PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE GET THE COVID SHOT.

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ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
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I don't trust the FDA either. I'm not sure why he even brought up the FDA when I was speaking specifically about his "sources".
Because it is illegal to mandate a vaccine if the FDA has not given it full approval.
 

Amanuensis

New member
Jun 12, 2021
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The events of the last three days have made me even more resolute in my support of the covid19 vaccinations. Sunday evening my wife had a fever of 104 and could barely move. We took her to the hospital ER where they ran a battery of blood, respiratory, and urinary track tests. They also ran a covid19 test. She had a massive UTI, strep, and covid19. The hospital was full, all but the trauma rooms in the ER were full, and there were people in ER passage way. She need to be hydrated and to have IV antibiotics. The ER doctor admitted her, but kept her in the ER treatment room until they could place her in a room. Our doctor arrived early Monday morning after all the test results were in. He examined her and told us that all her problems were the result of the UTI. Her lungs were clear, and she didn't have strep. She did have a positive covid19 test, but she had no covid19 symptoms. He sent her home with antibiotics and quarantine. After Friday, if she tests negative on two consecutive days, quarantine is over.

Doctor told her that, if she had not been vaccinated, she would be in the critical care unit.

He told us that over 90% of the covid19 patients in the hospital were not vaccinated, and all of the critical care patients were not vaccinated.

For you HCL advocates. My wife has been on it for at least five years.
Praise God your wife got the vaccine. And Praise God He provided us with effective vaccines. This is real. Thanks for sharing. Christians need to quit championing a false cause and get the vaccine. We already have a mission to preach the Gospel to every creature, there is no need to create a false mission of antivaccine crusade in an attempt to make ones life on the internet meaningful or to promote a conspiracy hobby or see how good they are at tricking people into thinking they have knowledge when they are simply spouting total ignorance. Someone might die who listens to their foolish crazy talk.
I am heart broken over the news of pastor Ricky Texada from the Texas mega church dying from COVID this week. I hope Christians will stop propagating ignorance and save their own lives by getting vaccinated. I can't help but wonder how many Christians who have refused the vaccine and died from Covid believed the misinformation from Christian antivaxxers who are passionate about their lies.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
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Oh, it has? By law you cannot approve a vaccine without first disclosing the ingredients. Can you find a list of exactly what is in the vaccine? Please post it for the rest of us, thanks.

My understanding of the FDA document is that they extended the EAU and said that it would receive full approval later this month.

So if you want to quote from the FDA document showing us where this particular vaccine has received full approval that would also be helpful.

Please note that Germany has suspended all licenses and you are not permitted to give any of the Covid vaccines in Germany.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
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This is what this document that you referenced says:

While this and other vaccines have met the FDA’s rigorous, scientific standards for emergency use authorization, as the first FDA-approved COVID-19 vaccine, the public can be very confident that this vaccine meets the high standards for safety, effectiveness, and manufacturing quality the FDA requires of an approved product

Emergency use authorization = EUA You cannot mandate an EUA vaccine.
 

Amanuensis

New member
Jun 12, 2021
24
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Oh, it has? By law you cannot approve a vaccine without first disclosing the ingredients. Can you find a list of exactly what is in the vaccine? Please post it for the rest of us, thanks.

My understanding of the FDA document is that they extended the EAU and said that it would receive full approval later this month.

So if you want to quote from the FDA document showing us where this particular vaccine has received full approval that would also be helpful.

Please note that Germany has suspended all licenses and you are not permitted to give any of the Covid vaccines in Germany.
1) Read the FDA press release from Aug 23... https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-first-covid-19-vaccine
"Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved the first COVID-19 vaccine. The vaccine has been known as the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine, and will now be marketed as Comirnaty (koe-mir’-na-tee), for the prevention of COVID-19 disease in individuals 16 years of age and older. The vaccine also continues to be available under emergency use authorization (EUA), including for individuals 12 through 15 years of age and for the administration of a third dose in certain immunocompromised individuals."

