work

[eternally-gratefull]

Work = force x distance

We are commanded to believe into (eis) Christ., not just statically believe in (en) Christ. Into means moving from one place to another (distance), i.e., out of the flesh into Christ. This requires effort on our part, which applied produces work.

I think you missed what he said about what it takes to do work

Work requires force from an outside source to be moved, You can't move yourself.. You must be moved.

Religion teaches we can move ourselves. But when the end result is tabulatied at the end of time, They sadly will see they did not move at all. They stayed in place.

 

[thepsalmist]

the sermon this past weekend at my little congregation was about work.
naturally - it had the focus you might expect, talking about the 'Christian work ethic' how we should consider ourselves to work for God, not men, the Boss with the capital B instead of the boss with the lowercase b, so we should not grumble, or do a poor job, but be faithful and diligent -- and that whatever we find ourselves called into doing for a living, we can represent Christ as good workers, our lives being a witness to how He has performed and is performing a work in us.

but as those of you who know me by now you may expect, post's mind wanders and he doodles on his bulletin and makes what might be odd associations in his mind with the topic. i want to share some of that rambling with you and maybe give you something other than condemning this or that to think about today

so i was thinking of physics -- the speaker opened his teaching with the physical definition . .

the physical definition of work is a force dotted across a distance.

the calculation of the amount of work done involves an active differential of momentum ('a force') acting on a body causing a displacement.
notice that it involves something happening to a thing, and that thing being moved.

two interesting results fall out physically from this definition that i'd like to call attention to in spiritual terms.

• the work done is path-independent. it only matters how far the object is displaced from its original location; not the route it took to get there. if you move a couch upstairs, the work done is the same whether you take it outside and lift it up through a window, haul it right up the stairs, move it across the street first or take it apart and drop it bit by bi through a skylight and then reassemble it.
• if the displacement is zero, no work is done. that is, if the final location is the same as the starting location ((at least in the interval considered)) then the amount of physical work calculated is nil. if you move that couch back downstairs, no work has been accomplished with regard to the couch. also, if you go back home after you go to your job, you've done no work! ((haha!
  
  ))

how does this relate to our life as being found in Christ?

well, consider the work done on us by the Spirit of God. the Father has drawn us to Christ, separating us and calling us out of the world and from darkness, displacing us into the glorious light of His presence, from death into life. if we then return to the things that He brought us out of - in our hearts, our thinking or our actions, then no "work" is calculated, because the displacement is 0 over that interval.

what about path-independence? the preacher said, and it's very true - that with regard to the believer and his everyday vocation, 'what you do is not nearly as important as how you do it' ((see, post was paying attention to the sermon too! haha)) -- referring to scripture like Colossians 3:23 & Ephesians 6:7 -- plying your trade as though for God, not for men, with the attitude and character that reflects service to the Lord rather than an earthly 'boss' -- the heavenly Boss is your employer, no matter what your 'job' is. so is this sentiment an expression of 'path dependence' if we were to calculate spiritual 'work' ?

i'd love to hear your thoughts and comments, and however you may develop this concept more

We take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ.
(2 Corinthians 10:5)

Being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you
will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.
(Philippians 1:6)​

Enjoyed this post Posthuman ... made me smile

This made me think of two things:

- The Israelites wandering the desert for forty years due to disbelief, when their original destination was actually quite near from where they left. They didn't accomplish their work of faith thus accomplished no work and did not reach their destination.

and

- "He who puts his hand to the plow and turns back is not worthy of me" ... this example shows that though someone has begun work, if they fall away and turn back then they have accomplished nothing.

 

[thepsalmist]

the sermon this past weekend at my little congregation was about work.
naturally - it had the focus you might expect, talking about the 'Christian work ethic' how we should consider ourselves to work for God, not men, the Boss with the capital B instead of the boss with the lowercase b, so we should not grumble, or do a poor job, but be faithful and diligent -- and that whatever we find ourselves called into doing for a living, we can represent Christ as good workers, our lives being a witness to how He has performed and is performing a work in us.

but as those of you who know me by now you may expect, post's mind wanders and he doodles on his bulletin and makes what might be odd associations in his mind with the topic. i want to share some of that rambling with you and maybe give you something other than condemning this or that to think about today

so i was thinking of physics -- the speaker opened his teaching with the physical definition . .

the physical definition of work is a force dotted across a distance.

the calculation of the amount of work done involves an active differential of momentum ('a force') acting on a body causing a displacement.
notice that it involves something happening to a thing, and that thing being moved.

two interesting results fall out physically from this definition that i'd like to call attention to in spiritual terms.

