Mark of the beast is sunday laws.

[ed2]

Paul makes a big difference between, ceremonial laws and Ten Commandments:
"Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. -1 Corinthians 7:19"

Now what do you say to that?
Heresy is bringing back ceremonial laws and sacrifices. Ten commandments have got nothing to do with this.
Revelation 22:14 makes it clear that only those that do His commandments will enter into the tree of life.
"Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have right into the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city."
If we should not keep the Law, why is it that only those that do it, enter into the kingdom? It is really false accusation to accuse us of holding up a false theory. I go with Paul, i will not make the law void by my faith. I will establish it.
Plus the new covenant is writing that law in our hearts and minds. So you are supposed to keep the Law gladly now. The new covenant is writing that law, not on tables of stone, but on our hearts! Now that the law is written in my heart, i can say with joy: How i love Thy law, O God.
"If we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, then there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins"- hebrews 10:26
You don't sin wilfully. You do your best not to sin because you love God, but if you fall into sin, you have an advocate.
"Brethren, theses things i write unto you that ye sin not. And[but] if any man sin we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous."- 1 john 2:1
Your faith is dead if it does not have works: "faith without works is death"- james 2:20.
If you want your faith to be dead so be it. But me i will awake from sin, "awake to righteousness and SIN NOT"- 1 corinthians 15:34

Ceremonial laws, sacrificial laws, and the ten commandments are part of ONE unit that is not divided. The Scriptures make no such division. The great majority of Jewish scholars will confirm this. If the Old Covenant law of keeping the Sabbath is binding, then everything pertaining to it is also binding, including the death penalty for breaking it.

[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD][h=3]Exodus 31:14[/h]Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
[/TD]
[TD][h=3][/h][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][h=3]Exodus 31:15[/h]Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
The punishment is part of the law also. Are we to go around executing people for not following the law? It is God's law right? If you keep the first part of the verse, you MUST keep the second part also.

 

[danschance]

Man, I must have missed it, I didn't know that I was supposed to bow on a beach, can i get forgiveness for that. I mean a child molester can receive forgiveness. If his heart is right, but dang I went to church on Sunday is there any grace for that. Oh smack guess I'm hell bound for worshipping God on the wrong day. Dang I wish somebody would of have told me before it was to late. I went to hell for praising God on the wrong day. Well you win some and lose some, My bad.

Go look in the mirror and see if you have a 666 on your forehead. If not then you can be forgiven. If you do have it, well you have the mark of the beast and it was nice knowing you.

 

[Kerry]

Man I looked in the mirror, Guess what I saw, a man lost and in need of a savoir. Try as I may I continually fail the word of God. Maybe you are a better man than me. If you are then praise God for that. I wish to be your servant in the Kingdom of God. all hail to danshcance.

 

[Kerry]

What work can you do. I am speaking to those that watch and do not post. What will you tell the Lord I have done this or I have done that. What will you tell the Lord. You can say I trust in the work of your son Jesus Christ, Whom the church has rejected and placed their faith in psychology and higher education I mean If you go to church with a problem, you are told to seek professional help is that not a fact. what professional help did. I wonder what professional help the women of the issue of blood had. Orv the little girl that Jesus raised from the dead. What professional help did they have. God is not a respecter of persons. explain if you can.

 

[SpiritofFire]

Ecclesiastes 3:19-20

[SUP]19 [/SUP]For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.

[SUP]20 [/SUP]All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.

2 Peter 2:9-15


[SUP]9[/SUP]The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord. (In other words angels do not call sinners, sinners before the Lord)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]But these (the priests and preachers of today), as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
[SUP]13[/SUP]And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, (which is death, being the wages of sin) as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
[SUP]15[/SUP]Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;

They have forsaken the right way, who for the profit of the collection plate, lead many astray.

1 Corinthians 3:1-7


3 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? (With the mind of beasts, going after gain and profit whether it be through law or material gain)
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For while one saith, I am of Paul (Example of Christianity); and another, I am of Apollos (Example of Islam); are ye not carnal?(Speaking evil of one another over who is right or wrong, never coming to an understanding)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Who then is Paul (The leaders associated with Christianity), and who is Apollos (Leaders of Islam), but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
[SUP]6 [/SUP]I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. (There are millions of people that found refuge this side of the globe in the bible and Christianity, but on the other side of the planet there are millions who found that same refuge in the Qu'ran and Islam)
[SUP]7 [/SUP]So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth (Again this is because we are like beasts that go back to the dust); but God that giveth the increase.

