Attack of the seventh day adventists

[Josh321]

Dan, talk about Jesus' instructions regarding the law in Matthew 5.

Matthew 5:18-19 "For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

as i stated the bible is like a puzzle correct? now i will show you why it can't be passed away because if there wasn't a law there wouldn't be any sin the law is there to show us that we can't keep it and we need a supernatural help to be righteous

Romans 2:14-15
King James Version (KJV)
14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:


15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

after reading that we clearly see that we cannot follow the law because of our nature, i'm gonna let the bible speak for itself

Romans 7:7

King James Version (KJV)

7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

that is why it was never pass away because sin would be dead if there wasn't a law * edit * this is why we must be born again to have a new nature [h=3]2 Corinthians 5:17[/h]King James Version (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

 

[Josh321]

You twist the meaning of Colossians 2:16, i have posted multiple times all the verses around it with a breakdown, and I have got no answer on that, just crickets. and clearly you dont understand the wineskins parable, if you did you may put off the old lawless nature, and put on the new spirit of obedience.

BTW, I dont know who that comment was aimed at but a "religous demon"? usually doesnt lead you to doing the traits of a Scriptual Saint:

Revelation 14:12

New International Version
This calls for patient endurance on the part of the people of God who keep his commands and remain faithful to Jesus.

New Living Translation
This means that God's holy people must endure persecution patiently, obeying his commands and maintaining their faith in Jesus.

English Standard Version
Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

New American Standard Bible
Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

King James Bible
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
This demands the perseverance of the saints, who keep God's commands and their faith in Jesus."

International Standard Version
Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, who keep the commandments of God and hold fast to their faithfulness in Jesus:

NET Bible
This requires the steadfast endurance of the saints--those who obey God's commandments and hold to their faith in Jesus.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
Here is the patience of The Holy Ones, those who keep the commands of God and the faith of Yeshua.”

GOD'S WORD® Translation
In this situation God's holy people, who obey his commands and keep their faith in Jesus, need endurance.

Jubilee Bible 2000
Here is the patience of the saints; here are those that keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

King James 2000 Bible
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

American King James Version
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

American Standard Version
Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Here is the patience of the saints, who keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Darby Bible Translation
Here is the endurance of the saints, who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

English Revised Version
Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Webster's Bible Translation
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Weymouth New Testament
Here is an opportunity for endurance on the part of God's people, who carefully keep His commandments and the faith of Jesus!"

World English Bible
Here is the patience of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus."

Young's Literal Translation
Here is endurance of the saints: here are those keeping the commands of God, and the faith of Jesus.'

i will copy paste what i previously wroted above in hopes that you may anwser it

none of you are also yet to anwser my question 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: what about the children? there is no age limit on this should 12 years old quit school and start LABOURING DOING HARD PHYSICAL work? or what about if someone is crippled and can't walk and in a wheel chair should this person have to do PHYSICAL HARD LABOUR WORK AS WELL? or did you all forget this is in the commandment? oh yea i forgot once you keep the sabbath everything else doesn't matter right? what about when we become older and reach an age where our bones are old and we can't do much should this person still labour 6 days a week, what about me i applied for a job at 6 places and didn't get the job, open your eyes people... stop blinding yourselves

 

[Hizikyah]

as i stated the bible is like a puzzle correct? now i will show you why it can't be passed away because if there wasn't a law there wouldn't be any sin the law is there to show us that we can't keep it and we need a supernatural help to be righteous

Romans 2:14-15
King James Version (KJV)
14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:


15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

after reading that we clearly see that we cannot follow the law because of our nature, i'm gonna let the bible speak for itself

Romans 7:7

King James Version (KJV)

7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

that is why it was never pass away because sin would be dead if there wasn't a law

"14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:"

those who live in lawlessness are the farthest thing from a law unto themsleves, unless you think that means what ever you think is ok, is ok.

"15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another"

You seem to be "excusing one another" from obedience instead of "shew the work of the law written in their hearts"

You quoted Rom7:7-8, keep readin the rest of 7 and chapter 8 then get back to me.

Romans 7:14, "Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous."

seems you despise what is holy?

 

[john832]

because you can't anwser this question and you have no anwser for it that's what is going on here, it's not foolishness at all you just have no anwser for it

Show me the Command that says that children should be forced into hard physical labor. Show me the command to force the infirmed into hadr physical labor. The foolishness is that you are fabricating to suit your own interests. God says something about that...

Exo 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

 

[Josh321]

Show me the Command that says that children should be forced into hard physical labor. Show me the command to force the infirmed into hadr physical labor. The foolishness is that you are fabricating to suit your own interests. God says something about that...