• the work done is path-independent. it only matters how far the object is displaced from its original location; not the route it took to get there. if you move a couch upstairs, the work done is the same whether you take it outside and lift it up through a window, haul it right up the stairs, move it across the street first or take it apart and drop it bit by bi through a skylight and then reassemble it.
• if the displacement is zero, no work is done. that is, if the final location is the same as the starting location ((at least in the interval considered)) then the amount of physical work calculated is nil. if you move that couch back downstairs, no work has been accomplished with regard to the couch. also, if you go back home after you go to your job, you've done no work! ((haha!
  
  ))

how does this relate to our life as being found in Christ?

well, consider the work done on us by the Spirit of God. the Father has drawn us to Christ, separating us and calling us out of the world and from darkness, displacing us into the glorious light of His presence, from death into life. if we then return to the things that He brought us out of - in our hearts, our thinking or our actions, then no "work" is calculated, because the displacement is 0 over that interval.

what about path-independence? the preacher said, and it's very true - that with regard to the believer and his everyday vocation, 'what you do is not nearly as important as how you do it' ((see, post was paying attention to the sermon too! haha)) -- referring to scripture like Colossians 3:23 & Ephesians 6:7 -- plying your trade as though for God, not for men, with the attitude and character that reflects service to the Lord rather than an earthly 'boss' -- the heavenly Boss is your employer, no matter what your 'job' is. so is this sentiment an expression of 'path dependence' if we were to calculate spiritual 'work' ?

i'd love to hear your thoughts and comments, and however you may develop this concept more

We take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ.
(2 Corinthians 10:5)

Being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you
will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.
(Philippians 1:6)​

It also made me think that we are the "object" and the Holy Spirit is the one displacing us ...

 

[thepsalmist]

yes, 'work' is done to turn that spiritual bread we eat into useful energy for accomplishing tasks and building up & keeping the body healthy

in physics, you can talk about 'work' in part done by a single force on a single object, or the 'total work' found by summing up the displacements of all objects in a system being considered and all forces applied in the system over some interval.

Great analogy with the calories from the Word.

 

[thepsalmist]

hard work used to be a Christian virtue. how much you could roof, plow, labor in a day. and you were proud of all the work you accomplished at the end of the day and how much money you made from it was not part of the equation. now its measured on how much money you made from it.

[h=3]The Parable of the Bags of Gold Matt 25[/h]14 “Again, it will be like a man going on a journey, who called his servants and entrusted his wealth to them. 15 To one he gave five bags of gold, to another two bags, and to another one bag,[a] each according to his ability. Then he went on his journey. 16 The man who had received five bags of gold went at once and put his money to work and gained five bags more. 17 So also, the one with two bags of gold gained two more. 18 But the man who had received one bag went off, dug a hole in the ground and hid his master’s money.
19 “After a long time the master of those servants returned and settled accounts with them. 20 The man who had received five bags of gold brought the other five. ‘Master,’ he said, ‘you entrusted me with five bags of gold. See, I have gained five more.’
21 “His master replied, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things.Come and share your master’s happiness!’
22 “The man with two bags of gold also came. ‘Master,’ he said, ‘you entrusted me with two bags of gold; see, I have gained two more.’
23 “His master replied, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things.Come and share your master’s happiness!’
24 “Then the man who had received one bag of gold came. ‘Master,’ he said, ‘I knew that you are a hard man, harvesting where you have not sown and gathering where you have not scattered seed. 25 So I was afraid and went out and hid your gold in the ground. See, here is what belongs to you.’
26 “His master replied, ‘You wicked, lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? 27 Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest.
28 “‘So take the bag of gold from him and give it to the one who has ten bags. 29 For whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them. 30 And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

There is an invisible force that causes people to be moved for the good, and it is the Spirit of God. That is why God's Spirit is often shown as like the wind. What happens when the wind blows? It moves things by it's power. But a mighty wind from the Lord can also bring destruction, much like a hurricane does.

