Gay snub Cornish B&B owners lose Supreme Court appeal

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Nov 27, 2013
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A person must abide by the laws of the country they are in, or face that country's criminal justice system.

I can't deny a gay person a chocolate bar in my shop because they are gay. The same way I can't deny an adulterous man and his mistress a night in my B&B because they aren't married. But I can live by my values myself without inflicting them on others.

I don't create obstacles or deny anything to a gay man, the same way I don't deny anything to a cheating spouse, or any 'sinner'. But i am not gay myself.

I wonder if this couple would have denied a prostitute a stay in their hotel should she be looking for a night of shelter, or a tax-man. Maybe a satanist?

'What you do not do for even the least of these, you do not do for me'.
 
Sep 14, 2013
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#3
And so they should lose the court case!

Disgusting behaviour.
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#4
"From Stettin in the Baltic to Trieste in the Adriatic, an iron curtain has descended across the Continent."
- Winston Churchill

It appears that sadly, an iron curtain of a less physical kind has descended upon Britain, and Europe as a whole.
 
Nov 18, 2013
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#5
And so they should lose the court case!

Disgusting behaviour.
There's nothing that is disgusting about their behaviour. They were just naive. For every such obnoxious law, there's a way around it. They just had not engaged in forward planning. Gays, as the sexually immoral, should be shunned in public. I would hesitate to associate with anyone who called themselves a Christian and who either was or who made a habit of socializing with such people.

1Cr 5:11 "But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister, but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people."

They can all be presumed to have been baptized under the Anglican rite. If they are genuinely ignorant of Christianity, fair enough, but most are not but simply categorized as "haters of God." They will get what is coming to them.
 
Nov 18, 2013
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'What you do not do for even the least of these, you do not do for me'.
The key to this is in Matt 25;40 "The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’"

The people who you mentions, gays, prostitutes, tax collectors, satanists, or whatever, are by definition, not "brothers and sisters of mine."
 
Nov 27, 2013
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#7
There's nothing that is disgusting about their behaviour. They were just naive. For every such obnoxious law, there's a way around it. They just had not engaged in forward planning. Gays, as the sexually immoral, should be shunned in public. I would hesitate to associate with anyone who called themselves a Christian and who either was or who made a habit of socializing with such people.

1Cr 5:11 "But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister, but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people."

They can all be presumed to have been baptized under the Anglican rite. If they are genuinely ignorant of Christianity, fair enough, but most are not but simply categorized as "haters of God." They will get what is coming to them.
The key to this is in Matt 25;40 "The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’"

The people who you mentions, gays, prostitutes, tax collectors, satanists, or whatever, are by definition, not "brothers and sisters of mine." - Gjoll



Once again Jesus went out beside the lake. A large crowd came to him, and he began to teach them. 14 As he walked along, he saw Levi son of Alphaeus sitting at the tax collector’s booth. “Follow me,” Jesus told him, and Levi got up and followed him.
15 While Jesus was having dinner at Levi’s house, many tax collectors and sinners were eating with him and his disciples, for there were many who followed him. 16 When the teachers of the law who were Pharisees saw him eating with the sinners and tax collectors, they asked his disciples: “Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?”
17 On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a healer, but the wounded. I have not come for the righteous, but sinners.”


..... You were saying?
 
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Nov 18, 2013
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#8
..... You were saying?
Preaching or teaching the gospel to sinners is one thing. Socializing, eating, being friends with them, for the sake of it, quite another.

Most self professed Christians who claim to have "gay friends" do not in fact preach the gospel to them.

One thing that the Pharisees were not guilty of hypocrisy over was their shunning of tax-collectors.

In any event, Matthew was called to repent and did repent. The topic of this thread is unrepentant sinners. Check out Jude and 2 Peter.
 
Nov 27, 2013
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#9
Preaching or teaching the gospel to sinners is one thing. Socializing, eating, being friends with them, for the sake of it, quite another.

Most self professed Christians who claim to have "gay friends" do not in fact preach the gospel to them.

One thing that the Pharisees were not guilty of hypocrisy over was their shunning of tax-collectors.

