you all have mental issues
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D
Romans 3
9 What then? Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, 10 as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”
13 “Their throat is an open grave;
they use their tongues to deceive.”
“The venom of asps is under their lips.”
14 “Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.”
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 in their paths are ruin and misery,
17 and the way of peace they have not known.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”
19 Now we know that whatever the law says it speaks to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be held accountable to God. 20 For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.
Yeah, he's got it all covered.
9 What then? Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, 10 as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”
13 “Their throat is an open grave;
they use their tongues to deceive.”
“The venom of asps is under their lips.”
14 “Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.”
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 in their paths are ruin and misery,
17 and the way of peace they have not known.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”
19 Now we know that whatever the law says it speaks to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be held accountable to God. 20 For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.
Yeah, he's got it all covered.
U
if she is Christ's, it doesn't simply make sense.
it's downright Just. and Biblical.
eh, don't mind me. been doing a study of the word 'checed' in the Old Testament.
we typically see it translated 'lovingkindness' but i wonder if it might have something to do with God's covenant loyalty to His dear but helpless children?
i have a daughter who goes through periods of a similar struggle. she almost becomes convinced at those times God cannot forgive her. so i try to help her recall to mind all His faithful promises to her in Christ.
and because He is faithful, these times are becoming less severe and fewer in between. it's a battle for her, but she told me a couple of months ago she knows the ultimate battle has already been fought. and won, but not by her.
Who is a God like Him?
it's downright Just. and Biblical.
eh, don't mind me. been doing a study of the word 'checed' in the Old Testament.
we typically see it translated 'lovingkindness' but i wonder if it might have something to do with God's covenant loyalty to His dear but helpless children?
i have a daughter who goes through periods of a similar struggle. she almost becomes convinced at those times God cannot forgive her. so i try to help her recall to mind all His faithful promises to her in Christ.
and because He is faithful, these times are becoming less severe and fewer in between. it's a battle for her, but she told me a couple of months ago she knows the ultimate battle has already been fought. and won, but not by her.
Who is a God like Him?
D
Since that part of my life is over, I'll be the guinea pig for your question.
On July 7, 1999, when I woke up from having my gallbladder removed, my back was in agony. Not exactly the pain I was expecting, and I saw the surgeon's eyes when I shouted "my back is killing me," so not the result he was expecting either. Within 13 hours that pain slipped from my back to right around the middle of my waist in the front and sides. I know what it feels like to be cut, and it wasn't that. I could feel the pain from the spot where my gallbladder was. I expected that pain, so it didn't bother me past what it should, but it wasn't that either. It took me three days to recover sufficiently from the gall bladder removal part. (I could get out of my bed without feeling like a turtle stuck on my back and I didn't have to hold onto the sore spot when I was about to jostle it anymore.) But, I believed them for 10 days that this incredibly big pain settled clear across my waistline from my bottom ribs to just below where a belt would go was from that operation. I took the next four months convincing doctors that it cannot be the gall bladder anymore. They took another 5 months avoiding the obvious reason. (The one they told me 15 years after the fact. They pinched a nerve in my back moving me off the operating table.)
Agonizing pain! The type that made me lie in the middle of the living room rocking back and forth so much that I remember seeing a dead waterbug under the sofa over and over again. Agonizing pain! The type that had me lying in bed face down for hours at a time, because sitting, standing, and lying on my back all made it hurt even more. I would have stood on my head, if I knew how to and it would work. Agonizing pain! The type that has stopped me from doing anything like playing hopscotch when I see a board on a sidewalk anymore, or running, or stomping, and the type that makes me cringe from head to toe even to this day on pain pills when I hit a pothole!
I saw this as the rest of my life. I could not deal with this as the rest of my life and doctors would not give pain pills for pain back then, unless you were going to die from cancer before you had a chance to become addicted to the pills! I could not deal, and yes, a lot of begging to God in that time, but if he answered me, that voice didn't get above the decimals needed to get past OUCH!
I was a believer. I still am. I knew suicide was wrong, but what other choice was there?
So who do I go to if not a shrink? Honestly, I picked shrink for the obvious hope that he could talk someone into giving me something for the pain, until someone figured out the cause and fixed it. Finances ran out before they could figure out what to do -- for the fourth time -- when my LES spasmed shut, my SOD is gone for the number of times they cut that to open it because it was spasming. Pretty much the effects were discovered. Pinching a back nerve causes serious spasming through the beginning of the digestive system. But a colleague's malpractice insurance payment were on the line, so no way was anyone ever going to tell the patient the cause, until she couldn't sue anymore.
