For my Dear Sisters in Christ

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twofeet

Guest
#1
This post is directed to women. To set women free to open their eyes up to something they may never have realised. But guys, feel free to comment (or attack) as you see fit.


Ladies, I know women have a tough time of it in life and in Church. I have seen men take scriptures like “wives submit to your husbands” and turn it into “I will MAKE my wife submit because it is biblical” not understanding at all that “submission” is something a person chooses to do in their own heart. And CONTROL of another person is not actually Gods way of doing things. It is NOT His nature at all.


So what has happened? Why do we see so often a woman being treated as though firstly a “help mate” was a wife made to help out Adam in picking fruit (like a slave that was beneath him) and secondly as a second rate citizen with not as much “rights” as a man? I could list so many areas where this attitude is seen, not just in Christian circles. I remember last year a woman on the news. She was in prison in an Islamic country for being raped. A woman requires 3 men to verify her story for a rape case. In China girls used to be left abandoned by parents at the side of roads as they were not a valued as a boy baby. Women are so often sexually assaulted all round the world in far more cases than guys and even in the Jewish culture women never had any legal rights. (but isn’t it interesting that when Job had his encounter with God and everything was restored to him he then gave his daughters an inheritance just like his sons breaking ALL traditions and attitudes. Amazing how an encounter with God brings equality!)


Genesis: God made Adam a “help mate”. Notice how the bible does not say “wife” or “servant”? “ezer kenegdo” is a difficult word to translate. It isn’t “wife” or “servant” .” Ezer” is only found 20 times in the Old Testament and every time it is used describing God himself when someone is desperate for help. “may the Lord answer you when you are in distress; may the name of the God of Jacob protect you. May He send you help (ezer). In every case this word is used in the Old Testament it is a life or death situation where help is desperately needed. Man and women are made in the image of God and posses different characteristics of His nature. This one is specifically for women, and women need to recognise how important their role as a “help mate” really is. Kenegdo means counterpart or alongside...not beneath....OPPOSITE.
God then said to BOTH Adam and Eve, as equals “ I give you DOMINION over the plants and the animals” but after the fall he said to Eve “from now on your husband will rule over you”...notice how God did not then say to Adam “ I now give you DOMINION over your wife”? God was warning Eve that the original command will now become so distorted through sin man will now rule over women, abuse them, use them, treat them as second rate citizens. Man will use every possible weapon, resource, even Gods word to twist it and use it for that very purpose.
Look at those scriptures about “submission”.

Did you know that when king James had his bible translated from the original there were 7 other translations he could have used for the word “submit”, one of them being “be gently persuaded” but as he was a king a MAN and wanted to DOMINATE his people, most of who couldn’t read or write he picked the best word that suited him.


1 Timothy 2: 11“ A woman should learn in quietness and fullsubmission.” Learn from who? God or man?
1 Timothy 2:12 “ I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent” . Keep it quiet ladies! You may hear God clearly but men have got to learn to do that for themselves! Learn not to jump in with both feet being eager to teach the guys something that you may already know. Man has to learn to listen to God and obey God DIRECTLY, something he failed at in Genesis. You will notice in Genesis after the fall that God said to Adam “Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you “you must not eat”. Notice how God did NOT say that to Eve? Where was Eve when God said that to Adam? She wasn’t even made!!!!! Yes, she was the first deceived but Adam DELIBERATLY sinned. Men have to learn to UNDERSTAND the deeper things of the spirit, look at what happened when the women went and told the Apostles that Jesus had risen from the dead? It says in Luke’s gospel “ but they did not believe the women because their words seemed like nonsense” Women do not do guys any favours if they do not understand this command. Women, PRAY for Godly men, pray that guys seek God and stop being easily lead by others. Pray that they will rise up like Moses, Elijah, Paul, Peter, men who have set their eyes on God and will not follow false teachings because they can HEAR God themselves. This scripture obviously does not mean that in ALL circumstances a woman should never speak , teach or have authority over a man because otherwise God would not have made women prophetess’ in the old Test. As we know a prophet/prophetess is the MOUTH PIECE of God. God is not double minded or that would make Him unstable. This scripture needs to be put into context and not taken out of context just to shut a woman up or for men to try and control women, which is what God warned Eve they will try and do as a result of the fall. Women, read about Deborah, understand the authority that God gave her and she was not the only one. Remember that you are a “help mate” and there will be times that the Holy Spirit will lead you rise up in those situations where guys are really having a tough time and are desperate enough for you to step into your role.


