I just found this on a rapture site

[Kimber321]

Christ, and he was conceived on or about Dec 25, 3 BC meaning he was born 9 months later sometime in September, 2 BC. He died on April 3, 33 AD. He was 35 when he died and rose again.

Can you please post scripture supporting this claim?

 

[mystdancer50]

Can you please post scripture supporting this claim?

It's really more of a study of the history of those times. Jesus was born during the census, and so this is how they figure His birth was around September.

Just one site that explains this: When, exactly, was Jesus Christ born?

 

[mystdancer50]

Obviously you forgot that after the act with Satan, God put an enmity between Satan's seed and Eve's seed thus separating them and allowing her to get pregnant again. This is the only known time in history that this was done. You are picking one of the 11 or so reasons I cited back in post 99 to attack. Why not attack them all? Clearly God did something to Eve's seed after her encounter with Satan. What exactly it was medically, I have no clue. But why do anything at all with Eve's seed if all she did was eat an apple?

The enmity between satan and Eve's seed is actually prophetically referring to the birth of Christ. This is why it is often capitalized when it says "He will crush your head". Essentially, God is saying, "You think you've won, but I have redemption already prepared for My creation."

 

[mystdancer50]

The explains it a little clearer:

Verses 14-15 God passes sentence; and he begins where the sin began, with the serpent. The devil's instruments must share in the devil's punishments. Under the cover of the serpent, the devil is sentenced to be degraded and accursed of God; detested and abhorred of all mankind: also to be destroyed and ruined at last by the great Redeemer, signified by the breaking of his head. War is proclaimed between the Seed of the woman and the seed of the serpent. It is the fruit of this enmity, that there is a continual warfare between grace and corruption, in the hearts of God's people. Satan, by their corruptions, buffets them, sifts them, and seeks to devour them. Heaven and hell can never be reconciled, nor light and darkness; no more can Satan and a sanctified soul. Also, there is a continual struggle between the wicked and the godly in this world. A gracious promise is here made of Christ, as the Deliverer of fallen man from the power of Satan. Here was the drawn of the gospel day: no sooner was the wound given, than the remedy was provided and revealed. This gracious revelation of a Saviour came unasked, and unlooked for. Without a revelation of mercy, giving some hope of forgiveness, the convinced sinner would sink into despair, and be hardened. By faith in this promise, our first parents, and the patriarchs before the flood, were justified and saved. Notice is given concerning Christ. 1. His incarnation, or coming in the flesh. It speaks great encouragement to sinners, that their Saviour is the Seed of the woman, bone of our bone, ( hebrews 2:11 hebrews 2:14 ) . 2. His sufferings and death; pointed at in Satan's bruising his heel, that is, his human nature. And Christ's sufferings are continued in the sufferings of the saints for his name. The devil tempts them, persecutes and slays them; and so bruises the heel of Christ, who is afflicted in their afflictions. But while the heel is bruised on earth, the Head is in heaven. 3. His victory over Satan thereby. Christ baffled Satan's temptations, rescued souls out of his hands. By his death he gave a fatal blow to the devil's kingdom, a wound to the head of this serpent that cannot be healed. As the gospel gains ground, Satan falls.

Taken from: Genesis 3 Commentary - Matthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible (Concise)

Note how "Seed" of the woman is capitalized here in this commentary and "seed" of satan is not...that is in reference of Christ.

 

[jb]

Satan is bi. He had sex with both Adam and Eve.

Yeah Baby!

Good to know how the other half live! LOL!

 

[PlainWord]

Can you please post scripture supporting this claim?

It was in the stars. There is an excellent DVD out called "Star of Bethlehem" which proves the crucifixion date. In this documentary, a strong case is made for the contraception date. The birth date is simple math. There is also some Biblical evidence as related to John the Baptist but I don't recall the specifics.

 

[PlainWord]

The enmity between satan and Eve's seed is actually prophetically referring to the birth of Christ. This is why it is often capitalized when it says "He will crush your head". Essentially, God is saying, "You think you've won, but I have redemption already prepared for My creation."

I don't dispute who the HE is and I even cite it as being Jesus. Gen 3:22 refers to Adam and Eve becoming like US. This US is either God and Satan or God and Christ. I prefer the latter. As for the verse you cited:

15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel."

There is no doubt that Satan has a seed thus Satan is able to sire children. That is a sick but fact. It is also fact that Satan's angels have hooked up with human women producing hybrids, see Gen 6 and the Book of Jude. I also agree that Christ will bruise Satan's head and that Satan bruised Christ's heel.