In any event, Matthew was called to repent and did repent. The topic of this thread is unrepentant sinners. Check out Jude and 2 Peter.
Again, Jesus' own actions on the matter of 'sinners' and how they are to be treated:

"Now when the Pharisee who had invited him saw it, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, He would have known who and what sort of woman this is who is touching Him, for she is a sinner."
And Jesus answering said to him, "Simon, I have something to say to you."
"And he answered, "What is it, Teacher?"
"A certain creditor had two debtors; one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. When they could not pay, he forgave them both. Now which of them will love him more?"
"Simon answered, "The one, I suppose, to whom he forgave more."
"And He said to him, "You have judged rightly."
"Then turning toward the woman He said to Simon, "Do you see this woman? I entered your house, you gave me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. You gave Me no kiss, but from the time I came in she has not ceased to kiss My feet. You did not anoint My head with oil, but she has anointed My feet with ointment. Therefore I tell you, her sins, which are many, are forgiven, for she loved much; but you who needs forgiven little, loves little."


The person who can bring themselves to forego judgement on others will be loved, and the one who is given such a gift as a person who does not judge them for their sins, will give out much love and forgiveness to others.

Suppose, Gjoll, that I were to judge you as harshly for your sins as you judge a homosexual, could you imagine how little love you might feel in the world? How little you would know what joy is? What forgiveness is? I propose that you put yourself in anothers shoes, because empathy is a starving virtue in our age - lots of people don't know how to embrace it.

That old saying 'consider others as yourself' is forgotten.


 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
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#10
Again, Jesus' own actions on the matter of 'sinners' and how they are to be treated:

"Now when the Pharisee who had invited him saw it, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, He would have known who and what sort of woman this is who is touching Him, for she is a sinner."
And Jesus answering said to him, "Simon, I have something to say to you."
"And he answered, "What is it, Teacher?"
"A certain creditor had two debtors; one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. When they could not pay, he forgave them both. Now which of them will love him more?"
"Simon answered, "The one, I suppose, to whom he forgave more."
"And He said to him, "You have judged rightly."
"Then turning toward the woman He said to Simon, "Do you see this woman? I entered your house, you gave me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. You gave Me no kiss, but from the time I came in she has not ceased to kiss My feet. You did not anoint My head with oil, but she has anointed My feet with ointment. Therefore I tell you, her sins, which are many, are forgiven, for she loved much; but you who needs forgiven little, loves little."


The person who can bring themselves to forego judgement on others will be loved, and the one who is given such a gift as a person who does not judge them for their sins, will give out much love and forgiveness to others.

Suppose, Gjoll, that I were to judge you as harshly for your sins as you judge a homosexual, could you imagine how little love you might feel in the world? How little you would know what joy is? What forgiveness is? I propose that you put yourself in anothers shoes, because empathy is a starving virtue in our age - lots of people don't know how to embrace it.

That old saying 'consider others as yourself' is forgotten.


I don't care what kinds of laws they pass in the U.K.,
but I do care when somebody spouts all kinds of nonsense,
and tries to attribute all kinds of fallacies to Christ.

Jesus DID eat and drink with sinners... with REPENTANT sinners.

Jesus NEVER told ANY sinner it was fine to continue in sin.

The woman in the above quoted story HAD ALREADY REPENTED OF HER SINS.

Maitreya,
You're even using the name of a false messiah, a worldwide deceiver.
You really think that went unnoticed???
People are not going to allow you come in here twisting everything holy into New Age nonsense.
 
Nov 27, 2013
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#11
I don't care what kinds of laws they pass in the U.K.,
but I do care when somebody spouts all kinds of nonsense,
and tries to attribute all kinds of fallacies to Christ.

Jesus DID eat and drink with sinners... with REPENTANT sinners.

Jesus NEVER told ANY sinner it was fine to continue in sin.

The woman in the above quoted story HAD ALREADY REPENTED OF HER SINS.

Maitreya,
You're even using the name of a false messiah, a worldwide deceiver.
You really think that went unnoticed???
People are not going to allow you come in here twisting everything holy into New Age nonsense.