The mark of the beast is a carnal mind.

Philippians 2:1-8


If there be therefore any consolation in Christ, if any comfort of love, if any fellowship of the Spirit, if any bowels and mercies,
[SUP]2 [/SUP]Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. (In other words as best you can, place yourself in their shoes)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
[SUP]6 [/SUP]Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
[SUP]7[/SUP]But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

The "appearances" of things causes all to receive the mark, as all has transgressed the love of God. In order to receive the seal of God one must crucify the flesh and the lust therein.

 

[Bookends]

nobody said anything about going out and breaking every one of God's laws...

misrepresenting a person's view is a false testimony against your neighbor...

and there is a commandment that says not to give false testimony against your neighbor!

i thought you claimed to care about obeying the commandments...but i guess that is only when it is convenient for you...

Matthew 22
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Then the Pharisees went and plotted how they might entangle Him in His talk.

 

[Bookends]

Dang, maybe I missed a law that should obey. Will I go to hell for that? Or should I place mt faith in the work of the cross and not what I can do?

Yah, we put our faith in the perfect law keeper, not in our ability to keep it, although we try, we fail. When we do fail, we look to our intercessor Jesus Christ who presents us holy to the Father, and ask Christ for help in molding us to His image. When Law emphasizers fail (if they admit it) they ask for forgives, then on their own efforts try to be/DO better for the next time.

 

[Michael50]

The Seventh Day Adventists message of legalism, fits in very well with Mormonism. Mormons say "We are saved by grace, after all we can do." Meaning we must first keep the law according to the best they can do and then when they slip they get grace. This is very clearly salvation by works. The emphasis is on external performance and legalism and the work of Christ becomes a footnote.

Did you do your very best today? Yesterday? The week before? The problem with this is we never do our best. We always fall short even by our own standards. This is why we need the work of the Lord on the cross.

Dan,, mormans are on your side.. They are sunday-keepers,,just like you. Everybody that loves sunday and has contempt for God and His Commandments will join you in honoring Sunday with you.

 

[Michael50]

Shiloah I said my wifes aunt. I am sure that many 7 dayers place their faith in christ, just as i am sure that many catholics place their faith in Christ. Honey, what I am saying is that the overall teaching of these churches are in direct conflict with the work of the cross. My aunt will not eat pork, She will not attend any church that meets on Sunday or any other day. Her life is governed by law a law that is impossible to keep. Now, my dear sister the word of God is valuable, but we must be lead by the Spirit and not the teaching or traditions of man no matter what denomination or creed we hold to. Shiloah, you are my dear sister in christ and I love you with all my heart and I have been praying for you. I am no greater than you. I know that you love the Lord. Keep seeking Him and He will show the way. I still seek Him and am always in need of Him. He leads I follow as best I can. Not to sound condescending by no means, you are a child of God. Seek, ask, knock. For what it means. I tried to be good and failed and almost said forget it. But, I had a pastor that would not let go. He told me to keep trusting in the cross and nothing else. Not my works, not my obedience, but faith in Him. He set me free and has shown me many things in His word that point to that very thing. My, sister, it is the cross and nothing else.

Like your Aunt,, I too obey God's dietary laws as well as His 10 Commandments. No pork is set on my table before my family.

You are blessed to have such a Aunt as you do.

 

[prodigal]

we can often think we are great for the commands we keep, but in reality we all fall short,

Matthew 25:36

35For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.' 37"Then the righteous will answer Him, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink?…

 

[Michael50]

we can often think we are great for the commands we keep, but in reality we all fall short,

Matthew 25:36

35For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.' 37"Then the righteous will answer Him, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink?…

When a baby begins to walk,,,we all know he/she will fall.......Do we say "stay down Baby!!!! You're only gonna fall again! No sense in trying."

Or do we encourage our babies, and help them to stand, and take their first steps, until they can walk on their own, under the watchful eye of their parent?


Just because you fail at some point,, is no reason to give up and quit! "If you love Me, keep My commandments"!

 

[zone]

You just stated it. All of the law can be boiled down to as:
1) Love God above all else.
2) Love your neighbor as yourself.

but we love Him BECAUSE He first loved us.
love for God is a gift from God.
and we still do not love Him as we ought to.

JESUS did.
ONLY JESUS did.

 

[zone]

Very true and very sad for those who follow into their false theology.

When accused by the Pharisees of breaking the Sabbath law, Jesus did not point out that he was only breaking the oral tradition. Instead, he made the astounding claim that, just as King David and the priests were ‘above the law’ in certain respects, so he was not subject to the Sabbath law, but Lord over it (Luke 6:1–11; cf. Mark 2:23–28).

