Mark of the beast is sunday laws.

[AgeofKnowledge]

I've reported you for the ugly name calling you engaged in this post Shiloah. Feel free to stop engaging in that behavior at any time.

I recognize truth and I recognize liars. And you're a liar.

I already replied to your abusive ad hominem accusation. Go back and reread. If you didn't understand it then you won't now. You are blind only to what you say. I accuse you because you're guilty of attacking those that do what Christ says. I'm only calling a spade a spade.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

I hear you 1still_waters. I'm on topic.

Just a reminder, let's keep it civil lil fishies.
I know things get heated, so maybe step away and diffuse a lil.
Thanks.

 

[Shiloah]

I've reported you for the ugly name calling you engaged in this post Shiloah. Feel free to stop engaging in that behavior at any time.

I'll not respond as I promised I wouldn't.

 

[Shiloah]

I do, however, see no point in taking part in a Bible study where my and others points of view are continually addressed as heresy and false teaching. I can't focus on the Bible study when that happens. I only see the bullying attacks and I continually have to wrestle with myself not to point it out and try to just focus on the study.

 

[zone]

LYING FOR GOD

2010 AD

Fighting Dirty In Defense Of The Three Pillars of Adventism

BOOK I - SABBATH IMPOSSIBILITIES

Chapter 1 - Dr. Bacchiocchi Opens Pandora's Box
Chapter 2 - What Adventists Don't Want You to Know About Early Church History
Chapter 3 - What Adventists Don't Want You to Know About Biblical Themes and Concepts

BOOK II - HISTORY OF ADVENTISM'S LONG WAR AGAINST TRUTH

Chapter 4 - The Cover-Up 1844 to 1899
Chapter 5 - The Cover-Up 1900-1919
Chapter 6 - The Cover-Up 1920-1939
Chapter 7 - The Cover-Up 1940-1959
Chapter 8 - Cover-Up During the 1960's and 1970's
Chapter 9 - The Cover-Up 1980-1989
Chapter 10 - The Cover-Up 1990 to Present

BOOK III - BACCHIOCCHI, DU PREEZ, AND MACCARTY WREAK THEOLOGICAL HAVOC

Chapter 11 - Dr. Bacchiocchi and Dr. du Preez Wreak Havoc
Chapter 12 - Dr. MacCarty Wreaks Havoc

BOOK IV - THE TITHING MYTH + HYPOCRISY CREATES CORRUPTION

Chapter 13 - Ellen Makes Millions With Her Visions
Chapter 14 - Ellen Makes Billions For The Church With Her Visions
Chapter 15 - Church Corruption Since The 1970's

APPENDIXES

Appendix I - Sabbath Not A Law For Christians, Robert K. Sanders
Appendix II - J. N. Andrews on the Didache
Appendix III - Tertullian: Was he Sabbatarian Or Anti-Sabbatarian?

By

Kerry B. Wynne

M.A., educational administration, Andrews University (1978)
B.A., English (1970) and history (1972), Pacific Union College

And

William H. Hohmann, B.A., theology, Ambassador College (1976)


Kerry Wynne is a former third generation Seventh-day Adventist. William Hohmann is a former Worldwide Church of God member. The Sabbath "heritage" of both authors goes back to one, single group of believers which adopted Sabbatarianism almost immediately after the Great Disappointment of 1844. Thus, these denominations are truly "sister" churches. Both authors graduated from the universities which host(ed) the theological seminaries of their respective denominations. The authors have worked in association with biblical researcher, Robert K. Sanders, a former Seventh-day Adventist who now hosts a comprehensive web-site which addresses issues in Adventism and Sabbatarianism—Truth Or Fables.Com.

3rd edition - November 27, 2010 - Copyright 2010 by Amazing Lies Publications

This work may be freely distributed in either print or electronic form without violation of copyright laws as long as the book's content is not altered and credit to the authors is retained.


APPENDIX I


SABBATH NOT A LAW FOR CHRISTIANS


By Robert K. Sanders

Sabbatatrians Refuted and Sabbath keepers Exposed: 2011 AD < click



outstanding resource, people.