My name is Sanskrit for 'friend'. I chose that name because it comes from a word that means 'loving-kindness'. The showing of love is what being a friend is. Whether it is the name of a false messiah or not, the story is fascinating. A person who will come when the world has forgotten the teachings of kindness, to show the world what kindness is again. I'm not saying I believe it, but it's interesting.

It sounds like someone I know.

MAxwell, you are offended because I like the idea of kindness where there is none left. Why is that offensive? Why do labels precede character in this discussion?

If I change it to 'kindness' will you view me differently?
 
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Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
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#12
I would hesitate to associate with anyone who called themselves a Christian and who either was or who made a habit of socializing with such people.
Thats okay I have some friends that happen to be gay, but none of us would want to be in the company of a bigot like yourself anyways.
 

maxwel

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2013
9,372
2,448
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#13
My name is Sanskrit for 'friend'. I chose that name because it comes from a word that means 'loving-kindness'. The showing of love is what being a friend is. Whether it is the name of a false messiah or not, the story is fascinating. A person who will come when the world has forgotten the teachings of kindness, to show the world what kindness is again. I'm not saying I believe it, but it's interesting.

It sounds like someone I know.

MAxwell, you are offended because I like the idea of kindness where there is none left. Why is that offensive? Why do labels precede character in this discussion?

If I change it to 'kindness' will you view me differently?
Nonsense.

You know exactly who your name refers to, and why you chose it.

Then somebody calls you out on it, and you try to lie about it.




Encyclopedia Britannica:
Maitreya, in Buddhist tradition, the future Buddha, presently a bodhisattva residing in the Tushita heaven, who will descend to earth to preach anew the dharma (“law”) when the teachings of Gautama Buddha have completely decayed. Maitreya is the earliest bodhisattva around whom a cult developed and is mentioned in scriptures from the 3rd century ce. He was accepted by all schools of Buddhism and is still the only bodhisattva generally honoured by the Theravada tradition.


Oxford Dictionary:
Maitreya Syllabification: (Mai·tre·ya)
Pronunciation: /mīˈtrāə/
Buddhism
the Buddha who will appear in the future.



buddhanet.net - Dictionary of Buddhist Terms:
Maitreya
A Bodhisattva now abiding in a heaven realm who in the distant future is due to become the Buddha of the next era. Meaning "The Loving One" or "The Friendly One", Maitreya is first mentioned in the Digha Nikaya of the Pali Tipitaka making him the earliest bodhisattva and the only one mentioned in the text of both the Theravada and the Mahayana traditions. Maitreya is believed to often appear on earth to help people and particularly to teach the Dhamma.

In ancient times during periods of political and social crisis worship of Maitreya would become very fervent and often give rise to millenniumist movements. Like Avalokitesvara, Maitreya is usually depicted as a young prince only he has a stupa in his crown and is sitting on a throne in a 'Western' posture.
See the Maitreya Project Website for a project which is building a large statue of the future Buddha Maitreya in Bodh Gaya, India.


Wikipedia:

The Maitreya or Lord Maitreya is described in Theosophical literature of the late 19th-century and subsequent periods as an advanced spiritual entity and high-ranking member of a hidden Spiritual Hierarchy, the so-called Masters of the Ancient Wisdom. According to Theosophical doctrine, one of the Hierarchy's functions is to oversee the evolution of humankind; in accord with this function the Maitreya is said to hold the so-called Office of the World Teacher. Theosophical texts posit that the purpose of this Office is to facilitate the transfer of knowledge about the true constitution and workings of Existence to humankind. Humanity is thereby assisted on its presumed cyclical, but ever progressive, evolutionary path. Reputedly, one way the knowledge transfer is accomplished is by Maitreya occasionally manifesting or incarnating in the physical realm; the manifested entity then assumes the role of World Teacher of Humankind.