2) A list of ingredients in the vaccine:

Pfizer-BioNTech (mRNA) Moderna (mRNA) Janssen (viral vector)
Active ingredient
Nucleoside-modified mRNA encoding the viral spike (S) glycoprotein of SARS-CoV-2Nucleoside-modified mRNA encoding the viral spike (S) glycoprotein of SARS-CoV-2Recombinant, replication-incompetent Ad26 vector, encoding a stabilized variant of the SARS-CoV-2 Spike (S) protein
Inactive ingredients 2[(polyethylene glycol (PEG))-2000]-N,N-ditetradecylacetamidePEG2000-DMG: 1,2-dimyristoyl-rac-glycerol, methoxypolyethylene glycolPolysorbate-801,2-distearoyl-sn-glycero-3-phosphocholine1,2-distearoyl-sn-glycero-3-phosphocholine2-hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrinCholesterolCholesterolCitric acid monohydrate(4-hydroxybutyl)azanediyl)bis(hexane-6,1-diyl)bis(2-hexyldecanoate)SM-102: heptadecan-9-yl 8-((2-hydroxyethyl) (6-oxo-6-(undecyloxy) hexyl) amino) octanoateTrisodium citrate dihydrateSodium chlorideTromethamineSodium chlorideMonobasic potassium phosphateTromethamine hydrochlorideEthanolPotassium chlorideAcetic acidDibasic sodium phosphate dihydrateSodium acetateSucroseSucrose

* None of the vaccines contain eggs, gelatin, latex, or preservatives. All COVID-19 vaccines are free from metals such as iron, nickel, cobalt, lithium, rare earth alloys or any manufactured products such as microelectronics, electrodes, carbon nanotubes, or nanowire semiconductors.
Note: Both the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines contain polyethylene glycol (PEG). PEG is a primary ingredient in osmotic laxatives and oral bowel preparations for colonoscopy procedures, an inactive ingredient or excipient in many medications, and is used in a process called “pegylation” to improve the therapeutic activity of some medications (including certain chemotherapeutics). Additionally, cross-reactive hypersensitivity between PEG and polysorbates (included as an excipient in some vaccines and other therapeutic agents) can occur. Information on active or inactive ingredients for vaccines and medications can be found in the package insert. CDC’s vaccine excipient summarypdf icon and the National Institutes of Health DailyMed databaseexternal icon can also be used as a resource.

This is not hard people. Why does it seem like some of you are on a religious crusade based on ignorance. Don't you fear God that you will be held accountable to lying and spreading lies? Is there no shame? No worries that you might be spreading false rumors, and propagating conspiracy theories cooked up by evil people who enjoy arguing but don't care if they lie?
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
113
This is not hard people. Why does it seem like some of you are on a religious crusade based on ignorance. Don't you fear God that you will be held accountable to lying and spreading lies? Is there no shame? No worries that you might be spreading false rumors, and propagating conspiracy theories cooked up by evil people who enjoy arguing but don't care if they lie?
It is hard because the list you gave me does not mention Graphene Oxide and two separate labs have independently verified that this is one of the primary ingredients, making up as much as 99% of the "vaccine".

It is hard because the normal protocol to approve a vaccine takes 12 years to make sure there are no long term side effects.

It is hard because Japan has had issues with their vaccine, Germany has suspended the licenses for all vaccines in their country, Israel which has the highest vaccine rate of anyone, not just one shot but those with three shots, and they are seeing their highest rates of hospitalizations.

It is hard because after only 6 months it is apparent that any protection you had is gone and you now need a third shot, and presumably more shots after that.

It is hard because only a few months after telling people they wouldn't mandate the vaccine they are mandating the vaccine, and this follows a long list of whatever they told you six months ago is now the opposite of what they are telling you today.

It is hard because it has been shown that people who recovered from Covid have exponentially greater immunity to the virus than those who are vaccinated and yet for some reason that doesn't count and if you don't get "vaccinate" you will be fired.

It is hard because 99.95% of healthy people who are not elderly survive, we have effective treatments, and yet they are mandating a vaccine that is not effective, is not safe, and is not necessary.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
113
No worries that you might be spreading false rumors, and propagating conspiracy theories cooked up by evil people who enjoy arguing but don't care if they lie?
Look at the title of this thread. The majority of people who are questioning the guidance we are getting concerning this vaccine are not asking anyone to not take it, that is up to you. What is really being propagated is this irrational and unscientific pressure on people to take an experimental vaccine that has not been proven to be safe, regardless of what the FDA says, because it hasn't been out long enough to prove it doesn't have long term effects.

