THE CROSS

[posthuman]

our debts were payed off at the cross, and at the empty tomb, He handed us the winning lottery ticket.

Ummm, what do you suspect he was doing for the 3 days after he died while in the heart of the earth?
Do you feel that may have some significance in the whole big picture sceheme of things or does God every think on as small of scale as humans do?

well obviously i think He was at the Sheol-Mart buying lottery tickets.

so to speak.

The cross was the vehicle for which part of Gods will to be accomplished, as well as a very important display of Christ dying a criminals death when he did no wrong.
An example for us to follow that we not only may but will be persecuted as some of the most detestable beings in the face of the worldly. Yet we are Godly.
It was Christs LIFE, while he LIVED that he accomplished so much more in a display of Love in doing nothing of his own will.
How many could easily sacrifice one day or die for another?
We can see that in war by a man jumping on a grenade for his friends, a man or woman defending their own children.
But how many will live their entire life....as a living ....sacrifice...for another...Their whole life.
Now do you understand?

can Christ get any more wonderful??

but if He had only lived, and been taken up, without the cross, without the resurrection - what would that have meant for us gentiles? a model of righteousness to aspire to? would that be any different than siddhartha buddah? we would still be under the law, seeking righteousness through it, unattainable, and even worse for us, outside of the covenant with His chosen people the Jews, we would have a perfect image to gaze on and no hope of ever measuring up to it, and all our sins would prevent us from even having the audience before the Almighty to cry for mercy.

but if He had only lived and died, and taken away our guilt, then we would have a model of pure living, and a forgiveness for our wantonness, but it would be but a vain hope, here we would still remain, no longer dead in our trespasses, but without power to overcome the sin of our future. we might then escape His wrath in our few short days, but then go to the grave without promise, and never having shared in His glory, but knowing the shadow of it as it passed over us on that hill golgatha.

but He lived, He died, and He rose again!

HOSANNA! ! !

 

[p_rehbein]

Some Scriptures to ponder:

Ephesians 2:1) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; 2 .) Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3 .) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. 4 .) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 .) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved, 6 .) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7 .) That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8 .) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 .) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

John 3:3) Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily,I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God…………………14)And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 .) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 .) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 .) For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 .) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God…………35) The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. 36 .) He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him

4:13) Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again: 14 .) But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

5:24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life……..39) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 .) And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

6:32) Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven. 33 .) For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. 34 .) Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread. 35 .) And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; andhe that believeth on me shall never thirst. 36 .) But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not. 37 .) All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

10:7) Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I sayunto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 .) All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 .) I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture 15) am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. 15 .) As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16 .) And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
17 .) Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. 18 .) No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

11:25) Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
26 .) And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

17:1) These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: 2 .) As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. 3 .) And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. 4 .) I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do

Jesus saves............Jesus saves...........Jesus saves!

 

[Cobus]

Kerry I bet I will beat you with Scriptures on what the Cross really do for us in the POWER of God...

The crosswork of Jesus (the cross) is the END OF ALL SIN FOR ALL WHO PASS THROUGH...
The cross is the FINAL step in repentance... Whe nwe lay a sin on the Cross of Jesus, GOD DECLARES THE SIN DEAD FOR US.. AND HE GIVES US VICTORY OBER THAT SIN AND ALSO RULERSHIP OVER THAT SIN... Let me just use the sin I committed most as an example...

I cheated on my wife for 16 years, and before that I had ungodly sex for MANY MANY TIMES... but then on a certain Sunday after Church, a younf man came for counceling and he had the same demons hanging onto him... We both got that from much older homo-sexual men... That was one of the times I heard God speak to me.... He said: Cobus if you pray now I will severe or cut all teh bods of those bemons from both of you... We prayed, and from that day neither me nor the younger man had EVER had ungodly sex, not even in thought again... You see God removed me from the sin, and the sin from me (sin burnt in the FIRE of the FIRE BAPTISM) and I got NEW THOUGHTS of all the temptations... Temtations are no longer temptations, but JUDGMENT IN TRUTH... (Spirit of Truth baptism)


Before that Sunday a woman in a short dress was a temptation, and able to stir inside with flesh lust... After that Sunday a woman in short dress was a child of satan, and a tempter and a stumbling stone... A person to pity and really sad to see how she satisfy satan with her dresscode... In stead of wanting to sleep with her, I now want to pray for her, and I do, right there in silence.

I cannot even get excited about the woman, but I do have GREAT joy in the victory over the same sex-demons she listen too when she buys the dress.... and put it on...


Modestly dressed woman just appears to be so more MODEST, and LADY-LIKE... I love how my wife dress, and she always looks so GODLY WOMAN...


