Paul's Testimony in Chapter 7 of Romans

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lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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#1
One of the most taken out of context section of the Bible is Rom 7:23-25. Please follow along.

But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Chapter seven's context continues into eight. Paul proclaims in verse two of chapter eight His deliverance from the Law of sin and death which he claimed to be in in service to through his flesh in verse 7:23, 25.

For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
(Rom 7:22-25)

Chapter seven's use of the word mind is dealing with head knowledge; knowing the law and desiring to serve it because you know it is good and makes sense to you to do so. This did not work for Paul nor will it work for us. The only way is Jesus Christ.

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
(Rom 8:1-4)

Paul claims he had been Made me free from the law of sin and death. No longer in captivity to the Law of sin which which is in His members. HE HAS BEEN MADE FREE! That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin. (Rom 8:2-4; 6:6,7)

Set free from the Law of sin and death. Our old man crucified with with HIM that the Body of Sin be destroyed. That Hence forth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin through Jesus Christ. Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
(1Pe 2:24 KJV)
 

lightbearer

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Jun 17, 2017
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#2
I love Romans. Quite the letter. In respect to obedience unto righteousness however.

But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith. But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by (the) Faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone; As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

For Christ (the word in the heart and mouth; the Faith in which we speak) is the end of the law (that which is written on parchment and Tables of Stone) for righteousness to every one that believeth. For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them. But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ (the word in the heart and mouth; the Faith in which we speak) down from above: ) Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ (the word in the heart and mouth; the Faith in which we speak) again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word (Christ) is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach.

For GOD has said of old, For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel (those who will stand with GOD) after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws (Christ; the Word) into their mind, and write them in their hearts (and in their Mouths): and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: As was available from the beginning of our LORD calling us to HIS Salvation as noted in Deut 30:6, 10-14.

The LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.
If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul. For this commandment which I command (To hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart) thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? But the word (Christ through which his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, HIS Laws; HIS Word) is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, (and in thy mind) that thou mayest do it.

In so much as we are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; (For it is He that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure)

Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter (not of parchment and of Tables of Stone), but of the spirit; (in the fleshly tables of the heart) for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones (and parchment; the Book of the Law), was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: How shall not the ministration (the Spirit of the Living GOD in the Hearts; true Faith; Christ in us the hope of Glory) of the spirit be rather glorious? For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.




(Rom 7:6; 8:3,4; 9:30-33; 10:4-8; Heb 8:10; Deu 30:6,10-14; 2Co 3:3-5)
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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#3
Romans 7 must be read in context to the surrounding chapters and the context to the letter in general. With that being said let's take a look at Romans chapter 6

1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

God's grace; HIS salvation.

It is His kindness, His favor to and for us, It is His Goodwill, His inclining toward us.

His yearning, His longing compassionate imploring for us to encamp. To abode, to set ourselves down with Him and He with us. It is His Beauty, His appearance, His image and likeness, His joy in us for Sanctification, which is only found in Him through the Gospel. The Kingdom of God; Christ in you, the Hope of Glory.

2 God forbid. (not becoming; NO WAY! Being spoken in the optative mood; action doubtful) How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? (Being spoken in the Indicative mood; a fact)

3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized (Immersed) into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? (Indicative)

Gal 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

4 (Indicative) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as (just like) Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should (Being spoken in the subjunctive; the mood of possibility ) walk in newness of life.

5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin (old man of sin) might be destroyed (rendered entirely idle; Subjunctive mood; the mood of possibility), that henceforth we should not serve sin (present active).

7 For he that is dead is freed from sin. (the Body of Sin; the old man crucified; rendered idle)

8 Now if we be dead (past tense; done deal) with (together with) Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: (Future tense; In the Future in New Heaven and New Earth Rev 21:1)

9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.

11 Likewise reckon (Figure; consider; reason; think; It’s Mood: Imperative. It is a command) ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

A COMMAND; a thus saith the LORD

Phil 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

GOD through Paul goes on to say imperatively; COMMANDINGLY



12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

14 For sin shall not have dominion over you (indicative; a fact): for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

God has favored us with the favor of Christ.

15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid in no way.

16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

17 But God be thanked, that ye were (past tense; the old man; the body of sin) the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

18 Being then made free (VERBAL NOUN) from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
An Indicative FACT For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness. Being spoken in the IMPARATIVE; a command.

20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.

22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. INDICATIVE

2Tim 3:1-4 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;

READ AGAIN 22

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.



23 For the wages (product; ration) of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

(Rom 6:1-23)
 

Hepzibah

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2015
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#4
For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
(Rom 7:22-25)
lightbearer, your theology is in error, if you say that an unconverted man or Jew if applied to Paul, delights in the law of God after the inward man or the spirit of man. No man delights in the law of God in the inward man unless he is converted.

For the Jew, he will accept the law of God as something he must obey outwardly, but the concept of delighting in the spirit is foreign to him and his testimony will be like Paul's as a Pharasee in Phil 3:6 'as for zeal, persecuting the church; as for righteousness based on the law, faultless.'

The passage in question is interpreted by those who follow Holiness doctrine as the man who has come to a crisis of faith, and sees his inability to be the sort of Christian he knows that he should be, and the deliverance thereafter.

Any converted person who is honest will admit that there is a battle going on inside. This battle does not exist in the unconveted/Jew.