Attack of the seventh day adventists

[Bryancampbell]

and your 100% right in this, but you know as well as I do, because you displayed this previously, that "keeping them without regard to intention" is not keeping them at all, it is in reality, keeping them their own way, which is what the Talmud is full of. You know they made a whole book of Sabbath Laws, a BOOK full, by the time they got done with Sabbath all you could do is sit in place and stare at a wall. My will is to do what Yahweh wants, when Yahweh, wants, how Yahweh wants, I slip at times, but the more I dwell in His presence the more and more I am able to hold fast.

Why is it then brother I am accused of sinning of something fulfilled? And why is it that the law is so focused, instead of doing what's right in the Spirit?

Our Father knows what's in our hearts. But to truly learn to obey God's law in the OT is to obey Jesus. There is a verse somewhere, Jesus says, if you obey My commandments you abide in My love, just as I obeyed my Father's commandments and abide His love. Jesus kept the Father's words, we couldn't. But if we obey Jesus's words then we abide in His love.

Teach righteous deeds through the Spirit, not the law. Rather than teach that obedience through the law, teach obedience through the Spirit.

 

[hootowl]

Hi

Stupid question but what has Yahweh ( which I do know means God) have to do with SDA

I do know about Yahweh have spoken with some of their people on the old CC6 cant say they impress.
Also watched a documentary on the TV saying they were on the move in Australia not impressed at all.

But the Jewish people themselves I have a lot of time for.

Hoot owl

 

[KohenMatt]

Thank goodness for other denominations or the markets would never be open Saturday or Sunday Waaaaaa

Side note......
Went to Provo, Utah over Labor Day weekend. I'd always that Mormons don't open their businesses on Sunday. That's an understatement. It took us over 30 minutes of calling restaurants to try and find something open. Downtown was absolutely dead. Very strange.

But one blessing about that place. We went to a water park on Monday and the place was packed. But I barely saw any women in revealing swimsuits. Very refreshing.

 

[Bryancampbell]

Hootowl, the OP author is sorta ignorant, as we all are. Don't mind his accusations, some here aren't even SDA

 

[KohenMatt]

Hi

Stupid question but what has Yahweh ( which I do know means God) have to do with SDA

I do know about Yahweh have spoken with some of their people on the old CC6 cant say they impress.
Also watched a documentary on the TV saying they were on the move in Australia not impressed at all.

But the Jewish people themselves I have a lot of time for.

Hoot owl

Yahweh (YWHW) is God. All of us as Christians serve Yahweh. Many of the SDA's, as faulty as their doctrine can be at times, are Christians and serve Yahweh.

I'm not sure what you're getting at.

 

[john832]

Why is it then brother I am accused of sinning of something fulfilled? And why is it that the law is so focused, instead of doing what's right in the Spirit?

Our Father knows what's in our hearts. But to truly learn to obey God's law in the OT is to obey Jesus. There is a verse somewhere, Jesus says, if you obey My commandments you abide in My love, just as I obeyed my Father's commandments and abide His love. Jesus kept the Father's words, we couldn't. But if we obey Jesus's words then we abide in His love.

Teach righteous deeds through the Spirit, not the law. Rather than teach that obedience through the law, teach obedience through the Spirit.

Why do you believe the Sabbath is fulfilled? Has the Millenium begun? Has the world entered Christ's rest? Has this been fulfilled?

Isa 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:
Isa 11:2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
Isa 11:3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:
Isa 11:4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.
Isa 11:5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.
Isa 11:6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
Isa 11:7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
Isa 11:8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.
Isa 11:9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.
Isa 11:10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

Isa 2:1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.
Isa 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
Isa 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
Isa 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

The people of Syria could use the Rest of Christ right about now, but it won't happen until He returns.

How about this? Is this fulfilled?

Isa 14:1 For the LORD will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet choose Israel, and set them in their own land: and the strangers shall be joined with them, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob.
Isa 14:2 And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the LORD for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.
Isa 14:3 And it shall come to pass in the day that the LORD shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve,
Isa 14:4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
Isa 14:5 The LORD hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers.
Isa 14:6 He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth.
Isa 14:7 The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.

If someone has been telling you the Sabbath (a shadow of future events Col 2:16-17) is fulfilled, they are lying to you.

 

[Bryancampbell]

Then I guess your accusing the scriptures of lying brother John, just read hebrew 4.

 

[Hizikyah]

Why is it then brother I am accused of sinning of something fulfilled? And why is it that the law is so focused, instead of doing what's right in the Spirit?

Our Father knows what's in our hearts. But to truly learn to obey God's law in the OT is to obey Jesus. There is a verse somewhere, Jesus says, if you obey My commandments you abide in My love, just as I obeyed my Father's commandments and abide His love. Jesus kept the Father's words, we couldn't. But if we obey Jesus's words then we abide in His love.

