Why does the Law cause contention among professing Christians?

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just-me

just-me

Banned
#141
Mar 4, 2013
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#141
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
Why do I bring it up? Because there are people here who say that all of GOD's commandments that he ever spoke are equally valid and binding right here right now. I'm proving that's not the case.
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Then why don't you agree with me?

There are three other people that liked what I wrote, and they have been labeled as esteeming all the law as physical only when all of us see the law relevant in a Spiritual sense only.

Let's all talk spiritually, and then we can all get along as God would have it. We all Believe that Jesus Christ is Lord, and by Him only can we receive salvation from being under the law. Righteousness only comes through Christ. We all know this. I have never, as long as I have been a member of this chat site, have seen anyone deny Christ except atheists.

Could be there are some die hard Jews, in fact there was one from Canada that I met in CC. When I wanted to talk about Jesus, that was the end of it, but I didn't condemn him, I wanted him to see the truth by loving him and being gentle. We talked the law a little, taking Paul's exhortations into account, become like some so some can be saved.

If you think we are lost, love us and deliver the message of salvation with love and longsuffering, and gentleness, with patience.
 
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HeRoseFromTheDead

HeRoseFromTheDead

Senior Member
#142
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
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#142
Originally Posted by just-me
According to verse 6, neither circumcision or uncircumcision means anything when we are in Christ, so why bring it up?
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HeRoseFromTheDead said:
Why do I bring it up? Because there are people here who say that all of GOD's commandments that he ever spoke are equally valid and binding right here right now. I'm proving that's not the case.
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Another reason I bring it up is to show that people who incessantly quote Matthew 5:19 in an attempt to show that Jesus says believers are under the law of Moses, can't possibly be interpreting that verse correctly.

Therefore whoever abolishes one of the least of these commandments and teaches people to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever keeps them and teaches them, this person will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 5:19​

The commandment of circumcision was more than a least commandment. It was a foundational commandment being the very doorway into the old covenant. Yet Paul taught that circumcision was nothing.

Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. 1 Corinthians 7:19​

And warned against observing that commandment as a means of obeying GOD.

Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. Galatians 5:2-4​

So either Paul is going to be among the least in the kingdom of heaven, or the people I mentioned above are misinterpreting Matthew 5:19. I truly think it's the latter.
 
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just-us-2

just-us-2

Banned
#143
Mar 3, 2013
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#143
It has been confirmed that people are proving certain things to others, but it isn't the case they are trying to prove that is being proven.
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#144
Mar 4, 2013
7,761
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#144
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
Another reason I bring it up is to show that people who incessantly quote Matthew 5:19 in an attempt to show that Jesus says believers are under the law of Moses, can't possibly be interpreting that verse correctly.

Therefore whoever abolishes one of the least of these commandments and teaches people to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever keeps them and teaches them, this person will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 5:19​
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So what did Jesus really mean in your opinion?
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#145
Mar 4, 2013
7,761
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#145
I am starting to question something. There are 6 members and 4 guests on thread information bar at the bottom of this page, but I only see myself, and 3 other members, yet the bar still says 6 members.?????????

Now there are 7 members and 6 guests after refreshing, and I see only 5 members. stealthy?????

Now it's back to 6 and 6, but only 4 members showing. something ain't right here. Moderators... I bet.
????????
 
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G

Graybeard

Guest
#146
#146
just-me said:
I am starting to question something. There are 6 members and 4 guests on thread information bar at the bottom of this page, but I only see myself, and 3 other members, yet the bar still says 6 members.?????????

Now there are 7 members and 6 guests after refreshing, and I see only 5 members. stealthy?????

Now it's back to 6 and 6, but only 4 members showing. something ain't right here. Moderators... I bet.
????????
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naw...just people like me poking our noses in every now and again to see what's going on:D
 
G

Graybeard

Guest
#147
#147
oh wait!!...I see what you mean....big brother is watching
 
G

Graybeard

Guest
#148
#148
actually, It could be those that have chosen to be not shown as online in their profile.
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#149
Mar 4, 2013
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#149
Ah that is why when I went to see who was on line that HeRoseFromTheDead's name said N/A like I said, stealthy. LOL:mad::cool::confused:
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#150
Mar 4, 2013
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#150
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
Another reason I bring it up is to show that people who incessantly quote Matthew 5:19 in an attempt to show that Jesus says believers are under the law of Moses, can't possibly be interpreting that verse correctly.

Therefore whoever abolishes one of the least of these commandments and teaches people to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever keeps them and teaches them, this person will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 5:19​
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from post #144 really want to know what you think.
So what did Jesus really mean in your opinion?
 
M

Married_Richenbrachen

Guest
#151
#151
just-me said:
I am starting to question something. There are 6 members and 4 guests on thread information bar at the bottom of this page, but I only see myself, and 3 other members, yet the bar still says 6 members.?????????