 

[Shiloah]

LYING FOR GOD

2010 AD

Fighting Dirty In Defense Of The Three Pillars of Adventism

BOOK I - SABBATH IMPOSSIBILITIES

Chapter 1 - Dr. Bacchiocchi Opens Pandora's Box
Chapter 2 - What Adventists Don't Want You to Know About Early Church History
Chapter 3 - What Adventists Don't Want You to Know About Biblical Themes and Concepts

BOOK II - HISTORY OF ADVENTISM'S LONG WAR AGAINST TRUTH

Chapter 4 - The Cover-Up 1844 to 1899
Chapter 5 - The Cover-Up 1900-1919
Chapter 6 - The Cover-Up 1920-1939
Chapter 7 - The Cover-Up 1940-1959
Chapter 8 - Cover-Up During the 1960's and 1970's
Chapter 9 - The Cover-Up 1980-1989
Chapter 10 - The Cover-Up 1990 to Present

BOOK III - BACCHIOCCHI, DU PREEZ, AND MACCARTY WREAK THEOLOGICAL HAVOC

Chapter 11 - Dr. Bacchiocchi and Dr. du Preez Wreak Havoc
Chapter 12 - Dr. MacCarty Wreaks Havoc

BOOK IV - THE TITHING MYTH + HYPOCRISY CREATES CORRUPTION

Chapter 13 - Ellen Makes Millions With Her Visions
Chapter 14 - Ellen Makes Billions For The Church With Her Visions
Chapter 15 - Church Corruption Since The 1970's

APPENDIXES

Appendix I - Sabbath Not A Law For Christians, Robert K. Sanders
Appendix II - J. N. Andrews on the Didache
Appendix III - Tertullian: Was he Sabbatarian Or Anti-Sabbatarian?

By

Kerry B. Wynne

M.A., educational administration, Andrews University (1978)
B.A., English (1970) and history (1972), Pacific Union College

And

William H. Hohmann, B.A., theology, Ambassador College (1976)


Kerry Wynne is a former third generation Seventh-day Adventist. William Hohmann is a former Worldwide Church of God member. The Sabbath "heritage" of both authors goes back to one, single group of believers which adopted Sabbatarianism almost immediately after the Great Disappointment of 1844. Thus, these denominations are truly "sister" churches. Both authors graduated from the universities which host(ed) the theological seminaries of their respective denominations. The authors have worked in association with biblical researcher, Robert K. Sanders, a former Seventh-day Adventist who now hosts a comprehensive web-site which addresses issues in Adventism and Sabbatarianism—Truth Or Fables.Com.

3rd edition - November 27, 2010 - Copyright 2010 by Amazing Lies Publications

This work may be freely distributed in either print or electronic form without violation of copyright laws as long as the book's content is not altered and credit to the authors is retained.


APPENDIX I


SABBATH NOT A LAW FOR CHRISTIANS


By Robert K. Sanders

Sabbatatrians Refuted and Sabbath keepers Exposed: 2011 AD < click



outstanding resource, people.

And here we go again, same thing from the same people. Stay on topic? What a joke.

 

[zone]

And here we go again, same thing from the same people. Stay on topic? What a joke.

TOPIC: Re: Mark of the beast is sunday laws.

the article not only refutes that ludicrous idea, it refutes that the jews who became christians continued to observe Sinai sabbath.

but it`s a lot of reading for you, i`m sure.

 

[Shiloah]

TOPIC: Re: Mark of the beast is sunday laws.

the article not only refutes that ludicrous idea, it refutes that the jews who became christians continued to observe Sinai sabbath.

but it`s a lot of reading for you, i`m sure.

Brood of vipers comes to mind. If you'd like to continue speaking to them, God be with you, Lao. I'm afraid I just don't feel compelled by the Holy Spirit to do so. I see no reason to sit in a snake pit when nothing can be accomplished. Surely there are edifying threads on this site.