So the cross really does seperate sin from us, and Jesus says.... Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

 

[loveme1]

1 Corinthians 15

16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

 

[Kerry]

Kerry I bet I will beat you with Scriptures on what the Cross really do for us in the POWER of God...

The crosswork of Jesus (the cross) is the END OF ALL SIN FOR ALL WHO PASS THROUGH...
The cross is the FINAL step in repentance... Whe nwe lay a sin on the Cross of Jesus, GOD DECLARES THE SIN DEAD FOR US.. AND HE GIVES US VICTORY OBER THAT SIN AND ALSO RULERSHIP OVER THAT SIN... Let me just use the sin I committed most as an example...

I cheated on my wife for 16 years, and before that I had ungodly sex for MANY MANY TIMES... but then on a certain Sunday after Church, a younf man came for counceling and he had the same demons hanging onto him... We both got that from much older homo-sexual men... That was one of the times I heard God speak to me.... He said: Cobus if you pray now I will severe or cut all teh bods of those bemons from both of you... We prayed, and from that day neither me nor the younger man had EVER had ungodly sex, not even in thought again... You see God removed me from the sin, and the sin from me (sin burnt in the FIRE of the FIRE BAPTISM) and I got NEW THOUGHTS of all the temptations... Temtations are no longer temptations, but JUDGMENT IN TRUTH... (Spirit of Truth baptism)


Before that Sunday a woman in a short dress was a temptation, and able to stir inside with flesh lust... After that Sunday a woman in short dress was a child of satan, and a tempter and a stumbling stone... A person to pity and really sad to see how she satisfy satan with her dresscode... In stead of wanting to sleep with her, I now want to pray for her, and I do, right there in silence.

I cannot even get excited about the woman, but I do have GREAT joy in the victory over the same sex-demons she listen too when she buys the dress.... and put it on...


Modestly dressed woman just appears to be so more MODEST, and LADY-LIKE... I love how my wife dress, and she always looks so GODLY WOMAN...


So the cross really does seperate sin from us, and Jesus says.... Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

Praise God Cobus. The cross did that for you. Shouldn't preach that cross instead of sinless perfection. We are sanctified by the cross and nothing else. I too have difficulty with women, I also struggled with alcohol. Thank God for the cross. My friend you will find other things that cling and the Holy Spirit, by the means of the cross will set you free. I love you Cobus and do not be deceived we are not sinless. Look deeper my friend, the perfection that God demands can not be obtained it is only by the cross and nothing else.

 

[Cobus]

Kerry how clean does the cross wash? And is that where the Gospel ends for us here on earth? Look I know where you are at, and I will WALK with you EVERY step on HIS WAY....

Kerry where is the holy Spirit when you are sloshed? Is He also sloshed? Where is the Holy Spirit when you commit adultery? In you, in the room, in the house, outside... Remember the Holy Spirit is light, and NO DARK works can be done in the Light...


You see your doctrine does not work... The Holy Spirit is NOT in a sinner. A sinner is a sinner because JESUS IS NOT RESURRECTED IN HIM YET.... If JESUS is resurrected in a sinner, HE IS A SAVED SINNER... DONE! COMPLETE, and SAVED SINNERS ARE ALL PERFECT... I will show you how it works, but you have first got to see this.... THE COMPLETE WORK OF GOD ON EARTH, ON A SINNER, IS A MAN THA TLIVES A GODLY LIFE HERE ON EARTH... NOT A SINFUL LFE... A GODLY LIFE...


Look here, RIGHT HERE ON EARTH... Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
And here... Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;


At least admit you did not know that we can live a GODLY life here in this present world.... It is a start of your awakening to the Truth... Kerry do not be proud today,... Admit you know not God as HE is in the Bible... Every person that GOD ENTERS INTO, LIVES A GODLY LIFE HERE ON EARTH....

Kerry the person that lives GODLY IN CHRIST, does not sin no more... GOD TOOK HIM PAST THE CROSS...

 

[p_rehbein]

Praise God Cobus. The cross did that for you. Shouldn't preach that cross instead of sinless perfection. We are sanctified by the cross and nothing else. I too have difficulty with women, I also struggled with alcohol. Thank God for the cross. My friend you will find other things that cling and the Holy Spirit, by the means of the cross will set you free. I love you Cobus and do not be deceived we are not sinless. Look deeper my friend, the perfection that God demands can not be obtained it is only by the cross and nothing else.[/QUOTE

I'm quite sure it is Jesus Christ who "sanctifies" us...........but, that might just be me......

Hebrews10:1) For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.2 .) For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins……..9) Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.10 .) By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all……….12) But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 .) From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. 14.) For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.15 .) Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, 16 .) This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; 17.) And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. 18 .) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
19 .) Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, 20 .) By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; 21 .) And having an high priest over the house of God; 22 .) Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.