Teach righteous deeds through the Spirit, not the law. Rather than teach that obedience through the law, teach obedience through the Spirit.

About the fulfilled, Yahshau said 2 times in that verese HE DID NOT COME TO DO AWAY WITH THE LAW, so to say it fulfilled so its done away is 100% against what the Messiah said, also the next verse says unless heaven and earth pass and all is perfect NOTHING will pass from the Law, in the next verse He says those who do and teach the Law/Commands will be great in heaven, why would he tell us to do and tech something that was done away?

Again if one obeys the Law they are obeying the Spirit, we are to be as Yahshua, and Yahshua did exactly as the Law said, we do not get our justification through this, however there is literally a guide book on how to be like yahshua and it is neglected by so many. Romans 8:7-8, tells us ONLY the man living in Yahweh's Spirit can subject himself to Yahweh's Laws, that doesnt mean we have to follow them perfectly, but subject ourselves to the will of the Father ans Yahshua says in MT 7:21-23, that only thos who do that will enter the kingdom, and in v23 says those who dont will be rejected, His words not mine. (Iniquity is the word used, its definition is in my signature) 7:14, "For we know that the Law is spiritual; but I was carnal, sold into the power of sin."

Youe middle paragraph I agree with, MT 22:37-40, Yahshua's Commans include Yahweh's Laws, not for justification but as a guide book on how to love Yahweh and our fellow human.

You said: "Teach righteous deeds through the Spirit, not the law"

Again

Romans 7:14, "For we know that the Law is spiritual; but I was carnal, sold into the power of sin."

Romans 8:6-8, "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against; (bitterly opposed to,) Yahweh; for it his not subject to the Law of Yahweh, nor indeed can be. So then, those who are of the flesh cannot please Yahweh."

Galations 5:19-21, "For the works of the flesh are obvious, which are these: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, licentiousness, Godworship, sorcery, bhatred, contentions, evil jealousies, rage, selfish ambitions, dissensions; disagreements with quarreling, heresies; sects or factions of division, Envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I warn you beforehand, just as I did in times past, that those who practice such things will not einherit the Kingdom of Yahweh."

EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THE "WORKS OF THE FLESH" IS AGAINST YAHWEH"S LAW.


Galations 5:22-25, "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering; patience, kindness, righteousness, The Faith; Meekness; gentleness, humility, temperance; self-control--such things are not against any Law. And those who are the Messiah's have sacrificed the flesh; the carnal mind, with its passions and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit."

I think Shaul clearly intended the pun "not against any Law" again no justification through the Law but fruits of the Spirit are there

The fruits of the Spirit are the goal of the Law, the pharisees made their own law so there were no fruits, people that havent studied it dont know this but it is so:

Leviticus 19:9-18,29-31 "When you reap the harvest of your land, you shall not completely harvest the corners of your field, nor shall you gather the gleanings of your harvest. You shall not glean your vineyard, nor shall you gather every grape of your vineyard. You shall leave them for the poor and the stranger; I am Yahweh your Father. You shall not steal, nor deal falsely, nor lie one to another. Do not vow falsely with My Name, and so profane the Name of your Father. I am Yahweh. You shall not defraud your neighbor, nor rob him. Do not hold back the wages of a hired man overnight. Do not curse the deaf or put a stumblingblock in front of the blind; but reverence your Father. I am Yahweh. Do not pervert judgment: You shall not show partiality to the poor, nor honor to the person of the great. In righteousness you shall judge your neighbor fairly. You shall not go about tale-bearing or slandering among your people. Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am Yahweh. You shall not hate your neighbor in your heart. Rebuke your brother or your sister frankly, so you will not share in his or her guilt. Do not seek revenge nor bear a grudge against one of your own people; but you shall love your neighbor; whether a brother or an enemy, as yourself. I am Yahweh.Do not R8prostitute your daughter, to cause her to be a harlot; or the land will fall into harlotry, and the land will become full of wickedness. You shall reverence Me, by keeping My Sabbaths at My Sanctuary; I am Yahweh. Do not turn to mediums nor familiar spirits. Do not seek after them, to be defiled by them. I am Yahweh. You shall stand up before the gray headed, and you shall honor the presence of an Elder or Teacher; thereby giving reverence to your Heavenly Father. I am Yahweh. If a stranger lives with you in your and, do not mistreat him. The stranger living with you must be treated as one of your native-born, and you shall love him as yourself; for you were strangers in the land of Egypt. I am Yahweh. Do not use dishonest standards when measuring length, weight, or quantity. You shall have honest balances, honest weights, an honest ephah; a dry measure, and an honest in; a liquid measure. I am Yahweh your Father Who brought you out of the land of Egypt; Therefore, you must observe all My statutes and My judgments, and perform and do them. I am Yahweh."

