You Say "HYPER GRACE" I Say HYPER SUPER ULTRA INFINITE GRACE!

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Aug 21, 2018
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#1
John 3:16 King James Version (KJV)
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Ephesians 2:8-9 King James Version (KJV)
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Romans 4:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Ephesians 4:30-32 King James Version (KJV)
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Acts 16:30 King James Version (KJV)
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? 31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Acts 13:39 King James Version (KJV)
39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

1 John 3:9 King James Version (KJV)
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
(NEW CREATURE) (NEW MAN, NOT YOUR FLESH)

Romans 7 King James Version (KJV)
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

Romans 3:20 King James Version (KJV)
20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

John 3:36 King James Version (KJV)
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Galatians 5:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Romans 11:6 King James Version (KJV)
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

1 Corinthians 15:50 King James Version (KJV)
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

1 John 5:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
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#2
There are two ditches on the road, legalism and hyper grace, between those 2 ditches is a MOUNTAIN; that mountain is the teachings of Yahshua the Messiah.

John 7:17, “If anyone chooses to do His desire, he shall know concerning the teaching, whether it is from YHWH, or whether I speak from Myself.”

Matthew 10:37-39, “He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me, and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. 38 “And he who does not take up his stake and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. 39 “He who has found his life shall lose it, and he that has lost his life for My sake shall find it.”

John 14:23-26, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our stay with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me. These Words I have spoken to you while still with you. But the Helper, the Set-apart Spirit, whom the Father shall send in My Name, He shall teach you all, and remind you of all that I said to you.”

John 5:43, “I have come in My Father's Name, but you do not follow Me. Let another come in his own name; him you will follow.”

John 8:51 “Truly, truly, I say to you, if anyone guards My Word he shall never see death at all.”
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
113
#3
Matthew 24:45-51, “Who then is a trustworthy and wise servant, whom his master set over his household, to give them food in season? Blessed is that servant whom his master, having come, shall find so doing. Truly, I say to you that he shall set him over all his possessions. But if that evil servant says in his heart, ‘My master is delaying his coming, and begins to beat his fellow servants, and to eat and drink with the drunkards, the master of that servant shall come on a day when he does not expect it, and at an hour he does not know, and shall cut him in two and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites – there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”

Matthew 25:14-30,

14 for it is like a man going from home, who called his own servants and delivered his possessions to them."

15 “And to one he gave five talents, and to another two, and to another one, to each according to his own ability, and went from home."

16 “And he who had received the five talents went and worked with them, and made another five talents."

17 “In the same way, he with the two also, he gained two more."

18 “But he who had received the one went away and dug in the ground, and hid the silver of his master."

19 “And after a long time the master of those servants came and settled accounts with them."

20 “And he who had received five talents came and brought five other talents, saying, ‘Master, you delivered to me five talents. See, I have gained five more talents besides them.’"

21 “And his master said to him, ‘Well done, good and trustworthy servant. You were trustworthy over a little, I shall set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master.’"

22 “Then he who had received two talents came and said, ‘Master, you delivered to me two talents. See, I have gained two more talents besides them.’"

23 “His master said to him, ‘Well done, good and trustworthy servant. You were trustworthy over a little, I shall set you over much. Enter into the joy of your master.’"

24 “And the one who had received the one talent also came and said, ‘Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you have not sown, and gathering where you have not scattered seed,"

25 and being afraid, I went and hid your talent in the ground. See, you have what is yours.’"

26 “And his master answering, said to him, ‘You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown, and gather where I have not scattered seed."

27 Then you should have put my silver with the bankers, and at my coming I would have received back my own with interest."

28 Therefore take away the talent from him, and give it to him who possesses ten talents."

29 ‘For to everyone who possesses, more shall be given, and he shall have overflowingly; but from him who does not possess, even what he possesses shall be taken away.

30 And throw the worthless servant out into the outer darkness – there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’"​
 
Aug 21, 2018
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#4
There are two ditches on the road, legalism and hyper grace, between those 2 ditches is a MOUNTAIN; that mountain is the teachings of Yahshua the Messiah.

John 7:17, “If anyone chooses to do His desire, he shall know concerning the teaching, whether it is from YHWH, or whether I speak from Myself.”

Matthew 10:37-39, “He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me, and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. 38 “And he who does not take up his stake and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. 39 “He who has found his life shall lose it, and he that has lost his life for My sake shall find it.”

John 14:23-26, “יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our stay with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me. These Words I have spoken to you while still with you. But the Helper, the Set-apart Spirit, whom the Father shall send in My Name, He shall teach you all, and remind you of all that I said to you.”

John 5:43, “I have come in My Father's Name, but you do not follow Me. Let another come in his own name; him you will follow.”