The question is, "What does the enmity that God placed between Satan and the woman and between their seeds?" The first conflict we have is Cain and Abel. So if there is animosity between Satan and Eve it was quickly manifested.

 

[Isdaniel]

I don't dispute who the HE is and I even cite it as being Jesus. Gen 3:22 refers to Adam and Eve becoming like US. This US is either God and Satan or God and Christ. I prefer the latter. As for the verse you cited:

15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel."

There is no doubt that Satan has a seed thus Satan is able to sire children. That is a sick but fact. It is also fact that Satan's angels have hooked up with human women producing hybrids, see Gen 6 and the Book of Jude. I also agree that Christ will bruise Satan's head and that Satan bruised Christ's heel.

The question is, "What does the enmity that God placed between Satan and the woman and between their seeds?" The first conflict we have is Cain and Abel. So if there is animosity between Satan and Eve it was quickly manifested.

santan did not have sex with Eve stop adding to God words

You have not nor canot prove anythin


Does satan have childre today ?

 

[mystdancer50]

I don't dispute who the HE is and I even cite it as being Jesus. Gen 3:22 refers to Adam and Eve becoming like US. This US is either God and Satan or God and Christ. I prefer the latter. As for the verse you cited:

15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel."

There is no doubt that Satan has a seed thus Satan is able to sire children. That is a sick but fact. It is also fact that Satan's angels have hooked up with human women producing hybrids, see Gen 6 and the Book of Jude. I also agree that Christ will bruise Satan's head and that Satan bruised Christ's heel.

The question is, "What does the enmity that God placed between Satan and the woman and between their seeds?" The first conflict we have is Cain and Abel. So if there is animosity between Satan and Eve it was quickly manifested.

Sin entered the world through Adam and Eve deciding to listen to satan and take the fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, which was disobedient to God, who had commanded them to not eat from said tree. Cain was jealous of Abel because Abel's offering to God was pleasing, whereas Cain's was not. Out of jealousy, Cain slew his brother.

The offerings of Cain and Abel were different. Cain showed a proud, unbelieving heart. Therefore he and his offering were rejected. Abel came as a sinner, and according to God's appointment, by his sacrifice expressing humility, sincerity, and believing obedience.*

Now, in regards to the angels sleeping with women on earth in Noah's day, I think that we have misinterpreted the verse all along, and truly, it is only this thread that has caused me to look at it closely. It says, "The sons of God." Well, who are the sons of God? Aren't the sons of God those that choose and follow Him? Has God ever referred to His angels as His 'sons'? No. Jesus is His only begotten Son and we are called children of God when we accept Christ. So, I believe that this verse is saying that those who were to serve Him mixed with Cain and his 'tribe', women they considered 'fair' and 'beautiful'. But Cain was an outcast, deemed so by God, so the act of them choosing to marry these women angered God.

Verses 1-2 For the glory of God’s justice, and for warning to a wicked world, before the history of the ruin of the old world, we have a full account of its degeneracy, its apostasy from God and rebellion against him. The destroying of it was an act, not of an absolute sovereignty, but of necessary justice, for the maintaining of the honour of God’s government. Now here we have an account of two things which occasioned the wickedness of the old world:-1. The increase of mankind: Men began to multiply upon the face of the earth. This was the effect of the blessing ch. 1:28 ), and yet man’s corruption so abused and perverted this blessing that it was turned into a curse. Thus sin takes occasion by the mercies of God to be the more exceedingly sinful. Prov. 29:16 , When the wicked are multiplied, transgression increaseth. The more sinners the more sin; and the multitude of offenders emboldens men. Infectious diseases are most destructive in populous cities; and sin is a spreading leprosy. Thus in the New-Testament church, when the number of the disciples was multiplied, there arose a murmuring (Acts. 6:1 ), and we read of a nation that was multiplied, not to the increase of their joy, Isa. 9:3 . Numerous families need to be well-governed, lest they become wicked families. Mixed marriages (v. 2): The sons of God (that is, the professors of religion, who were called by the name of the Lord, and called upon that name), married the daughters of men, that is, those that were profane, and strangers to God and godliness. The posterity of Seth did not keep by themselves, as they ought to have done, both for the preservation of their own purity and in detestation of the apostasy. They intermingled themselves with the excommunicated race of Cain: They took them wives of all that they chose. But what was amiss in these marriages? (1.) They chose only by the eye: They saw that they were fair, which was all they looked at. (2.) They followed the choice which their own corrupt affections made: they took all that they chose, without advice and consideration. But, (3.) That which proved of such bad consequence to them was that they married strange wives, were unequally yoked with unbelievers, 2 Co. 6:14 . This was forbidden to Israel, Deu. 7:3, Deu. 7:4 . It was the unhappy occasion of Solomon’s apostasy (1 Ki. 11:1-4 ), and was of bad consequence to the Jews after their return out of Babylon, Ezra. 9:1, Ezra. 9:2 . Note, Professors of religion, in marrying both themselves and their children, should make conscience of keeping within the bounds of profession. The bad will sooner debauch the good than the good reform the bad. Those that profess themselves the children of God must not marry without his consent, which they have not if they join in affinity with his enemies.**

