Why MAGA is the greatest threat to American Democracy

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ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
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#41
74 have been convicted of assault 18 USC 111, I put the info in a spreadsheet but the site wouldn't allow upload so I had to put it in a zip folder. You can take a look for yourself here just search for 18 USC 111 .
OK, so we have 74/1,000,000 who are convicted of assault or threatening assault of a federal officer.

So why do they characterize the constitutionally protected exercise to assemble and protest as "violent" when 99.993% were not violent and when no weapons were there and when to my knowledge there were no serious injuries caused by the crowd to federal officers? It seems to me that "mostly peaceful" actually did apply to this event.

Also, you didn't really answer my question even though I appreciate this spreadsheet. Were the two people in that video arrested, tried and convicted of assault? Do we know their names? Are they Federal officers or members of ANTIFA? If we don't know why not? Why would CNN give us that video without identifying them? Why would 20 police officers not take those two into custody?
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
11,721
6,312
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#42
OK, so we have 74/1,000,000 who are convicted of assault or threatening assault of a federal officer.

So why do they characterize the constitutionally protected exercise to assemble and protest as "violent" when 99.993% were not violent and when no weapons were there and when to my knowledge there were no serious injuries caused by the crowd to federal officers? It seems to me that "mostly peaceful" actually did apply to this event.

Also, you didn't really answer my question even though I appreciate this spreadsheet. Were the two people in that video arrested, tried and convicted of assault? Do we know their names? Are they Federal officers or members of ANTIFA? If we don't know why not? Why would CNN give us that video without identifying them? Why would 20 police officers not take those two into custody?
it seems as if some have never been to a concert, or a ball game.

when you have a crowd of 20,000 people, there is going to be a few dozen act a fool, and get kicked out.

so, when you have about a million people in d c on j 6, and a few hundred act a fool, then that is a proper, if not a small, ratio.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
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#43
One of the people convicted was clearly and demonstrably ANTIFA, another who was clearly instigating others was a Federal employee. The one person who was undeniably violent extremist was the guy who left the pipe bomb and yet we don't know who that was. There is no doubt that some people were violent, some broke windows, some were hitting cops. I want to know who those people were, show me the video evidence that was used to convict them, the proof, and find out who they were. We have seen video evidence that quite a few government informants were dressed up as Trump supporters as well as ANTIFA and Anarchists.

So far everything I have seen is guilty by association. Just because someone was at the capital is not proof they were associated with the rally.

What we do know is the FBI was going to stage the kidnapping of Governor Whitmer, that was a false flag event, and we know that Antifa showed up to every stop the steal rally with the intention of causing trouble, and no one was there to stop anyone from coming to DC regardless of their purpose.

I agree 100% that the security at the Capital was seriously lacking considering the size of that crowd. I don't know how much of that is Trump's fault, I don't completely exonerate him since it was his rally at the Whitehouse, but there were no allegations of any violence at the Whitehouse.

I also know that Pelosi refused to request the National Guard even though Trump offered it to her. She is the one responsible for the security at the Capital and she knew the rally was coming to Washington to stand vigil outside the Capital while they deliberated. Therefore I feel she and Schumer should bear the responsibility since security is there responsibility and unless they request the National Guard they can't be sent.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
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#44
Did you watch this? Two people, when you can see thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands in the background doing nothing. Were those two people arrested? No one questions that there were hundreds of thousands exercising their constitutional right to protest. We have lots of video evidence that proves the vast majority of those people were peaceful. People estimate between 500,000 to 1,000,000 people were in the crowd. Only 1,000 were arrested, many of whom never entered the capital, so that means 99.8% didn't do anything worthy of arrest. People who weren't there were arrested and people standing on statues outside were charged. Most of the people who were arrested were charged with trespassing.

They tried to say that they killed a police officer, but that was quickly dismissed as a blatant lie. Then they tried to accuse them of assaulting a police officer but the footage released to Tucker Carlson disproved that. An unarmed woman was shot dead by the police and there has never been a trial concerning that. Another woman died when she got trampled. It is still in dispute whether that was the fault of the police or the crowd.

No one has been convicted of beating a cop that I know of and yet we have these two on video who should be charged with assault.

But I would be very interested in knowing if the two people in this video which you claim indicates the "crowd" was violent were arrested, charged and convicted? Please let me know when you find out, that will assure me that this isn't some ridiculous false flag attempt to paint the crowd as violent.
OK, so we have 74/1,000,000 who are convicted of assault or threatening assault of a federal officer.