 

[john832]

Then I guess your accusing the scriptures of lying brother John, just read hebrew 4.

I have, the summation of the matter is this...

Heb 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Future tense here. The subject is the weekly Sabbath and the Millenial Rest it shadows or portrays.

The weekly Sabbath is shown in Hebrews 4:9, I and others have been through this on numerous occasions showing that this is the weekly Sabbath and I just posted scriptures showing the fulfillment is the Rest of the Millenium.

 

[RedTent]

Side note......
Went to Provo, Utah over Labor Day weekend. I'd always that Mormons don't open their businesses on Sunday. That's an understatement. It took us over 30 minutes of calling restaurants to try and find something open. Downtown was absolutely dead. Very strange.

But one blessing about that place. We went to a water park on Monday and the place was packed. But I barely saw any women in revealing swimsuits. Very refreshing.

I think it is a very sad comment on our churches dedicated to the Lord. We are not disciplined and our beaches are filled with "sex" bathing suits. People want and need discipline. So they go to the Mormons and Muslims, missing completely our Holy Spirit and true God. Our God wants our discipline, too.

I don't know much about the Adventists, except they teach discipline, too, and we don't. Seems to me they also teach Christ.

I think we should let this be in God's hands instead of all the judging, and watch for what God calls the log in our own eye.

 

[john832]

I think it is a very sad comment on our churches dedicated to the Lord. We are not disciplined and our beaches are filled with "sex" bathing suits. People want and need discipline. So they go to the Mormons and Muslims, missing completely our Holy Spirit and true God. Our God wants our discipline, too.

I don't know much about the Adventists, except they teach discipline, too, and we don't. Seems to me they also teach Christ.

I think we should let this be in God's hands instead of all the judging, and watch for what God calls the log in our own eye.

Cogent comments indeed.

 

[Bryancampbell]

Brother Hizikya,

No one is saying the law is abolished. But fulfilling even to the end of the world.

You say Christ fulfilled the sacraments, ceremonial, prohibition of food, but don't you know he hasn't abolished those but fulfilled thus we are not obligated to do them.

I'm fulfilling the law if I present love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self control. I don't need the ten commandments. I have Jesus' spiritual law that fulfils those commands. Love is spiritual living off the physical realm.

Now concerning the sabbath.

Sabbath was pointing to where rest in Jesus is, faith. So we fulfill this by believing in Him resting from our evil deeds. That's an action.
Murder was pointing to what leads to murder, anger. We fulfill this by not being angry without cause. That's an action.
Stealing and Coveting was pointing to what leads to them, not fully being content and obtaining peace of Jesus [the shalom], thus we fulfill this commandment by being grateful for what we have not desiring what is not ours.

The list goes on, fulfillment in the Spirit.

 

[Bryancampbell]

I have, the summation of the matter is this...

Heb 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Future tense here. The subject is the weekly Sabbath and the Millenial Rest it shadows or portrays.

The weekly Sabbath is shown in Hebrews 4:9, I and others have been through this on numerous occasions showing that this is the weekly Sabbath and I just posted scriptures showing the fulfillment is the Rest of the Millenium.

Uhh verse 9 says rest, not day. So there remains rest, not the day...

 

[john832]

Uhh verse 9 says rest, not day. So there remains rest, not the day...

Uh, the word rest is translated from the word Sabbatismos. Here is Thayers for that...

Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

rest:

σαββατισμός
sabbatismos
Thayer Definition:
1) a keeping sabbath
2) the blessed rest from toils and troubles looked for in the age to come by the true worshippers of God and true Christians
Part of Speech: noun masculine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from a derivative of G4521
Citing in TDNT: 7:34, 989

And here is the Diaglott...

Heb 4:9 Therefore remains a keeping of a sabbath for the people of the God.

 

[Josh321]

Dedicate the ENTIRE 24 hrs to YAHWEH ONLY. It is a beautiful thing!

Isayah 58:13-14, "If you turn away your foot from breaking the Sabbath: from doing your pleasure; your own business, your own pleasure, on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight; the holy day of Yahweh honorable, and will honor Him by not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor engaging in aidle conversation: Then you will find your joy in Yahweh; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Yaaqob your father- -for the mouth of Yahweh has spoken it."

The Sabbath was made for doing righteousness only, a day to center yourself and train yourself in the Spirit of Yahweh and not the spirit of the world.

Mattithyah 12:12, "And how much more valuable is a man than a sheep? Therefore, it is Lawful to do righteousness on the
Sabbath."

