God's sovereignty vs human free will

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T_Laurich

T_Laurich

Senior Member
#121
Mar 24, 2013
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#121
texascowgirl said:
Jesus Christ is not God the father. There is only one God. God works through a man, Jesus Christ. Refer to my thread called the word was God. It on like page 4 now I think. The scriputers tell us Jesus is a man. Jesus Christ even said his father is greater than him. He also said he can do nothing of himself, just as we cant.
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I am a man and you are a woman... If we were to be married we would be one... This is the same with God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost... They are all separate but married into one!
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#122
Sep 4, 2013
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#122
texascowgirl said:
Jesus Christ is not God the father. There is only one God. God works through a man, Jesus Christ. Refer to my thread called the word was God. It on like page 4 now I think. The scriputers tell us Jesus is a man. Jesus Christ even said his father is greater than him. He also said he can do nothing of himself, just as we cant. Jesus stated why do you call me good, there is but one good and that's God,[ his father]. Jesus is simply doing the words of his father, he is not his father.
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........when He made Himself a little less than the angels, and took upon Himself the "form" of man, is what He is referring to when He says He can do nothing of Himself...........yet He also said this:

I AND MY FATHER ARE ONE! IF YE HAD KNOWN ME, YOU WOULD HAVE KNOWN THE FATHER, and it would greatly help in understanding if you read His words in the 17th Chapter of the Gospel of John.

God the Father........(God OF man) God the Son (God AS man), God the Holy Spirit (God within man)

The Holy Trinity, three Persons in One in perfect harmony........
 
T

texascowgirl

Banned
#123
Sep 11, 2013
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#123
if they were the same being how on earth is it that even the son Jesus Christ does not know the day of his return? Only God the father knows the day. If Jesus was God the father, don't you think he would know the day of his own return?
 
T_Laurich

T_Laurich

Senior Member
#124
Mar 24, 2013
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#124
T_Laurich said:
I am a man and you are a woman... If we were to be married we would be one... This is the same with God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost... They are all separate but married into one!
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When you go deeper you can also see that our marriages actually resemble the relationship between Christ and God... (If we are true to the scripture)
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#125
Sep 4, 2013
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#125
Maybe this will help explain.......

[h=1]John
1[/h]
1 .) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 .) The same was in the beginning with God.
3 .) All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 .) In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 .) And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
 
T_Laurich

T_Laurich

Senior Member
#126
Mar 24, 2013
3,356
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#126
texascowgirl said:
if they were the same being how on earth is it that even the son Jesus Christ does not know the day of his return? Only God the father knows the day. If Jesus was God the father, don't you think he would know the day of his own return?
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If only the Father knows how am I a man who believes in the Trinity, and the word of God suppose to answer???

I guess it is like saying only the man knows when he is going to propose to a girlfriend or ask a girl on a date... The girl just waits for the special occasion... And Christ returning is a very big and special occasion...
 
T

texascowgirl

Banned
#127
Sep 11, 2013
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#127
He is referring to when He says He can do nothing of Himself[endquote]
It means he don't have freewill and neither do we. It means He is doing what his father commanded him to do. The words he speaks are not his own, they are his fathers. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
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T

texascowgirl

Banned
#128
Sep 11, 2013
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#128
p_rehbein said:
Maybe this will help explain.......

John
1


1 .) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 .) The same was in the beginning with God.
3 .) All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 .) In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 .) And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
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I did a thread called, "the word was God. It like on page 4 or 5 by now. Pull it up and read it. I have explained it.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#129
Sep 4, 2013
30,548
6,766
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#129
texascowgirl said:
He is referring to when He says He can do nothing of Himself[endquote]
It means he don't have freewill and neither do we. It means He is doing what his father commanded him to do. The words he speaks are not his own, they are his fathers. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
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No, it does not mean that He or we don't have free will..........sorry..........won't but that one........

However, carrying on with the idea of God the Father and God the Son.......

continue reading in the 1st Chapter of the Gospel of John, vs. 10) He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11 .) He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
12 .) But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 .) Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
14 .) And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
15 .) John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
16 .) And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.
17 .) For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
18 .) No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

These clearly show that God the Father and God the Son ARE ONE!
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p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#130
Sep 4, 2013
30,548
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#130
Uh, hmmm, ok, If you do not accept, understand the Holy Trinity, then in all honesty, this discussion is of no value......There will never be a way to reconcile differences between predestination and free will if both parties do not believe in the Holy Trinity.
 