Scripture will always line up with Gods nature. Jesus IS the word and the word IS Jesus. We cannot separate the two. Look at Jesus’s nature. “I stand at the door knocking”, does that sound like someone with a forceful nature MAKING someone submit? When people came up to him and said “Lord I will follow you wherever you go and He named the one thing they couldn’t do and they went away sad. Did he go running after them saying you MUST obey me! You MUST do as I say!!” ANYONE who uses scripture to CONTROL another person is using scripture in an abusive way.
All those scriptures directed at women are exactly that. They are FOR a woman and it is between her and God to work out not for men to try and control a woman with. Yes, a husband is the spiritual head of the house there to protect her spirit from emotional harm, from the enemies arrows and to protect her from physical harm..but how many men are actually using those scriptures to CAUSE emotional harm and physical harm?


It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Free to be ourselves, free to follow wherever the Lord leads. If any aspect of a Christian relationship is about control then people need to repent before they have to stand before Gods throne to deal with this one.
 
Sep 4, 2012
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#2
It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Free to be ourselves, free to follow wherever the Lord leads. If any aspect of a Christian relationship is about control then people need to repent before they have to stand before Gods throne to deal with this one.
Can you imagine the number of women who will be given greater rewards in heaven for having endured their husbands disrespectful treatment? GOD is a just GOD.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#3
yes for freedom...nice thread..and very true...wish you hadnt left out the part said about eve before
He announced what man will do:cool: thats a tad revealing also
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#4
God made Adam a “help mate”.
Mine says help MEET. Your argument is correct, but this slight emendation makes it even stronger.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
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#5
The weaker vessel is to be cherished not abused. Adam was created first and Eve was made from Adam's rib. Close to his heart and part of his flesh. Cherished and loved like Christ and His church.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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twofeet

Guest
#6
yes for freedom...nice thread..and very true...wish you hadnt left out the part said about eve before
He announced what man will do:cool: thats a tad revealing also
He said to Eve her pains will increase in childbirth ...that one is pretty obvious Abiding ...the reason being, from my own experience, that when you are facing such an ordeal and the threat of death you have nowhere else to turn to...God. He did that to SAVE a woman so she would seek Him. And for the other part she would cling to her husband...God knew what a deep in depth person a woman is, she is RELATIONAL more than men are (thats why they are such gossips) and now that se will cleave to her hubby, who is not so chatty and relational she will have to search for something deeper...thats Right....Jesus :)
 
Feb 17, 2010
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#7
I pity the MEN MORE,.... They have WAY more hardship than women.... Even in the Bible the men were the ones that got HAMMERED for their faith, far more than women... There were no PAULINA that went through GREAT sufferings...I know there was a PAUL

My wife submit, becasue she TRUST MY LEADERSHIP and Priesthood for the family. AS I TRUST JESUS as my priest.... Perfectly SCRIPTURE...

There is no FORCE or pressure on her, just love and leadership, Biblical leadership... IT IS A GODLY GIFT TO MY WIFE TO BE SO OBEDIENT,.,,, If she wants to talk in church she will have to throw the gift of GOD OUT OF HER!!! And let SATAN in to say what HE WANTs... Fortunately she is 100% content with me being our preacher.... Exactly like God wants it...

If she talks in church I CANNOT become an elder... 1 Tim 3.... If I cannot priest my wife, I cannot take care of my own house, then I cannot take care of God's house... So if I cannot preach ... women should be quiet in church, I disqualify as elder... 1 Tim 3... So there it is quite a job for a man to become an elder... women can just sit back and see the elders TEACH...
 

Agricola

Senior Member
Dec 10, 2012
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#8
If a man wants to envoke wives submit to your husands, then the woman should remind him of the rest of it, that men are ment to treat women as Christ treats the church, that is to love unconditionally and give support and help. Does Christ beat us when we do not give him his dinner on time? Course not.