23 .) Let us holdfast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised)

 

[Kerry]

What does dispensationalism do for you? What does serpent seed doctrine do for you? what does cessation do for you? what does the speaking in tongues do for you?

All these different doctrines and teachings. My friend they do nothing for you. They don't bring you closer to God, they tickle the intellect which is flesh and allow us to boast or be big and bad of our knowledge. The fact is we have nothing but the cross.

Keep law as best you can. It will do nothing for you. Yes we strive to do so, but guess what we can't. Thats why we have the cross. The cross is everything. All blessings come through the cross. Salvation comes through the cross. Healing comes through the cross. Justification comes through the cross. Sanctification comes through the cross. Baptism in the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues comes through the cross.

The only thing we can do is have faith in the work of the cross and say thank you and nothing more.

 

[ElizabethPeter]

What does the cross mean to you? I believe that the cross is the ultimate move of God. I believe that there is nothing else. Believe that the Holy Spirit can only move on a person that has their faith exclusively in the work of the cross and nothing else, No not your works, nor how Holy you try to live. But solely in the cross. Most, if not threads on this forum, can be answered in the cross. The problem we are faced is, is where is our faith. What is it placed in?

Tell me this, if our faith is to be based solely on the cross, then what is it that brought Christ to the cross? For the wages of sin is death, but wasn't Christ sinless?

 

[4enlightment]

What does the cross mean to you? I believe that the cross is the ultimate move of God. I believe that there is nothing else. Believe that the Holy Spirit can only move on a person that has their faith exclusively in the work of the cross and nothing else, No not your works, nor how Holy you try to live. But solely in the cross. Most, if not threads on this forum, can be answered in the cross. The problem we are faced is, is where is our faith. What is it placed in?

The cross has several meanings in the ancient times before Christ. It symbolizes a sign of goodness in all cultures. God had use this symbol because the people of those found comfort in it like a lucky charm of some sort.

John 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.

Numbers 21:8The Lord said to Moses, “Make a snake and put it up on a pole; anyone who is bitten can look at it and live.”

Luke 22:53Every day I was with you in the temple courts, and you did not lay a hand on me. But this is your hour—when darkness reigns.”

Romans 5:14Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

John 3:14Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,




The ankh seems at least to be an evolved form of, or associated with the Egyptian glyph for magical protection, sa. However, what the sign itself represents is often disputed. For example, Sir Alan Gardiner thought that it showed a sandal strap with the loop at the top forming the strap, but if so, the symbolism is obscure and so his theory has found little real favor early on. However, this interpretation seems to have received some acceptance among modern writers. It would seem that the ancient Egyptians called that part of the sandal 'nkh (exact pronunciation unknown). Because this word was composed of the same consonants as the word "life", the sign to represent that particular part of the sandal, was also used to write the word "life".[TABLE="width: 710"]
[TR]
[TD]

​

[/TD]
[TD]

​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

The Ancient Ankh Symbol of Life

Swastika - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Indus Valley Civilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Indus Valley Civilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Kerry]

I'm not talking about the symbol, but the work that was performed on the cross. Without it we have no hope. We must lean on the cross and not our intellect or knowledge or our fasting and good deeds they do nothing only faith in the work of the cross brings the blessing and nothing else.

 

[4enlightment]

Tell me this, if our faith is to be based solely on the cross, then what is it that brought Christ to the cross? For the wages of sin is death, but wasn't Christ sinless?

1 Peter 1:19but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect.

In those times a lamb sacrifice was given for our penalties of violating the laws. The lamb did not sinned, but it represented or symbolize what we had done to our sins. And so the lamb became the symbol of our sins, but not become a sinner.

Leviticus 5:6As a penalty for the sin they have committed, they must bring to the Lord a female lamb or goat from the flock as a sin offering; and the priest shall make atonement for them for their sin.

 

[ElizabethPeter]

1 Peter 1:19but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect.

In those times a lamb sacrifice was given for our penalties of violating the laws. The lamb did not sinned, but it represented or symbolize what we had done to our sins. And so the lamb became the symbol of our sins, but not become a sinner.

Leviticus 5:6As a penalty for the sin they have committed, they must bring to the Lord a female lamb or goat from the flock as a sin offering; and the priest shall make atonement for them for their sin.

Exactly my point. But in order for Christ to die, mustn't He first take our sins, through the laying on of hands? So where did He take them? Because in The OT, it was through the laying of hands by a priest from the Aaronic priesthood, and then only was the animal killed. Doesn't this also apply to Christ?