John 8:51 “Truly, truly, I say to you, if anyone guards My Word he shall never see death at all.”
Who was Jesus talking to in Matthew? 1st century believers right? To FOLLOW him would be hard and many lost their lives doing so. This is a message for discipleship not salvation. Sirs what must i do to be saved? Believe on the Lord Jesus..
Salvation is bc God loves us not bc we love him again your mixing up salvation and servitude. Also you dont have the KJV but do we love God perfectly as we should? Do we keep His word? There is none righteousness no not one.. You need Gods righteousness imputed onto you be born again
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
113
#5
Who was Jesus talking to in Matthew? 1st century believers right? To FOLLOW him would be hard and many lost their lives doing so. This is a message for discipleship not salvation. Sirs what must i do to be saved? Believe on the Lord Jesus..
Salvation is bc God loves us not bc we love him again your mixing up salvation and servitude. Also you dont have the KJV but do we love God perfectly as we should? Do we keep His word? There is none righteousness no not one.. You need Gods righteousness imputed onto you be born again
I guess we can ignore everything else He said then...

Ohhh, wait.... after His resurrestion He said this:

Matthew 28:19-20, “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

Looks like you can;t throw His words in the trash... Ohh and Acts 3 teaches Deut 18:18-19 as if it still matters.... WOW!

John 6:28-29,28 So they said to Him, “What should we do to work the works of the Mighty One?” יהושע answered and said to them, “This is the work of the Mighty One, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”





Acts 7:37-38, “This is the Mosheh who said to the children of Yisra’yl, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear.’ This is he who was in the assembly in the wilderness with the Messenger who spoke to him on Mount Sinai, and with our fathers, who received the living Words to give to us.”





John/Yahanan 5:46-47, "For had you believed Mosheh, you would have believed Me, for he wrote about Me*. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?"

*Mosheh wrote:

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, “I (YHWH) will raise up for them a Prophet (Yahshua/Jesus) like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it.”

"listen" is word #8085 - שָׁמַעshama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey





John/Yahanan 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”





Acts 3:19-23, “Repent therefore and turn back, for the blotting out of your sins, in order that times of refreshing might come from the presence of the Master, and that He sends יהושע Messiah, pre-appointed for you, whom heaven needs to receive until the times of restoration of all matters, of which the Mighty One spoke through the mouth of all His set-apart prophets since of old. For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.”
 
Aug 21, 2018
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#6
I guess we can ignore everything else He said then...

Ohhh, wait.... after His resurrestion He said this:

Matthew 28:19-20, “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

Looks like you can;t throw His words in the trash... Ohh and Acts 3 teaches Deut 18:18-19 as if it still matters.... WOW!

John 6:28-29,28 So they said to Him, “What should we do to work the works of the Mighty One?” יהושע answered and said to them, “This is the work of the Mighty One, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”





Acts 7:37-38, “This is the Mosheh who said to the children of Yisra’yl, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear.’ This is he who was in the assembly in the wilderness with the Messenger who spoke to him on Mount Sinai, and with our fathers, who received the living Words to give to us.”





John/Yahanan 5:46-47, "For had you believed Mosheh, you would have believed Me, for he wrote about Me*. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?"

*Mosheh wrote:

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, “I (YHWH) will raise up for them a Prophet (Yahshua/Jesus) like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it.”

"listen" is word #8085 - שָׁמַעshama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey





John/Yahanan 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”





Acts 3:19-23, “Repent therefore and turn back, for the blotting out of your sins, in order that times of refreshing might come from the presence of the Master, and that He sends יהושע Messiah, pre-appointed for you, whom heaven needs to receive until the times of restoration of all matters, of which the Mighty One spoke through the mouth of all His set-apart prophets since of old. For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.”
Keep on working for your salvation you obviously deserve God's grace I have no time for your false reprobate gospel
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
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#7
Keep on working for your salvation you obviously deserve God's grace I have no time for your false reprobate gospel
Being a bond slave of the Messiah is not working for salvation, it is following the Master.

Matthew 16:24-26, “Then יהושע said to His disciples, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his stake, and follow Me. For whoever wishes to save his life shall lose it, and whoever loses his life for My sake shall find it. For what is a man profited if he gains all the world, and loses his own life? Or what shall a man give in exchange for his life?"

John/Yahanan 10:27-30, "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they will never perish; neither will any man snatch them out of My hand. My Father, Who gave them to Me, is greater than all; and no man is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand: I and My Father are in accord."
 
Aug 21, 2018
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#8
Being a bond slave of the Messiah is not working for salvation, it is following the Master.

Matthew 16:24-26, “Then יהושע said to His disciples, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his stake, and follow Me. For whoever wishes to save his life shall lose it, and whoever loses his life for My sake shall find it. For what is a man profited if he gains all the world, and loses his own life? Or what shall a man give in exchange for his life?"

