Walking With Christ

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
1Tim 6:17 . . Command those who are rich in this present world not to be
conceited or to fix their hope on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who
richly supplies us with all things to enjoy.

In other words; providence is where the real security is because God
controls it rather than market fluctuations.

Webster's defines "conceit" as an excessive appreciation of one's own worth
and/or virtue. It's is all too common for the rich and famous to exhibit an
aristocratic masters-of-the-universe demeanor, so to speak. In other words:
conceited people think of themselves as self-reliant; they don't need God for
anything; no, they can get by just fine without Him. In their mind's eye, only
the weak need religion.

1Tim 6:18-19 . . Command them to do good, to be rich in good works, to
be generous and ready to share, storing up for themselves the treasure of a
good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is
life indeed.

"that which is life indeed" refers to the divine nature about which Peter
wrote at 2Pet 1:4, which offers a lasting return on one's investment.

"He who is gracious to a poor man lends to The Lord, and He will repay him
for his good deed." (Prov 19:17)
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
1Tim 6:20 . . Avoid impious and vain babblings, and oppositions of science
falsely so called:

Not all science is false. However, there are disciplines that fall into a
category called "theoretical" referring to unproven ideas and concepts in
chemistry, astronomy, geology, archeology, medicine, genetics,
paleontology, anthropology, history, literature, physics, engineering,
mathematics, etc.

Impious babbling probably refers to science-sounding arguments
deliberately intended to discredit the Bible.

Vain babbling tells us that science-sounding arguments are futile; defined by
Webster's as trifling and frivolous, i.e. of no real practical use or value.

1Tim 6:20 is especially applicable to informal group discussions, i.e. forums,
bull sessions, and brain storming; conducted by people with a head full of
scientific opinions who likely haven't a clue what they're talking about.

For example: one day at work a man in the break room said it's arrogant to
assume there is no other intelligent life in the universe but that found on
earth. You know why he said that? Because he heard it said first by someone
he admires, ergo: he was perpetuating false science in the form of a
respectable opinion.

People throw that kind of unproven stuff up to Christians all the time in
attempts to debunk their religion and prove that it deserves no more
credibility than myth, superstition, and/or fantasy. But seriously; don't
impossible-to-prove scientific theories deserve the very same labels?
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 1:8a . . Do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord (cf.1Pet
4:16-19)

Christianity is rooted in Jesus Christ. So when people identify themselves as
Christians they're saying that they're his followers; i.e. they're aligned with
him and they accept his teachings and his claims as the God's truth; while at
the same time categorizing themselves as kooks and religious fanatics; and
thus open to mockery and unkind gossip.

It's tough, but we have to bite the bullet lest when we meet Jesus, he gives
us the same look he gave Peter on the night of the Lord's arrest. (Luke
22:61-62)

"If anyone is ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful
generation, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when he comes in his
Father's glory with the holy angels." (Mark 8:38)
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 1:8b . . Don't be ashamed of me his prisoner; but Join with me in
suffering for the gospel, by the power of God.

Peter distanced himself from Christ on the night of the Lord's arrest, no
doubt fearing that if he were to admit to being one of the Lord's associates,
he'd be arrested too. It appears Paul was concerned that Timothy, who was
normally a loyal associate, would do the same to him while he was behind
bars.

The power of God is involved in one's suffering for the gospel when He sets
you up for it.

"For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe on
him, but also to suffer for him." (Phil 1:29)

Suffering for the Gospel doesn't necessarily include imprisonment and/or
martyrdom. The more common forms of suffering are privation, humiliation,
threats, coercion, hunger, loss of friends and family, ostracizing, ridicule,
mockery, harsh criticism, judgmental remarks, insults, intimidation, name
calling, demeaning comments, ugly insinuations, slander, teasing,
harassment, bullying, unfairness, prejudice, intolerance, disassociation,
treachery, and betrayal. In other words: the kinds of stuff that really get you
right down in the gut.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 1:13 . . Hold fast the pattern of sound words which you have heard
from me.

The Greek word for "hold fast" is echo (ekh'-o) which means: to clutch,
cling, or adhere to.