But there is also another invisible force, or spirit that causes people to be moved to do and speak evil, which is from the Prince of the power of the air, or the god of this world, the Devil.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

There is an invisible force that causes people to be moved for the good, and it is the Spirit of God. That is why God's Spirit is often shown as like the wind. What happens when the wind blows? It moves things by it's power. But a mighty wind from the Lord can also bring destruction, much like a hurricane does.

But there is also another invisible force, or spirit that causes people to be moved to do and speak evil, which is from the Prince of the power of the air, or the god of this world, the Devil.

The lord is not in the powerful wind; he's in the gentle breeze that persuades men to act right.

And [GOD] said [to Elijah], Thou shalt go forth to-morrow, and shalt stand before the Lord in the mount; behold, the Lord will pass by. And, behold, a great [and] strong wind rending the mountains, and crushing the rocks before the Lord; [but] the Lord [was] not in the wind; and after the wind an earthquake; [but] the Lord [was] not in the earthquake: and after the earthquake a fire; [but] the Lord [was] not in the fire: and after the fire the voice of a gentle breeze - there was the lord. ​ 1 Kings 19:11-12

The wind blows wherever it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.” John 3:8​

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The lord is not in the powerful wind; he's in the gentle breeze that persuades men to act right.

And [GOD] said [to Elijah], Thou shalt go forth to-morrow, and shalt stand before the Lord in the mount; behold, the Lord will pass by. And, behold, a great [and] strong wind rending the mountains, and crushing the rocks before the Lord; [but] the Lord [was] not in the wind; and after the wind an earthquake; [but] the Lord [was] not in the earthquake: and after the earthquake a fire; [but] the Lord [was] not in the fire: and after the fire the voice of a gentle breeze - there was the lord. ​ 1 Kings 19:11-12

The wind blows wherever it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.” John 3:8​

yet look what the slight wind did. It wrent the mountains and crushed the rocks, it basically moved the mountain.

Thats alot of power, if that slight wind can move mountians, How much will it take to move on man or woman? i would not say it is very much power at all

 

[crossnote]

I think you missed what he said about what it takes to do work

Work requires force from an outside source to be moved, You can't move yourself.. You must be moved.

Religion teaches we can move ourselves. But when the end result is tabulatied at the end of time, They sadly will see they did not move at all. They stayed in place.

Sure does in our case...

In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.
(Col 2:11-12)

 

[oldethennew]

ACTS 2:2.
And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of A Rushing Mighty Wind,
and it filled all the house where they were sitting.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

The lord is not in the powerful wind; he's in the gentle breeze that persuades men to act right.

And [GOD] said [to Elijah], Thou shalt go forth to-morrow, and shalt stand before the Lord in the mount; behold, the Lord will pass by. And, behold, a great [and] strong wind rending the mountains, and crushing the rocks before the Lord; [but] the Lord [was] not in the wind; and after the wind an earthquake; [but] the Lord [was] not in the earthquake: and after the earthquake a fire; [but] the Lord [was] not in the fire: and after the fire the voice of a gentle breeze - there was the lord. ​ 1 Kings 19:11-12

The wind blows wherever it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.” John 3:8​

God is Spirit, God's Word is Spirit, and God's Spirit is Spirit, all these are One by the same Spirit, as we also are united as one in them by the same Spirit. So if God is in us by way of His Spirit, then God is in His Spirit.

Also you need to rightly divide between the natural earthly winds shown, from the spiritual heavenly winds as is symbolized many times in scripture.

But God's Spirit is likened oftentimes to the wind....

And the earth [SUP]H776[/SUP] was [SUP]H1961[/SUP] without form, [SUP]H8414[/SUP] and void; [SUP]H922[/SUP] and darkness [SUP]H2822[/SUP] was upon the face [SUP]H6440[/SUP] of the deep. [SUP]H8415[/SUP] And the Spirit [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of God [SUP]H430[/SUP] moved [SUP]H7363[/SUP] upon [SUP]H5921[/SUP] the face [SUP]H6440[/SUP] of the waters. [SUP]H4325[/SUP]

The KJV translates Strongs H7307 in the following manner: Spirit or spirit (232x), wind (92x), breath (27x), side (6x), mind (5x), blast (4x), vain (2x), air (1x), anger (1x), cool (1x), courage (1x),

This verse speaks of the glory of this world passing away by the Spirit of God blowing upon it....