I went nuts! I was suicidal. It was because of that level of pain. The only reason I did not kill myself is because I promised hubby I would not. I held on to that thread as long as I could, and fortunately (or God sent, in reality) a new law hit the US on January 1, 2000. "Doctors and hospitals must treat patients with pain." I went to the ER at 6 AM that day -- only waiting for them to get past dealing with all the drunks from the previous night.
So, who should I have gone to and what were they supposed to do for me?
On July 7, 1999, when I woke up from having my gallbladder removed, my back was in agony. Not exactly the pain I was expecting, and I saw the surgeon's eyes when I shouted "my back is killing me," so not the result he was expecting either. Within 13 hours that pain slipped from my back to right around the middle of my waist in the front and sides. I know what it feels like to be cut, and it wasn't that. I could feel the pain from the spot where my gallbladder was. I expected that pain, so it didn't bother me past what it should, but it wasn't that either. It took me three days to recover sufficiently from the gall bladder removal part. (I could get out of my bed without feeling like a turtle stuck on my back and I didn't have to hold onto the sore spot when I was about to jostle it anymore.) But, I believed them for 10 days that this incredibly big pain settled clear across my waistline from my bottom ribs to just below where a belt would go was from that operation. I took the next four months convincing doctors that it cannot be the gall bladder anymore. They took another 5 months avoiding the obvious reason. (The one they told me 15 years after the fact. They pinched a nerve in my back moving me off the operating table.)
Agonizing pain! The type that made me lie in the middle of the living room rocking back and forth so much that I remember seeing a dead waterbug under the sofa over and over again. Agonizing pain! The type that had me lying in bed face down for hours at a time, because sitting, standing, and lying on my back all made it hurt even more. I would have stood on my head, if I knew how to and it would work. Agonizing pain! The type that has stopped me from doing anything like playing hopscotch when I see a board on a sidewalk anymore, or running, or stomping, and the type that makes me cringe from head to toe even to this day on pain pills when I hit a pothole!
I saw this as the rest of my life. I could not deal with this as the rest of my life and doctors would not give pain pills for pain back then, unless you were going to die from cancer before you had a chance to become addicted to the pills! I could not deal, and yes, a lot of begging to God in that time, but if he answered me, that voice didn't get above the decimals needed to get past OUCH!
I was a believer. I still am. I knew suicide was wrong, but what other choice was there?
So who do I go to if not a shrink? Honestly, I picked shrink for the obvious hope that he could talk someone into giving me something for the pain, until someone figured out the cause and fixed it. Finances ran out before they could figure out what to do -- for the fourth time -- when my LES spasmed shut, my SOD is gone for the number of times they cut that to open it because it was spasming. Pretty much the effects were discovered. Pinching a back nerve causes serious spasming through the beginning of the digestive system. But a colleague's malpractice insurance payment were on the line, so no way was anyone ever going to tell the patient the cause, until she couldn't sue anymore.
I went nuts! I was suicidal. It was because of that level of pain. The only reason I did not kill myself is because I promised hubby I would not. I held on to that thread as long as I could, and fortunately (or God sent, in reality) a new law hit the US on January 1, 2000. "Doctors and hospitals must treat patients with pain." I went to the ER at 6 AM that day -- only waiting for them to get past dealing with all the drunks from the previous night.
So, who should I have gone to and what were they supposed to do for me?
D
My back sends messages to my brain that say, "Something is drastically wrong!"
My brain answers by letting me know I'm in pain so deal with the cause.
I cannot. Apparently it is impossible to unpinch a back nerve 17 years after the fact. (I'm not sure it's possible right after either.)
So, the brain is giving me signals I am powerless to resolve.
Which means, darn tooting! NUMB THE PAIN! Strangely, the back has progressively gotten worse, but the pain pills do nothing to ease back pain. They just calm down front-pain to "I can live with it" levels. "Numb the feeling" isn't always a bad idea. How many wait out the pain from burning our fingers? Don't most of us go for the ice?
My brain answers by letting me know I'm in pain so deal with the cause.
I cannot. Apparently it is impossible to unpinch a back nerve 17 years after the fact. (I'm not sure it's possible right after either.)
So, the brain is giving me signals I am powerless to resolve.