The word for "pattern" is hupotuposis (hoop-ot-oop'-o-sis) which means: a
sketch; viz: a blueprint and/or a schematic diagram.

When Noah was commissioned to build the ark, he wasn't left clueless as to
what it was supposed to look like. God gave him a design to work with. And
when Moses was tasked to fabricate articles of worship for the Tabernacle,
he too was given designs. In other words, Moses and Noah both made
everything according to God-given specifications; viz: Christianity is a God
given religion; He has not left its design to human ingenuity.

What this boils down to is that modern churches have been handed down
from Paul, and to a certain extent from Peter, a God-given pattern for their
operations. When they depart from His pattern, then they are no longer
following Christ; rather, they are attempting to lead him.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 1:14 . . With the help of the Holy Spirit who lives within us; carefully
guard what has been entrusted to you.

This probably refers to congregations whose spiritual welfare is the
responsibility of church officers. The officers found in dereliction of duty are
known as non vigilant watchdogs and self-seeking, incompetent shepherds;
for example:

"Israel's watchmen are blind, they all lack knowledge; they are all mute
dogs, they cannot bark; they lie around and dream, they love to sleep. They
are dogs with mighty appetites; they never have enough. They are
shepherds who lack understanding; they all turn to their own way, each
seeks his own gain." (Isa 56:10-11)

So; exactly what is the "help of the Holy Spirit". Well; I'd say it's a
motivation, to the point of obsession, because i think we can safely assume
that God is never half-hearted about His business, viz: a church officer who
lacks obsession with his congregation's spiritual welfare should probably not
be in a position to influence folks in that way.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:2 . . And the things you have heard me say in the presence of
many witnesses, entrust to reliable men who will also be qualified to teach
others.

Paul's instructions were given to Timothy "in the presence of many
witnesses" indicating that his instructions were never intended to be
privileged information for the eyes-only of an elite category of super saints.
The things he taught were transferred publicly rather than deep inside a
secret chamber whose access was restricted to a special clique.

I also suspect that Paul sand-bagged Timothy. By instructing him in the
hearing of witnesses, Timothy could never fall back on the tiresome old
excuse of saying "I didn't know I was supposed to do that." Well, witnesses
would certainly testify that he did know what he was supposed to do
because they themselves heard Paul instruct him with their own ears.

It's a wise church that fully understands a pastor's duties and responsibilities
just in case a time comes when they need to hold his feet to the fire;
especially a complacent pastor or one that's gotten mixed up in political
activism and civil disobedience. If a church doesn't know what a pastor's
sacred obligations are, then there's no way they can know whether or not
they're getting their money's worth. In my opinion, an ignorant church is a
private pond stocked with hatchery fish.

Paul's directive in this matter was also a practical consideration as nobody
resides forever on this earthen globe. Pastors die; that's just a fact of life.
And they also get diseases like dementia, Parkinson's, and Alzheimer's. It's a
wise pastor busy training his replacements so that all his knowledge and
experience isn't lost to future church generations. Abraham was commended
for this very thing.

"For I have chosen Abraham, in order that he may command his children
and his household after him to keep the way of The Lord." (Gen 18:18-20)

A good example of the result of neglecting to train reliable men in "all the
things you have heard me say" is the church of Laodicea described in Rev
3:14-20.

According to Col 2:1-2 and Col 4:13-16; the Laodicean Christians were at
one time solid believers. But between the time of Paul's writing his letter to
the Colossians, and John writing the 3rd chapter of Revelation, the
congregation meeting in Nymphas' home somehow went dark. It was still
Christian in name, yes; but it no longer followed Christ.

The Laodicean church had all the trappings of a Christian church; except for
one salient feature: the Christ of Christianity wasn't even a member let
alone the captain of its industry. It was literally a christless Christian church.
He's depicted outside the building banging on the door trying to get.
somebody's attention to let him in. Not a single member of that church
followed him, not one; no, not even the senior pastor.

"If anyone loves me, he will keep my word; and my Father will love him, and
we will come to him, and make our abode with him. He who does not love
me does not keep my words; and the word which you hear is not mine, but
the Father's who sent me. (John 14:23-24).
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:3-7 . . Endure hardship with us like a good soldier of Christ Jesus.
No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs-- he wants to
please his commanding officer.