The passage in Matthew 12:1–8 reinforces the point by virtue of its position, following Jesus’ call to the weary to find rest in him rather than in the Mosaic law (11:28–30).

In the light of this, Jesus’ taking authority over the Sabbath both wrests it from the legal framework in which it previously stood and realizes the rest which God’s people were always intended to enjoy.

In all three Synoptics, the subsequent miracle is an example of what Jesus’ lordship of the Sabbath will mean in practice: people delivered from the shadow of death and restored into the unblemished image of God.

The Sabbath only features in Paul’s writings negatively. For the Galatians to observe it as if they were still under the Mosaic Law rather than New Covenant moral law would be to descend into gospel-denying slavery (Gal. 4:9–11); for the Colossians to observe it as part of a syncretistic system would be equally fatal (Col. 2:16).

For the Mosaic Law belonged to an earlier era, and since the coming of Christ it is no longer binding (Col. 2:17). Even Sabbath observance ‘for the Lord’ was tolerated only for the sake of those whose faith was weak (Rom. 14:1–12). In short, those in Christ are beyond the jurisdiction of the Old Testament Mosaic Law which has been fulfilled in Jesus.

As God’s perfect human, Jesus lived the Sabbath day for God, releasing his fellow humans from bondage and striving for salvation under the law (e.g. Mosaic Law), bringing them into a new spiritual rebirth in which the moral law of God is written on their heart, bringing them into blessing, and at the last entering Himself into God’s rest.

Ultimately, as Lord of the Sabbath, Jesus made it possible for others to follow him into that rest. This means that the Christian’s task is no longer to keep the Sabbath (Jesus has done that already) as if they were still under the Mosaic Law but rather to believe in Christ and obey Him.

In its final setting, then, the fourth commandment is no longer a commandment for God’s people, but its intent remains. The ‘law of Christ’ anticipates rest by prescribing belief, but now rest has been realized and will have its fullest expression in the gathering of genuine Christians who will reign with the Lamb for ever in the new creation (Rev. 22:3–6).

So sad to see SDA deceived cult members maligning the Word to "prove" their false theology. It's really deception and pride. I agree with you.

truth, AoK.
it's not hard to see all the cults appeared at roughly the same time.
they all have one thing in common....the earlier cults also share gnosticism.
and the crowning cult, appearing much later - though planned - to legitimize the others, is the "Hebrew Roots" Movement.

why did we think The Pharisees were giving up?
they never gave up.
they are working, even today.
this isn't hard.

Jesus warned about their leaven. it's seen in all the cults.

 

[directline2iam]

Like your Aunt,, I too obey God's dietary laws as well as His 10 Commandments. No pork is set on my table before my family.

You are blessed to have such a Aunt as you do.

Ok, someone on this post complained that we watch the threads but don't join in bla bla. May be they were taught to close the mouth and open the ears?


Here is Paul in Romans 14:KJV Him that is weak in the faith recieve ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
2For one BELIEVETH that he MAY EAT all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
3Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not;AND LET NOT HIM WHICH EATETH NOT JUDGE HIM THAT EATETH: FOR GOD HATH RECIEVED HIM.


4Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
5ONE MAN ESTEEMETH ONE DAY ABOVE ANOTHER: another esteemeth EVERY DAY alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.


6He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.


7For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
8For whether we live, we live unto the Lord: and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
9For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.


10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
11For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
12So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.


13Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumbling block or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
14I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is NO THING UNCLEAN of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.


15But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.
16Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
17For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.


18For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.
19Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.
20FOR MEAT DESTROY NOT THE WORK OF GOD. ALL THINGS INDEED ARE PURE; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.


21It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.
22Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.


23And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.


Chapter 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime (MEANING THE OT) were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.


I eat pig because the Lord makes it clean and blesses my food but I don't serve it to you nor do I eat it in your presence to insult your beliefs which also are fine by the Lord. This is the Word of God.

 

[john832]

Like your Aunt,, I too obey God's dietary laws as well as His 10 Commandments. No pork is set on my table before my family.

You are blessed to have such a Aunt as you do.

Hmmm, I have always assumed that the Designer and Creator of the human body knows exactly what to put in it and what not to. Seems some think they know better than Him.

 

[john832]

Ok, someone on this post complained that we watch the threads but don't join in bla bla. May be they were taught to close the mouth and open the ears?