 

[zone]

Brood of vipers comes to mind. If you'd like to continue speaking to them, God be with you, Lao. I'm afraid I just don't feel compelled by the Holy Spirit to do so. I see no reason to sit in a snake pit when nothing can be accomplished. Surely there are edifying threads on this site.

so you are too sacred to read the article, because your foundation will crumble.
understandable. but without excuse.
you wont ever be able to say no one told you.

brood of vipers...lol.
you re teamed with a masonic sabbatarian cult to preserve your delusion that you keep the Sinai Sabbath.
mkay

 

[Laodicea]

And here we go again, same thing from the same people. Stay on topic? What a joke.

Yes always the same. Anyone could get critical info of the net about any church, it would be easy to find critical info on the net about the church zone goes to. Critical info does not prove truth. How many use the Bible and let the Bible speak.

 

[CoooCaw]

I am surprised no one has mentioned ron wyatt

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Good stuff zone. This is older and lengthy but it's worth watching all the way through. The John Ankerberg Show 'Seventh Day Adventism: Who Is Telling the Truth?':

[video=youtube;JM6lmUCTpDo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JM6lmUCTpDo&amp;feature=share&amp;list=UUG8z9cSzYA cl3dZJM2s1z3w[/video]

Part 2: 2 of 5 - Seventh-day Adventism - Who's Telling the Truth - The John Ankerberg Show - YouTube
Part 3: 3 of 5 - Seventh-day Adventism - Who's Telling the Truth - The John Ankerberg Show - YouTube
Part 4: 4 of 5 - Seventh-day Adventism - Who's Telling the Truth - The John Ankerberg Show - YouTube
Part 5: 5 of 5 - Seventh-day Adventism - Who's Telling the Truth - The John Ankerberg Show - YouTube

 

[CoooCaw]

the original source of this idea

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKCRvzTJyc

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Here's Robert K. Sander's webpage on this Appendix with related links to the topic of the thread:

Sabbath not a law for Christians

More information on Sabbath:

Sabbath Not a Law for Christians: Explaining the Covenants
The Pope nor the Catholic Church Changed Sabbath to Sunday
The Seal of God—What Is It?
The Mark of The Beast—What Is It?
History and Overview About the Sabbath Day By Rob Chaffart

Sabbath in Christ—A new book, by former Adventist Pastor Dale Ratzlaff, that explains how Sabbath keepers have been misled. Be a Bible Berean and read this book. Thousands including Adventist pastors have left Adventism after getting their eyes opened.

Appendix I - Sabbath Not A Law For Christians, Robert K. Sanders

 

[Shiloah]

Yes always the same. Anyone could get critical info of the net about any church, it would be easy to find critical info on the net about the church zone goes to. Critical info does not prove truth. How many use the Bible and let the Bible speak.

Lao, the truth is, I'm willing to listen to good reasoning on this issue. But when I see people that present their side by way of accusing and insulting people in ways that are not even honest, this shows me that whatever argument they may have is not of God, and hence, not worth considering. Especially people that are downright cruel in their accusations and end up making parting shots show me what they are. They are not of God, in fact, I honestly believe they are enemies of God when their agendas clearly become more important to them than people. Christ came to save us, not to condemn us. And when one's religious interests become only about seeking out conspiracies in governments, people, etc. to the degree that these theorists treat anyone that disagrees with them with apparent malice, they are on the side of Satan, I have no doubt, for their behavior drives the sheep from the flock. And those are Christ's sheep that He died for. This is where " but whosoever shall cause one of these little ones who believe in Me to fall, it were better for him that a millstone were hung about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea" comes in.

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

You are misunderstanding me. I NEVER SAID THAT YOU GET SAVED BY KEEPIN THE LAW WITH YOUR OWN EFFORTS. That's impossible to be done. In no way can it be done.
You are saved by FAITH.
"It is the gift of God, not of works lest any man should boast"- ephesians.
But now that you have faith, you don't WILFULLY break His law! True faith is the faith that works by love! And to love God is "that we keep His commandments: and His commandments are not grievous"- 1 john 5:3. I am not telling you to get saved by your own efforts. I am just trying to share with you that you make transgressing the Ten Commandments a light thing. A thing not to be concerned about. Judgement is based at the end on your works! "Behold, i come quickly, to give every man according as his work shall be"- revelation 22:12.
True believers are those that love God and because of their love keep His commandments: "if ye love Me, keep My commandments"- John 14:15.