Isaiah 40:7
The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: because the spirit of the Lord bloweth upon it: surely the people is grass.

Here are some more examples of how Gods Spirit (blast and breath H7307) moves things, even brings destruction.....

[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD]Exo 15:8[/TD]
[TD]And with the blast [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of thy nostrils the waters were gathered together, the floods stood upright as an heap, and the depths were congealed in the heart of the sea.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

[/TD]
[TD] 2Sa 22:16And the channels of the sea appeared, the foundations of the world were discovered, at the rebuking of the LORD, at the blast [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of the breath [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of his nostrils.[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

[/TD]
[TD]Job 4:9 By the blast [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of God they perish, and by the breath [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of his nostrils are they consumed.[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[crossnote]

God is Spirit, God's Word is Spirit, and God's Spirit is Spirit, all these are One by the same Spirit, as we also are united as one in them by the same Spirit. So if God is in us by way of His Spirit, then God is in His Spirit.

Also you need to rightly divide between the natural earthly winds shown, from the spiritual heavenly winds as is symbolized many times in scripture.

But God's Spirit is likened oftentimes to the wind....

And the earth [SUP]H776[/SUP] was [SUP]H1961[/SUP] without form, [SUP]H8414[/SUP] and void; [SUP]H922[/SUP] and darkness [SUP]H2822[/SUP] was upon the face [SUP]H6440[/SUP] of the deep. [SUP]H8415[/SUP] And the Spirit [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of God [SUP]H430[/SUP] moved [SUP]H7363[/SUP] upon [SUP]H5921[/SUP] the face [SUP]H6440[/SUP] of the waters. [SUP]H4325[/SUP]

The KJV translates Strongs H7307 in the following manner: Spirit or spirit (232x), wind (92x), breath (27x), side (6x), mind (5x), blast (4x), vain (2x), air (1x), anger (1x), cool (1x), courage (1x),

This verse speaks of the glory of this world passing away by the Spirit of God blowing upon it....

Isaiah 40:7
The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: because the spirit of the Lord bloweth upon it: surely the people is grass.

Here are some more examples of how Gods Spirit (blast and breath H7307) moves things, even brings destruction.....

[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD]Exo 15:8[/TD]
[TD]And with the blast [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of thy nostrils the waters were gathered together, the floods stood upright as an heap, and the depths were congealed in the heart of the sea.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

[/TD]
[TD] 2Sa 22:16And the channels of the sea appeared, the foundations of the world were discovered, at the rebuking of the LORD, at the blast [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of the breath [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of his nostrils.[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

[/TD]
[TD]Job 4:9 By the blast [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of God they perish, and by the breath [SUP]H7307[/SUP] of his nostrils are they consumed.[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

God also took on flesh...

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.
(Joh 1:14)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Sure does in our case...

In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.
(Col 2:11-12)

He said almost the same in Eph, After telling us we are saved by grace through faiht not works.

We are HIS WORKMANSHIP CREATED in Christ Jesus FOR GOOD WORKS.

Its all about Jesus!!

 

[oldethennew]

amen!!!

it's always about JESUS and about our denying our 'old-selves-man', choosing His ways,
and not the 'ways of the world' ANY-MORE...

 

[posthuman]

Work = force x distance

this isn't exactly true -- i passed over it before, because it seemed like a trivial point, and the reason why it's not true is certainly not something you should know unless you are a mathematician or physicist or engineer of some sort . . what you were expressing was right, but the way you expressed it was wrong, just a matter of a symbol ((provided you didn't mean to give the wrong definition, which i am sure you did not)) . . .

. . . but i was thinking about it this morning and now it doesn't seem so trivial, not just mathematically, but because of what it can teach.

there are two common forms of multiplication for vector quantities {a,b}, the cross product 'a × b' and the dot product 'a · b'

these are defined quite differently:

something to note is that a × b has a vector result: a quantity with a direction.
on the other hand a · b results in a scalar: a directionless quantity.

why is this interesting?

recall the definition of work:

work is a dot product. work is a directionless quantity.


as believers, our 'works' do not result in a direction -- they are purely a quantity.

