I just found this on a rapture site
- Thread starter MusicTester
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
You are forgetting the enmity that God placed between Eve's seed and Satan's seed. This separation could have allowed for her to get pregnant with Adam while already pregnant with Satan. Let's face it, this is a little above the norm and what we understand may not have applied to Eve.
This is theory and conjecture as the Bible does not say this. See what I mean??? We all make assumptions about things that aren't clearly taught. If Cain was the son of Adam and God wanted to show us that Cain was cut off, he could have shown the two lineages with Adam at the top in both cases, but He didn't. God showed us two distinct and separate lineages for a reason.
One reason is to show that Jesus did not come from Cain's line and we see that it was from Seth's line that Noah came. But this reason does not account for why we have Cain's line at all. Why not just leave it out? There is a lesson there.
As for Moses, he was writing about a period 2,000+ years before him so clearly Moses wrote down exactly what the Lord told him to write. He was not writing from memory and likely not from stories handed down. So the garden wasn't written in a writing style of Moses.
1 Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them,
2 that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose.
Ask yourself what this means.
The sons of God are angels otherwise they would be called sons of men and not sons of God just as the women are called daughters of men. If angels are fooling around with human women you can bet they learned it from their master.
This is theory and conjecture as the Bible does not say this. See what I mean??? We all make assumptions about things that aren't clearly taught. If Cain was the son of Adam and God wanted to show us that Cain was cut off, he could have shown the two lineages with Adam at the top in both cases, but He didn't. God showed us two distinct and separate lineages for a reason.
One reason is to show that Jesus did not come from Cain's line and we see that it was from Seth's line that Noah came. But this reason does not account for why we have Cain's line at all. Why not just leave it out? There is a lesson there.
As for Moses, he was writing about a period 2,000+ years before him so clearly Moses wrote down exactly what the Lord told him to write. He was not writing from memory and likely not from stories handed down. So the garden wasn't written in a writing style of Moses.
1 Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them,
2 that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose.
Ask yourself what this means.
The sons of God are angels otherwise they would be called sons of men and not sons of God just as the women are called daughters of men. If angels are fooling around with human women you can bet they learned it from their master.
Last edited:
I believe the Garden was destroyed in the flood. The land mass was dramatically changed. If you read the descriptions of the different rivers in the garden, 2 I think don't exist today.
As for the Tree of Life not being in the future heaven, go back and look again. Rev 22 is all the eternal state, new heaven on earth. Remember, the old heaven and earth will pass away, 2 Peter 3:10.
As for the Tree of Life not being in the future heaven, go back and look again. Rev 22 is all the eternal state, new heaven on earth. Remember, the old heaven and earth will pass away, 2 Peter 3:10.
Easy killer. I'm working too and not just sitting here non stop. This isn't a chat room.
Where in the bible says the tree of life is in heaven ? Rev 22 is all about heaven.
Who was Esau father ? Do you have a theory that suggest it isn't Isaac?
Why did Cain say least someone found him to kil him ? Apparently there were others on earth but I don't think you or anyone on this site wants to go there. Too many here are stuck on traditional teaching.
Where did those people come from? You tell me
Why are not all the other genologies of Adam and Eve other children not mentioned ? You tell me. Probably because they weren't important enough for us to know.
Now I have a question for you. Why does Gen 1:27 say this?
27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
How is it God created male and female on the 6th day then rested then we see in Chapter 2 that he later forms Eve?
Wow, we should have started a new thread as this is way off course. I throw one little idea out there and everyone goes insane.
Where in the bible says the tree of life is in heaven ? Rev 22 is all about heaven.
Who was Esau father ? Do you have a theory that suggest it isn't Isaac?
Why did Cain say least someone found him to kil him ? Apparently there were others on earth but I don't think you or anyone on this site wants to go there. Too many here are stuck on traditional teaching.
Where did those people come from? You tell me
Why are not all the other genologies of Adam and Eve other children not mentioned ? You tell me. Probably because they weren't important enough for us to know.
Now I have a question for you. Why does Gen 1:27 say this?
27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
How is it God created male and female on the 6th day then rested then we see in Chapter 2 that he later forms Eve?
Wow, we should have started a new thread as this is way off course. I throw one little idea out there and everyone goes insane.
From my stand point:
Both arguments are conjecture. I believe that Moses (although it could be argued that others wrote Genesis) wrote the literal and you believe that, on occasion, he wrote metaphorical. Neither of which we can ultimately prove to be right as God doesn't say anywhere in the Bible who the writer was nor the writing style. I believe that, since God deemed it palatable for us that genocide and infanticide happened and wrote some in detail, He would find it palatable for us to tell us that Satan had sexual relations with Adam and/or Eve if it really happened. You believe that God deemed it too much for us to swallow and instead had the writer(s) write a metaphor instead.
Since, we are both standing solid on said beliefs, I cannot convince you otherwise and you cannot convince me otherwise. We will have to let God's Spirit do the convincing.We, as humans, have reached an impasse on this.
As the above statements are true, I propose a question: Is it profitable for us to continue discussing?
