Women joining the workforce

Depleted · May 31, 2017

Ah, man! It's as good as a picnic. Got to try it just once. lol

Depleted · May 31, 2017

And this is why I so strenuously object to the KJV and its modern counterparts. Many of the words translated represent culture, not universal Biblical principle. King James did not like women, so he made sure women were nothing in the Bible. Phoebe was a "servant" but all the men, for whom the SAME word was used were "deacons." Talk about BAD exegetics!

Then there is that "help meet," or "helper" in Genesis 2:18,20.

"Then the Lord God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit forhim" Gen. 2:18

"The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adamthere was not found a helper fit for him." Gen. 2:20. ESV

All the versions I checked seemed to use this word.But what does the word mean in Hebrew?

Well, the word is kenegdo-ezer. First, kenegdo means "as in front of him." It means the the creation of this "helper" for Adam will correspond to him. Thus the new creation will be neither superior or inferior, but an equal. The creation of this helper will form one half of a polarity and will be to man as the South Pole is to the North Pole. She will be his strongest ally in pursuing God's purposes and his first road block when he veers off course.

Ezer is the really important word here. The word appears 21 time in the OT. It is used twice for the women in Genesis 2:12,20. Three times for nations to whom Israel appealed for military aid, (Isa. 30:5; Eze. 12:14; Daniel 11:34).

But it appears most in relationship to God as Israel's helper - 16 times!

(Ex. 18:4; Deut. 33:7, 26, 29; Psalm 20:2; 33:20; 70:5;89:19; 115:9, 10, 11; 121:1-2; 1234:8; 146:5 Hosea 13:9)

So in fact, not just a "helper" but a STRONG helper. For consistent understanding of words, we do have to check how the word is used in other situations. We cannot change the meanings of words to make it suit our theology. In fact, that is what the translators have done. Certain versions, like the ESV are unabashedly complimentarian, meaning men are in control, women obey. (Oops! I mean, submit, like the bible actually says - a voluntary act!)

All 21 of the times ezer is used in the Bible, it is in a military sense. Israel seeks military aid from her neighbours. God is his people's "shield and defence," "better than chariots and horses," standing sentry watch over his people."

Even Eden fits this pattern. The command to rule and subdue put God's image bearers on high alert that fierce resistance lay ahead. God commanded the man to keep or guard the garden, by using military language later used to the cherubim who guarded the garden with a flaming sword. The reason, of course, is that a powerful Enemy was already plotting an attack.

Putting the facts together, it is obvious that the ezer is a warrior! God deploys the ezer to break the man's aloneness by soldiering with him wholeheartedly and at full strength for God's gracious kingdom. The man needs everything she bring to their global mission.

Someone asked about reading the genealogies a while back. Interesting to find that men were called "Eli-ezer" and "Abi-ezer" and just plan "Ezer." Even a recent Israeli military pilot was called "Ezer Weizman."

So why is this important to the discussion? Descriptions of woman as dependent, needly, vulnerable, deferential, helpless, leaderless, or weak, are simply wrong - the betray cultural biases. The ezer is a warrior! Like the man, she is also God's creative masterpiece - she is fearfully and wonderfully made. The image-bearer responsibilities to reflect God to the world and to rule and subdue on his behalf still rest on her shoulders, too!

In the garden, Adam didn't need someone to do laundry, pick up after him, or manage his home. If Adam must think, decide, protect, or provide for the woman, she actually becomes a burden on him- not much help when you think about it. The kind of help the man needs demands full deployment of her strength, her gifts, and the best she has to offer.

As for the children, there is this myth that the children will be damaged it if their mother does not stay at home. In fact, studies have shown that consistent and loving care is all that young children really need. And yes, that means both parents contributing, loving and sharing the burden of raising the children.

When my children were young, we didn't have enough money to make ends meet. But I had a teaching degree, and I was able to work part time. There was a recession on when I graduated, and even a north community in BC didn't have job openings. I am grateful to God that I was able to spend time with my small children. But when a part time job opening in teaching music opened up, my husband and I agreed it was vital I take the job. Child care was an issue, sadly, because we trusted people in our church who were not fit for the job. But God led me to better babysitters. Were were able to save every penny, and put a downpayment down on a house. We could never have done that if I had not worked.

I look at my children and their spouses. One of my DIL's is a doctor. She works long, hard hours sometimes. But, then she also gets time off - and she choses to spend it with her children. They are in an excellent daycare, so well adjusted and happy. Then, there is my stay-at-home DIL. Those kids are never dressed. She bribes them with chocolate chips. They throw the most terrible temper tantrums. They disobey and mock their parents openly. I pray so much for those kids, because that stay-at-home mom simply doesn't have the smarts to raise those kids properly. I have talked over child raising with her so many times, I almost lost access to my grandkids.

If someone feels that being a stay at home mom is important, and feel God is leading them in that direction, AND you can afford it, then go for it. But, if you are doing it because you feel guilted out, because someone told you a woman is just a "helper" then tell that person you are a warrior of God. Tell them your gifts lie elsewhere.