Please understand what we arw trying to share with you before you argue. This is why as EGW said, that the condition of eternal life is obedience to the Law. This is how it is:
Because wicked, do not keep the law.
Righteous, being righteous by faith, because of the Holy Spirit, keep the Law. They don't keep it by their own power! They keep it by the power of God. Not by their own efforts.
Revelation 22:14 is clear: "Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city".
Just because you got faith now, you don't triffle with His mercy and break His law as if it was some small thing.
What you think of Jesus' command by the way. This was a COMMAN: "be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven as perfect." Matthew sermon on the mount.
So please. You got faith. Now you are supposed to love the Lord with all thy heart and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. Loving God is obeying Him. "He that saith, i know Him, and keeps not His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him"- 1 john 2:4.
Your faith is DEAD if you don't perfect it with works:
"Faith without works is death."- James 2:20.
If you boast to have faith , without works, i will tell you "i will show you my faith by my works"- james 2:18
Suppose that Abraham believed God, but did not venture to leave his family and go to the land of Cannan. How's that believing God?! Suppose that moses believed God, but did not go to egypt to OBEY God in pulling the children out of the land of Egypt. If that's the case, than how can you say that Moses belived God. Well We are saying he believed, how come he did not go to Egypt and obey God's purpose?
Even so "faith if it hath not works is dead".
"Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? -James 2:22"
My faith is being made perfect by obeying His law. You have agreed to the first half of the story. But the second half that tells you that obedience to God is necessary, you throw away. I perceive you do this:
1. You are deceived and have been truthfully ignorant about this fact of obedience to God.
2. You are just arguing back, because the idea of obeying God does not sound "tickling" to your ears. The idea that keeping a day holy for God for His pleasure and purpose you cannot handle, because you want to do YOUR WILL.
It's either point 1 , or point 2. You know your hearts. What TRULY is the purpose of your heart for arguing that you don't have to keep the Law? I shared the verses above. You can't go a shortcut around that! The Bible says so. Now i know that, and i am following what the Bible says. What will YOU do?
"Behold, i come quickly, and my reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work shall be."- revelation 22:12.
When it comes to city of heaven, Jesus wants the purest pure: remember the parable, how he will seperate the sheep from the goats? A small sin, as eating a fruit of the forbidden tree, caused woe and misery and destruction. When the Bible tells you that "the wages of sin is death"- romans 6:23 please believe it. No sin is allowed to enter into heaven. You gotta repent! And true repentance and forsaking sin in your heart! Repent is to change your mind about sin! Well how you are saying you repented, when you are clinging to make it okay to break God's Law? You were supposed to repent! Jesus tells you," by my power, you can bring forth fruit" that was a paraphrasing of John 15:1-5.
Thank you for reading. I hope you see the unreasonablenes that you keep on doing about ignoring basic Bible facts.

this whole post just shows that you believe in salvation by works...even while you were trying to claim that you don't...

if you are saved by grace through faith then your salvation does not depend on keeping the law...period...

there can be no 'mark of the beast' based on -keeping or not keeping the law- if salvation is by grace through faith...

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

The only agenda I have is refuting the heretical false assertion, which is a lie of the devil, that genuine born again Christians receive the ultimate condemnation (e.g. mark of the beast) because they worship God on Sunday.

A secondary agenda would be bringing the gross heretical theological error of Seventh Day Adventism, the group responsible for inventing the heretical false assertion that genuine born again Christians are damned for worshipping God on Sunday, to the light so people are not drawn into such gross error.

For my part, it's DEFINITELY done out of love and concern for people.

What Does the Bible Say About New Covenant?