Irrational -- if the vaccine actually imparts immunity then people who are vaccinated would not be threatened by those who aren't.

Unscientific -- the data does not support any of their edicts or mandates.

Why the desperation to get people to take this? Why the coercion? Why the carrot and stick approach?
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
10,188
6,604
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Guess I have to repost some of today’s development stories.

Apparently we now have vaxxers testing positive for Covid, with a fever and aches, yet couldn’t possibly be because the vaccine didn’t work and they got Covid. So here’s the stories again:

From the Governor of West Virginia:

‘We have seen a 25% increase in deaths of people who are FULLY Vaccinated’…

https://citizenfreepress.com/breaki...n-deaths-of-people-who-are-double-vaccinated/

How’s that Pfizer shot working out for you, Israel…
Vaccinated Israel records 10,000+ Covid cases in one day



The vaccination campaign is proceeding at full speed with more than 100,000 shots administered on most days. So far, more than 2.15 million Israelis have received their third shot. On Sunday, anyone over the age of 12 who has been vaccinated for at least five months became eligible for the booster shot.





[/QUOTE]
 

Amanuensis

New member
Jun 12, 2021
24
9
3
It is hard because the list you gave me does not mention Graphene Oxide and two separate labs have independently verified that this is one of the primary ingredients, making up as much as 99% of the "vaccine".

It is hard because the normal protocol to approve a vaccine takes 12 years to make sure there are no long term side effects.

It is hard because Japan has had issues with their vaccine, Germany has suspended the licenses for all vaccines in their country, Israel which has the highest vaccine rate of anyone, not just one shot but those with three shots, and they are seeing their highest rates of hospitalizations.

It is hard because after only 6 months it is apparent that any protection you had is gone and you now need a third shot, and presumably more shots after that.

It is hard because only a few months after telling people they wouldn't mandate the vaccine they are mandating the vaccine, and this follows a long list of whatever they told you six months ago is now the opposite of what they are telling you today.

It is hard because it has been shown that people who recovered from Covid have exponentially greater immunity to the virus than those who are vaccinated and yet for some reason that doesn't count and if you don't get "vaccinate" you will be fired.

It is hard because 99.95% of healthy people who are not elderly survive, we have effective treatments, and yet they are mandating a vaccine that is not effective, is not safe, and is not necessary.
Each point can can be discussed and found to not contradict the science that the vaccine is working for most people who take it.
Most people in critical condition or dying are not vaccinated. There are good scienctific studies out showing that those who survived COVID without vaccination benefit greatly from taking the vaccination.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70..., 2021&deliveryName=USCDC_921-DM63289#T1_down
The science does prove that the vaccine is effective and those that say it does not are just being belligerent at this point. And there is no sense in arguing with them as they will remain belligerent even if all their unvaccinated loved ones die of COVID. They will say it was their time, but it really wasn't, they could have been vaccinated and lived. It is so sad.
 

Smoke

Senior Member
Oct 27, 2016
777
214
43
You dont trust the FDA? Yet you say you trust your doctor. Where does your doctor get his info? You know if you want to get shot up with barely tested or untested drugs go for it but cheerleading for it while distrusting the very agency pushing it is questionable at best.
Who says my doctor trusts the FDA entirely? Do you even know who my doctor is? If not, why do you presume to know what he believes? You realize there are anti vaxxer doctors who are speaking out of the potential dangers of the vaccine.... you probably do... so then you must know you can't put all doctors in a box and assume they all trust the FDA 100%.

I pay my doctor very well so that I can take his medical advice. If you want to get your medical advice from an alt right website, you're free to do so. I am not going to pretend I know more about medicine than my doctor though.
 