John/Yahanan 10:27-30, "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they will never perish; neither will any man snatch them out of My hand. My Father, Who gave them to Me, is greater than all; and no man is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand: I and My Father are in accord."
Your mixing up discipleship with salvation! YOU'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR DAYS! I HOPE YOU CAN HEAR MY WORDS (You might be reprobate). SALVATION IS TO THOSE WHO SIMPLY BELIEVE.. NOT ALL SAVED PEOPLE SERVE.. NOT ALL SERVANTS ARE SAVED! JUDAS WAS A DISCIPLE AND WENT TO HELL. HE FOLLOWED JESUS AND MADE RESTITUTION FOR BETRAYING JESUS' BUT WAS NEVER A BELIEVER. ONLY THOSE WHO BELIEVE THE GOSPEL ARE SAVED. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT YOU DO AND EVERYTHING TO DO WITH WHAT GOD HAS ALREADY DONE AND DOING BC HE'S STILL SAVING TODAY.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
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#9
How I feel about people telling me I'm working for salvation because I want to follow the Messiah...

sheep-and-the-goats custom.jpg
 

ljs

Member
Jan 13, 2018
300
431
63
#10
Your mixing up discipleship with salvation! YOU'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR DAYS! I HOPE YOU CAN HEAR MY WORDS (You might be reprobate). SALVATION IS TO THOSE WHO SIMPLY BELIEVE.. NOT ALL SAVED PEOPLE SERVE.. NOT ALL SERVANTS ARE SAVED! JUDAS WAS A DISCIPLE AND WENT TO HELL. HE FOLLOWED JESUS AND MADE RESTITUTION FOR BETRAYING JESUS' BUT WAS NEVER A BELIEVER. ONLY THOSE WHO BELIEVE THE GOSPEL ARE SAVED. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT YOU DO AND EVERYTHING TO DO WITH WHAT GOD HAS ALREADY DONE AND DOING BC HE'S STILL SAVING TODAY.

I agree with you but , your wasting your time im afraid
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
113
#12
Your mixing up dicipleship with salvation! YOU'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR DAYS! I HOPE YOU CAN HEAR MY WORDS (You might be reprobate). SALVATION IS TO THOSE WHO SIMPLY BELIEVE.. NOT ALL SAVED PEOPLE SERVE.. NOT ALL SERVANTS ARE SAVED! JUDAS WAS A DISCIPLE AND WENT TO HELL. HE FOLLOWED JESUS AND MADE RESTITUTION FOR BETRAYING JESUS' BUT WAS NEVER A BELIEVER. ONLY THOSE WHO BELIEVE THE GOSPEL ARE SAVED. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT YOU DO AND EVERYTHING TO DO WITH WHAT GOD HAS ALREADY DONE AND DOING BC HE'S STILL SAVING TODAY.
Judas was a betrayer...

John 8:51 “Truly, truly, I say to you, if anyone guards My Word he shall never see death at all.”

John 12:25-26, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it remains alone. But if it dies, it bears much fruit. He who loves his life shall lose it, and he who hates his life in this world shall preserve it for everlasting life." Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.”

John/Yahanan 10:16, "And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to My voice. So there will be one flock, one Shepherd (4166 – poimén)."

Maybe you should read those parables I posted above, read these passages, read all the Messiah's words and read Deut 18:18-19.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
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#13
Here I will leave you with this passage, direct words from the King:

John/Yahanan 15:5-16, “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you.”
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
13,529
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#14
Actually it's not easy to believe. Men are proud and to submit to God is very difficult. Jesus said except you came as a little child you cannot enter the kingdom of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
42,009
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#15
Where sins abounds, grace abounds the more<--written unto believers...!!
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
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#16
There are two ditches on the road, legalism and hyper grace, between those 2 ditches is a MOUNTAIN; that mountain is the teachings of Yahshua the Messiah.
I was a part of that long winded discussion on hyper-grace and legalism back then, and what both sides seemed to miss was that both sides wanted holiness and righteousness, only the methods for its attainment were different. Also too, people were mixing together justification and sanctification, putting one before the other. It leads to a works based Gospel when you make sanctification a prerequisite to salvation.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
687
113
#17
I was a part of that long winded discussion on hyper-grace and legalism back then, and what both sides seemed to miss was that both sides wanted holiness and righteousness, only the methods for its attainment were different. Also too, people were mixing together justification and sanctification, putting one before the other. It leads to a works based Gospel when you make sanctification a prerequisite to salvation.
I think being set apart to Yah is a continual process, you know He calls us and if we follow, sanctification will happen. Everything starts with a thought, grows into belief, and matures into His narrow path. After all His Spirit is not going to lead away from Him and His ways.