T

texascowgirl

Banned
#131
Sep 11, 2013
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#131
T_Laurich said:
If only the Father knows how am I a man who believes in the Trinity, and the word of God suppose to answer???

Trinity is not biblical. Trinity is a definition man applied to his own understanding of those scriputres. And you are a man that believes in it because its what you have been falsely taught by man. If you don't believe only the father knows and the son doesn't here is the verse.


Matt 24:36 But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.
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T

texascowgirl

Banned
#132
Sep 11, 2013
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#132
God the father and Jesus Christ are simply working on the same goal. If you and I are painting a house together, that does not make me you and you me. We are still two separate beings.
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#133
#133
texascowgirl said:
Jesus Christ is not God the father. There is only one God. God works through a man, Jesus Christ. Refer to my thread called the word was God. It on like page 4 now I think. The scriputers tell us Jesus is a man. Jesus Christ even said his father is greater than him. He also said he can do nothing of himself, just as we cant. Jesus stated why do you call me good, there is but one good and that's God,[ his father]. Jesus is simply doing the words of his father, he is not his father. God the father IS NOT A MAN
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I'm wondering if she isn't JW, because she is saying Jesus is not divine. She denies eternal punishment. There's not a lot of groups that I know of that believe these things.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#134
Sep 4, 2013
30,548
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#134
texascowgirl said:
T_Laurich said:
If only the Father knows how am I a man who believes in the Trinity, and the word of God suppose to answer???

Trinity is not biblical. Trinity is a definition man applied to his own understanding of those scriputres. And you are a man that believes in it because its what you have been falsely taught by man. If you don't believe only the father knows and the son doesn't here is the verse.


Matt 24:36 But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.
Click to expand...
this is what I was concerned with...........I will have to bid adieu to this thread........and God bless all here as they seek understanding of Truth......
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T

texascowgirl

Banned
#135
Sep 11, 2013
220
2
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#135
jimmydiggs said:
I'm wondering if she isn't JW, because she is saying Jesus is not divine. She denies eternal punishment. There's not a lot of groups that I know of that believe these things.
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Stop that. I didn't say He is not divine. He was given all power and authority by his father. And I deny eternal punishment because its a lie taught to man by preachers. Lets not forgot its is they that lead the sheep astry and it is they that deceived the whole world. Lets not forget God put lying spirit in the mouths of prophets and those lies have passed down from generation to generation and those lies are still believed today.
 
T_Laurich

T_Laurich

Senior Member
#137
Mar 24, 2013
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#137
texascowgirl said:
T_Laurich said:
If only the Father knows how am I a man who believes in the Trinity, and the word of God suppose to answer???

Trinity is not biblical. Trinity is a definition man applied to his own understanding of those scriputres. And you are a man that believes in it because its what you have been falsely taught by man. If you don't believe only the father knows and the son doesn't here is the verse.


Matt 24:36 But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.
Click to expand...
I explained this, and you are trying to use the point that only the father knows against me...

Explain why God created everything! including the heavens and the earth (Genesis) Yet in John it says the word always existed... Only God always existed... So either the whole Bible is fallible right there or the word is GOD and the word is Christ!!!! so that means Christ is the Lord in another form!!!!

You cannot throw out scripture do to a fact NO ONE CAN EXPLAIN SOMETHING! ONLY THE FATHER KNOWS THE DAY AND HOUR!!!!

My fleshly body only knows of the world and will not go to heaven... so am I two person's or one??? I am two beings in a sense....
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T

texascowgirl

Banned
#138
Sep 11, 2013
220
2
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#138
If people would check on it they will find out trinity was not in the bible.
 
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T_Laurich

T_Laurich

Senior Member
#139
Mar 24, 2013
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#139
texascowgirl said:
If people would check on it they will find out trinity was not in the bible. Man added it later.
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Answer my question I answered yours twice in two different ways...

Explain why God created everything, including the heavens and the earth (Genesis) Yet in John it says the word always existed. Only God always existed. So either the whole Bible is fallible right there or the word is GOD and the word is Christ! so that means Christ is the Lord in another form!!!!
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#140
#140
texascowgirl said:
If people would check on it they will find out trinity was not in the bible. Man added it later.
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I think you need to spend less time with the cows, and more time with scripture. You are so erroneous you don't know truth from lies. You call truth lies, and lies truth, and you call good evil... Your tongue is forked. Jesus is Jehovah. Repent of your sin, repent of your unbelief.
 
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