whats your opinion on atheism ?

[Blase-and-Blithe]

Hmmm.. Your'e on a Christian Chat site yet still think I shouldn't get you to become Christian! You better study step 2. hard.

I'm just going to ignore you. You have no desire to learn why I am here and consistently ignore what I am saying. Responses such as yours are why many people shy away from religiosity. You're pushy and care only for your own agenda. Good day.

 

[megaman125]

I'm just going to ignore you. You have no desire to learn why I am here and consistently ignore what I am saying. Responses such as yours are why many people shy away from religiosity. You're pushy and care only for your own agenda. Good day.

So, why are you here?

 

[Blase-and-Blithe]

So, why are you here?

To talk? Discuss things. My own spiritual searchingly will be done in real life by going to church and talking with priests about the issues. On here it's a place to see other points of view and discuss those views. I am not here to be converted to Christianity over the Internet.

 

[PennEd]

To talk? Discuss things. My own spiritual searchingly will be done in real life by going to church and talking with priests about the issues. On here it's a place to see other points of view and discuss those views. I am not here to be converted to Christianity over the Internet.

Dude, if I went on an atheism chat site and said " I'm here to discuss Jesus Christ but I don't want you guys to talk about how there is no god" how do you think that would go over?

 

[Blase-and-Blithe]

Dude, if I went on an atheism chat site and said " I'm here to discuss Jesus Christ but I don't want you guys to talk about how there is no god" how do you think that would go over?

You're not discussing how there is God. You're simply copying and pasting the same thing over and over. How can't you see what you were doing was not discussion and just blatant proselytizing?

 

[Phillipy]

Atheism is the pinnacle of arrogance, hubris, and narcissism! To say you are an atheist means you have been to, and have knowledge of, all places at all times. Otherwise how do you know God isn't on the dark side of the moon right now? Or in your fridge, on top of Everest.... or in my heart?

That's a 'gnostic atheist' you are thinking of, in my experience most atheists are agnostic atheists - they don't claim to know there isn't a God, most are aware they would have to be all-knowing to make that claim.
I'd totally agree that gnostic atheism is a silly position, but I consider the rest of atheists as just innocently unaware of the truth. That tends to be how they consider themselves

 

[Siberian_Khatru]

That's a 'gnostic atheist' you are thinking of, in my experience most atheists are agnostic atheists - they don't claim to know there isn't a God, most are aware they would have to be all-knowing to make that claim.
I'd totally agree that gnostic atheism is a silly position, but I consider the rest of atheists as just innocently unaware of the truth. That tends to be how they consider themselves

Gnostic comes from the Greek word "gnostos", meaning knowledge, to my understanding. It seems the more appropriate monikers/argot would be:

Theist - little to no doubt; opts for faith
Atheist - acronym of 'Theist'; much doubt in a theism or theistic worldview
Gnostic - stemming from above etymology; one who is sure of their knowledge(?)
Agnostic - acronym of Gnostic; 'fence sitter'; not swayed into either side of a theistic argument

I get a little lost in the vernacular sometimes, with all the 'isms' and 'eist(s)'.

 

[PennEd]

You're not discussing how there is God. You're simply copying and pasting the same thing over and over. How can't you see what you were doing was not discussion and just blatant proselytizing?

First off, you lied. You said you were going to ignore me. Don't worry about that one, if you accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior you'd be forgiven. Secondly, your'e right, I'm not discussing if there is a God, I already KNOW there is one. I'm discussing JESUS CHRIST on a CHRISTIAN chat site! Crazy right? Thirdly, I don't think I copy and pasted a single post with you, and if i did it was from Scripture. The real question is why are you here if not to understand why Bible-believing Christians believe what we do?

 

[Mo0448]

First off, you lied. You said you were going to ignore me. Don't worry about that one, if you accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior you'd be forgiven. Secondly, your'e right, I'm not discussing if there is a God, I already KNOW there is one. I'm discussing JESUS CHRIST on a CHRISTIAN chat site! Crazy right? Thirdly, I don't think I copy and pasted a single post with you, and if i did it was from Scripture. The real question is why are you here if not to understand why Bible-believing Christians believe what we do?

I understand your frustration PennEd, however shouldn't we try to approach this with a Christ-like understanding and mercy and love? Let us have more patience in explaining our viewpoint so that through that patience and kindness others can see Christ through us. I know its not easy I could not stand to talk to a non Christian about anything God related for more than oh geez i don't know 3 seconds without forcing my selfrighteousness down their throat. Let us have more understanding and love like Christ did we are all at equal footing on a the cross you, me, our neighbors and friends all Christians and non Christians, we are all the same in God's eyes

 

[Grey]

Atheism has not presented one challenging question or even a decent argument. They've all been answered before. The arguments atheists use have been debunked for thousands of years already. Atheists just like to regurgitate the same tired old arguments and questions, then plug their ears to the Christian responses and answers, then prance around claiming victory and that their questions somehow challenge Christians too much. What a joke.