A soldier's primary responsibility is to accomplish the mission assigned by
their commanders. They don't give themselves leave to abandon their posts
to go off on their own personal agenda doing other stuff. Desertion and
dereliction of duty are courts martial offenses.

These days; successful activism depends to a larger and larger extent upon
the participation of evangelical Christians; hence the smart organizers make
recruiting them and their ministers a priority; and their numbers typically
end up in a poll somewhere; thus activists utilize religion as a sort of stamp
of approval for their causes; like the way professional athletes sell their
names to endorse NIKE sports apparel.

Political activism and civil disobedience may seem like every Christian
citizen's duty when a "worthy cause" comes along; but those causes can be
treacherous sirens; leading to a shipwreck of the ministry of a man ordained
to serve Jesus Christ.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:8 . . Remember Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, descendant of
David, according to my gospel

There are Bible-toting missionaries out there going door to door all over the
world teaching that Jesus Christ's crucified dead body wasn't restored to life;
they're saying it's still dead, and his remains are squirreled away somewhere
on Earth in a condition and a location known only to God.

That is NOT the kind of gospel that Christ wants to hear preached about
himself.

Others are adamantly opposed to any ideas that even so much as suggest
that Jesus Christ is David's biological progeny. That too is NOT the kind of
gospel that Christ wants to hear preached about himself. In point of fact, it
is very easy to prove that Jesus Christ is not only David's biological progeny,
but Adam's too.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:14 . . Command them in God's name to stop quarrelling over trifles.

I take it that it's okay to discuss trifles, but not okay to get into food fights
over them.

In a Sean Connery movie titled "The Name Of The Rose" church dignitaries
assembled a meeting of the minds to reach a resolution on a theological
question which was: Did the Christ own the clothes that he wore or not?

Well, needless to say, the discussion turned into bickering wherein nothing
was resolved. Tempers flared, shouting ensued, feelings were hurt, and
people were alienated over the issue-- a rather meaningless issue; which is
precisely what it means to fiddle while Rome burns down around you.

Christians are often embroiled in arguments over things that in the grand
scheme of things have almost zero importance while all around them are
weightier matters begging their attention.

It's interesting that Paul didn't want Timothy's flock instructed to avoid
quarreling over trifles, rather, to stop. I can't help but wonder how many
Christians think to seek absolution for the sin of quarreling over trifles when
they go to God in prayer.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:15 . . Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker
who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Some folks construe rightly dividing the truth as instructions to keep the Old
Testament completely separate from the New. But that's not even close to
what Paul is instructing.

He was a blue collar tradesman: Paul fabricated portable shelters for a living
(Acts 18:3). The Greek word for "rightly dividing" is orthotomeo (or-thot
om-eh'-o) which means: to make a straight cut-- as opposed to a crooked
cut --or a cut that misses the line and yields a piece of material that's either
too long, too short, or the wrong contour; thus resulting in a tent whose
pieces won't join properly when it comes time to sew them together. The
results? A distorted tent and a black mark for the craftsman.

The intent is not one of severing the Bible in half and treating each as a
separate book, nor of breaking the New Testament in two pieces with the
gospels in one and the epistles in the other; but to be accurate in the
whole's interpretations and applications so that it all fits together perfectly
from first to last, like a well made armoire instead of a hastily constructed
rabbit hutch.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:16 . . Avoid worldly, empty chatter; for it will lead to further impiety.

The Greek word for "worldly" refers to heathenism, i.e. secular.

What he's talking about there are bull sessions wherein untrained people
discussing the Bible haven't a clue what they're talking about; and their
perpetual deliberations-- consisting of sophistry, conjecture, theory, and
personal opinions --never get to the bottom of anything.

Well, truth isn't meant to be learned by means of discussion; it's meant to
be learned by instruction, taught by someone especially enabled by God for
that purpose. (Eph 4:11-14)

"Are all teachers?" (1Cor 12:29)

The answer to that is a great big NO.

Some years ago I was invited to a home Bible study. Before considering his
invitation; I asked the man if his group was led by a competent Bible
teacher. He said: No; we don't have a teacher. The group teaches itself. In
other words: we speak as the Spirit leads us to speak.

