Attack of the seventh day adventists

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

sorry but a yes or no will not suffice. i came to my views of the Sabbath as a personal moment. i cannot make other believers go through that moment. each believer has to be convinced in their own heart. i can only state that i concur with God claiming a specific day that was blessed for man and to what day i think that is. the rest is left to a readers own logic or persuasion by the holy spirit.

A commandment is a commandment, not a suggestion or recommendation. All believers are bound by GOD's commands whether they have personal moments or not.

By your response, I conclude that you believe that GOD commands you to not work on Saturdays, but you do not have the strength of conviction to unequivocally state that all men are bound by that same commandment.

 

[KAdamW]

A commandment is a commandment, not a suggestion or recommendation. All believers are bound by GOD's commands whether they have personal moments or not.

By your response, I conclude that you believe that GOD commands you to not work on Saturdays, but you do not have the strength of conviction to unequivocally state that all men are bound by that same commandment.

so is that your goal? to seek my own behavior and judge me on that? cannot sinners be able to discern scripture but still fall short?

the subject has not one iota as to my ability to be without sin, yet somehow you have attempted to transfer my legit questions about scripture and "conclude" i am a sinner therefore you should not regard my comments. how utterly evil, you have disgraced a serious discussion of scripture with a petty finger pointing and name calling. shame on you!

 

[BananaPie]

I'm trying to determine what you believe.

Well, I believe that he believes almost everything of a sound mind, which I believe God has already. :chuckles:

 

[Praus]

please take into consideration the context, you joining subject so late and quoting out of context does not help but add more confusion.

Paul and James continued the animal sacrifice, as you can see in Acts 21. They knew exactly what Hebrews 10 says. Who's confused?

Acts 21:23 Do therefore what we tell you. We have four men (AH)who are under a vow; 24 take these men and (AI)purify yourself along with them and pay their expenses, (AJ)so that they may shave their heads. Thus all will know that there is nothing in what they have been told about you, but that you yourself also live in observance of the law. ... 26 Then Paul took the men, and the next day (AL)he purified himself along with them and (AM)went into the temple, giving notice when the days of purification would be fulfilled and (AN)the offering presented for each one of them.

Like I already said, you are taking it out of context, the CEREMONIAL laws were fulfilled. I already gave examples of why. The Moral and Civil laws were not.

Whether found in leviticus or not you know what laws are ceremonial, you obviously are well versed in scripture so let's not play like this is our first rodeo. Christ fulfilled the need to sacrifice lambs, he did not fulfill or do away with consorting with witches or witchcraft(civil laws). Nor did he fulfill do not commit adultery(moral laws).

There is evidence of all three of these types of laws before Sinai or Israelite. They have been around from the beginning.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

so is that your goal? to seek my own behavior and judge me on that? cannot sinners be able to discern scripture but still fall short?

the subject has not one iota as to my ability to be without sin, yet somehow you have attempted to transfer my legit questions about scripture and "conclude" i am a sinner therefore you should not regard my comments. how utterly evil, you have disgraced a serious discussion of scripture with a petty finger pointing and name calling. shame on you!

My goal was to determine what you believe by getting you to state what you believe.

 

[danschance]

it does no such thing.

lets assume for a crazy moment it does though.

are you allowed to murder or participate in sorcery then?

You are guilty of a "bait and switch" tactic. Neither sorcery or murder are a part of the Mosaic laws. Old Testament law can be broken down into 1)God's moral law, 2)Ritual or ceremonial laws and 3) Dietary laws. God's moral laws define what sin is and they stand forever. Ritual laws and dietary laws are defined by Mosaic law and these have been fulfilled by Christ. They were shadows of things to come.

Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until the seed would come to whom the promise had been made. Gal. 3:19

The above verse is clear to all but the spiritually blind. The Mosaic law (The clear context of Gal. 3 is the Mosaic law) was only given until Christ would come and fulfill them. Circumcision of the penis is now circumcision of the heart. Not wearing clothing made of mixed fibers is now putting on the garment of righteousness and so on.

Unfortunately, you are teaching others to put the New wine of Christ into old wine skins. The old wine skins burst and the wine runs into the ground being totally wasted. You are a Judaizer telling others they must confirm to a standard Christ freed us from.

 

[KAdamW]

My goal was to determine what you believe by getting you to state what you believe.

should have reread that before submitting. that utterly evil and shame on you stuff was sarcasm, sorry if it did not translate well. i was trying to sound motherly. i would never use that phrase in a serious manner. i am a male.

i am a bit of a smarty pants and what i hear in my head doesn't always look right in a forum setting. for example "smarty pants" really, what man seriously says things like that? i got a pm from someone who thought i was serious so i had to come and reread it. please note it was late and i was trying to respond to 3 of you.

now in all seriousness i thought i stated what i believe. may have to reread that as well. okay i just back read the last 4 pages. gosh this is getting nuts.

i believe what is in my Bible, that includes the 4th commandment. and i do not think that justifies anyone. the Sabbath is a sanctified day and is to our advantage to keep it as prescribed. not as an obligation. i feel like several of you somehow are twisting this commandment to make it seem like Sabbath keepers are trying to work for their salvation.

when i got baptized, when i pray, when i repent, when i forgive, when i do many many things, and when i refrain from many many things to keep in line with God's will it is not obligation. it is love. i love God and i want to please God. it is a joy to do these things. and I believe it is God's will that we all keep the Sabbath.

i hope that answers whatever it is that we are going around in circles on.

 

[RickShafer]

Jesus fulfilled the sabbath.
Please read Hebrews chapter 4.
Then see that He said the sabbath was made for man, and not the other way around.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

i feel like several of you somehow are twisting this commandment to make it seem like Sabbath keepers are trying to work for their salvation.