So why do they characterize the constitutionally protected exercise to assemble and protest as "violent" when 99.993% were not violent and when no weapons were there and when to my knowledge there were no serious injuries caused by the crowd to federal officers? It seems to me that "mostly peaceful" actually did apply to this event.

Also, you didn't really answer my question even though I appreciate this spreadsheet. Were the two people in that video arrested, tried and convicted of assault? Do we know their names? Are they Federal officers or members of ANTIFA? If we don't know why not? Why would CNN give us that video without identifying them? Why would 20 police officers not take those two into custody?
Good morning,
I am in the process of checking into those folks identity. Thanksgiving has however refocused my attention temporarily. I believe the part about federal officers is part of a conspiracy theory and I can’t get drawn into that. Has anyone offered any proof about their identities?
I hope you and your family have a restful Thanksgiving, it is nice to have a day off from working in the middle of the week.
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
4,925
1,505
113
#45
So let’s see. Trump was impeached because of Russian disinformation (We know know for a fact Trump was justified in calling out Bidens influence in Eukrane and Biden’s sons laptop was a real thing)

We now know that Jan 6 was a hoax. That there was no riot until after the police used force and started shooting at peaceful protestors. We also know there was many planted FBI and other security agents in the crowd) We also know that a lady was sent there to video the whole thing. And the campus police was told to stay away. While at the same time, Rashida Talib incited a riot that was ten times worse. And nothing was done.

We also now know that the George Floyd murder was not a murder but a Drug overdose. (I challenge everyone to watch this link, it is an eye opener)
The Fall of Minneapolis

We know the main stream media can not be trusted. We know the legal system is Biassed and has a double standard.

We Know the president we have now can’t walk, Can;t climb stairs, Can’t read a teleprompter. And is being hidden by his aids instead of talking to the public because they fear we will find the truth. We know there is so much evidence that he has been compromised to Ukraine, to China and Russia, which makes him a threat to our security. But for some reason, the split republicans can not come to a decision to file true impeachment findings for whatever reason (is it because his vice President is even a worse threat?)

What we are seeing is Socialism in action. Open the borders and allow our enemy in. Pay off those in charge so they do not appose you (both republicans and dems in congress are paid off) Misinformation in the media (we called it propaganda in the Cold War concerning the USSR for those old enough to remember) We are attempting to take the leading opposition candidate out by charging him with all kinds of crimes (This is only seen in communist and socialist nations, except they usually just murder them, We have not got that deep yet. But If I was trump, I would worry for my life) The cost of living is through the roof. And no one wants to work. The justifiable racism, the justifiable destruction of cities, The justifiable murder and attack of people (again two distinct justice systems)

and people are worried about trump? He is dangeorus, He is dangerous to the “system” He is dangerous to the socialist mob who is trying to take over the country. He is dangerous to the Paid for people in our government (right and left) because he can not be bribed.

People need to wake up. Is trump th=e answer? We were a lot better off when he was in, but then again, Who else do we have? I would not mind sanctimonious as trump calls him. He has done a great job in Florida) But no one else on the right or left intrigues me. And he has run such a poor campaign I do nto see him having a chance.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#46
Good morning,
I am in the process of checking into those folks identity. Thanksgiving has however refocused my attention temporarily. I believe the part about federal officers is part of a conspiracy theory and I can’t get drawn into that. Has anyone offered any proof about their identities?
I hope you and your family have a restful Thanksgiving, it is nice to have a day off from working in the middle of the week.
Yes, Happy Thanksgiving to you as well and thank you for doing this research.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
66
28
#47
Yes, Happy Thanksgiving to you as well and thank you for doing this research.
The video was of the attack at the Lower West Terrace Tunnel. The two men in question were sentenced on November 3, 2023 per
the DOJ.
Here is more information about Federico Klein and Steven Cappuccio . It was also reported that Mr Klein was a Trump appointee to the State Department. Maybe that's where the rumors of Federal Agents organizing the attack originated.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#48
The video was of the attack at the Lower West Terrace Tunnel. The two men in question were sentenced on November 3, 2023 per
the DOJ.
Here is more information about Federico Klein and Steven Cappuccio . It was also reported that Mr Klein was a Trump appointee to the State Department. Maybe that's where the rumors of Federal Agents organizing the attack originated.
The Article says he worked for the State department and the Trump campaign, but doesn't say he was a Trump appointee.