They say iron sharpeneth iron. But that doesn't work when both irons are
soft; all they end up doing is chafing each other. That's why files are
hardened and tempered. Well; that man's group lacked a file, so to speak;
so I declined.

NOTE: We're always being pressured by well-meaning ministers to share our
faith with the outside world every chance we get. I highly recommend
exercising some sanctified common sense in that pursuit lest you get
yourself into a discussion with feral brutes whose sole intent is to discredit
Christianity.

"Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you
do, they may trample them under their feet, and then turn and tear you to
pieces." (Matt 7:6)

Be cautious out there. Gauge the listeners carefully before you speak.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:22 . . Flee from youthful lusts, and pursue righteousness, faith,
love and peace, with those who call on The Lord from a pure heart.

The Greek word translated "lusts" is somewhat ambiguous. It can refer to
both inordinate longings and legitimate longings. For example; the same
word is used at Luke 22:15 referring to Christ's desire for one last Passover
dinner with his apostles.

Hippies pursued love and peace but failed because they could obtain neither
except by means of promiscuity and mood-enhancing drugs like marijuana
and LSD.

A "pure" heart is one that's unadulterated; in other words: it's not an
amalgam of good and bad; viz: it's a heart that's whole-heartedly devoted to
pleasing God rather than half-hearted.

Righteousness, Love, Peace, and Purity are all blessing-worthy attributes.

"Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness" (Matt 5:6)

"Blessed are the compassionate" (Matt 5:7)

"Blessed are the pure in heart" (Matt 5:8)

"Blessed are the peaceable" (Matt 5:9)

The Greek word translated "blessed" means fortunate. In other words;
people lacking those attributes are deprived; i.e. in a regrettable spiritual
condition.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:23 . . Refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they
produce debating.

Not all speculation is forbidden; only the kind that's absurd and uneducated.

I seriously doubt that 2Tim 2:23 is addressing one's IQ, but rather, the
propensity of some to shoot from the lip without really knowing what they're
talking about and/or having the slightest basis for their perspective.

So; if Christians are to refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, then they
really ought to avoid spouting their own too.

Anyway, the focus is upon debating which, at its worst, are typically running
gun battles, food fights, and/or perpetual bull sessions that never get to the
bottom of anything.

Classical debates are quite a bit different. Neither side interrupts the other,
nor shouts to be heard, nor strives to get in the last word; rather, opponents
take turns to present what they believe to be evidence supporting their
argument until there comes a sensible point in the discussion when both
sides "rest" which is a legal term for concluding all arguments when neither
side has any new evidence to submit.

Sensible discussion is peaceful and orderly whereas running gun battles,
food fights, and perpetual bull sessions typically deteriorate into quarreling,
anger, frustration, animosity, malice, reciprocity, recriminations,
antagonism, and hurt feelings.

"Conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ." (Phil 1:27)
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:24a . . The Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome

The Greek word translated bond-servant means slave; ether voluntary or
involuntary. Bond servants are different than captive slaves. A bond servant
is typically someone who's entered into a service agreement without
compensation; usually to satisfy a debt.

Although the choice to translate the Greek to indicate a bond servant was
probably done so arbitrarily, it fits the Christian concept of one's allegiance
to Christ.

As regards quarrelling:

Sometimes it's best to follow Han Solo's advice and "let the Wookie win
one". In other words; when one is wise; two are happy. Be the wise one and
pick your fights carefully. Don't expend your energies on hot button topics;
they'll just lead to anger, frustration, demeaning comments, and flaming
remarks.

Especially avoid getting into discussions with obtuse individuals driven by a
rather annoying propensity to challenge everything you say simply because
they thrive on perpetual debating that never gets to the bottom of anything.

Another thing: Do we really have to be right all the time? People are entitled
to a second opinion so let them have one. It's good diplomacy; which can be
defined as skill in handling affairs without arousing hostility, i.e. tact.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 2:24b-26 . . The Lord's servant must . . be kind to all, apt to teach,
patient when wronged, with gentleness correcting those who are in
opposition, if perhaps God may grant them a change of heart leading to the
knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from
the snare of the Devil, having been held captive by him to do his will.