Here is Paul in Romans 14:KJV
I eat pig because the Lord makes it clean and blesses my food but I don't serve it to you nor do I eat it in your presence to insult your beliefs which also are fine by the Lord. This is the Word of God.

And again, Rom 14?

Rom 14:1 Him that isweak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.

The first thing we see here is that this chapter is aboutrelating to a weak brother.

Rom 14:2 For onebelieveth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

The subject here? Vegetarianism

Rom 14:3 Let not himthat eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judgehim that eateth: for God hath received him.

So, if you encounter one who is weak in the faith andbelieves he must eat vegetables only, don’t let this puff you up…

2Co 10:12 For we darenot make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commendthemselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparingthemselves among themselves, are not wise.

What is the gold standard here?

1Pe 2:21 For even hereuntowere ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example,that ye should follow his steps:

Eph 4:13 Till we allcome in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto aperfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:


Rom 14:4 Who art thouthat judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth.Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

Now to the meat and potatoes…

Rom 14:5 One manesteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let everyman be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He thatregardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not theday, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, forhe giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, andgiveth God thanks.

Why is eating and fasting (not eating) connected to dayshere? Let’s see…

Luk 18:11 ThePharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am notas other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes ofall that I possess.

From Bullingers Companion Bible…

Luke 18:12


twice in the week. The law prescribed only one in the year(Lev_16:29. Num_29:7). By the time of Zec_8:19 there were four yearly fasts. Inour Lord's day they were bi-weekly (Monday and Thursday), between Passover andPentecost; and between the Feast of Tabernacles and the Dedication.

Yes they fasted two days a week, Monday and Thursday, EVERYMONDAY and EVERY THURSDAY.

Rom 14:7 For none ofus liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
Rom 14:8 For whetherwe live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord:whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
Rom 14:9 For to thisend Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of thedead and living.
Rom 14:10 But whydost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for weshall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
Rom 14:11 For it iswritten, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and everytongue shall confess to God.
Rom 14:12 So thenevery one of us shall give account of himself to God.
Rom 14:13 Let us nottherefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put astumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
Rom 14:14 I know, andam persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but tohim that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
Rom 14:15 But if thybrother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy nothim with thy meat, for whom Christ died.

Now Paul shifts his attention to meat offered to idols. At the time, meat and drink were offered topagan idols. After it was offered it was sold in a meat market called the‘Shambles’.

1Co 10:25 Whatsoeveris sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:

Shambles…

G3111
μάκελλον
makellon
Thayer Definition:
1) a place where meat and other articles of food are sold,meat market
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: of Latin origin[macellum]
Citing in TDNT: 4:370, 549

There were those who were weak in the faith (verse 1) whowere offended by this. They somehowthought that eating that food was somehow connecting them with the idolatrouspractices around them. This is why thefollowing is written…

Rom 14:16 Let notthen your good be evil spoken of:
Rom 14:17 For thekingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, andjoy in the Holy Ghost.

Meat here is…

G1035
βρῶσις
brōsis
bro'-sis
From the base of G977; (abstractly) eating (literally orfiguratively); by extension (concretely) food (literally or figuratively): -eating, food, meat.

Notice it is food, not clean or unclean flesh.

G4213
πόσις
posis
pos'-is
From the alternate of G4095; a drinking (the act), that is,(concretely) a draught: - drink.

Drinking, can be alcoholic or non-alcoholic beverages. Paul was dealing with ascetism and the beliefthat doing without was somehow a show of character. He dealt with this issue at Colossae also…

Col 2:21 (Touch not;taste not; handle not;
Col 2:22 Which allare to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?
Col 2:23 Whichthings have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, andneglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

Rom 14:18 For he thatin these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.
Rom 14:19 Let ustherefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewithone may edify another.
Rom 14:20 For meatdestroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil forthat man who eateth with offence.

The word for meat here is broma, from Thayer’s…

G1033
βρῶμα
brōma
Thayer Definition:
1) that which is eaten, food
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from the base ofG977
Citing in TDNT: 1:642, 111

Again, we are dealing with food.

Rom 14:21 It is goodneither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brotherstumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.

So, it is not dealing with clean and unclean, but with flesh(meat) and wine (drink) that makes a weak brother stumble.

Rom 14:22 Hast thoufaith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himselfin that thing which he alloweth.
Rom 14:23 And he thatdoubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever isnot of faith is sin.

There is no passage in Rom 14 that deals with the Sabbath orclean and unclean meats. The subjectsare vegetarianism, fasting and food and drink offered to idols.