The Theosophical concept of Maitreya has many similarities to the earlier Maitreya doctrine in Buddhism. However, they differ in important aspects, and developed differently. The Theosophical Maitreya has been assimilated or appropriated by a variety of quasi-theosophical and non-theosophical New Age and Esoteric groups and movements. These have added, and advanced, their own interpretations and commentary on the subject.

Maitreya’s incarnations

In Theosophical texts, the Maitreya is said to have had numerous manifestations or incarnations: in the theorized ancient continent of Atlantis; as a Hierophant in Ancient Egypt;[SUP][22][/SUP] as the Hindu deity Krishna;[SUP][23][/SUP] as a high priest in Ancient India;[SUP][24][/SUP] and as Christ during the three years of the Ministry of Jesus.[SUP][23][/SUP]

Later concepts of Maitreya

Following the Krishnamurti debacle, major Theosophical organizations and writers became increasingly muted, at least publicly, on the subject of the reappearance of Maitreya and on the possible next "impulse" from the Spiritual Hierarchy.[SUP][36][/SUP] However the concepts of World Teacher, of a hidden Spiritual Hierarchy, and of Masters of Occult Wisdom as described in Theosophical literature, continued to have vocal supporters. These were found among Theosophical Society members and increasingly, among near-theosophical and non-theosophical New Age adherents.[SUP][38][/SUP]
 
Nov 27, 2013
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#14
Nonsense.

You know exactly who your name refers to, and why you chose it.

Then somebody calls you out on it, and you try to lie about it.




Encyclopedia Britannica:
Maitreya, in Buddhist tradition, the future Buddha, presently a bodhisattva residing in the Tushita heaven, who will descend to earth to preach anew the dharma (“law”) when the teachings of Gautama Buddha have completely decayed. Maitreya is the earliest bodhisattva around whom a cult developed and is mentioned in scriptures from the 3rd century ce. He was accepted by all schools of Buddhism and is still the only bodhisattva generally honoured by the Theravada tradition.


Oxford Dictionary:
Maitreya Syllabification: (Mai·tre·ya)
Pronunciation: /mīˈtrāə/
Buddhism
the Buddha who will appear in the future.



buddhanet.net - Dictionary of Buddhist Terms:
Maitreya
A Bodhisattva now abiding in a heaven realm who in the distant future is due to become the Buddha of the next era. Meaning "The Loving One" or "The Friendly One", Maitreya is first mentioned in the Digha Nikaya of the Pali Tipitaka making him the earliest bodhisattva and the only one mentioned in the text of both the Theravada and the Mahayana traditions. Maitreya is believed to often appear on earth to help people and particularly to teach the Dhamma.

In ancient times during periods of political and social crisis worship of Maitreya would become very fervent and often give rise to millenniumist movements. Like Avalokitesvara, Maitreya is usually depicted as a young prince only he has a stupa in his crown and is sitting on a throne in a 'Western' posture.
See the Maitreya Project Website for a project which is building a large statue of the future Buddha Maitreya in Bodh Gaya, India.


Wikipedia:

The Maitreya or Lord Maitreya is described in Theosophical literature of the late 19th-century and subsequent periods as an advanced spiritual entity and high-ranking member of a hidden Spiritual Hierarchy, the so-called Masters of the Ancient Wisdom. According to Theosophical doctrine, one of the Hierarchy's functions is to oversee the evolution of humankind; in accord with this function the Maitreya is said to hold the so-called Office of the World Teacher. Theosophical texts posit that the purpose of this Office is to facilitate the transfer of knowledge about the true constitution and workings of Existence to humankind. Humanity is thereby assisted on its presumed cyclical, but ever progressive, evolutionary path. Reputedly, one way the knowledge transfer is accomplished is by Maitreya occasionally manifesting or incarnating in the physical realm; the manifested entity then assumes the role of World Teacher of Humankind.

The Theosophical concept of Maitreya has many similarities to the earlier Maitreya doctrine in Buddhism. However, they differ in important aspects, and developed differently. The Theosophical Maitreya has been assimilated or appropriated by a variety of quasi-theosophical and non-theosophical New Age and Esoteric groups and movements. These have added, and advanced, their own interpretations and commentary on the subject.