I think it is fascinating that he was working for the State department and acting like that. I'm glad he was arrested and convicted. Did he get 20 years, I know others did.

At this point I know of one Anarchist who was arrested (guy with feet on Pelosi's desk), one Antifa guy who was convicted, and one State department guy who was convicted.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,410
12,900
113
#49
What we are seeing is Socialism in action.
That should be "Communism". Socialism is just a veneer to hide Communism. Full blown Marxist/Fascist/Racist/Communism. The USSR had the word "Socialist" but was totalitarian Communism. Bernie Sanders presented the Communist agenda to America and no one took warning. Biden simply adopted (or was compelled to adopt it). That plus Obama's Communism learned from Saul Alinsky.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
66
28
#50
The Article says he worked for the State department and the Trump campaign, but doesn't say he was a Trump appointee.

I think it is fascinating that he was working for the State department and acting like that. I'm glad he was arrested and convicted. Did he get 20 years, I know others did.

At this point I know of one Anarchist who was arrested (guy with feet on Pelosi's desk), one Antifa guy who was convicted, and one State department guy who was convicted.
Klein got 70 months prison and 24 probation, the man with his feet on Pelosi's desk was Richard Barnett 54 months. I couldn't find anything on the member of Antifa, do you know his name?
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#51
Klein got 70 months prison and 24 probation, the man with his feet on Pelosi's desk was Richard Barnett 54 months. I couldn't find anything on the member of Antifa, do you know his name?
Don't know his name, he was convicted in the last two months, I had seen his pictures, he was right there when the girl was shot and killed by the police. He made movies for Antifa of their riots.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
66
28
#52
The Article says he worked for the State department and the Trump campaign, but doesn't say he was a Trump appointee.

I think it is fascinating that he was working for the State department and acting like that. I'm glad he was arrested and convicted. Did he get 20 years, I know others did.

At this point I know of one Anarchist who was arrested (guy with feet on Pelosi's desk), one Antifa guy who was convicted, and one State department guy who was convicted.
John Earle Sullivan found guilty on Nov. 16 of this year. To be sentenced later but there is plenty of room in the Federal prison system.

I found this poem online:

James Earle Sullivan, a man of many names,
A political activist, he played many games.
He joined the Capitol riots on that fateful day,
And now he's been convicted, with a price to pay.

Sullivan was a self-identified photojournalist,
But his actions on January 6th were far from altruist.
He was accused of wearing a ballistic vest and gas mask,
And yelling expletives, a dangerous task.

He led rioters to overwhelm police officers,
Pushing a bike rack against them, a show of force.
He was found guilty of seven charges related to the riot,
His actions that day, a clear violation of quiet.

Sullivan captured footage of the attack and law enforcement,
And the shooting of Ashli Babbitt, a moment of torment.
He was convicted of felony obstruction of an official proceeding,
Civil disorder, and five misdemeanors, a heavy reading.

Sullivan's involvement in the Black Lives Matter movement,
Was not enough to absolve him of his indictment.
He was disavowed by fellow activists, expelled from rallies,
And warned to avoid associating with him, a clear tally.

Now he faces the consequences of his actions,
A reminder that justice will not tolerate infractions.
May this poem serve as a reminder to all,
That violence and chaos will only lead to a fall.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#53
John Earle Sullivan found guilty on Nov. 16 of this year. To be sentenced later but there is plenty of room in the Federal prison system.

I found this poem online:

James Earle Sullivan, a man of many names,
A political activist, he played many games.
He joined the Capitol riots on that fateful day,
And now he's been convicted, with a price to pay.

Sullivan was a self-identified photojournalist,
But his actions on January 6th were far from altruist.
He was accused of wearing a ballistic vest and gas mask,
And yelling expletives, a dangerous task.

He led rioters to overwhelm police officers,
Pushing a bike rack against them, a show of force.
He was found guilty of seven charges related to the riot,
His actions that day, a clear violation of quiet.

Sullivan captured footage of the attack and law enforcement,
And the shooting of Ashli Babbitt, a moment of torment.
He was convicted of felony obstruction of an official proceeding,
Civil disorder, and five misdemeanors, a heavy reading.

Sullivan's involvement in the Black Lives Matter movement,
Was not enough to absolve him of his indictment.
He was disavowed by fellow activists, expelled from rallies,
And warned to avoid associating with him, a clear tally.