• Q: what quantity is sufficient for us to accomplish to be justified before the holy Most High?
• A: infinity ∞

and our works do not direct us towards heaven -- they cannot; they are are directionless.
so then,

It is by grace you have been saved, through faith — and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God — not by works, so that no one can boast.
(Ephesians 2:8-9) ​

 

[RobbyEarl]

this isn't exactly true -- i passed over it before, because it seemed like a trivial point, and the reason why it's not true is certainly not something you should know unless you are a mathematician or physicist or engineer of some sort . . what you were expressing was right, but the way you expressed it was wrong, just a matter of a symbol ((provided you didn't mean to give the wrong definition, which i am sure you did not)) . . .

. . . but i was thinking about it this morning and now it doesn't seem so trivial, not just mathematically, but because of what it can teach.

there are two common forms of multiplication for vector quantities {a,b}, the cross product 'a × b' and the dot product 'a · b'

these are defined quite differently:

something to note is that a × b has a vector result: a quantity with a direction.
on the other hand a · b results in a scalar: a directionless quantity.

why is this interesting?

recall the definition of work:

work is a dot product. work is a directionless quantity.


as believers, our 'works' do not result in a direction -- they are purely a quantity.

• Q: what quantity is sufficient for us to accomplish to be justified before the holy Most High?
• A: infinity ∞

and our works do not direct us towards heaven -- they cannot; they are are directionless.
so then,

It is by grace you have been saved, through faith — and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God — not by works, so that no one can boast.
(Ephesians 2:8-9) ​

work = putting on your boots and doing what you have to do to feed your kids.

 

[posthuman]

and our works do not direct us towards heaven -- they cannot; they are are directionless.
so then,

It is by grace you have been saved, through faith — and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God — not by works, so that no one can boast.
(Ephesians 2:8-9) ​

instead, we have already been set in motion in the direction, and what works we do contribute to the scalar amplitude, not the direction we are headed.

For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works,
which God prepared in advance for us to do.
(Ephesians 2:10)​

the direction is toward good works, and the our vector was provided by God our Creator and Redeemer, who multiplied grace and peace to us through Jesus Christ our Lord

so i guess what i'm saying is that 1 Peter 1:2 is a cross product?

ha!

 

[posthuman]

work = putting on your boots and doing what you have to do to feed your kids.

He clothed Himself in humanity and did all that was necessary to draw His children toward Him ((the direction​)), to bring them home safely, and provide everything they need to become mature and perfect in all knowledge and righteousness.

Having set aside His glory and put on His 'work clothes' He fully accomplished the work -

"it is finished."
​

- and what shoes were on His feet?
peace with God for mankind, the gospel of good will from Him towards us !!

How beautiful on the mountains are the feet of those who bring good news,
who proclaim peace, who bring good tidings, who proclaim salvation,
who say to Zion, "Your God reigns!"
(Isaiah 52:7)
​

 

[RobbyEarl]

He clothed Himself in humanity and did all that was necessary to draw His children toward Him ((the direction​)), to bring them home safely, and provide everything they need to become mature and perfect in all knowledge and righteousness.

Having set aside His glory and put on His 'work clothes' He fully accomplished the work -

"it is finished."
​

- and what shoes were on His feet?
peace with God for mankind, the gospel of good will from Him towards us !!

How beautiful on the mountains are the feet of those who bring good news,
who proclaim peace, who bring good tidings, who proclaim salvation,
who say to Zion, "Your God reigns!"
(Isaiah 52:7)
​

It doesn't take a mathematical equation to establish work. It only takes faith in what work Jesus did. I love your math and enjoy deciphering it. Until it git's above ten toes (lol). But E=MC2 doesn't save any one.

Consider

Me (M) and Christ saved By (1) and Justified by (2) = Eternal life (E).

so MC2=E Amen.

 

[notmyown]

instead, we have already been set in motion in the direction, and what works we do contribute to the scalar amplitude, not the direction we are headed.

For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works,
which God prepared in advance for us to do.
(Ephesians 2:10)​

the direction is toward good works, and the our vector was provided by God our Creator and Redeemer, who multiplied grace and peace to us through Jesus Christ our Lord

so i guess what i'm saying is that 1 Peter 1:2 is a cross product?

ha!

i just had to look up 'scalar amplitude'.

MIT says it's what 'determines the overall normalization of the two power spectra'.

haha

please can you elaborate as to how this er, works? (spiritually speaking)
orr, it's totally probable i still fail to grasp the meaning of scalar amplitude.