Atheism is a lack of a belief in god or a supernatural force likewise theism is a belief in a god or supernatural force. Atheists are even less so united then Christians. And you should know that a state of theism or nontheism don't require that arguments are put forth. Neither theism or nontheism put forth arguments they are simply states of believing or not believing. Now non-theists and theists put forth arguments, some well though out some not, but when you said atheism hasn't presented arguments its illogical, a state of something can't put forth an argument. Its like pointing out that a plate is hot yet the heat has not put forward an argument as to why it is hot or why it isn't cold. Definitions simply exist. They don't think or propose something they just are.

 

[Blase-and-Blithe]

First off, you lied. You said you were going to ignore me. Don't worry about that one, if you accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior you'd be forgiven. Secondly, your'e right, I'm not discussing if there is a God, I already KNOW there is one. I'm discussing JESUS CHRIST on a CHRISTIAN chat site! Crazy right? Thirdly, I don't think I copy and pasted a single post with you, and if i did it was from Scripture. The real question is why are you here if not to understand why Bible-believing Christians believe what we do?

...

I have no issue with discussing Jesus on this Christian site. Why else did I join? Do you think I'm a troll or something? I am simply stating this:

If you are going to talk about Jesus Christ in a thread about Atheism with someone who clearly doesn't believe 100% what you're espousing at least have some intellectually stimulating points. I'm not some drug addict or failure searching for outright redemption. I try and treat people right, I have a good job (I'm a Sailor in the Navy). I go to college for Creative Writing. I have a girlfriend back home. I don't have any tangible reason to be searching for God at this point in my life.

Though, I am here. I wonder why? I went to Mass for the first time since June 2010 this Sunday. I'm going to a Tridentine Mass tonight. I do not need you shoving whatever Protestant 'Sinners Prayer' stuff down my throat when I'm figuring out all of this on my own. I posted in this thread to discuss Atheism because I can relate to it.

By copy and paste I meant you keep reiterating the exact same stuff over. Sure, you change the wording a little, but it's the same words with the same message time and time again after I kindly asked you to stop. I can tell you're getting angry, but you are not good at this proselytizing deal. Talk to people. Treat them like they aren't inferior to you and maybe you'll get your message across. Yes, I know I lied. I thought you were the one who asked me 'Why are you here', though I recently realized that wasn't you. It was a misunderstanding and I apologize.

So now, are you going to keep trying to convert me? Or can we get back to the topic of the thread which is not proselytizing?

I understand your frustration PennEd, however shouldn't we try to approach this with a Christ-like understanding and mercy and love? Let us have more patience in explaining our viewpoint so that through that patience and kindness others can see Christ through us. I know its not easy I could not stand to talk to a non Christian about anything God related for more than oh geez i don't know 3 seconds without forcing my selfrighteousness down their throat. Let us have more understanding and love like Christ did we are all at equal footing on a the cross you, me, our neighbors and friends all Christians and non Christians, we are all the same in God's eyes

See, you can be as self-righteous as you want. It won't get you anywhere. The Westboro Baptist Church are as self-righteous as they come, same with Al-Qaeda. How many people are honestly converting to their groups? Self-righteousness will get you nowhere. Especially with individuals who actively study and research what they believe. If Christians by and large actually acted like Christ instead of retreating to the whole 'If I admit I'm a sinner when I'm an a**hole to people I'll be forgiven' mindset, you'd get a lot more people joining your churches and believing what you believe.

Food for thought is all.

 

[PennEd]

I understand your frustration PennEd, however shouldn't we try to approach this with a Christ-like understanding and mercy and love? Let us have more patience in explaining our viewpoint so that through that patience and kindness others can see Christ through us. I know its not easy I could not stand to talk to a non Christian about anything God related for more than oh geez i don't know 3 seconds without forcing my selfrighteousness down their throat. Let us have more understanding and love like Christ did we are all at equal footing on a the cross you, me, our neighbors and friends all Christians and non Christians, we are all the same in God's eyes

I'm not frustrated Mo. Frankly I think I've been using kid gloves with him. And I do love him, all the more since it appears he is serving to defend our freedom, but i shouldn't have to apologize for talking about Christ on a Christian chat site. I agree it is counter-productive OUTSIDE a place like this to push the Gospel on those unwilling or outwardly hostile to it. I'm not sure about your assertion that non-Christians are viewed by God the same way as Christians.
28And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. 29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. …

 

[KJVBIBLECATOWNER]

As far as Atheism goes, I understand and can see it. In essence, I am an Agnostic Atheist right now (not 100% sure, but leaning towards Atheism over religiosity while looking at Christianity with a skeptical and empirical eye).