Which means, darn tooting! NUMB THE PAIN! Strangely, the back has progressively gotten worse, but the pain pills do nothing to ease back pain. They just calm down front-pain to "I can live with it" levels. "Numb the feeling" isn't always a bad idea. How many wait out the pain from burning our fingers? Don't most of us go for the ice?
oh, forgive me, please! i'm not saying that at all.
this is just the way our daughter is dealing with it, and yes, she has seen a qualified medical professional who happens to be a brother in Christ. she's still seeing him, because she feels it's responsible. she's 24, and it's her decision.
i am against shaming people for struggling with mental/emotional problems. that's just wrong.
it's just i am in favor of totally relying on God. this can take different forms... i think a person can see a doc and still rely on God.
hope that clears it up?
this is just the way our daughter is dealing with it, and yes, she has seen a qualified medical professional who happens to be a brother in Christ. she's still seeing him, because she feels it's responsible. she's 24, and it's her decision.
i am against shaming people for struggling with mental/emotional problems. that's just wrong.
it's just i am in favor of totally relying on God. this can take different forms... i think a person can see a doc and still rely on God.
hope that clears it up?
sometimes we need God to help us through a source like a shrink or a pain specialist. they've been trained in things like how chronic or terribly acute pain affects the brain.... the actual physical part of the body we call the brain.
perhaps, though, there are folks whose emotional pain is being numbed by Prozac?
when it might be better to feel that pain, and see a Biblical counselor about it.
not a pop-psychology-spirit-of-the-age counselor, but an elder or pastor who offers what God says in the Bible for counsel?
eh, maybe this is my O2 sat at 84% talking.
perhaps, though, there are folks whose emotional pain is being numbed by Prozac?
when it might be better to feel that pain, and see a Biblical counselor about it.
not a pop-psychology-spirit-of-the-age counselor, but an elder or pastor who offers what God says in the Bible for counsel?
eh, maybe this is my O2 sat at 84% talking.
So I have anxiety sometimes it gets pretty bad and i sometimes get depressed pretty bad. does that mean I am not a child of GOD? Does that mean I am not saved through him? I believe in God very much and I pray for deliverance from many symptoms of depression and anxiety but have not be relieved from them as of yet. So what is your suggestion on that? In this world this is called mental illness maybe in Gods world I am just being 1 Peter 5:8 - Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
D
sometimes we need God to help us through a source like a shrink or a pain specialist. they've been trained in things like how chronic or terribly acute pain affects the brain.... the actual physical part of the body we call the brain.
perhaps, though, there are folks whose emotional pain is being numbed by Prozac?
when it might be better to feel that pain, and see a Biblical counselor about it.
not a pop-psychology-spirit-of-the-age counselor, but an elder or pastor who offers what God says in the Bible for counsel?
eh, maybe this is my O2 sat at 84% talking.
perhaps, though, there are folks whose emotional pain is being numbed by Prozac?
when it might be better to feel that pain, and see a Biblical counselor about it.
not a pop-psychology-spirit-of-the-age counselor, but an elder or pastor who offers what God says in the Bible for counsel?
eh, maybe this is my O2 sat at 84% talking.
Sometimes people have chronic depression because it's a physiological problem. They may need the Prozac forever. Hubby was depressed because his brother and father died two weeks apart while hubby was divorcing first wife. Oddly enough through a series of events that can only be covered under "God did that" he was introduced to Vitamin B12. That separated the physical part of the depression from the, "well, yeah, that's really depressing, so you're supposed to be depressed" part. He reverts right back to depressed, if he forgets B12 really does something for him.
Even some mental illnesses can be diverted through all sorts of methods. Some can't be. God has to help us, but I've got no problems using drugs if they help, just as long as I don't abuse them.
I really really hate pain -- any kind of pain!
yes to what you said.
i've kinda gotten used to a certain level of pain. physical pain.
not the rocking-back-and-forth-can't-get-out-of-bed pain, but a certain level.
not sure that's normal, but what about me is?
i still go crying to God about other types of pain, though.
'help me, Dad, i have no clue what's happening or how to deal with it!'
because, as you know, i don't process events properly, so it sneaks up on me.
and then i hang on His every Word concerning His 'checed'.
i've kinda gotten used to a certain level of pain. physical pain.
not the rocking-back-and-forth-can't-get-out-of-bed pain, but a certain level.
not sure that's normal, but what about me is?
i still go crying to God about other types of pain, though.
'help me, Dad, i have no clue what's happening or how to deal with it!'
because, as you know, i don't process events properly, so it sneaks up on me.
and then i hang on His every Word concerning His 'checed'.
hey y'all -- i am not trying to "shame" anyone for seeing a doctor over anything or even for taking anti-anxiety or anti-depressant medicine, and i am for sure not saying that every problem is 'spiritual' -- i hope you all understand that.
what i am saying is that i am concerned about how Americans over-medicate -- there are only like 2 countries in the world where it is not illegal for drug companies to run ads on television for their products -- and i'm saying that in some cases people use these things, and seek help from outside the body of Christ, for mental issues that are legitimately spiritually based, and sometimes not even 'issues' at all, but the natural consequences of wrong thinking and wrong actions, and of trying to juggle 10 more things than we are capable of actually juggling.
do we all, or most of us, or some of us anyway, agree that there are cases where that's the truth?