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

your theology that the Sabbath was done away does not fit at all. The Sabbath was never done away. The fourth commandment was never done away. Jesus never broke it. Nor will He ever teach men to sin by breaking it.
Hebrews 4, is clear. Paul is talking about the seventh day, which God rested on, when He created the world at the foundation of the world. We enter into that rest, and we harden not our hearts. He that enters into God's rest, cease from his own works, as God did from His, when He rested at the foundation of the world. Mosaic law got nothing to do with the ten commandments. Ten commandments were from the beginning before there even was a Moses on the earth.
"For in six days the Lord, made heaven, and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested on the seventh day, wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it."- exodus 20:11.
Sabbath was before sin. It was not a shadow of things to come. Had adam and eve never sinned, Jesus would have never came to this earth.

now you are just repeating the same assertions that have already been refuted...

you were shown john 5:18 which says jesus was 'breaking the sabbath'...so yes jesus broke the sabbath commandment...

you are not allowed to ignore scripture because it doesn't fit your theology...your job is to change your theology to agree with this scripture...

you have also been shown already that hebrews 4 is not talking about the saturday sabbath...to summarize...

hebrews 4 is talking about a -promised- rest...the saturday sabbath is a rest that is not promised but -commanded-
hebrews 4 is talking about a rest that you enter -by believing...the saturday sabbath was observed by refraining from work...
hebrews 4 is talking about a rest that can be entered 'today'...that is on any given day...the saturday sabbath can only be observed on saturday by definition...

so like i said before...hebrews 4 cannot be talking about the saturday sabbath...because the saturday sabbath does not fit what is being described in hebrews 4...

you are not allowed to twist scripture to make it fit your theology...your job is to change your theology to agree with the meaning of this scripture...

finally you have no scriptural proof that the ten commandments were given before the time of moses...

you are not allowed to add to scripture to make it fit your theology...your job is to change your theology to agree with what scripture -does- say...not what you -wish- it said...

in just this one post you have committed all three of the sins relating to scripture...adding to scripture...taking away from scripture...and twisting scripture...you have departed to the right and to the left and everywhere in between...

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

Like your Aunt,, I too obey God's dietary laws as well as His 10 Commandments. No pork is set on my table before my family.

and this just goes to show that adventists are being dishonest about their claim that the ten commandments are separate from God's law and that they believe only the ten commandments are still in effect...

it is obvious from the fact that you keep the dietary laws that you believe that they are also in effect...

and since you follow the dietary laws but not any of the other laws...it is obvious that you are picking and choosing which laws to follow...

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

You know? What I find so suspicious about these accusers of 7th day Adventists is this. Again, I'm not one and don't know that much about them though I've checked into them recently because of accusations I've seen on here AS WELL as the reasoning I've seen put forth by (apparently) some 7th day Adventists. The reasoning I've seen put forth by the 7th dayers made much more sense than that of the accusers, not to mention, it was all scripturally based. And the accusers? What's funniest is that the accusations made involve these Millerites or whatever that lived back in the early 18 hundreds, and whatever was involved there had absolutely nothing to do with the arguments being discussed. I've never even heard this Ellen White mentioned in here by 7th Day Adventists in respect to these arguments, which have been strictly about the Laws of God, specifically the sabbath law on occasion. So don't you people realize this is a perfect example of basing your arguments on a logical fallacy?

Your argument that is a church that believes that sabbath still should be kept on Saturday originated with a group of people that interpreted something wrong makes the argument itself invalid? Something that had nothing to do with these arguments? Huh? It seems apparent to me that accusation is made when you can't win the argument based on scriptures alone. I also know when I see this accusation made that the accusers are not entirely honest people, nor do they even care if their accusations are entirely sound, for clearly, the reason for these accusations in the first place is simply to devalue the argument of anyone who might be associated with this church on that charge alone, which again, has nothing whatsoever to do with an argument based on scriptures alone.

I've not seen these 7th day Adventists do this. I've only seen them ever base their arguments solely on scripture. This tells me a lot about both sides of this argument.

the millerite background of the seventh day adventist church -is- relevant...because the millerites committed the sin of false prophecy...and the adventists are those millerites that never abandoned miller's false prophecy...they just edited it...

false prophecy is claiming that God said something that he didn't really say...so when it comes to adding to the words of God...the adventists already have a prior record...

the adventists haven't mentioned ellen white...but you have surely noticed that their interpretation of scripture is -very- different from everyone else's...do you know why that is?

it is because they get their interpretations from ellen white...

so the adventists do not really base their teachings on scripture alone...they base their teachings on scripture plus ellen white...they are being deceptive when they claim to base their arguments solely on scripture...