Texas Senate passes bill allowing doctors to lie to patients...

[Smoke]

Texas Senate passes bill allowing doctors to lie to patients suspected of wanting abortions

Senate Bill 25, which will now be sent to the Texas House, prevents parents from suing their doctor if their baby is born with disabilities, even if that doctor discovered the condition during routine prenatal testing and failed to inform the parents.

The architects of the so-called “wrongful-birth” bill have argued it would protect children with disabilities and prevent doctors from facing unnecessary facing lawsuits. “It is unacceptable that doctors can be penalized for embracing the sanctity of life,” Senator Brandon Creighton (R-TX) said in a press release when he introduced the legislation last fall.

​

“SB 25 is another thinly veiled attempt to prevent Texans from accessing their constitutional right to abortion,” Heather Busby, executive director at NARAL Pro-Choice Texas, the reproductive healthcare advocacy group, said in an e-mailed statement to The Huffington Post.

If abortion is a protected right, wouldn't this bill go against patients rights who would have terminated early on if their doctor didn't withhold information about their baby having disabilities?

Don't get me wrong, I won't be crying over this bill... but it is just loaded with irony. If abortion is wrong (which I believe it is), then shouldn't people demand the Supreme Court to reverse their decision? I don't see how a state undermining rights that the Supreme Court ruled to protect is part of the "checks and balances".

What are your thoughts?

 

[maxwel]

Do you have a formula for navigating a culture where people murder their own babies?

 

[hornetguy]

It seems that this would be more easily solved if all doctors had their patients sign a waiver saying they understand that the doctor will not provide that information.

If the patients didn't want the doctor to withhold that information, they would be free to find another doctor. But they should definitely know the doctor's practices before they "hired" him.

All in all, I think it's a bad bill, (based only on what you posted... I haven't read the bill) and should be revised before going for a full vote.

 

[maxwel]

It seems that this would be more easily solved if all doctors had their patients sign a waiver saying they understand that the doctor will not provide that information.

If the patients didn't want the doctor to withhold that information, they would be free to find another doctor. But they should definitely know the doctor's practices before they "hired" him.

All in all, I think it's a bad bill, (based only on what you posted... I haven't read the bill) and should be revised before going for a full vote.

I'm not concerned about one controversial bill.


The real problem...

when you have wicked laws, there isn't really a good way to deal with them.

 

[Smoke]

I'm not concerned about one controversial bill.


The real problem...

when you have wicked laws, there isn't really a good way to deal with them.

But I sort of think the beauty with our system is that when we have wicked laws (abortion, slavery, etc...), there is a formula to correct our ignorance. It's checks and balances, it's voting, it's not being passive about what we know to be true.

The best way to deal with the issue of abortion is by having the Supreme Court reverse it's decision. I just don't think this bill will set a good precedent.

 

[Smoke]

It seems that this would be more easily solved if all doctors had their patients sign a waiver saying they understand that the doctor will not provide that information.

If the patients didn't want the doctor to withhold that information, they would be free to find another doctor. But they should definitely know the doctor's practices before they "hired" him.

All in all, I think it's a bad bill, (based only on what you posted... I haven't read the bill) and should be revised before going for a full vote.

I think that's a great idea. Choices are a good thing.

 

[Depleted]

Texas Senate passes bill allowing doctors to lie to patients suspected of wanting abortions



If abortion is a protected right, wouldn't this bill go against patients rights who would have terminated early on if their doctor didn't withhold information about their baby having disabilities?

Don't get me wrong, I won't be crying over this bill... but it is just loaded with irony. If abortion is wrong (which I believe it is), then shouldn't people demand the Supreme Court to reverse their decision? I don't see how a state undermining rights that the Supreme Court ruled to protect is part of the "checks and balances".

What are your thoughts?

Actually, that checks and balances allow for someone else to tell the Supreme Court to shove their decisions -- the President. Andrew Jackson did it. (And that's how the Trail of Tears happened, so it's not always a good idea either.) SCOTUS interprets the Constitution. It does not make law. So abortion is not the law of the land.