i for sure ain't all against medicine. right now i am on three different kinds of pills because if i wasn't, i wouldn't be able to sit in a chair and read this thread without extreme pain and total lack of concentration.
please don't take me the wrong way about this; i mean well -- but i'm probably not being entirely clear, because i got 'mental issues' of my own, ¡por supuesto!
what i am saying is that i am concerned about how Americans over-medicate -- there are only like 2 countries in the world where it is not illegal for drug companies to run ads on television for their products -- and i'm saying that in some cases people use these things, and seek help from outside the body of Christ, for mental issues that are legitimately spiritually based, and sometimes not even 'issues' at all, but the natural consequences of wrong thinking and wrong actions, and of trying to juggle 10 more things than we are capable of actually juggling.
do we all, or most of us, or some of us anyway, agree that there are cases where that's the truth?
i for sure ain't all against medicine. right now i am on three different kinds of pills because if i wasn't, i wouldn't be able to sit in a chair and read this thread without extreme pain and total lack of concentration.
please don't take me the wrong way about this; i mean well -- but i'm probably not being entirely clear, because i got 'mental issues' of my own, ¡por supuesto!
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D
yes to what you said.
i've kinda gotten used to a certain level of pain. physical pain.
not the rocking-back-and-forth-can't-get-out-of-bed pain, but a certain level.
not sure that's normal, but what about me is?
i still go crying to God about other types of pain, though.
'help me, Dad, i have no clue what's happening or how to deal with it!'
because, as you know, i don't process events properly, so it sneaks up on me.
and then i hang on His every Word concerning His 'checed'.
i've kinda gotten used to a certain level of pain. physical pain.
not the rocking-back-and-forth-can't-get-out-of-bed pain, but a certain level.
not sure that's normal, but what about me is?
i still go crying to God about other types of pain, though.
'help me, Dad, i have no clue what's happening or how to deal with it!'
because, as you know, i don't process events properly, so it sneaks up on me.
and then i hang on His every Word concerning His 'checed'.
Does anyone know how to "properly process?" This is an amazing concept to me!
D
hey y'all -- i am not trying to "shame" anyone for seeing a doctor over anything or even for taking anti-anxiety or anti-depressant medicine, and i am for sure not saying that every problem is 'spiritual' -- i hope you all understand that.
what i am saying is that i am concerned about how Americans over-medicate -- there are only like 2 countries in the world where it is not illegal for drug companies to run ads on television for their products -- and i'm saying that in some cases people use these things, and seek help from outside the body of Christ, for mental issues that are legitimately spiritually based, and sometimes not even 'issues' at all, but the natural consequences of wrong thinking and wrong actions, and of trying to juggle 10 more things than we are capable of actually juggling.
do we all, or most of us, or some of us anyway, agree that there are cases where that's the truth?
i for sure ain't all against medicine. right now i am on three different kinds of pills because if i wasn't, i wouldn't be able to sit in a chair and read this thread without extreme pain and total lack of concentration.
please don't take me the wrong way about this; i mean well -- but i'm probably not being entirely clear, because i got 'mental issues' of my own, ¡por supuesto!
what i am saying is that i am concerned about how Americans over-medicate -- there are only like 2 countries in the world where it is not illegal for drug companies to run ads on television for their products -- and i'm saying that in some cases people use these things, and seek help from outside the body of Christ, for mental issues that are legitimately spiritually based, and sometimes not even 'issues' at all, but the natural consequences of wrong thinking and wrong actions, and of trying to juggle 10 more things than we are capable of actually juggling.
do we all, or most of us, or some of us anyway, agree that there are cases where that's the truth?
i for sure ain't all against medicine. right now i am on three different kinds of pills because if i wasn't, i wouldn't be able to sit in a chair and read this thread without extreme pain and total lack of concentration.
please don't take me the wrong way about this; i mean well -- but i'm probably not being entirely clear, because i got 'mental issues' of my own, ¡por supuesto!
Mick Jagger sang about "Mother's Little Helper" back in the 60's. I suspect some are still doing those drugs. I just don't friend people who think the worst catastrophes in life is the floor squeaks, (heard two neighbors consoling each other over that one last week lol), or somebody said something about the dog barking, or "my daughter is dating." I just don't know those people, and never really put in the effort to find them. I bet it would be a great ministry for someone to go for though.
i always assume i'm the village idiot. i figured healthy individuals had a lock on that sort of stuff.
for me it's weep uncontrollably over a dog food commercial, or fly into a rage at a piece of junk mail.
it isn't till Mark says, what's wrong, that it even occurs to me there could be something more wrong.
by then, i can't remember it either!
thanks for making me feel less alone.
and thanks to post, and to you all, for teaching me there are fewer 'healthy individuals' around than i suspected.