Exo 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: does it give a particular age group of who has to labour? it's a simple question it never give a particular age group or WHEN TO STOP that is why i asked you what about the old people and the children

 

[john832]

i will copy paste what i previously wroted above in hopes that you may anwser it

none of you are also yet to anwser my question 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: what about the children? there is no age limit on this should 12 years old quit school and start LABOURING DOING HARD PHYSICAL work? or what about if someone is crippled and can't walk and in a wheel chair should this person have to do PHYSICAL HARD LABOUR WORK AS WELL? or did you all forget this is in the commandment? oh yea i forgot once you keep the sabbath everything else doesn't matter right? what about when we become older and reach an age where our bones are old and we can't do much should this person still labour 6 days a week, what about me i applied for a job at 6 places and didn't get the job, open your eyes people... stop blinding yourselves

Please show me where God, the author of this...

Deu 14:28 At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates:
Deu 14:29 And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

Says that children and infirmed are to be slaves for forced labor. What you have said is a terrible twisting of the scritpure.

 

[Josh321]

"14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:"

those who live in lawlessness are the farthest thing from a law unto themsleves, unless you think that means what ever you think is ok, is ok.

"15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another"

You seem to be "excusing one another" from obedience instead of "shew the work of the law written in their hearts"

You quoted Rom7:7-8, keep readin the rest of 7 and chapter 8 then get back to me.

Romans 7:14, "Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous."

seems you despise what is holy?

oh ofcourse the law is holy and righteous it showed me that i cannot keep it and i need a superior being to change my nature so i can cease from sinning

 

[john832]

Frankly, this is foolishness and this scripture comes to mind...

Pro 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

Hmmm, if I keep it up, I shall make myself to be a fool. Done and done.

 

[john832]

oh ofcourse the law is holy and righteous it showed me that i cannot keep it and i need a superior being to change my nature so i can cease from sinning

So, you don't sin?

 

[Josh321]

Please show me where God, the author of this...

Deu 14:28 At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates:
Deu 14:29 And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

Says that children and infirmed are to be slaves for forced labor. What you have said is a terrible twisting of the scritpure.

nope i'm not saying anything i'm just quoted what the scripture said 9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

it never gave an age group or when to stop, you never will have an anwser to this question

 

[KohenMatt]

Josh, are you practicing and teaching the Law?

Matthew 5:19 "Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

 

[Josh321]

So, you don't sin?

i'm no longer a slave to sin it's a difference, before i use to practise sinning without knowing it but now that God changed my nature i'm free from that i'm no longer under the yoke of sin

 

[john832]

What is sin?

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

You are ignoring the first part, yahshua asked have you done this first thing? The guy said yes. Then He said ok, now do this second thing. If I just do one without the other its of no effect. either way, only commendments or only giving to poor, we need both according to Yahshua, the guys said how may I enter the kingdom, Yahshua's first answer was THE COMMANDMENTS.

I'm not ignoring the first part, because I know how it fits within the context of history. When Jesus told the young man to keep the law if he wanted to find life, he simply pointed him to the covenant then in existence: the covenant of law under Moses. The new covenant did not exist yet.

When the young man persisted and justified himself by answering that he was flawless in regards to the law, Jesus told him that if he wanted to be perfect (instead of just imagining that he was so by keeping the law) to follow him. In other words, take your eyes off of yourself in relation to the law and follow me, perfection itself.

This is a key point of that parable: that perfection is achieved by following Christ, not the law.

 

[KohenMatt]

i'm no longer a slave to sin it's a difference, before i use to practise sinning without knowing it but now that God changed my nature i'm free from that i'm no longer under the yoke of sin

So Jesus was wrong when He said this?

Matthew 5:18 "For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."

 

[danschance]

Dan, talk about Jesus' instructions regarding the law in Matthew 5.

Matthew 5:18-19 "For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

First off, I can't help but to notice how you left off what Jesus said in verse 17. Verse 17 puts the rest into it's proper context:

17"Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets;I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.18"For trulyI sayto you, until heaven and earth pass away,not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished.19"Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments,and teaches others[to do] the same,shall be calledleastin the kingdomof heaven;but whoever keeps and teaches[them], he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

By taking things out of context, one can put a spin on things. Ask yourself this" Paul did away with circumcision which is a part of the law. So did Paul violate verses 18 and 19 of Matt. 5?" He did, didn't he? In Galations 5 Paul very clearly states that circumcision has no place in Christianity. So by your own twisted Pharisaical thinking, Paul must be counted as least in the kingdom of God as Paul did away with part of the law---OR Jesus meant something else entirely different.

If we are to interpret Matt 5:17-19 we must first understand what Jesus meant by "fullfill". If we only read verses 18 and 19 then by all means lets adhere to all 619 Jewish laws, fully embrace all Jewish rituals, start observing circumcision, Sabbath, Passover, all dietary restrictions and toss out the New Testament teachings on grace too.