Now there are 7 members and 6 guests after refreshing, and I see only 5 members. stealthy?????

Now it's back to 6 and 6, but only 4 members showing. something ain't right here. Moderators... I bet.
????????
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Does this post belong in a conspiracy thread? ;)
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#152
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#152
Romans 8:1-2
[SUP]1[/SUP]There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. [SUP]2 [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

There is no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus because the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made them free from the law of sin and death.

What is the law of sin and death and who was it given by?

2 Corinthians 3:5-8

[SUP]5 [/SUP]Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
[SUP]6 [/SUP]Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
[SUP]8 [/SUP]How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?


Why are the 10 commandments written on stones called the ministration of death? Because the 10 commandments condemn us in our flesh, each time every time. The Law, the 10 commandments are condemnation to us because they are a description of perfection and we haven't attained that yet. At least I haven't...

But what I have attained, or rather, what has been given to me as a gift, is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. I have faith that the Lord Jesus Christ has died for my sins and saved me from condemnation even though I am not perfect. Because I am not perfect I need a saviour. The Lord Jesus says in His Word that He didn't come for the righteous but for sinners... Thats me and the rest of humanity willing to walk in the light, to be honest about our condition.

The law, written on stone, is our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. We should have learned that we can't follow the Law perfectly and need a saviour. We should have learned that Christ is our only righteousness and that our obedience is a gift.

Otherwise you are attempting to add your works of the law to the Cross, or in the worse case, denying the Cross altogether.
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#153
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
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#153
What is the leaven of the Pharisees?
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#155
Mar 4, 2013
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#155
Grandpa said:
What is the leaven of the Pharisees?
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An expansion of hypocrisy. Meaning pretending as in play acting.
For more information look up hypocrite on the web. It comes from a Greek word do describe actors in a play. Like a movie star playing apart, but not themselves. An expansion of fiction, and calling it reality.
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#156
Mar 4, 2013
7,761
107
0
#156
Grandpa said:
Why are the 10 commandments written on stones called the ministration of death? Because the 10 commandments condemn us in our flesh, each time every time. The Law, the 10 commandments are condemnation to us because they are a description of perfection and we haven't attained that yet. At least I haven't...

But what I have attained, or rather, what has been given to me as a gift, is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. I have faith that the Lord Jesus Christ has died for my sins and saved me from condemnation even though I am not perfect. Because I am not perfect I need a saviour. The Lord Jesus says in His Word that He didn't come for the righteous but for sinners... Thats me and the rest of humanity willing to walk in the light, to be honest about our condition.

The law, written on stone, is our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. We should have learned that we can't follow the Law perfectly and need a saviour. We should have learned that Christ is our only righteousness and that our obedience is a gift.

Otherwise you are attempting to add your works of the law to the Cross, or in the worse case, denying the Cross altogether.
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You did well in defining the law of sin and death. Would you be so kind as to expand in description on the Spirit of the Law as life?
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#157
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
113
#157
just-me said:
An expansion of hypocrisy. Meaning pretending as in play acting.
For more information look up hypocrite on the web. It comes from a Greek word do describe actors in a play. Like a movie star playing apart, but not themselves. An expansion of fiction, and calling it reality.
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I completely agree. Hypocrisy.
 
G

Grandpa

Senior Member
#158
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
113
#158
just-me said:
You did well in defining the law of sin and death. Would you be so kind as to expand in description on the Spirit of the Law as life?
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There is no spirit of the law as life. It is the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus. I could expand on that. But first we have to agree on what we are describing. Otherwise it is of no use.
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#159
Mar 4, 2013
7,761
107
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#159
Grandpa said:
There is no spirit of the law as life. It is the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus. I could expand on that. But first we have to agree on what we are describing. Otherwise it is of no use.
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But you quoted this verse. Romans 8:2
[SUP]2 [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Okay let me rephrase that. Is the law spiritual, and the Spirit life, and can you explain the spiritual aspects of the law please, for Paul said the law is Spiritual?
 
just-me

just-me

Banned
#160
Mar 4, 2013
7,761
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#160
Well, grandpa left. fooee! :confused: was hoping he'd stick around to answer my question after I was more specific. Well, I'll just post this then.


Romans 8:3-4 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
[SUP]4 [/SUP]That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

We must hear something first in order to be led by the Spirit, and as Jesus told us that His Father would send the Spirit, it is rational to think that the Word had to come first for Jesus was the Word, and He taught while the Old Testament was still in effect.

Hebrews 9:16-17 (KJV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP]For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

It took the death of Christ to complete and fulfill all things from the beginning of time. Rejecting anything that was established by God and Jesus from the beginning, is actually rejecting everything before the New Testament. Remember when Jesus prayed? John 17:5 (KJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Jesus sanctioned the law that God gave to Moses for He was there. Follow the Law by the Spirit, NOT by the flesh.
 
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