Contraception

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jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
592
113
#21
If I was using the bible literally there is no way one should use any form of contraception



I believe no Christian should use any birth control and this was universally agreed by all Christians less than 100 years ago all the way back to Jewish times before jesus
The problem arises when parents who are very poor (as in a 3rd world country) uses no birth control and just keep having children usually 1 a year, ending up with 10-15 children, and ALL the unfortunate consequences that follows!

Contraception in this case would stop so much terrible suffering to that family, especially the children!

I have absolutely NO problems whatsoever with contraception and the most appropriate measure can and should be used.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,786
2,961
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#22
This is as bad as the quiverful movement. It is like saying I should suffer in pain with Rheumatoid Arthritis because God allowed me to have this dreadful auto-immune disease. There are drugs that mean I can get out of bed, dress myself, and actually function as a productive member of society. Should I be denied these drugs because they weren't available till the 21st century??

God never condemns contraception. Having repeated babies is hard on the body for a woman. I have had 4 children, all wanted, but they have taken a toll on me. I love my kids, but I am glad I was not forced to have baby after baby.

Matt, you have a lot of weird over-literalistic interpretations of the Bible. God expects us to look at each passage in context of the rest of the passage, the chapter and book, and also in context of the time it was written. Under the New Covenant, God has set us free! That means there is no burden to be a baby machine, but rather for a husband and wife to be able to love each other without having to worry about another child.

And no, in Old Testament times, this wasn't available. So men had multiple wives to meet their needs. In the New Testament, marriage is between one man and one woman. That means that a man is to treat that wife with love and care, so she will not be broken by childbirth and erratic protection under so-called "natural" contraception. I know we tried that method and I have 4 children. LOL
 

Joidevivre

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,838
272
83
#23
I know it was many years ago, but all five of my children were conceived even while using contraception methods. Sometimes God breaks through the "barriers".
 
May 9, 2012
1,514
25
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#24
The denominations that usually teach contraception as sinful is Catholicism. Funny, people interpret that situation to refer to birth control but in those days, I'm almost positive they would not have even conceived the idea in the first place...
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
#25
The denominations that usually teach contraception as sinful is Catholicism. Funny, people interpret that situation to refer to birth control but in those days, I'm almost positive they would not have even conceived the idea in the first place...
Contraception is not Birth Control; they are different. Contraception is taking measures to prevent conception (fertilization of an egg). Contraception includes even refraining from conjugation.

Birth Control on the other hand, refers to taking measures to stop babies from being born. Thus it includes contraception, but goes beyond it. Birth control includes murdering babies before they are born.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
#26
This is as bad as the quiverful movement. It is like saying I should suffer in pain with Rheumatoid Arthritis because God allowed me to have this dreadful auto-immune disease. There are drugs that mean I can get out of bed, dress myself, and actually function as a productive member of society. Should I be denied these drugs because they weren't available till the 21st century??

God never condemns contraception. Having repeated babies is hard on the body for a woman. I have had 4 children, all wanted, but they have taken a toll on me. I love my kids, but I am glad I was not forced to have baby after baby.

Matt, you have a lot of weird over-literalistic interpretations of the Bible. God expects us to look at each passage in context of the rest of the passage, the chapter and book, and also in context of the time it was written. Under the New Covenant, God has set us free! That means there is no burden to be a baby machine, but rather for a husband and wife to be able to love each other without having to worry about another child.

And no, in Old Testament times, this wasn't available. So men had multiple wives to meet their needs. In the New Testament, marriage is between one man and one woman. That means that a man is to treat that wife with love and care, so she will not be broken by childbirth and erratic protection under so-called "natural" contraception. I know we tried that method and I have 4 children. LOL
Angela, I am unaware of much dispensational difference as to what is permitted sexually or with regard to having babies.

A man who has more than one wife cannot be an elder in the Church Age. The Biblical ideal of monogamy goes back to creation. But actually I don't think there is any outright ban on a man having more than one wife in the Bible anywhere. But then so much is governed by loving neighbor as self.

It is just that in modern times technology has made it possible to reduce conceptions. It is a New Technology, instead of a New Covenant. Obviously, as you say, one doesn't want to damage one's wife with an abundance of pregnancies. I think my great-great grandmother on one side had 17 children! Poor woman. I think my great-great grandfather was happy to have a large number of boys for his farm.

A major issue brought about by modern technology is that some so-called contraception devices overlap with baby-murder devices. And if a device prevents a fertilized egg from implanting in the womb, that is not really contraception. A given drug might prevent conception mostly -- yet allow fertilization in some cases, but then kill the fertilized egg or zygote.

BTW, I prayed for your arthritis. Sorry you suffer that way.
 