If God is in the centre and the husband fulfils his role and duty in this manner , then the wife will automatically submit out of love and adoration, just as we submit to Christ out of adoration and love.
 
Feb 17, 2010
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#9
Yep and when the church did not listen Jesus threw the tables over and whipped them out of the Temple... Should I use the same tactics, when she does not listen or submit?
 

Misty77

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2013
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#10
I pity the MEN MORE,.... They have WAY more hardship than women.... Even in the Bible the men were the ones that got HAMMERED for their faith, far more than women... There were no PAULINA that went through GREAT sufferings...I know there was a PAUL

My wife submit, becasue she TRUST MY LEADERSHIP and Priesthood for the family. AS I TRUST JESUS as my priest.... Perfectly SCRIPTURE...

There is no FORCE or pressure on her, just love and leadership, Biblical leadership... IT IS A GODLY GIFT TO MY WIFE TO BE SO OBEDIENT,.,,, If she wants to talk in church she will have to throw the gift of GOD OUT OF HER!!! And let SATAN in to say what HE WANTs... Fortunately she is 100% content with me being our preacher.... Exactly like God wants it...

If she talks in church I CANNOT become an elder... 1 Tim 3.... If I cannot priest my wife, I cannot take care of my own house, then I cannot take care of God's house... So if I cannot preach ... women should be quiet in church, I disqualify as elder... 1 Tim 3... So there it is quite a job for a man to become an elder... women can just sit back and see the elders TEACH...
In other words:

100283.jpg
 

Misty77

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2013
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#11
Yep and when the church did not listen Jesus threw the tables over and whipped them out of the Temple... Should I use the same tactics, when she does not listen or submit?
Again. . .
sexism.jpg
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
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#12
Wow this really happens? Men try to control or have wives submit to them like this? All I ever see is wives being the stronger one of the relationship and men being afraid of getting in trouble with their wives. I think men who would use scripture to do that are wanting to be able to do as they please and have things their way no ifs ands or butts. Or are just really old fashioned and want things back to the old days, but you cannot use scripture to justify your actions
 

Misty77

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2013
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#14
Wow this really happens? Men try to control or have wives submit to them like this? All I ever see is wives being the stronger one of the relationship and men being afraid of getting in trouble with their wives. I think men who would use scripture to do that are wanting to be able to do as they please and have things their way no ifs ands or butts. Or are just really old fashioned and want things back to the old days, but you cannot use scripture to justify your actions
It happens a lot more than you think. There are marriages that are on the opposite swing of the pendulum, but you don't really hear from the oppressed women because we are usually too scared to talk or think we deserve the treatment. I was abused mentally, emotionally, and sexually by my ex-husband of 10 years who was also a preacher. He twisted scripture around until I was convinced that I was just a really bad person. I was never good enough or quiet enough or thin enough or smart enough. The "punishments" are too humiliating to talk about, but I really believed I deserved them. He didn't even realize the damage he was doing. What most people don't know is that most abusers truly believe they are doing the right thing and that their victim "makes" them do the harmful actions.

Thankfully, the Lord freed me from that nightmare; and my son and I have been healed from so much.
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
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#16
A woman's role is to perfectly exemplify Christ's relationship to his Father (before crucifixion), while a man's role is to perfectly exemplify Christ's relationship to his Church (after crucifixion)...this is why women are told to submit to their husbands (...not to submit to men in general, btw. The relationship between a man and woman *outside of marriage* is one of brother and sister).

Christ never sought his own will but submitted to the will of his Father at all times. "..not my will (not my desires & wants) but thy will be done." And in submission he was exalted to the right hand. Christ said "I have not come to be served but to serve".

Christ said, "anyone who will be great in the kingdom must be the least, and anyone who wants to be the greatest of all must be servant of all."