On the other hand, Texas should shove it too. How dare they say it's okay for a doctor to lie? Then there is the other side of that coin. I'm having a baby and find out when the little tyke is born, something is seriously wrong and the tyke will need many operations and a lot of medical help. Had I been told this in the third month, that gives me six months to figure out how to raise that money to get that help, how to adjust our lives around what is about to happen, and how to pray long and hard that God gives us the strength to go through that. Instead? Now we get, "Surprise! Your baby made it, but now we're taking her away to do all this stuff."

And then there is the ability to fix some health problems before the baby is born. Amazing what the medical field can do now, but some doctor is worried I might be the type of person to abort the child, so she says nothing? Ridiculous!

What next? Doctors don't have to tell us we have cancer for fear we'll kill ourselves? Doctors won't mention we have dementia, because we might kill ourselves? Yeah, that works great. Imagine knowing something is wrong, the doctor finds out, but doesn't tell you, so you think it's no big deal even after you wander the area in your car for 13 hours or set your wood pile on fire. "No big deal. Not like I have dementia or anything wrong. It just happened."

How much power will politicians hand doctors because they're too inept/chicken just to make a law saying you can't murder your babies?

 

[Depleted]

Do you have a formula for navigating a culture where people murder their own babies?

We already have the formula in place. Murder is against the law.

 

[Depleted]

But I sort of think the beauty with our system is that when we have wicked laws (abortion, slavery, etc...), there is a formula to correct our ignorance. It's checks and balances, it's voting, it's not being passive about what we know to be true.

The best way to deal with the issue of abortion is by having the Supreme Court reverse it's decision. I just don't think this bill will set a good precedent.

Checks and balances has little to do with voting. It's three branches of government -- President, Congress and SCOTUS. We vote for the first two, but they vote for the last group. Once they're voted in, we are not part of checks and balances. You will never see a bill on a national ballot, because we are not checks and balances after the election. Our only duty is to not vote in the idiots. (And, obviously, after this last election, it's too late to claim we did our duty right, no matter who we voted for.)

SCOTUS will never reverse Roe V. Wade. Only the President and Congress can do that. It's back to the states to make their own laws for abortion again, and look what the idiots in Texas are doing instead.

 

[Smoke]

Actually, that checks and balances allow for someone else to tell the Supreme Court to shove their decisions -- the President. Andrew Jackson did it. (And that's how the Trail of Tears happened, so it's not always a good idea either.) SCOTUS interprets the Constitution. It does not make law. So abortion is not the law of the land.

On the other hand, Texas should shove it too. How dare they say it's okay for a doctor to lie? Then there is the other side of that coin. I'm having a baby and find out when the little tyke is born, something is seriously wrong and the tyke will need many operations and a lot of medical help. Had I been told this in the third month, that gives me six months to figure out how to raise that money to get that help, how to adjust our lives around what is about to happen, and how to pray long and hard that God gives us the strength to go through that. Instead? Now we get, "Surprise! Your baby made it, but now we're taking her away to do all this stuff."

And then there is the ability to fix some health problems before the baby is born. Amazing what the medical field can do now, but some doctor is worried I might be the type of person to abort the child, so she says nothing? Ridiculous!

What next? Doctors don't have to tell us we have cancer for fear we'll kill ourselves? Doctors won't mention we have dementia, because we might kill ourselves? Yeah, that works great. Imagine knowing something is wrong, the doctor finds out, but doesn't tell you, so you think it's no big deal even after you wander the area in your car for 13 hours or set your wood pile on fire. "No big deal. Not like I have dementia or anything wrong. It just happened."

How much power will politicians hand doctors because they're too inept/chicken just to make a law saying you can't murder your babies?

You are completely right about everything. It can (and has/is) be abused. And yes, you hit the nail on the head when we allow doctors to lie.

 

[Smoke]

Checks and balances has little to do with voting. It's three branches of government -- President, Congress and SCOTUS. We vote for the first two, but they vote for the last group. Once they're voted in, we are not part of checks and balances. You will never see a bill on a national ballot, because we are not checks and balances after the election. Our only duty is to not vote in the idiots. (And, obviously, after this last election, it's too late to claim we did our duty right, no matter who we voted for.)

SCOTUS will never reverse Roe V. Wade. Only the President and Congress can do that. It's back to the states to make their own laws for abortion again, and look what the idiots in Texas are doing instead.