Some here openly admit that one must keep the sabbath to be saved. I was just wondering where you are in that regard. Thanks for clarifying. No offense taken. Be blessed.

 

[BananaPie]

i love God and i want to please God. it is a joy to do these things. and I believe it is God's will that we all keep the Sabbath.

Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the Earth.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.
(Matthew 5)

Thank you for loving my Savior the way you do.

 

[BananaPie]

Some here openly admit that one must keep the sabbath to be saved. I was just wondering where you are in that regard. Thanks for clarifying. No offense taken. Be blessed.

Dear Brother,

In all respect to your faith and person, allow me to kindly disagree with you in that most Shabbat keepers worldwide do not believe that "one must keep Shabbat to be saved," and nothing of the sort has been stated here by KAdamW either.

Perhaps, we may all consider the thoughts others are wanting to communicate, and opine according in the kindness of Christ rather than with our own errors. Thank you for understanding and for not taking offense. The Lord is good and still reigns upon His throne of glory!

BPie

 

[Josh321]

This argument will never end, the carnal mind does not understand the things of God, i've been telling you that when we are born again God enables us to live a righteous life, the laws are written in our hearts and mind so when we are truly born again the it is fulfilled in us, i'm telling you this and your telling me that we must manually keep the law and try to be righteous OURSELVES, which is wrong, this is exactly what has happen to israel, righteousness comes from faith in Christ not by following something... and in the process making it your idol and God.. without any of you recognizing it your bound by whatever organization you are following instead of being bound to christ, your just pushing yourselves further and further away from ever knowing him..

 

[Josh321]

Dear Brother,

In all respect to your faith and person, allow me to kindly disagree with you in that most Shabbat keepers worldwide do not believe that "one must keep Shabbat to be saved," and nothing of the sort has been stated here by KAdamW either.

Perhaps, we may all consider the thoughts others are wanting to communicate, and opine according in the kindness of Christ rather than with our own errors. Thank you for understanding and for not taking offense. The Lord is good and still reigns upon His throne of glory!

BPie

it has been stated many tells on this forum someone even told me it that we must keep the sabbath to the saved sad that no one examines themselves to see that they are doing the right thing, i still think they are right after telling me we must keep the sabbath to be saved, isn't that something?

 

[KAdamW]

Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until the seed would come to whom the promise had been made. Gal. 3:19

This verse proves that the Mosaic law is no longer in effect. Jesus came to fulfill it. End of story.

no, that quite obviously refers to the ceremonial laws. it plainly says right there "It was added because of transgressions".

before sin there were no ceremonial laws needed. why sacrifice animals for forgiveness of sins that had not happened? thanks for reminding me of the passage it actually makes my case that the ceremonial laws are fulfilled.

 

[KAdamW]

Some here openly admit that one must keep the sabbath to be saved. I was just wondering where you are in that regard. Thanks for clarifying. No offense taken. Be blessed.

well there are 32 pages in this one thread. if you know where to find this post i would like to see it. trust me i would stand by you for disagreeing with someone who thinks they can save themselves.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

well there are 32 pages in this one thread. if you know where to find this post i would like to see it. trust me i would stand by you for disagreeing with someone who thinks they can save themselves.

I don't think it's on this thread, but RedTent and John832 have both confessed the sabbath must be kept to be saved. I have no idea how to find the posts. The search function here sucks, IMO.

 

[KAdamW]

Jesus fulfilled the sabbath.
Please read Hebrews chapter 4.
Then see that He said the sabbath was made for man, and not the other way around.

yes the Sabbath was made and blessed and set aside for man. to top it off he included it in His top ten list of things He wishes we should or should not do.

Heb 12:27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

So he is telling us that certain things were removed and certain things did indeed remain. And the purpose of this book is supposed to help us with that. So what does Hebrews say about the Sabbath?

Heb. 4:1-11 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest. Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief: Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts. For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

 

[KAdamW]

I don't think it's on this thread, but RedTent and John832 have both confessed the sabbath must be kept to be saved. I have no idea how to find the posts. The search function here sucks, IMO.

wow that's scary and sure discredits Sabbatarians. but i guess we can find people in every group that don't speak for the majority. i know a Sabbatarian in real life that has a really strong hatred for gays, it disturbs me that she goes around spreading that hatred and the Sabbath at the same time.

 

[Josh321]

what we need to do is look to Jesus and live, not look at the 10 commandments and live, that will be we doing our own things but all that is required is to us to look to Jesus and live let him tell us what to do must be led by the spirit, the Just shall live by faith

 

[KAdamW]

This argument will never end, the carnal mind does not understand the things of God, i've been telling you that when we are born again God enables us to live a righteous life, the laws are written in our hearts and mind so when we are truly born again the it is fulfilled in us, i'm telling you this and your telling me that we must manually keep the law and try to be righteous OURSELVES, which is wrong, this is exactly what has happen to israel, righteousness comes from faith in Christ not by following something... and in the process making it your idol and God.. without any of you recognizing it your bound by whatever organization you are following instead of being bound to christ, your just pushing yourselves further and further away from ever knowing him..

josh, please note what i put in bold in your comment. i want you to look at this from our point of view for a moment. let's use another commandment as an example.

let's say you have a friend who is your Christian brother and he commits adultery every week with no plan to change his behavior. when you talk to him about why he should stop committing adultery he says; "when we are born again God enables us to live a righteous life, the laws are written in our hearts and mind so when we are truly born again the it is fulfilled in us".

would you not feel he is denying the obvious?