Smoke

Senior Member
Oct 27, 2016
777
214
43
The events of the last three days have made me even more resolute in my support of the covid19 vaccinations. Sunday evening my wife had a fever of 104 and could barely move. We took her to the hospital ER where they ran a battery of blood, respiratory, and urinary track tests. They also ran a covid19 test. She had a massive UTI, strep, and covid19. The hospital was full, all but the trauma rooms in the ER were full, and there were people in ER passage way. She need to be hydrated and to have IV antibiotics. The ER doctor admitted her, but kept her in the ER treatment room until they could place her in a room. Our doctor arrived early Monday morning after all the test results were in. He examined her and told us that all her problems were the result of the UTI. Her lungs were clear, and she didn't have strep. She did have a positive covid19 test, but she had no covid19 symptoms. He sent her home with antibiotics and quarantine. After Friday, if she tests negative on two consecutive days, quarantine is over.

Doctor told her that, if she had not been vaccinated, she would be in the critical care unit.

He told us that over 90% of the covid19 patients in the hospital were not vaccinated, and all of the critical care patients were not vaccinated.

For you HCL advocates. My wife has been on it for at least five years.
Brother, I'm sorry for what happened to your wife but I thank our Heavenly Father that covid didn't take her away from you. Be it the vaccine, the HCL, or God Almighty Himself, it's a tremendous blessing she was spared. :giggle:
 

Smoke

Senior Member
Oct 27, 2016
777
214
43
Because it is illegal to mandate a vaccine if the FDA has not given it full approval.
It should be illegal period even with full approval. I mean, there are people who still think the old vaccines cause autism... while I think it is completely unfounded from my research, I don't have the right to force my belief (even if it's backed by a dominant majority of physicians and the science community as a whole) onto someone else's child.
 

Smoke

Senior Member
Oct 27, 2016
777
214
43
Oh, it has? By law you cannot approve a vaccine without first disclosing the ingredients. Can you find a list of exactly what is in the vaccine? Please post it for the rest of us, thanks.

My understanding of the FDA document is that they extended the EAU and said that it would receive full approval later this month.

Please note that Germany has suspended all licenses and you are not permitted to give any of the Covid vaccines in Germany.
I apologize, I thought you were American all this time. But yes, over here in the USA, the FDA did grant full approval of the Pfizer vaccine.

[Please note I am not backing the FDA but rather reporting on facts, devoid from my personal opinion of the FDA or how much credibility they have by their approval of the Pfizer vaccine.]
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
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It should be illegal period even with full approval. I mean, there are people who still think the old vaccines cause autism... while I think it is completely unfounded from my research, I don't have the right to force my belief (even if it's backed by a dominant majority of physicians and the science community as a whole) onto someone else's child.
It has been common practice for a long time.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
113
I apologize, I thought you were American all this time. But yes, over here in the USA, the FDA did grant full approval of the Pfizer vaccine.

[Please note I am not backing the FDA but rather reporting on facts, devoid from my personal opinion of the FDA or how much credibility they have by their approval of the Pfizer vaccine.]
I am under the impression that the "vaccine" that is approved has a different name from the vaccine with the EUA, so if you get a vaccine make sure they are giving you the "approved" one and not the EUA one because from what I have heard they are giving people a "vaccine" with the EUA while publicly telling people a "vaccine" by a different name has full approval.

(PS No problem, I am actually a citizen of the heavens, my home is the embassy for the kingdom of the heavens)
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
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3 For by the grace given me I say to every one of you: Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourself with sober judgment, in accordance with the faith God has distributed to each of you.

The worst part of this debate is that many are thinking more highly of themselves than they ought to. Maybe they think the FDA is more credible than Germany, maybe they think the study they have is more credible than the one in Israel. We need to consider that everyone has received a certain portion of grace.

When you have a situation like this where half the people feel strongly one way and half the people feel strongly the other the answer is not that half the people are fascists, or anti science, or any other broad brush slur. No, the answer is that there is a piece to this puzzle that you are not seeing.

For 200+ years our government for the most part has been concerned about the health of their citizens. It is completely unreasonable to think that they aren't now. Even if you thought the absolute worse about the US it wouldn't make sense that every country would be on board. So those who feel they will just continue to trust the government have a valid point, there would have to be some incredibly dramatic change that no one knows about for this to no longer be true.