*Genesis 4 Commentary - Matthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible (Concise)
**Genesis 6 Commentary - Matthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible (Complete)

 

[p_rehbein]

Exercise in Futility:
1. An action that achieves no end or goal.

2. An action to achieve a goal that is unachievable.

3. An action that achieves an end or goal that is in itself pointless

AN EXERCISE IN FUTILITY:

a totally pointless endeavor

 

[mystdancer50]

It wasn't pointless to me, though. It helped me look at that verse more closely and understand it fully, rather than taking for granted what I had been taught regarding Noah, the flood, and angels. :-D

 

[shrimp]

It wasn't pointless to me, though. It helped me look at that verse more closely and understand it fully, rather than taking for granted what I had been taught regarding Noah, the flood, and angels. :-D

Tue that! I think I learn more about God and His word when Atheists try to come up with "solid" accusations than I do when I don't engage people who think and believe differently from me. I like a challenge, although I'm still working on my approach and presentation.

 

[mystdancer50]

Tue that! I think I learn more about God and His word when Atheists try to come up with "solid" accusations than I do when I don't engage people who think and believe differently from me. I like a challenge, although I'm still working on my approach and presentation.

Me too! Sometimes, I get overly passionate. Then, the message is lost. I am working on my approach and presentation as well. Doing a little better lately.

 

[PlainWord]

santan did not have sex with Eve stop adding to God words

You have not nor canot prove anythin


Does satan have childre today ?

I am not adding to the WORDS!!!!!! I am proposing a theory!!!! Have you ever proposed a Biblical theory???

I am not stating that this is fact. All I've done is point out some very interesting things back in Post 99 that seem to suggest a lot more than a piece of fruit was involved.

Nobody has given me a reasonable explanation for the 11 points I made that support the Apple version over the version I proposed. I'm waiting!!!

As for Satan having children today. IDK. The False Prophet is human, He is Pope Francis. But is he the child of Satan? You tell me. The False Messiah will also be human. Is he the child of Satan??? IDK but clearly both are doing Satan's work and I think they are well aware of it.

 

[PlainWord]

Sin entered the world through Adam and Eve deciding to listen to satan and take the fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, which was disobedient to God, who had commanded them to not eat from said tree. Cain was jealous of Abel because Abel's offering to God was pleasing, whereas Cain's was not. Out of jealousy, Cain slew his brother.

Have you ever seen or heard of a literal tree that gives you knowledge of anything if you eat it? It must be a special tree, wouldn't you say??? Same with the Tree of Life, have you ever heard of a tree that gives you eternal life? So clearly, these are not literal trees, they are special trees. Therefore the fruit of these trees are not literal fruit but "special" fruit. Are we all in agreement over this?

Gen 1:11: Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth"; and it was so.

Eve ate from a fruit tree that was evil. Cain was brought forth and was evil. Eve had an "encounter" with Satan BEFORE we are told that Adam "knew" her. I find it very interesting that it was her first born, Cain, who was evil and not her second born, Abel. Why was that? Could it not have been the other way around if Adam was father of both?

We have established that neither tree is literal therefore the fruit from these trees also cannot be literal so what do they represent?

We know from Judges 9:7-16 that trees can represent men or leaders.

Deut 16:21 equates "trees" as idols:

"You shall not plant for yourself any tree, as a wooden image, near the altar which you build for yourself to the Lord your God.

Then in Kings 17:10 we find that Idol worship often occurs under trees:

They set up for themselves sacred pillars and wooden images on every high hill and under every green tree.

We learn that evil King Ahez, would offer sacrifices and burn incense under trees in 2 Chron 2:4:

4 And he sacrificed and burned incense on the high places, on the hills, and under every green tree.

The Psalmist uses trees to describe wickedness in Psa 37:35:

I have seen the wicked in great power, And spreading himself like a native green tree.