S

sassylady

Guest
#27
I could not understand a Christian couple not having at least a couple of children, but it is still our choice how many we have. We live in a different society, marriages break up, moms work rather than stay home. We are human and have our limits. I never saw it as a sin to have a limit on how many children you feel you should have. If a couple does feel God does not want to practice any birth control, then He will provide a way for them to care for the children.
 
M

Matt1626

Guest
#28
The problem arises when parents who are very poor (as in a 3rd world country) uses no birth control and just keep having children usually 1 a year, ending up with 10-15 children, and ALL the unfortunate consequences that follows!

Contraception in this case would stop so much terrible suffering to that family, especially the children!

I have absolutely NO problems whatsoever with contraception and the most appropriate measure can and should be used.

Both sets of my grandparents never used contraception and only had 5 and 3 kids each it doesn't mean you are having 15 kids on the other hand my mother in law was 1 of 15 and the 17 of them lived in a 900 square foot house in Oklahoma they all did fine
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
53
48
#29
17 people in a 900 square foot house? Thats ridiculous.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#30
A major reason my marriage has lasted is we stopped using contraception three years ago and I stopped treating my wife like an object just to please me because we had to wait
Oh, my goodness! There are no words for what I'm feeling reading your posts.
 
T

TheClimaxWarrior

Guest
#31
I believe no Christian should use any birth control and this was universally agreed by all Christians less than 100 years ago all the way back to Jewish times before jesus
So if you have a wet dream how many Hail Mary's do you perform? ...bahahahahaha

What an invalid post!!!
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#33
i literally have no idea what you are talking about
You have no idea? Now you know how we feel about every one of your posts in this thread!
 
T

TheClimaxWarrior

Guest
#34
i literally have no idea what you are talking about
You act like it's an abomination to wear contraception. I can't believe oh hang on I can. It's CC there are some very weird ones on here. It's like I'm in the Twilight Zone or something of the 3rd Dimension.
 
M

Matt1626

Guest
#35
You act like it's an abomination to wear contraception. I can't believe oh hang on I can. It's CC there are some very weird ones on here. It's like I'm in the Twilight Zone or something of the 3rd Dimension.

All people who claimed to be Christian 100 years ago felt the same way as I do gods word doesn't change
 
T

TheClimaxWarrior

Guest
#36
Who led that? Joseph Smith?
 
T

TheClimaxWarrior

Guest
#37
All people who claimed to be Christian 100 years ago felt the same way as I do gods word doesn't change
Are you a Mormon or JWs or COC?
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
53
48
#38
All people who claimed to be Christian 100 years ago felt the same way as I do gods word doesn't change
To be fair 100 years ago children were also a great source of free labor on farms so using contraceptives would be dumb especially in the south and midwest. They used child labor in factories as well. If it was affecting my bottom line back then I might have been against contraceptives too. The thing is you cant honestly provide a good reason not to other than people didnt use to.
 
S

ServantStrike

Guest
#39
The biggest reason we don't use contraception is most forms are actually abortion inducing such as the pill and iud,

I can say and I don't know why but my wife is much more interested in me since we stopped using contraception
Most forms are not abortifacients. Most forms either are estrogenic compounds which prevent ovulation or are methods that prevent sperm from migrating.

And yes, sometimes those estrogenic compounds drive down libido - which could be why your wife is more interested now that she's off it.

Abstinence within marriage in 100% effective
natural family planning is 95% effective better than birth control
95 percent is not 99 percent, and the link you provided shows 95 percent effective at ensuring conception. That's... not what we're talking about here.

Both sets of my grandparents never used contraception and only had 5 and 3 kids each it doesn't mean you are having 15 kids on the other hand my mother in law was 1 of 15 and the 17 of them lived in a 900 square foot house in Oklahoma they all did fine
The cost of living has gone up - inflation is an ugly thing.

Assuming this family was to grow up in the US in a populated area - lets use the northeast as an example, here's a bit of a reality check. We're talking at least 15-20 grand a year on food. That's not including water to take a 2 minute cold shower (you can forget about hot water), or medical deductibles for child care. If there is any kind of transportation cost to get to work, then it drives the costs up further.

You'd have to be making at least 50k a year gross income, and that's to just barely scrape by, and only if you didn't have to deal with housing costs. If housing was involved, the minumum is going to be closer to 75-100k, and again just scraping by. The food you (and your children) would eat will not be very good (or very nutritious, which is bad for children), nor will it be very plentiful (also bad for children). Medical care will be nonexistent or extremely basic (also bad for children), and clothing (if you can even afford it) is going to be threadbare and of minimal protective value.

So how exactly is the average American supposed to feed and clothe 15 children without relying on taxpayer dollars to keep their children form starving to death.

They can't, which means in your scenario a married couple should have sex until they have had as many kids as they can afford, at which point, their marriage is completely devoid of sex.

That's a pretty tough sale, isn't it?
 
M

Matt1626

Guest
#40
I have an employee who lives on 40,000 in Seattle and has 5 kids and both of his parents living with him