Both arguments are conjecture. I believe that Moses (although it could be argued that others wrote Genesis) wrote the literal and you believe that, on occasion, he wrote metaphorical. Neither of which we can ultimately prove to be right as God doesn't say anywhere in the Bible who the writer was nor the writing style. I believe that, since God deemed it palatable for us that genocide and infanticide happened and wrote some in detail, He would find it palatable for us to tell us that Satan had sexual relations with Adam and/or Eve if it really happened. You believe that God deemed it too much for us to swallow and instead had the writer(s) write a metaphor instead.
Since, we are both standing solid on said beliefs, I cannot convince you otherwise and you cannot convince me otherwise. We will have to let God's Spirit do the convincing.We, as humans, have reached an impasse on this.
As the above statements are true, I propose a question: Is it profitable for us to continue discussing?
Satan is in heaven now accusing the brethren day and night. Michael is restraining him until he returns as Antichrist.
Your statement does nothing to counter my argument. It is absolutely true that God would have accepted Cain had Cain chosen to do what delighted the Lord rather than doing what did not delight the Lord.
Nobody on here has disputed that fallen angels slept with human women and procreated with them. Since that is an indisputable fact, why are so many people having problems accepting that Satan took the lead? Obviously Satan is capable of reproduction or he wouldn't have a seed for God to put an enmity between his seed and Eve's seed.
Your statement does nothing to counter my argument. It is absolutely true that God would have accepted Cain had Cain chosen to do what delighted the Lord rather than doing what did not delight the Lord.
Nobody on here has disputed that fallen angels slept with human women and procreated with them. Since that is an indisputable fact, why are so many people having problems accepting that Satan took the lead? Obviously Satan is capable of reproduction or he wouldn't have a seed for God to put an enmity between his seed and Eve's seed.
The reason we don't dispute the angels sleeping with women is because the Bible specifically says so. Where does it specifically say that satan slept with Eve? It doesn't. The only verse you've shown is that Cain was of the evil one, which anyone who chooses to follow satan is and it's not because satan slept with their moms.
This guy is messed up from the floor up. 
1. Cain is NOT in Adam's genealogy, Gen 5:1.
2. Eve conceived once, but bore twice, Gen 4:1-2
3. God placed an enmity between Satan's seed and Eve's seed, Gen 3:15. If Satan has a seed, he has ability to procreate. Either Satan and Eve had been fooling around or at a minimum, God was concerned about it.
4. The Tree of Life and Knowledge of Good and Evil were both in the Garden, Gen 2:9.
5. It is said that if anyone eats of the Tree of Life that they would live forever, Gen 3:22.
6. The only way one receives eternal life is through Jesus, Multiple passages including John 6:54, 10:28, Rom 5:21. This would imply Jesus was the Tree of Life in the Garden.
7. Jesus says, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing." John 15:5. Jesus also was furious over a fig tree with no fruit and destroyed it. On the surface it seemed like an over-the-top reaction but Jesus was teaching us something bigger.
8. Much is made about using the literal meaning of fruit as the item Satan tempted Adam and Eve with. However, the word, "Fruit" is used repeatedly in the Bible as a synonym to "works, deeds and rewards" both good and bad. Rom 6:22 But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life. We see in John 4:36 And he who reaps receives wages, and gathers fruit for eternal life, that both he who sows and he who reaps may rejoice together. Jesus teaches us literally in multiple places that we can judge a tree by its fruit. Then we have in Acts 2:30 the use of the word "Fruit" to describe the body of David, Therefore, being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that of the fruit of his body, according to the flesh, He would raise up the Christ to sit on his throne.
9. Cain was the first murder. 1 John 3:12 tells us, "not as Cain who was of the wicked one and murdered his brother." It's fair to say Cain was just of Satan's ways, but this verse certainly could imply much more if taken literally.
10. Gen 3:15 says in part, "He (Jesus) shall bruise your (Satan) head, And you (Satan) shall bruise His (Jesus) heel." Since neither "he" is identified by name but we know this is speaking of Satan having Christ crucified and Christ finally defeating Satan then it is clear that both Christ and Satan were present in the garden, thus they were symbolically the two aforementioned trees.
11. We have documentation that Satan's fallen angels have slept with and bore children with human woman and that God destroyed the earth by flood in large part because of this, Gen 6. If the Angels can do it, why can't Satan? In fact I would argue these evil angels were following their master's lead.
You may not like this theory as it may offend your sensitivities but there is no doubt that a compelling case can be made for Satan to have slept with Eve. There is far too much here to think all of this was simple disobedience over a piece of actual fruit. That's my humble opinion and we are each entitled to our own views.
Last edited:
See my post #99 above. You have to look at the whole picture. God isn't a pervert and even telling this story (if true) would be beyond God's sensitivities. Stories He does tell of Rape and incest as despicable as they are don't even come close to Eve and/or Adam rolling around in that way with the Devil.
I am open to this being simple Satan worship as it does go along with what Satan tries to do when he temps Christ and what he will do when he comes as antichrist soon. But this is not a case of simple disobedience with a piece of fruit as the punishment doesn't come close to fitting the crime. It would be like killing your child over catching their hand in the cookie jar after you told them no. We all know God is a just God. And he is fair.
I am open to this being simple Satan worship as it does go along with what Satan tries to do when he temps Christ and what he will do when he comes as antichrist soon. But this is not a case of simple disobedience with a piece of fruit as the punishment doesn't come close to fitting the crime. It would be like killing your child over catching their hand in the cookie jar after you told them no. We all know God is a just God. And he is fair.
Last edited: