NKJV
• Center-column references that allow comparison of Scripture for maximum understanding

Source: http://smile.amazon.com/dp/1418544701

 

[John146]

No I haven't. I read and understand the KJV just fine. You know why? Because I read and study it. Anyone who takes the time and is willing can easily read it. It's beautifully written like no other book in history. Words are important to compare Scripture to Scripture. You need the right words to make connections. The KJV has it's own built-in dictionary. It defines itself.

John146,

Have you ever checked one of these out?

View attachment 146617

Thomas Nelson's KJV / NKJV Parallel Bible is the only center-column reference Bible of its kind. This Bible allows KJV users to experience the readable and accurate New King James Version[SUP]®[/SUP], and it gives NKJV users a direct way to connect with the KJV for detailed study.
Celebrating 400 years of the King James Version, 1611-2011
Features include:

• The full text of the KJV and NKJV, the two best translations for study, in parallel columns
• Easy comparison of the time-honored wording of the KJV with the up-to-date, readable text of the NKJV
• The full translators' notes of the NKJV
• Center-column references that allow comparison of Scripture for maximum understanding

Source: http://smile.amazon.com/dp/1418544701

 

[fredoheaven]

Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will teach you all things....I believe Him. I trust Him!

Where have you known that The Holy Spirit will teach you all thing so that you believe Him and trust Him?
If you have sources other than the Holy Scriptures (the Final Authority), I just don't know my friend...It so happened it is all written in the Holy Scriptures that's why we believe and trust Him.

 

[fredoheaven]

Hello. Thanks.

I would argue that preservation is not concerned with keeping arrangement and order intact, but more concerned with keeping meaning and message intact.

In other words, it doesn't matter so much what order books of the Bible are presented--but what is important is that the message of these books is preserved.

I hope I answered your question. If not, feel free to ask again!

God is concerned with His words and because message would depend on ones interpretation but "We have a more sure word..."

2 Peter 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

 

[fredoheaven]

No. And I am not fluent in English either. That does not mean I cannot use it or that the translation is better than the original in a principle.

If you want proofs that KJV got some things wrong, there are some:

Matthew 9:13: I will have mercy, and not sacrifice
Hosea 6:6: I desired mercy, and not sacrifice

He will have or He desired? In Greek, both texts say "I will have".

--------

Matthew 4:4: It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God
Deuteronomy 8:3: ...man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live

Present tense of future tense? In Greek, both places say "shall not".

--------

Mark 10:6: But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female
Genesis 1:27: male and female created he them

Made or created? In Greek, both places say "made".

----------

These I have found just in few minutes, there are many others, I tried to pick differences, that can have some impact on teaching, not just some wrong wording or such.
I dont say KJV is a wrong translation or significantly worse than others, but all translations have their biased views, sources etc and got things messed up, there is no "perfect translation".

Hi,

These are easily manage when ask the Holy Spirit to teach you. Have you prayerfully ask the Holy Spirit to to teach or they are just only a third hand or fourth hand pick from the internet... Better study them, you might have the best interpretation on them..

 

[fredoheaven]

All taken from KJV:

Galatians 3:10 ...for it is written,
Cursed [is] every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

Deuteronomy 27:26
Cursed [be] he that confirmeth not [all] the words of this law to do them.

Ups! Not only some wrong word, but possibly quite wrong teaching, in this infallible perfect and inspired translation of Deuteronomy.

Hi,


I think you should have done your assignment here more thoroughly if you have considered other correlating verses such as below instead of just one verse to prove KJV in error. No my frien believe it or not the Holy Spirit says on the Hebrew quwm as “confrimeth” or “confirm” with a basic meaning of continue which the same Holy Spirit guided Apostle Paul to wrote “continueth” or “continue” in Galatians . Actually, you have just disregarded the Greek evidence on this matter by your mere guesswork. Believe the Word, OT says in below passage means obedience (continuing) means blessing, disobedience (continueth not) on the other hand brought curse. So this is what Paul means …


Deu 11:26-28


Deut. 11:26 Behold, I set before you this day a blessing and a curse;
27 A blessing, if ye obey the commandments of the LORD your God, which I command you this day:
28 And a curse, if ye will not obey the commandments of the LORD your God, but turn aside out of the way which I command you this day, to go after other gods, which ye have not known.

[FONT=&quot] Just for reference on Strong not as Final Authority: The KJV translates [/FONT][FONT=&quot]quwm[/FONT][FONT=&quot] H6965 in the following manner:[/FONT][FONT=&quot] (stood, rise, etc...) up (240x), arise (211x), raise (47x), establish (27x), stand (27x), perform (25x), confirm (9x), again (5x), set (5x), stablish (3x), surely (3x), continue (3x), sure (2x), abide (1x), accomplish (1x), misc (19x).[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Outline of Biblical Usage [?][/FONT]

1. [FONT=&quot]to rise, arise, stand, rise up, stand up[/FONT]
   1. [FONT=&quot](Qal)[/FONT]
      1. [FONT=&quot]to arise[/FONT]
      2. [FONT=&quot]to arise (hostile sense)[/FONT]
      3. [FONT=&quot]to arise, become powerful[/FONT]
      4. [FONT=&quot]to arise, come on the scene[/FONT]
      5. [FONT=&quot]to stand[/FONT]
         1. [FONT=&quot]to maintain oneself[/FONT]
         2. [FONT=&quot]to be established, be confirmed[/FONT]
         3. [FONT=&quot]to stand, endure[/FONT]
         4. [FONT=&quot]to be fixed[/FONT]
         5. [FONT=&quot]to be valid[/FONT]
         6. [FONT=&quot]to be proven[/FONT]
         7. [FONT=&quot]to be fulfilled[/FONT]

 

[trofimus]

to fredoheaven:

You missed the point. I didnt say that it is impossible to invent some theological explanation, why it is ok to drop the "Lord" word or to change tense, verb etc.

My point was, that if KJV is infallible and "word to word perfectly inspired", it should not CHANGE the words of Scripture.

 

[fredoheaven]

to fredoheaven:

You missed the point. I didnt say that it is impossible to invent some theological explanation, why it is ok to drop the "Lord" word or to change tense, verb etc.

My point was, that if KJV is infallible and "word to word perfectly inspired", it should not CHANGE the words of Scripture.

Hi,

Then again there is no "word for word perfectly inspired" translation. FYI KJV isn't a "word for word translation".
Sorry my friend...

 

[trofimus]

Hi,

Then again there is no "word for word perfectly inspired" translation. FYI KJV isn't a "word for word translation".
Sorry my friend...

Exactly. That is my point I have proved by my examples.
You do not need to be sorry, because I am not KJV onlyist, its only the topic that this thread is about.

 

[jeremyPJ]

Not to start trouble, but I would love to read the original text after fresh translation into English (5th century AD?)...just to see the changes in wording. There are in many instances considerable changes in what is available today. I consider them all based on God's will. But I am curious like that, on what I might be missing.

As for casual use I prefer the NKJV.

 

[fredoheaven]

to fredoheaven:

You missed the point. I didnt say that it is impossible to invent some theological explanation, why it is ok to drop the "Lord" word or to change tense, verb etc.

My point was, that if KJV is infallible and "word to word perfectly inspired", it should not CHANGE the words of Scripture.

It seems you are trying to suggest the Holy Spirit to what a word be written. No, you could not teach the Holy Spirit with that in mind. Anyway, we can learned more of His Word by His grace. "Study to show thyself approved unto God.." 2Tim. 2:15

God bless you...

 

[fredoheaven]

Hi,

Then again there is no "word for word perfectly inspired" translation. FYI KJV isn't a "word for word translation".
Sorry my friend...

Yep, it does not need to be a "word fpr word" translation to be inspired. KJV is a "...scriptures given by the inspiration of God..."

 

[trofimus]

It seems you are trying to suggest the Holy Spirit to what a word be written. No, you could not teach the Holy Spirit with that in mind. Anyway, we can learned more of His Word by His grace. "Study to show thyself approved unto God.." 2Tim. 2:15

God bless you...

You dont understand. If inspired New testament says "it is written: xyz", then it is the authority on what was really written in Old Testament, so you can check it out.

 

[John146]

Exactly. The "originals" were the very words of God given in the Greek and Hebrew languages. The KJB is the very words of God necessary for the English language. Again, we do not need a word for word translation to have the exact words we need in English.

Yep, it does not need to be a "word fpr word" translation to be inspired. KJV is a "...scriptures given by the inspiration of God..."

 

[trofimus]

Exactly. The "originals" were the very words of God given in the Greek and Hebrew languages. The KJB is the very words of God necessary for the English language. Again, we do not need a word for word translation to have the exact words we need in English.

But KJV should not change the Scripture at will, in NT use one word and different in the OT or even drop the "Lord" name.
Its not "exact" translation, but the benevolent one..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Exactly. The "originals" were the very words of God given in the Greek and Hebrew languages. The KJB is the very words of God necessary for the English language. Again, we do not need a word for word translation to have the exact words we need in English.

Your right, we do not need a word for word. We need an actual literal interpretation. with phrases that make up for the lack of words in the english text.

As an example. A perfect tense verb would be translated not in the past tense, or present tense (as in all english bibles, which are not accurate translations. because they fail to interpret correctly that it is a completed action once for all time)

It is impossible to have a word for word in english, there are not enough english words.

The problem is, If we had an actual expanded literal translation. People would complain it was not a word for word.

The division will never stop.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

No I haven't. I read and understand the KJV just fine. You know why? Because I read and study it. Anyone who takes the time and is willing can easily read it. It's beautifully written like no other book in history. Words are important to compare Scripture to Scripture. You need the right words to make connections. The KJV has it's own built-in dictionary. It defines itself.

I'm sorry. My point was not to imply that you can better understand the KJV with this parallel. My point was to try to encourage you to see for yourself that the NKJV is not an evil version--that it has the same doctrinal soundness as the KJV.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Exactly. The "originals" were the very words of God given in the Greek and Hebrew languages. The KJB is the very words of God necessary for the English language. Again, we do not need a word for word translation to have the exact words we need in English.

In your mind, it makes no sense to have two (or more) reliable Bible translations.
In your mind, it makes more sense that there is only one reliable Bible translation.

Am I accurate?

 

[KJV1611]

What does justified mean?

adjective: justified

• 1. having, done for, or marked by a good or legitimate reason.
  "the doctors were justified in treating her"
  
  
• 2.
  THEOLOGY
  declared or made righteous in the sight of God.
  
  
• 3.
  PRINTING
  having been adjusted so that the print fills a space evenly or forms a straight line at one or both margins.
  "the text is left-justified"
  
  
  Definition #1 & 2 are best for our context here (since we're not talking about print margins).

What does righteous mean?

adjective: righteous

• 1.
  (of a person or conduct) morally right or justifiable; virtuous.
  "he is a good, righteous man, I am sure"
  [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
  [TR]
  [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
  [TD]good, virtuous, upright, upstanding, decent; More[/TD]
  [/TR]
  [/TABLE]
  
  [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
  [TR]
  [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]antonyms:[/TD]
  [TD]sinful, unjustifiable[/TD]
  [/TR]
  [/TABLE]
  
  
  

Righteousness and justification are practically synonyms in this context.

No offense intended... but your problem is not with doctrine but with understanding definitions of words in the English language. I suggest a dictionary to go along with whatever Bible version you are reading.

Abraham could not have been justified - made righteous in the sight of God by his works because that contradicts Galatians 2:16 and the rest of the bible.

Galatians 2:16 KJV
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

So we can throw out the definition as being "made righteous" we can also eliminate justified in printing so we are left with justified as in having done something for a legitimate reason. Abraham's faith was justified (made legitimate) by offering up Isaac.