It is also written that The Church (the bride) must "die to self" and instead "take on Christ's life" (the Husbandman). This is why traditionally the woman forsook her family name and took on her husband's last name; she died to her life to live his. A woman becoming a wife literally prophesies "Christ, the servant"...she must die to self *completely*. A man becoming a husband literally prophesies "Christ, the king"...he must treat his wife as his very own body and reign in love...but then he - along with all other believers - is the "bride" of Christ, so then *his* will also submits so that there is only one body...Christ's. Then Christ submits to the father, so that God may be all in all.

"And two shall become one flesh"; one body, with one mind and will. One body can not have two minds/wills because that's being double-minded...and double-mindedness is instability in every way.

...As I type this I realize more and more that BOTH people MUST have the truth of Christ living within them fully before they ever consider entering into marriage. If neither really yields to Christ neither will operate within their unique roles, and the marriage will most definitely fail. Gives me pause.
 

Misty77

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2013
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#17
A woman's role is to perfectly exemplify Christ's relationship to his Father (before crucifixion), while a man's role is to perfectly exemplify Christ's relationship to his Church (after crucifixion)...this is why women are told to submit to their husbands (...not to submit to men in general, btw. The relationship between a man and woman *outside of marriage* is one of brother and sister).

Christ never sought his own will but submitted to the will of his Father at all times. "..not my will (not my desires & wants) but thy will be done." And in submission he was exalted to the right hand. Christ said "I have not come to be served but to serve".

Christ said, "anyone who will be great in the kingdom must be the least, and anyone who wants to be the greatest of all must be servant of all."

It is also written that The Church (the bride) must "die to self" and instead "take on Christ's life" (the Husbandman). This is why traditionally the woman forsook her family name and took on her husband's last name; she died to her life to live his. A woman becoming a wife literally prophesies "Christ, the servant"...she must die to self *completely*. A man becoming a husband literally prophesies "Christ, the king"...he must treat his wife as his very own body and reign in love...but then he - along with all other believers - is the "bride" of Christ, so then *his* will also submits so that there is only one body...Christ's. Then Christ submits to the father, so that God may be all in all.

"And two shall become one flesh"; one body, with one mind and will. One body can not have two minds/wills because that's being double-minded...and double-mindedness is instability in every way.

...As I type this I realize more and more that BOTH people MUST have the truth of Christ living within them fully before they ever consider entering into marriage. If neither really yields to Christ neither will operate within their unique roles, and the marriage will most definitely fail. Gives me pause.
Actually, Ephesians calls for the husband to give up his life for his wife, not the other way around.
 
Q

Quickfire

Guest
#18
To much drama for me all this it looks like handbags at dawn ,,, ouch I just probably just got hit by one,,,
Just boogy woogy let it go if you hate men become a nun or a critic .. start a revolution but I think you'll makes more enemies than friends speaking this way, just imagine switching your tv on listening to some woman none stop attack men,, men who are good honest and sharing will just switch off which is what I'm doin Now,, don't blame me for your hurt I'm just an innocent bystander voicing my feelings,, if you go looking for badness you will surely find it what makes no sense to me is why take up the form of a snake angels can take up the form of humans ,, it makes no sense surely if yer wanted to deceive someone you wouldnt form a talking snake so to me it's like a matter of trust
 
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Q

Quickfire

Guest
#19
What's more I though being Christian is about making a change and being kind and also putting away your hurt becoming Christian is suppose to mean you have changed and also mean you have been forgiven so why is it Christians carnt forgive others,
 

Misty77

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2013
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#20
To much drama for me all this it looks like handbags at dawn ,,, ouch I just probably just got hit by one,,,
Just boogy woogy let it go if you hate men become a nun or a critic .. start a revolution but I think you'll makes more enemies than friends speaking this way, just imagine switching your tv on listening to some woman none stop attack men,, men who are good honest and sharing will just switch off which is what I'm doin Now,, don't blame me for your hurt I'm just an innocent bystander voicing my feelings,, if you go looking for badness you will surely find it what makes no sense to me is why take up the form of a snake angels can take up the form of humans ,, it makes no sense surely if yer wanted to deceive someone you wouldnt form a talking snake so to me it's like a matter of trust
Pointing out sexism isn't man-hating. I truly believe the genders are created to work together for God's kingdom. All of my posts were in response to really demeaning statements.