Then he uses trees to describe good in Psa 52:8:

But I am like a green olive tree in the house of God; I trust in the mercy of God forever and ever.

and 92:12:

The righteous shall flourish like a palm tree, He shall grow like a cedar in Lebanon.

Then we have Solomon actually using the "tree of life" as an analogy for good in Prov 11:30:

The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life, And he who wins souls is wise.

Again, "trees" have been used to symbolize people, Isa 56:3:

Do not let the son of the foreigner Who has joined himself to the Lord Speak, saying, "The Lord has utterly separated me from His people"; Nor let the eunuch say, "Here I am, a dry tree."

Jer 2:20 makes a clear reference to sin, harlotry and trees:

"For of old I have broken your yoke and burst your bonds; And you said, 'I will not transgress,' When on every high hill and under every green tree You lay down, playing the harlot.

There are many more examples but the above makes a strong case that "trees" often represent "people" throughout the Bible.

The two trees in the Garden of Eden are symbolic of something representing Good and Evil. But more than that, these trees appear to be eternal, especially the Tree of Life as it is seen in heaven in Rev 21-22.

To me it is very uncertain that the sin of disobedience was a simple eating of a literal piece of fruit. Note also from the text that Adam and Eve were NOT told that they couldn't eat from the Tree of Life until AFTER they sinned. If the Tree of Life was Jesus or represented Jesus, it makes total sense that Adam and Eve would be allowed to eat or worship the Tree of Life. If the Tree of Life is or represents Christ, then it is clear who or what is represented by the Tree of Knowledge of the Good and Evil.

Again, I am open to the thought that Adam and Eve worshiped Satan in the Garden as Satan is known for tempting people to worship him (Temptation of Christ, the future temptation of Antichrist), however, this does not explain why Cain was evil and Abel wasn't or why Cain is not found in Adam's genealogy. It also doesn't explain the other 11 points I made back in Post #99. What is clear to me is, this wasn't over simple disobedience of eating a common piece of fruit. Anyone who still thinks that after all this debate may want to take stock of their fruit.

 

[RuthHannah]

Have you ever seen or heard of a literal tree that gives you knowledge of anything if you eat it? It must be a special tree, wouldn't you say??? Same with the Tree of Life, have you ever heard of a tree that gives you eternal life? So clearly, these are not literal trees, they are special trees. Therefore the fruit of these trees are not literal fruit but "special" fruit. Are we all in agreement over this?

Gen 1:11: Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth"; and it was so.

Eve ate from a fruit tree that was evil. Cain was brought forth and was evil. Eve had an "encounter" with Satan BEFORE we are told that Adam "knew" her. I find it very interesting that it was her first born, Cain, who was evil and not her second born, Abel. Why was that? Could it not have been the other way around if Adam was father of both?

We have established that neither tree is literal therefore the fruit from these trees also cannot be literal so what do they represent?

We know from Judges 9:7-16 that trees can represent men or leaders.

Deut 16:21 equates "trees" as idols:

"You shall not plant for yourself any tree, as a wooden image, near the altar which you build for yourself to the Lord your God.

Then in Kings 17:10 we find that Idol worship often occurs under trees:

They set up for themselves sacred pillars and wooden images on every high hill and under every green tree.

We learn that evil King Ahez, would offer sacrifices and burn incense under trees in 2 Chron 2:4:

4 And he sacrificed and burned incense on the high places, on the hills, and under every green tree.

The Psalmist uses trees to describe wickedness in Psa 37:35:

I have seen the wicked in great power, And spreading himself like a native green tree.

Then he uses trees to describe good in Psa 52:8:

But I am like a green olive tree in the house of God; I trust in the mercy of God forever and ever.

and 92:12:

The righteous shall flourish like a palm tree, He shall grow like a cedar in Lebanon.

Then we have Solomon actually using the "tree of life" as an analogy for good in Prov 11:30:

The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life, And he who wins souls is wise.

Again, "trees" have been used to symbolize people, Isa 56:3:

Do not let the son of the foreigner Who has joined himself to the Lord Speak, saying, "The Lord has utterly separated me from His people"; Nor let the eunuch say, "Here I am, a dry tree."

Jer 2:20 makes a clear reference to sin, harlotry and trees:

"For of old I have broken your yoke and burst your bonds; And you said, 'I will not transgress,' When on every high hill and under every green tree You lay down, playing the harlot.

There are many more examples but the above makes a strong case that "trees" often represent "people" throughout the Bible.