The thing that probably bothers me most about women not working out of the home, is seeing what it did to my mother. She was an extremely smart woman, with top marks in her high school every year, especially in math. She married my father, and did work - she put my father through university. When his job was secure, she got pregnant, quit her job and never worked again. First, my siblings and I have a LOT of issues. I won't say more, but sometimes I think we would have been much better off being raised by babysitters, and my mom being happy.

And of course, children grow up! So, if your whole world has been taking care of your children in your 20's and 30's and maybe even early 40's, then what? Well, my mom became a neurotic, frustrated, anxious, OCD mess. Her life was empty. True, volunteering might have helped, but she was a woman who needed a good career. And so from age 53, when my much younger sister finally left home, to today - age 87, she has had 34 years of golfing, replaced by sitting in a chair, then a bed when her hip and then knee went, and she couldn't golf anymore. It breaks my heart. Then there was MIL. She was a German housekeeper. But my FIL did most of the caring for the children, when he got home from work. Sad to spend 6 hours a day washing dishes, but housework expands to fill the time, and that is all my MIL had left. When she got old and could not drive, she didn't not even get support and help from her long time church. Very sad!

So, as a warrior, if that helps your family in these difficult times, if it is God's will, then go get the best possible job and career you can find. Perhaps having parents or family babysit is another option. I know several family members that did that, and it certainly benefitted the children.

This stay at home mom, is a 1950's invention, coming out of a buoyant economy and a bad translation of the Bible. I look back at my grandmothers in the 1920's and 1930's and they worked. One grandmother had been a teacher in France, but had to work as a maid in a hotel, cleaning during the depression. Because they couldn't make ends meet! The other grandmother barely spoke English, and she ran a store, a boarding house, and bought up real estate in the downtown area of Edmonton, which she lived on in her retirement, after my grandfather passed away.

Women have ALWAYS worked outside the home. Don't fall for the lies of complimentarians who demand authority to a myth, and something that is simply not in the Bible!

And, I don't know about Canada, but the US government built in women were going to have to work right about in the 70's. Truth was they set up the income tax, so no one would complain about it in years, and so, once inflation hit, eventually the feds would take enough money out of income, that it was likely two people needed to work out of every home. Perfect timing. Dad didn't complain how much they took out, (and he's cheap, so he likes complaining about stuff like that lol), and by the time I was out of college it was time for women to have to work. When government takes 30%-50% of the paycheck away, what else can be done?

renewed_hope · May 31, 2017

We have to remember that women at least in the US were obligated to go to work in the 60s and 70s because they enlisted all of the able men to fight in Vietnam leaving the women to provide for the household. Women loved the power they got for earning their own money and that is where it started becoming a problem. We can still be a Proverbs 31 woman and be out of the house and work....its all in the attitude and whether or not our husband and children come before our job, if not then you seriously have a problem that needs to be fixed.

I believe my "husband" needs to be the primary person making the income for our family, and my job is not as important because I need to take care of things as they came up and care for "our children" schooling, nuturing and disciplining them, but that doesn't mean I can't be educated which I am

Angela53510 · May 31, 2017

renewed_hope said:

I'm glad his arrangement is working for you. That is what is important!

But the OP asked for what God, the Bible says about this. That is what is important, not guilting people out because they want or need to work.

As for the Vietnam War, this also happened in WWII and "Rosie the Riveter."

Rosie the Riveter - World War II - HISTORY.com

This always happens in wars, then women are expected to go back to their "place" in the home! And that can be a big problem.

As for the war in Vietnan, Canada was not involved, so no, women weren't in the work force because of the men being gone. We just worked because the economy was buoyant, we were trained and qualified, and able.

oldethennew · May 31, 2017

oh yes,

after 'rosie the riviter' was through with her most liberating 'jobs',
it was like, 'never again the twain shall meet'...

we took a HUGE blast from satan on that one alone! - just LOOK!!!

melita916 · May 31, 2017

i've been married for little over a month. i moved to a new town, so i am currently not working. husband told me there is no rush, and i am taking my tiiiiime looking for a job lol! jk. i'm just waiting for all my name change stuff to get done lol.

i want to work. i want to contribute to our finances so we can have "wiggle" room. if we have children, then i might be a stay at home mom. we haven't decided yet.

Thelistener7 · May 31, 2017

So basically, its about priorities. It was enlightening. Thank you

SparkleEyes · May 31, 2017

Depleted said:

Amen!! I'd marry you, Depleted, but you're already married and I am a woman...so...!! LOL!!

Depleted · Jun 1, 2017

renewed_hope said:

I am a child of the 60's. (Not to be confused with the hippie generation. That was hubby's generation. He was a young man in the 60's and did enlist before being drafted.) All the dads were home. If they went to war, it was Korea. But, we lived in South Jersey where there are many chemical plants. Working at a chemical plant got you out of the draft. The ones drafted were usually not married when drafted. They were 18.

As for future-hubby? He sent home all but 5 bucks, so his wife and daughter were taken care of. And they lived with her parents. She was working all right, but the type of work required to take care of a baby.

Depleted · Jun 1, 2017

melita916 said:

Mazel tov! I was wondering when you were gonna get hitched, and here you are already hitched.

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