Now what meats does God really bless?

1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

the word sanctified here means set apart. So what meats are set apart by the Word of God?

Lev 11 and Deut 14.

 

[directline2iam]

this is the other cool thing in Paul to the Romans chapter 14:6


6He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

So there you go...You want to pray and go to church on Sunday have at it cause the Lord says it's ok. In fact you can do it any day of the week.

It was said so many time ALL THE LAW IS FULFILLED IN THE WORDS OF CHRIST THAT YOU LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART SOUL STRENGTH AND MIND AND LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF. It don't get any simpler than that.

 

[Shiloah]

Paul makes a big difference between, ceremonial laws and Ten Commandments:
"Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. -1 Corinthians 7:19"

Now what do you say to that?
Heresy is bringing back ceremonial laws and sacrifices. Ten commandments have got nothing to do with this.
Revelation 22:14 makes it clear that only those that do His commandments will enter into the tree of life.
"Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have right into the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city."
If we should not keep the Law, why is it that only those that do it, enter into the kingdom? It is really false accusation to accuse us of holding up a false theory. I go with Paul, i will not make the law void by my faith. I will establish it.
Plus the new covenant is writing that law in our hearts and minds. So you are supposed to keep the Law gladly now. The new covenant is writing that law, not on tables of stone, but on our hearts! Now that the law is written in my heart, i can say with joy: How i love Thy law, O God.
"If we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, then there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins"- hebrews 10:26
You don't sin wilfully. You do your best not to sin because you love God, but if you fall into sin, you have an advocate.
"Brethren, theses things i write unto you that ye sin not. And[but] if any man sin we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous."- 1 john 2:1
Your faith is dead if it does not have works: "faith without works is death"- james 2:20.
If you want your faith to be dead so be it. But me i will awake from sin, "awake to righteousness and SIN NOT"- 1 corinthians 15:34

The ranks are building. Solid reasoning brings me such comfort. I actually give way to fear at times that this really doesn't all make perfect sense. And then sensible people come in and say sensible things, and I'm so surprised at how much better I feel. Yes, it all makes perfect sense when interpreted as a whole, for it is one complete and perfect message.

 

[Shiloah]

You know? What I find so suspicious about these accusers of 7th day Adventists is this. Again, I'm not one and don't know that much about them though I've checked into them recently because of accusations I've seen on here AS WELL as the reasoning I've seen put forth by (apparently) some 7th day Adventists. The reasoning I've seen put forth by the 7th dayers made much more sense than that of the accusers, not to mention, it was all scripturally based. And the accusers? What's funniest is that the accusations made involve these Millerites or whatever that lived back in the early 18 hundreds, and whatever was involved there had absolutely nothing to do with the arguments being discussed. I've never even heard this Ellen White mentioned in here by 7th Day Adventists in respect to these arguments, which have been strictly about the Laws of God, specifically the sabbath law on occasion. So don't you people realize this is a perfect example of basing your arguments on a logical fallacy?

Your argument that is a church that believes that sabbath still should be kept on Saturday originated with a group of people that interpreted something wrong makes the argument itself invalid? Something that had nothing to do with these arguments? Huh? It seems apparent to me that accusation is made when you can't win the argument based on scriptures alone. I also know when I see this accusation made that the accusers are not entirely honest people, nor do they even care if their accusations are entirely sound, for clearly, the reason for these accusations in the first place is simply to devalue the argument of anyone who might be associated with this church on that charge alone, which again, has nothing whatsoever to do with an argument based on scriptures alone.

I've not seen these 7th day Adventists do this. I've only seen them ever base their arguments solely on scripture. This tells me a lot about both sides of this argument.

 

[directline2iam]

And again, Rom 14?

Rom 14:1 Him that isweak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.

The first thing we see here is that this chapter is aboutrelating to a weak brother.

Rom 14:2 For onebelieveth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

The subject here? Vegetarianism

Rom 14:3 Let not himthat eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judgehim that eateth: for God hath received him.

So, if you encounter one who is weak in the faith andbelieves he must eat vegetables only, don’t let this puff you up…

2Co 10:12 For we darenot make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commendthemselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparingthemselves among themselves, are not wise.

What is the gold standard here?

1Pe 2:21 For even hereuntowere ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example,that ye should follow his steps:

Eph 4:13 Till we allcome in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto aperfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:


Rom 14:4 Who art thouthat judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth.Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

Now to the meat and potatoes…

Rom 14:5 One manesteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let everyman be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He thatregardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not theday, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, forhe giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, andgiveth God thanks.