So do me a favor and next time you quote scripture, please quote it in it's proper context. Otherwise you are guilty of twisting it and creating new doctrines that God does not embrace.

 

[Josh321]

Josh, are you practicing and teaching the Law?

Matthew 5:19 "Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

well what i actually teach and tell people is the meaning of what born in sin mean that we cannot fulfil the will of God unless we are born again, to tell someone they living in sin is like telling a rabbit that is is a rabbit what i mean like this as the bible said we the gentiles do by nature the things contained in the law this is why it won't make sense to tell people to do this and that but it doesn't mean you should encourage them to break the law that is why we must preach about salvation

 

[KohenMatt]

First off, I can't help but to notice how you left off what Jesus said in verse 17. Verse 17 puts the rest into it's proper context:


By taking things out of context, one can put a spin on things. Ask yourself this" Paul did away with circumcision which is a part of the law. So did Paul violate verses 18 and 19 of Matt. 5?" He did, didn't he? In Galations 5 Paul very clearly states that circumcision has no place in Christianity. So by your own twisted Pharisaical thinking, Paul must be counted as least in the kingdom of God as Paul did away with part of the law---OR Jesus meant something else entirely different.

If we are to interpret Matt 5:17-19 we must first understand what Jesus meant by "fullfill". If we only read verses 18 and 19 then by all means lets adhere to all 619 Jewish laws, fully embrace all Jewish rituals, start observing circumcision, Sabbath, Passover, all dietary restrictions and toss out the New Testament teachings on grace too.

So do me a favor and next time you quote scripture, please quote it in it's proper context. Otherwise you are guilty of twisting it and creating new doctrines that God does not embrace.

I apologize for leaving out the 1 verse I've quoted dozens of times in this thread alone.

So are you saying that this 1 word "fulfill" negates the following concepts that Jesus said?
1) “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets (insert your 1 word argument, "fulfill" here.
2) until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
3) Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven
4) but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

So Jesus say's he fulfilled the Law. OK, but He also said He didn't come to abolish it. Then He said the Law won't disappear. Then He said you should do the Law. Then He said you should teach others to do it.

4-1. That's 4 Pro-Law remarks vs. your 1 "fulfill"

 

[danschance]

You twist the meaning of Colossians 2:16, i have posted multiple times all the verses around it with a breakdown, and I have got no answer on that, just crickets. and clearly you dont understand the wineskins parable, if you did you may put off the old lawless nature, and put on the new spirit of obedience.

BTW, I dont know who that comment was aimed at but a "religous demon"? usually doesnt lead you to doing the traits of a Scriptual Saint:

Revelation 14:12

New International Version
This calls for patient endurance on the part of the people of God who keep his commands and remain faithful to Jesus.

New Living Translation
This means that God's holy people must endure persecution patiently, obeying his commands and maintaining their faith in Jesus.

English Standard Version
Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

New American Standard Bible
Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

King James Bible
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
This demands the perseverance of the saints, who keep God's commands and their faith in Jesus."

International Standard Version
Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, who keep the commandments of God and hold fast to their faithfulness in Jesus:

NET Bible
This requires the steadfast endurance of the saints--those who obey God's commandments and hold to their faith in Jesus.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
Here is the patience of The Holy Ones, those who keep the commands of God and the faith of Yeshua.”

GOD'S WORD® Translation
In this situation God's holy people, who obey his commands and keep their faith in Jesus, need endurance.

Jubilee Bible 2000
Here is the patience of the saints; here are those that keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

King James 2000 Bible
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

American King James Version
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

American Standard Version
Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Here is the patience of the saints, who keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Darby Bible Translation
Here is the endurance of the saints, who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

English Revised Version
Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Webster's Bible Translation
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Weymouth New Testament
Here is an opportunity for endurance on the part of God's people, who carefully keep His commandments and the faith of Jesus!"

World English Bible
Here is the patience of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus."

Young's Literal Translation
Here is endurance of the saints: here are those keeping the commands of God, and the faith of Jesus.'

No, you only twisted the meaning of Col 2:16 to fit your paradigm. That is called "Square peg in round hole theology".



People who embrace false doctrine can also get a free religious demon. A personal gift from satan to help you stay focused on the wrong things while you get cheated out of you prize in Heaven. I am sure you don't understand that but I think Josh does.

 

[KohenMatt]

well what i actually teach and tell people is the meaning of what born in sin mean that we cannot fulfil the will of God unless we are born again, to tell someone they living in sin is like telling a rabbit that is is a rabbit what i mean like this as the bible said we the gentiles do by nature the things contained in the law this is why it won't make sense to tell people to do this and that but it doesn't mean you should encourage them to break the law that is why we must preach about salvation

But doesn't Jesus say pretty plainly that you are to do the Law and to teach others to do it?