When I look to the sky over the Rocky mountains, what do I see? Do I see heaven and Angels or the wonder of God? Not exactly. Beyond the puffy clouds and blue-hued sky I think of space. How vast it is. How unfathomable. How I, standing on a spot of grass on our tiny pale blue dot is just a fraction of an atom in the sheer vastness of existence. It doesn't make me sad, it makes me happy because it means here I am. A bipedal mammal on a tiny little rock capable of contemplating my own insignificance in relation to the rest of the universe. It's a beautiful thing. It means we are special (either divinely or no, that point is moot right now).

Science without wonder is worthless. That's where a lot of religious people go wrong, they believe science is this cold, hard, uncompromising calculator rigidly punching out hypothesis, theories and facts. That's not the case at all. Scientists are more akin to Priests and Pastors than Mathematicians.

In order to discover and have the will to discover new facts about our existence a Scientists would have to be filled with awe and wonder at the physical universe. They would have to have an imagination capable of comprehending the unknown and willing to dive deep into the abyss to grab a shred of truth.

That's how I see Atheism in my own romanticized way. It's not a lack of light, it's simply an 'embrace of the darkness to reveal the tiny, microscopic specks of light. One at a time.' Do I think Atheism and science will have all the answers in the next 50, 100, 500, 1000, 5000 years? No. Not really. We aren't supposed to. Once we know everything life becomes pointless in my opinion.

Cheers!

HA HA HA HA - Look at your psychotic picture.... is that a muslim woman with a machine gun??? I love it, your actually a real spirit filled bible believing christian, and your only POSING as an godless. HA I get it, love that humour - ( SARCASM )

 

[LadyOscar]

Personally I have no problem with atheism. I was an atheist once. I was a very logical person and thought that everything in this world is explainable until I realized that I was wrong.

 

[homwardbound]

As far as Atheism goes, I understand and can see it. In essence, I am an Agnostic Atheist right now (not 100% sure, but leaning towards Atheism over religiosity while looking at Christianity with a skeptical and empirical eye).

When I look to the sky over the Rocky mountains, what do I see? Do I see heaven and Angels or the wonder of God? Not exactly. Beyond the puffy clouds and blue-hued sky I think of space. How vast it is. How unfathomable. How I, standing on a spot of grass on our tiny pale blue dot is just a fraction of an atom in the sheer vastness of existence. It doesn't make me sad, it makes me happy because it means here I am. A bipedal mammal on a tiny little rock capable of contemplating my own insignificance in relation to the rest of the universe. It's a beautiful thing. It means we are special (either divinely or no, that point is moot right now).

Science without wonder is worthless. That's where a lot of religious people go wrong, they believe science is this cold, hard, uncompromising calculator rigidly punching out hypothesis, theories and facts. That's not the case at all. Scientists are more akin to Priests and Pastors than Mathematicians.

In order to discover and have the will to discover new facts about our existence a Scientists would have to be filled with awe and wonder at the physical universe. They would have to have an imagination capable of comprehending the unknown and willing to dive deep into the abyss to grab a shred of truth.

That's how I see Atheism in my own romanticized way. It's not a lack of light, it's simply an 'embrace of the darkness to reveal the tiny, microscopic specks of light. One at a time.' Do I think Atheism and science will have all the answers in the next 50, 100, 500, 1000, 5000 years? No. Not really. We aren't supposed to. Once we know everything life becomes pointless in my opinion.

Cheers!

And the bottom line beyond religion, christianity, and science GOD just love us all, shown to us all by the cross. Now there are many interpretations about this cross of Christ, not many beiing set free. A lot put into bondage and a lot kept into bondage. therefore the seek, unto being set free and confident, or stressed out too much to want to believe, and just go do ones thing, not caring for their neighbor. Or taking advantage of this amazing fact of Christ going to the cross for to save us set us free from a life of stress, turning that stress into trust of God the Father, knowing that God has got our back and will see us through, even and especially while we are in tragedies that are here from this evil fallen world, that will one day pass, it is headed that way.
Anyway please know this, Atheism has arrived and been in effect becuase of the people that have claimed God and misrepresented God. The Devil injects thoughts into mans head and man hears if this is God and these people believe God and harm you in the way you just got harmed or have been harming you, then you hear I want nothiing to do with God and become an Atheist, when it was never God doing the wrong, it was and is those people period.
God is LOVE in truest form that this earth's people can never do in and of themselves see God's love and tell me if you can do this type of love unless God does this for you, through you by being born again in the Spirit of God by the resurrected Christ?
[h=3]1 Corinthians 13:4-13[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[SUP]4 [/SUP]Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up; [SUP]5[/SUP]does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; [SUP]6[/SUP]does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; [SUP]7 [/SUP]bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away. [SUP]9 [/SUP]For we know in part and we prophesy in part. [SUP]10 [/SUP]But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things. [SUP]12 [/SUP]For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