On the other hand those that question this "vaccine" have many valid and compelling reasons to be skeptical. Yes, the implication that the government would knowingly force everyone to take a "vaccine" which at best is unnecessary and at worst is a lot worse than that doesn't make sense. However, everything else about this vaccine doesn't make sense either and you have every right to have those questions answered first.

I would say the missing puzzle piece is this meteor shower which will cause catastrophic damage to the world and particularly to the US at the end of this month. That is the existential threat that has all the world governments united, not Covid. That is the puzzle piece that everyone is missing.
 

Amanuensis

New member
Jun 12, 2021
24
9
3
Look at the title of this thread. The majority of people who are questioning the guidance we are getting concerning this vaccine are not asking anyone to not take it, that is up to you. What is really being propagated is this irrational and unscientific pressure on people to take an experimental vaccine that has not been proven to be safe, regardless of what the FDA says, because it hasn't been out long enough to prove it doesn't have long term effects.

Irrational -- if the vaccine actually imparts immunity then people who are vaccinated would not be threatened by those who aren't.

Unscientific -- the data does not support any of their edicts or mandates.

Why the desperation to get people to take this? Why the coercion? Why the carrot and stick approach?
Thinking that the unvaccinated do not threaten the vaccinated sounds right until one sees the actual results being played out in the world right now. It turns out that the unvaccinated are clogging the ICUs and hospitals and the vaccinated are not getting the premium treatment for other illnesses they should be getting and are paying premium insurance rates for because the unvaccinated are in critical condition and getting all the beds. This unnecessary taxing of the limited medical resources because people refuse vaccinations is just ...so unnecessary and sad.

Why get people to get vaccinated? 1) it saves lives and 2) the unvaccinated with COVID occupying all the ICUs unnecessarily is selfish and harms those who can't get the timely treatment and level of medical attention they are paying for because of the unvaccinated. This is a fact. It is happening tonight in America. If all those unvaccinated in the ICUs were vaccinated the majority would not be in the ICU and there would be more available ICUs. FACT.
 

rayzor

Well-known member
Aug 20, 2021
1,827
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I don't know if you were talking to me but if you were then the "they" i was obviously referring to in the context of my message was The NHS (national health service) and what they do to us is try to keep us alive and well
I see that news is nonsensical, fake.And i see that many of us don't remember things.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
5,338
794
113
Thinking that the unvaccinated do not threaten the vaccinated sounds right until one sees the actual results being played out in the world right now. It turns out that the unvaccinated are clogging the ICUs and hospitals and the vaccinated are not getting the premium treatment for other illnesses they should be getting and are paying premium insurance rates for because the unvaccinated are in critical condition and getting all the beds. This unnecessary taxing of the limited medical resources because people refuse vaccinations is just ...so unnecessary and sad.

Why get people to get vaccinated? 1) it saves lives and 2) the unvaccinated with COVID occupying all the ICUs unnecessarily is selfish and harms those who can't get the timely treatment and level of medical attention they are paying for because of the unvaccinated. This is a fact. It is happening tonight in America. If all those unvaccinated in the ICUs were vaccinated the majority would not be in the ICU and there would be more available ICUs. FACT.
I'm just not seeing that. I have seen data that tries to say that, phony data in Florida, graphs from India comparing them to the US that look terrible till you take into account they have 4 times the population of the US.

What I am seeing is hospitals in Israel having a terrible spike and they are all vaccinated with 2-3 shots. I'm seeing the same thing in the UK.

We are obviously looking at very different "data".

I am also seeing great success in treating Covid in India, not with the vaccine but with therapeutics. I have seen evidence that the numbers who died from Covid were artificially inflated with reporting anyone who tested positive for Covid to have died from Covid regardless of how absurd that was. I have seen Cuomo and other governors inflate the numbers by putting contagious people into nursing homes killing tens of thousands.

I live in NYC, saw the worst of it a year ago and despite all that I am not seeing healthy people get sick all that much. 2018 was far worse in our school for the Flu. I have not heard of any of the students in our high school getting particularly sick, or at my church. So even though I am connected to several thousand people between the church and the school, I'm not seeing this "terrible pandemic".