Isayah 56:1-7, "This is what Yahweh says: Keep the judgments, and do justly; for My salvation is near, soon, to come, and My righteousness to be revealed. Blessed is the man who does this, and the son of man who lays hold on it; who keeps the Sabbaths without polluting; defiling, them; and keeps his hand from doing dany evil. Do not let the son of the Gentile, who has joined himself to Yahweh, speak, saying; Yahweh has utterly separated me from His people. Nor let the eunuch say; Behold, I am a dry tree. For this is what Yahweh says: To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths, and choose those things which eplease Me, and hold fast to My covenant: I will give to them, in My House, even within My walls, a place and a Name equal to that of sons and of daughters; I will give them the Name of The Everlasting: YAHWEH; which will not be cut off. Also the sons of the Gentile who join themselves to Yahweh, to serve Him, and to love the Name of Yahweh, to be His servants--everyone who keeps the Sabbaths without polluting; defiling, them and who holds fast to My covenant--I will bring them to My holy mountain, and make them joyful in My House of prayer..."

i dedicate every single day of my life since God saved me this is irrelevant and this exact statement you use is what get people in trouble THEY SO HOLY on the sabbath, soon the sabbath done back to living a filthy life, that's your problem and all the sabbath keepers think you must keep just 1 single day holy and do whatever for the rest of the other week, when i go to the adventist churches it's so corrupt people marrying and divorcing and acting holy in church living in adultery, and may i add have no love, last year this woman i use to work for in a summer job, would call me all kind of bad names and when the job is over she would say * you should really come to church Joshua, young people need to be in church * and this woman have no love in her, that's the problem with most people PUTTING ON A SATURDAY MASK AND LIVING A FILTHY LIFE THE REST OF THE DAYS.

 

[john832]

Hmmm, keeping the fourth Commandment equals living a filthy life?

Isa 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

 

[Hizikyah]

i dedicate every single day of my life since God saved me this is irrelevant and this exact statement you use is what get people in trouble THEY SO HOLY on the sabbath, soon the sabbath done back to living a filthy life, that's your problem and all the sabbath keepers think you must keep just 1 single day holy and do whatever for the rest of the other week, when i go to the adventist churches it's so corrupt people marrying and divorcing and acting holy in church living in adultery, and may i add have no love, last year this woman i use to work for in a summer job, would call me all kind of bad names and when the job is over she would say * you should really come to church Joshua, young people need to be in church * and this woman have no love in her, that's the problem with most people PUTTING ON A SATURDAY MASK AND LIVING A FILTHY LIFE THE REST OF THE DAYS.

Im glad you think you know what i do the rest of the week and for that matter what all Sabbath keepers do, your unwarrented judgement of those who honor Yahweh's COMMANDMENT is foolish.

 

[Bryancampbell]

Hmmm, keeping the fourth Commandment equals living a filthy life?

Isa 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

That is no where what we are saying. If you have faith in Jesus alone, that isn't a license to sin. That's why by faith we enter the rest from our evil deeds...

 

[Josh321]

So you are aware that in the ten commandments that it says we must rest from physicial labour right?

So let's say you went to work all week and on the sabbath you are at home wanting to honor the sabbath, but you just got a phone call from your co-worker from work, and it was said he just got into an accident and his daughter is somewhat injured and said he will come in late. And this is the only position that you and the other person are responsible of. Isn't it also lawful to do good and take his shift? Or will you deny it because your laboring on a time you believe must be kept to obey Yahweh?

How about murder?

A man joins the army to serve his country in a war, and he is aware he will kill in his service of infantry.

Another man joins the army in a war because he likes to kill, it's an enjoyment to him, and he is aware he will kill in his service of infantry.

Who is committing sin?

now that you mention this bryan i remember seeing in an article in indian they had this princess or something and the people were not allowed to touch her and she went to the beach and was in the water and a huge wave or something came and she went under the water and screamed for help but no one help her because they weren't allowed to touch her and after a few minutes she drowned and died, now why i said this is if on the sabbath day and lets say one of their child got hit in the head or something and fell in the road and a car is coming up and the only way to help the child is to physically lift the child out of the way, i wonder what they will do or say " i'm sorry i'm not suppose to do physically labour on the sabbath" see where i am going with this?

 

[Josh321]

That is no where what we are saying. If you have faith in Jesus alone, that isn't a license to sin. That's why by faith we enter the rest from our evil deeds...

None of them understand what this means or what it feels like, does it even make any sense at all.. i mean if we are born again the truth is revealed to us that we were living in sin and were slaves to sin and christ sets us free from sin which means we no longer under the yoke of sin.. well then why would we still need to keep thou shalt not do this? when your free from sin, lol it's just too funny and none of you realise that