From a flesh, earth standpoint can anyone do this type of love 100% complete?
Now can God do this? So if God by you beleiving in God do you think God just want to live in you or rather through you performing this type of Love, with no condemnation to anyone ?
I know what I wanted when I saw this deep love and recieved, because I asked, thereofore just as God just love you and all the world so do I, and by this love one says no to unrighteousness, as a response of thankfulness to God for the Son, Jesus Christ. without Chirst, we be without God the Father and have no life. HMM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! something to think on, chew on ask God not me, and ask privately, so the enemy knows not what you ask from God, through christ the way, the truth and the life

"Comfort God by letting God know that you would see God just to dwell in God's Presence. Not for teaching, not for material gain, not even for a message, but for God. The longing of the human heart to be loved for itself is something caught from the Great Divine Heart."

A man must learn to understand the motives of human beings, their illusions, and their sufferings.
Judgements are only based on what one sees, from their owns thoughts. From their own experiences. There is truly only one that knows all. that one would be and is the creator of all.
If one learns to listen to the creator as Jesus Christ revealed to all mankind. (He taught us, to do nothing or say nothing w/o Father's instruction first and foremost), we would make the right judgements, with out condemnation. ( coming from the one listening)
The ones that argued would reveal their true selves, as was done in the day of visitation from our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
Steer clear from arguements, seek the truth in all things and one shall be free from the world and it's traps.

 

[homwardbound]

I'm not frustrated Mo. Frankly I think I've been using kid gloves with him. And I do love him, all the more since it appears he is serving to defend our freedom, but i shouldn't have to apologize for talking about Christ on a Christian chat site. I agree it is counter-productive OUTSIDE a place like this to push the Gospel on those unwilling or outwardly hostile to it. I'm not sure about your assertion that non-Christians are viewed by God the same way as Christians.
28And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. …

careful please and do not show contempt as is what Blase has said from his side of things

[h=3]Romans 2:4[/h]New International Version (NIV)

[SUP]4 [/SUP]Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?

 

[Blase-and-Blithe]

HA HA HA HA - Look at your psychotic picture.... is that a muslim woman with a machine gun??? I love it, your actually a real spirit filled bible believing christian, and your only POSING as an godless. HA I get it, love that humour - ( SARCASM )

No. It's a 106-year old Armenian woman defending her home. I do not know the context of the picture or her religious beliefs or her life.

I feel it's more powerful and filled with way more meaning than a picture of a cat. >.>

And I am not a Christian posing as an unbeliever, I can assure you of that.

Why is it that some of the religiously inclined get so defensive/offensive when anyone even hints that they don't believe in God even when they aren't even trying to disprove God or admit they are searching for God? Seems counterproductive to your evangelism mission doesn't it?

 

[NiceneCreed]

In a debate about the existence of God (Carl Sagan), William Lane Craig stated, “Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.” I have concluded any argument against this claim would be self-defeating in nature, as one would then have to apply Carl Sagans’ principle to their own argument. There is a lack of evidence for the Atheists’ cosmological view (Origin of the Universe/”Big Bang”), as well as for those with religious views that differ from Christianity. The argument for a “lack of evidence” of God’s existence does not disprove theism, nor does it validate its own alternate claim. To assert something does not exist, merely because there is a lack of evidence, is a philosophical and logical fallacy. After all, there are many cosmological theories which have no evidence to support them. Should we then assume scientific claims to be wrong, simply because there is a lack of evidence to support those claims?

 

[NiceneCreed]

I forgot to add, you may really enjoy this quote: “People are generally better persuaded by the reasons which they have themselves discovered than by those which have come in to the mind of others.” - Blaise Pascal

The point is, although we are aware of the existence of God, no amount of evidence can persuade an Atheist to believe in His Existence.

 

[Grey]

In a debate about the existence of God (Carl Sagan), William Lane Craig stated, “Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.” I have concluded any argument against this claim would be self-defeating in nature, as one would then have to apply Carl Sagans’ principle to their own argument. There is a lack of evidence for the Atheists’ cosmological view (Origin of the Universe/”Big Bang”), as well as for those with religious views that differ from Christianity. The argument for a “lack of evidence” of God’s existence does not disprove theism, nor does it validate its own alternate claim. To assert something does not exist, merely because there is a lack of evidence, is a philosophical and logical fallacy. After all, there are many cosmological theories which have no evidence to support them. Should we then assume scientific claims to be wrong, simply because there is a lack of evidence to support those claims?

I agree, that's why Im not an anti-theist or a complete atheist.