Now he faces the consequences of his actions,
A reminder that justice will not tolerate infractions.
May this poem serve as a reminder to all,
That violence and chaos will only lead to a fall.
Yes, that is the guy. It was very clear to me that some in the crowd came to start a riot, they were dressed for it, got there before the rally and speeches were even over, and it was their goal from the outset, while the vast majority of people simply came to peacefully protest. They had no weapon, no face covering, and simply stood outside. Sullivan was definitely one who wanted violence.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
66
28
#54
Yes, that is the guy. It was very clear to me that some in the crowd came to start a riot, they were dressed for it, got there before the rally and speeches were even over, and it was their goal from the outset, while the vast majority of people simply came to peacefully protest. They had no weapon, no face covering, and simply stood outside. Sullivan was definitely one who wanted violence.
Yep, it says he sold the footage that he recorded for a pretty good bit of money. That's why we have jails. :)
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#55
Yep, it says he sold the footage that he recorded for a pretty good bit of money. That's why we have jails. :)
Agreed, I think jails were made for the three people we have talked about (the guy from the State department, the Anarchist and the Antifa videographer). But many of the others who were "trespassing" in the capital should not have been given jail terms.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
66
28
#56
Agreed, I think jails were made for the three people we have talked about (the guy from the State department, the Anarchist and the Antifa videographer). But many of the others who were "trespassing" in the capital should not have been given jail terms.
The majority of the people as you said were not breaking any laws, they had permits to assemble and none of them were arrested. Those who stormed the capital did break the law and the differences in sentencing seems to have taken the seriousness of their actions into consideration. There is certainly a difference between beating policemen or further inciting a riot when compared to simple trespassing but to enforce the law equally everyone they catch should receive a just sentence.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#57
The majority of the people as you said were not breaking any laws, they had permits to assemble and none of them were arrested. Those who stormed the capital did break the law and the differences in sentencing seems to have taken the seriousness of their actions into consideration. There is certainly a difference between beating policemen or further inciting a riot when compared to simple trespassing but to enforce the law equally everyone they catch should receive a just sentence.
I agree that those who "stormed" the capital and broke windows were breaking the law and should get prison sentences. But the video released this last week reveals that many came in after the police opened the doors. They came in peacefully, greeted the cops and were led around by the cops who were opening doors for them.

Stormed indicates coming in angrily, with force, and of an army capturing a place. That does not in any way describe what I am seeing with many people. For example, Tucker Carlson did a special on the "January 6th Shaman" based on video he was given access to, there was nothing angry, forceful or violent on that video. In my opinion based on that video he should not have been given prison time.
 

rrcn

Active member
Oct 15, 2023
215
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#58
I agree that those who "stormed" the capital and broke windows were breaking the law and should get prison sentences. But the video released this last week reveals that many came in after the police opened the doors. They came in peacefully, greeted the cops and were led around by the cops who were opening doors for them.

Stormed indicates coming in angrily, with force, and of an army capturing a place. That does not in any way describe what I am seeing with many people. For example, Tucker Carlson did a special on the "January 6th Shaman" based on video he was given access to, there was nothing angry, forceful or violent on that video. In my opinion based on that video he should not have been given prison time.
There is a clear line here:
lineatthecapitol.jpeg
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
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#59
That is only part of the story. I have seen video of police removing the barriers, opening doors and letting protestors in. I have seen videos of protestors walking in respectfully, greeting the cops and being led around the building by the cops.

I have also seen video of thugs storming the capital, smashing windows and acting like looters and criminals.

It should be obvious to all who have looked at this that there are different groups of people there. Look at your picture here, I see many American flags, most flying normally, but one in the center is upside down. That indicates "grave danger or distress". It is very clear that the person doing that does not speak for the majority of the crowd.

Imagine if that crowd had behaved as the two people we saw hitting the 20 or so cops that you showed me. The place would have been completely swamped and overrun. But they didn't. 99.9% of those people stood outside respectfully, peacefully.

So while we had 500,000+ people outside that line we also had 2 jerks hitting cops and a few others breaking windows. We have two very different groups in the crowd.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,573
5,599
113
#60
Whoa!

MORE January 6th Footage! [What Is This?]


"You pushed us in!" This takes entrapment to a new level.

Here is someone who broke the windows, clearly a violent criminal, never prosecuted.