The all in "be kind to all" really should be taken to mean all in Christian
congregations rather than all in the world. The reason being, according to
Eph 4:11-16, Christ doesn't dispense his servants for the world's benefit,
rather, for his body's benefit.

For the above reason; Sunday school teachers need to treat the people in
church who oppose them with the same sympathy and consideration as they
would patients in a mental hospital who lack the faculties to know what
they're doing and/or to think for themselves; hence the instructions to be
kind, gentle, and patient because according to the last words in that
passage, those folks are entangled in a bit of paranormal activity not easily
overcome by argument.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 3:12-15 . .You, however, continue in the things you have learned and
become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them; and that
from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give
you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

The "sacred writings" upon which Timothy cut his teeth are of course the Old
Testament's collection; which Paul affirms is useful to Christians.

"Whatever was written in earlier times was written for our instruction that
we, through patience and the encouragement of the scriptures, might have
hope." (Rom 15:4)

NOTE: The Greek word for "hope" in that passage is elpis (el-pece') which
means: to anticipate (usually with pleasure and confidence). In other words:
elpis hope doesn't crossing its fingers and pray for the best while in the back
of its mind dreading the worst. No; elpis hope has something to look forward
to with the bold unreserved expectation of obtaining it.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 4:1-2 . . I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ
Jesus-- who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and
His kingdom --preach the word; be ready in season and out of season;
reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction.

Preaching and teaching are areas where pastors must take the reins. They
can't wait until their boards take a vote on it. No, the pastor's vote is the
only one that counts because left to themselves, congregations (and boards)
are just like any other flock of dim-witted sheep: they're prone to wander.

"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but
wanting to have their ears rubbed, they will accumulate for themselves
teachers in accordance with their own desires; and will turn away their ears
from the truth, and will turn aside to fiction." (2Tim 4:3-4)

Once somebody adopts an error for themselves as the God's truth, they like
to hear it reinforced, over and over again so they feel good about
themselves rather than feeling like a fool for thinking a certain way.

That mindset is very difficult to correct. So, like it's said; the best remedy is
prevention; hence the instruction to "preach the word' lest by preaching
something else a pastor's congregation gets their heads full of wrong ideas,
and from then on they tune out everything that opposes those ideas and/or
fails to reinforce them.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 4:5a . . Be discreet

Webster's defines "discreet" as: using good judgment, caution, and
prudence.

Human nature can be so inconsistent. Though most adults have fairly good
judgment, they oftentimes do things that are contrary to their better
judgment and make foolish choices (especially on Black Friday) because they
don't always use their heads but instead yield to their feelings; and
everybody knows that one's feelings, by and large, are mostly incoherent.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,792
1,069
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
.
2Tim 4:5b . . endure hardship

Some of the aspects of hardship are adversity, mischance, misfortune;
danger, hazard, peril; affliction, trial, tribulation; drudgery, toil, travail;
discomfort, and distress. Feelings of isolation and loneliness are a part of
that too. Nobody really cares to sympathize with somebody when they're at
the top of the food chain. Pastors comfort others, but who comforts the
pastors? Hardly anybody; though maybe his wife; if she's the type.

The lives of Christ's pastors are not supposed to be a piece of cake. If
they're doing their jobs in a way that pleases The Lord, pastors will have
some struggles. Hardship comes with the turf; it's a given when Christ's
pastors serve him faithfully and effectively.

The reason being that a pastor is essentially a shepherd. Well; according to
Jacob, that job was a rough career path back in the day.

"Thus I was: by day the heat consumed me, and the frost by night, and my
sleep fled from my eyes." (Gen 31:40)

Part of the reason that tending sheep was rough in Jacob's day is because a
shepherd was essentially a security guard, constantly keeping an eye out for
rustlers and predators. That part alone was a 24-7 task; not to mention
monitoring the herd so none of them wandered off; as sheep are prone to
do. It's no wonder Jacob lost a lot of sleep outside in the fields; and when
you throw in exposure to the elements; a shepherd's life was really not one
to be desired.
_