Why is eating and fasting (not eating) connected to dayshere? Let’s see…

Luk 18:11 ThePharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am notas other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes ofall that I possess.

From Bullingers Companion Bible…

Luke 18:12


twice in the week. The law prescribed only one in the year(Lev_16:29. Num_29:7). By the time of Zec_8:19 there were four yearly fasts. Inour Lord's day they were bi-weekly (Monday and Thursday), between Passover andPentecost; and between the Feast of Tabernacles and the Dedication.

Yes they fasted two days a week, Monday and Thursday, EVERYMONDAY and EVERY THURSDAY.

Rom 14:7 For none ofus liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
Rom 14:8 For whetherwe live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord:whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
Rom 14:9 For to thisend Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of thedead and living.
Rom 14:10 But whydost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for weshall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
Rom 14:11 For it iswritten, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and everytongue shall confess to God.
Rom 14:12 So thenevery one of us shall give account of himself to God.
Rom 14:13 Let us nottherefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put astumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
Rom 14:14 I know, andam persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but tohim that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
Rom 14:15 But if thybrother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy nothim with thy meat, for whom Christ died.

Now Paul shifts his attention to meat offered to idols. At the time, meat and drink were offered topagan idols. After it was offered it was sold in a meat market called the‘Shambles’.

1Co 10:25 Whatsoeveris sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:

Shambles…

G3111
μάκελλον
makellon
Thayer Definition:
1) a place where meat and other articles of food are sold,meat market
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: of Latin origin[macellum]
Citing in TDNT: 4:370, 549

There were those who were weak in the faith (verse 1) whowere offended by this. They somehowthought that eating that food was somehow connecting them with the idolatrouspractices around them. This is why thefollowing is written…

Rom 14:16 Let notthen your good be evil spoken of:
Rom 14:17 For thekingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, andjoy in the Holy Ghost.

Meat here is…

G1035
βρῶσις
brōsis
bro'-sis
From the base of G977; (abstractly) eating (literally orfiguratively); by extension (concretely) food (literally or figuratively): -eating, food, meat.

Notice it is food, not clean or unclean flesh.

G4213
πόσις
posis
pos'-is
From the alternate of G4095; a drinking (the act), that is,(concretely) a draught: - drink.

Drinking, can be alcoholic or non-alcoholic beverages. Paul was dealing with ascetism and the beliefthat doing without was somehow a show of character. He dealt with this issue at Colossae also…

Col 2:21 (Touch not;taste not; handle not;
Col 2:22 Which allare to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?
Col 2:23 Whichthings have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, andneglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

Rom 14:18 For he thatin these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.
Rom 14:19 Let ustherefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewithone may edify another.
Rom 14:20 For meatdestroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil forthat man who eateth with offence.

The word for meat here is broma, from Thayer’s…

G1033
βρῶμα
brōma
Thayer Definition:
1) that which is eaten, food
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from the base ofG977
Citing in TDNT: 1:642, 111

Again, we are dealing with food.

Rom 14:21 It is goodneither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brotherstumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.

So, it is not dealing with clean and unclean, but with flesh(meat) and wine (drink) that makes a weak brother stumble.

Rom 14:22 Hast thoufaith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himselfin that thing which he alloweth.
Rom 14:23 And he thatdoubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever isnot of faith is sin.

There is no passage in Rom 14 that deals with the Sabbath orclean and unclean meats. The subjectsare vegetarianism, fasting and food and drink offered to idols.

Now what meats does God really bless?

1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

the word sanctified here means set apart. So what meats are set apart by the Word of God?

Lev 11 and Deut 14.

Yes I know how the story goes I was using quotations out of the Word to show the depth of Gods Word. Nothing I copied out of the bible and used to explain about someone not eating pig and of a course the title about Sunday Laws is a lie. Your just hung up on this means this only and that means that only and your taking that out of context and bla bla. The amount of His Word that we do have in the old and new testament which are bits and pieces where given to us to see that God is SO SO much more in UNDERSTANDING and WISDOM. You can call Sunday your day of rest or any other day, you can even work on the Sabbath Day and you can even eat all the pig you want on the Sabbath Day! If you understand God's Word. Since Christ died on the stick and is at the right hand of God ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE. In case you didn't know it, pigs were clean before the fall of Adam and since Christ made all things NEW AND CLEAN AGAIN pigs too are sanctified in His blood. Now don't argue with me, take it up with the Lord and ask Him.