Maitreya’s incarnations

In Theosophical texts, the Maitreya is said to have had numerous manifestations or incarnations: in the theorized ancient continent of Atlantis; as a Hierophant in Ancient Egypt;[SUP][22][/SUP] as the Hindu deity Krishna;[SUP][23][/SUP] as a high priest in Ancient India;[SUP][24][/SUP] and as Christ during the three years of the Ministry of Jesus.[SUP][23][/SUP]

Later concepts of Maitreya

Following the Krishnamurti debacle, major Theosophical organizations and writers became increasingly muted, at least publicly, on the subject of the reappearance of Maitreya and on the possible next "impulse" from the Spiritual Hierarchy.[SUP][36][/SUP] However the concepts of World Teacher, of a hidden Spiritual Hierarchy, and of Masters of Occult Wisdom as described in Theosophical literature, continued to have vocal supporters. These were found among Theosophical Society members and increasingly, among near-theosophical and non-theosophical New Age adherents.[SUP][38][/SUP]
Maxwell, perhaps if you spent less time trying to attack people and accuse people of ill-will you might learn some of the quality and virtue to which this name attributes itself to:


The name Maitreya (Metteyya in Pāli) is derived from the Sanskrit word maitrī (Pāli: mettā) meaning "loving-kindness", which is in turn derived from the nounmitra (Pāli: mitta) in the sense of "friend".
 

Drett

Senior Member
Feb 16, 2013
1,663
38
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#15
You have elected your leaders. They have made laws representing you. Now you reap what you have collectively sown.
 

Drett

Senior Member
Feb 16, 2013
1,663
38
48
#16
Maxwell, perhaps if you spent less time trying to attack people and accuse people of ill-will you might learn some of the quality and virtue to which this name attributes itself to:


The name Maitreya (Metteyya in Pāli) is derived from the Sanskrit word maitrī (Pāli: mettā) meaning "loving-kindness", which is in turn derived from the nounmitra (Pāli: mitta) in the sense of "friend".
You are not Christian so pick your handle as you wish. I think the name being associated to the reincarnation of Jesus is too much of a coincidence.
 
Nov 18, 2013
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#17
Thats okay I have some friends that happen to be gay, but none of us would want to be in the company of a bigot like yourself anyways.
The word "bigot" does not exist in the bible. It used to have a real meaning in English, like gay, as a proponent of some kind of deluded opinion. Then, as with gay, it became adopted by the gay lobby for their own purposes. It is now predominantly used as a verbal term of abuse by the gay lobby against their political opponents. What does this say about you?

Christianity is all about discrimination. God is found to be a discriminator whenever the gospel is preached. He discriminated against the worldly and idolatrous Egyptians when it came to selecting the nation of Israel. Those who remained in Egypt did not get saved. He discriminates against those whose righteousness is of the world and who account political correctness as a virtue. Those who remain mired in the standards of the world will never be saved. "Do not be deceived God cannot be mocked." (Gal 6;70).

[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD]2Cr 6:17
[/TD]
[TD]"Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you"

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
 

Agricola

Senior Member
Dec 10, 2012
2,638
88
48
#18
The Christian couple running the B&B did not have any hope of winning anything regarding this case. They were foolish to take it to Supreme Court.

Discrimination laws have been around for some time now, which basically say that if you are running a business, you can not deny a person a service based on their political, religious, race, sexual orientation or disability, which is exactly what happened, they broke the law.

It was a stupid argument to say that it was their home and they can say what or what does not go on in it.
 
Jul 25, 2005
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#19
"From Stettin in the Baltic to Trieste in the Adriatic, an iron curtain has descended across the Continent."
- Winston Churchill

It appears that sadly, an iron curtain of a less physical kind has descended upon Britain, and Europe as a whole.
Who are we kidding? It's come to nest over here on the other side of the Atlantic as well. Hopefully there is still time to declare independence against this sort of tyranny.
 
Sep 14, 2013
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#20
See, that's the cost of your faith. You've built a wall around you and your little subgroup of people and don't want any interaction with those outside. What a miserable existence.