You're absolutely correct about not reversing Roe v. Wade, but I meant, they can take on a new case and change their positioning, or as you said, congress passes new legislation.

I'm hoping any viable option gets abortion removed (future Supreme Court case or congress passes new legislation) without having states decide it's okay for doctors to lie to their patients for the reasons you've mentioned.

 

[Utah]

Texas Senate passes bill allowing doctors to lie to patients suspected of wanting abortions



If abortion is a protected right, wouldn't this bill go against patients rights who would have terminated early on if their doctor didn't withhold information about their baby having disabilities?

Don't get me wrong, I won't be crying over this bill... but it is just loaded with irony. If abortion is wrong (which I believe it is), then shouldn't people demand the Supreme Court to reverse their decision? I don't see how a state undermining rights that the Supreme Court ruled to protect is part of the "checks and balances".

What are your thoughts?

I want heather busby to show us where it is written that abortion is a constitutional right.

 

[Utah]

Do you have a formula for navigating a culture where people murder their own babies?

I do. Prayer in school, the Ten Commandments displayed in our courtrooms, and mandatory classes showing actual abortions taking place and how the baby suffers at the moment it's aborted and how so many women suffer afterwards.

 

[imfinallyfree]

Yet another example of satan ruling the world with chaos.

You have to figure that yes that's a bad law that they passed but even worse what kind of doctor would eant to keep that kind of information to themselves?for what purpose? How could that be beneficial to the patient?

It's not just ironic it's contradictory to the oath that doctors take I think...isn't it?

Doesn't that oath take precedence over a state law?

Well this is texas that we are talking about and they don't consider themselves part of the rest of the world I bet that God will make a example of them just for that.

He says that we have to live by the laws of the land and He says that for a good practical common sense reason.

So that corruption doesn't take hold in little unnoticed regions of the world.

 

[p_rehbein]

The IRONY of this is...........the Dems, at all levels of Government, do this on a regular basis. Just think of all the things Dem controlled States are doing right now that are in violation of Federal Law AND the Constitution.

So, Repubs learning to "play their game" is actually encouraging for me.............Congress needs to take the hint, and start running Congress the way the Dems do when they are in the Majority. Do whatever they want, and, if need be, change the rules whenever they want to do whatever they want.

Texas Senate passes bill allowing doctors to lie to patients suspected of wanting abortions



If abortion is a protected right, wouldn't this bill go against patients rights who would have terminated early on if their doctor didn't withhold information about their baby having disabilities?

Don't get me wrong, I won't be crying over this bill... but it is just loaded with irony. If abortion is wrong (which I believe it is), then shouldn't people demand the Supreme Court to reverse their decision? I don't see how a state undermining rights that the Supreme Court ruled to protect is part of the "checks and balances".

What are your thoughts?

 

[JosephsDreams]

The means are not often worth the ends. Anyone who thinks it is are just sliding down a slippery slope.
The bible says do not lie. That's all I need to know.
I am all for insuring babies are not aborted, but this is not the way to go about it.

 

[maxwel]

Texas Senate passes bill allowing doctors to lie to patients suspected of wanting abortions



If abortion is a protected right, wouldn't this bill go against patients rights who would have terminated early on if their doctor didn't withhold information about their baby having disabilities?

Don't get me wrong, I won't be crying over this bill... but it is just loaded with irony. If abortion is wrong (which I believe it is), then shouldn't people demand the Supreme Court to reverse their decision? I don't see how a state undermining rights that the Supreme Court ruled to protect is part of the "checks and balances".

What are your thoughts?

Just for the record, this article is from DailyKos, a very left-wing liberal site... and it's taking some liberties with the truth here.

The actual bill seems to be about allowing Doctors to "withhold information" in order to save the life of a baby.
Withholding information is not the same as lying.
Lying means to "give false information"... so these two things are just not the same.

We can debate whether or not "withholding information" is ethical.
It's fine to debate that.
But my point is, this article from a left-wing site didn't even state the facts correctly.

So debate all you like.
But let's start with the actual facts.


The correct title would be this:
"Tx senate passes bill allowing doctors to withhold information from parents to protect life of a child."

There.