The two trees in the Garden of Eden are symbolic of something representing Good and Evil. But more than that, these trees appear to be eternal, especially the Tree of Life as it is seen in heaven in Rev 21-22.

To me it is very uncertain that the sin of disobedience was a simple eating of a literal piece of fruit. Note also from the text that Adam and Eve were NOT told that they couldn't eat from the Tree of Life until AFTER they sinned. If the Tree of Life was Jesus or represented Jesus, it makes total sense that Adam and Eve would be allowed to eat or worship the Tree of Life. If the Tree of Life is or represents Christ, then it is clear who or what is represented by the Tree of Knowledge of the Good and Evil.

Again, I am open to the thought that Adam and Eve worshiped Satan in the Garden as Satan is known for tempting people to worship him (Temptation of Christ, the future temptation of Antichrist), however, this does not explain why Cain was evil and Abel wasn't or why Cain is not found in Adam's genealogy. It also doesn't explain the other 11 points I made back in Post #99. What is clear to me is, this wasn't over simple disobedience of eating a common piece of fruit. Anyone who still thinks that after all this debate may want to take stock of their fruit.

it is persons like you that give christians a bad name

If the tree of life is Jesus why would God put angels to guard Him ? Can he not protect Himself ?

Adam and Eve never ate of the tree of life before they sin or else when they ate of the evil tree they would have not die at all because the tree of is for eternal life .

God was talking to Jesus so therefore lets see if they had eaten out of the tre of life after they sin the tree of life would allow them to live forever in a sinful state

Ask yourself this the tre of life would not reverse the effect of that sinful nature get the picture there fore if the were eating from the tree before the samer should apply living forever in sin

death upon man is spiritual death not physical

Is there any good in the devil based on what you are saying

why is not the rest of Adam childre mentioned in the geneolgy also ?

 

[RuthHannah]

To plain word

did they eat of every tree in the garden of Eden except the evil tree ?


please shew a verse note i said every tree

 

[PlainWord]

Now, in regards to the angels sleeping with women on earth in Noah's day, I think that we have misinterpreted the verse all along, and truly, it is only this thread that has caused me to look at it closely. It says, "The sons of God." Well, who are the sons of God? Aren't the sons of God those that choose and follow Him? Has God ever referred to His angels as His 'sons'?

Ah ha, I knew someone was going to make this argument. Let me show you why this is wrong. The below is from Gen 6:

1 Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them,

2 that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose.

3 And the Lord said, "My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years."

4 There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.

5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6 And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart.

7 So the Lord said, "I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them."

Notice clearly in verse 1 is says "when MEN began to multiple on earth and daughters were born to them?" Here the word, "MEN" is used, NOT "SONS OF GOD" which is used in verse 2. Human men were already multiplying. This is obvious from verse 1. Therefore if verse 2 referred to human men, the point would be redundant.

It wasn't until there were apparently lots of daughters that the Sons of God found the daughters beautiful. Normal men were already having children with them that's how there came to be more daughters. See what I mean???

 

[PlainWord]

it is persons like you that give christians a bad name

Pot calling the kettle black.

Adam and Eve never ate of the tree of life before they sin or else when they ate of the evil tree they would have not die at all because the tree of is for eternal life .

This is a point I already made.

If the tree of life is Jesus why would God put angels to guard Him ? Can he not protect Himself ?

24 So He drove out the man; and He placed cherubim at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

It wasn't about protecting Jesus, it was about preventing them back in the Garden where Jesus was, the way to Jesus, not Jesus himself.

Those that don't understand Biblical symbolism may as well throw in the towel. If you read everything literally, you will misunderstand about a third of the Bible.

Is there any good in the devil based on what you are saying

There is no good in the devil correct!!

why is not the rest of Adam childre mentioned in the geneolgy also ?

Genealogy is normally given starting with the oldest son unless otherwise told. Birth right is passed to the oldest son first. Cain was older than Seth, yet Adam's genealogy started with Seth. Nothing is said that Cain gave up his birth right, just that he was banished. Yet, Cain has his own genealogy separate from Adam this is very revealing as it shows Cain's line is separate from Adam's line.

 

[PlainWord]

To plain word

did they eat of every tree in the garden of Eden except the evil tree ?


please shew a verse note i said every tree

16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, "Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat;

17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."

It doesn't say if they actually ate of every tree, just that they were allowed to eat from every tree except the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.

What's your point??

Also, they ate of the tree of evil and were supposed to die that day, but did they die that day???

I tell you they died spiritually so here is an example that not all things are to be taken literally.