Begotten

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B

BananaPie

Guest
#61
You appeal to unknown bible commentators and scholars,...
The Brother is disagreeing with the scholar he mentions by name in the essay.
 
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iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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#62
It was temptation and Yeshua had not eaten anything....was in a weak state, and He answers all questionings with scripture.

Our pattern.

Satan knew who He was.
if that was so all one would need do to conger up the devil is to go without eating for 40 days,,shhh,,, don't tell the satanist!
 
Nov 18, 2013
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#63
So, you're suggesting that Paul got it wrong?
No old chap. I'm suggesting that Paul got it right. You just can't understand him as you only perceive Paul through the blinkers of the man made Nicene Creed, which is your true bible. Nicea fell to the Turks in 1077, and apart from being temporarily rescued by the Crusaders, has been under the control of Islam ever since. Is God trying to give people a message?
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#65
Of course, the Son pre-existed as the Word. Of course, "he" was around at the beginning. But "he" was not in the nature of a "son" in the beginning, but in the nature of God.

I repeat, the notion of a "heavenly" son is absurd. It is a pagan concept deriving from Babylon.

Were the angels sons of God in the heavens before Jesus came ?

Is so why were they not called only begotten Son ?
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#66
No old chap. I'm suggesting that Paul got it right. You just can't understand him as you only perceive Paul through the blinkers of the man made Nicene Creed, which is your true bible. Nicea fell to the Turks in 1077, and apart from being temporarily rescued by the Crusaders, has been under the control of Islam ever since. Is God trying to give people a message?
Perhaps then you can explain this text to me and show me how I have misunderstood it.

32“And we preach to you the good news of the promise made to the fathers, 33that God has fulfilled this promise to our children in that He raised up Jesus, as it is also written in the second Psalm, ‘YOU ARE MY SON; TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN YOU.’ 34“As for the fact that He raised Him up from the dead, no longer to return to decay, He has spoken in this way: ‘I WILL GIVE YOU THE HOLY and SURE blessings OF DAVID.’ 35“Therefore He also says in another Psalm, ‘YOU WILL NOT ALLOW YOUR HOLY ONE TO UNDERGO DECAY.’ 36“For David, after he had served the purpose of God in his own generation, fell asleep, and was laid among his fathers and underwent decay; 37but He whom God raised did not undergo decay. 38“Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through Him forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you, 39and through Him everyone who believes is freed from all things, from which you could not be freed through the Law of Moses. 40“Therefore take heed, so that the thing spoken of in the Prophets may not come upon you:
 
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iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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#67
im curious how you will see this,,,in matt.4;3 and matt. 4;6,,,the devil ask Jesus a direct question,,,,"if thou be the son of god",,,,now contemplate it in job the devil speaks to god,he was punished in the garden by god,,,,,,,why all of the sudden does he say to Jesus "if thou be the son of god",,as if he does not recognize him?,,,,,
no,he ask "yea,hath god said,ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?",,,,and again "doth job fear god for nought?,hast not thou made an hedge about him,and about his house,and about all he hath on every side?",,,,and then "if thou be the son of god",,,,,,,,you see in every instance he does not know and must ask first,,he does not know his own sentence,,,,,,
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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#68
if that was so all one would need do to conger up the devil is to go without eating for 40 days,,shhh,,, don't tell the satanist!
Don't put words in my post. Never said that.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
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#69
Were the angels sons of God in the heavens before Jesus came ?

Is so why were they not called only begotten Son ?
Only one has been begotten of God Daniel.

He is the imrah or the Word of the Lord in the OT. Memrah.

And the hebrews knew Him as such.
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#70
no,he ask "yea,hath god said,ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?",,,,and again "doth job fear god for nought?,hast not thou made an hedge about him,and about his house,and about all he hath on every side?",,,,and then "if thou be the son of god",,,,,,,,you see in every instance he does not know and must ask first,,he does not know his own sentence,,,,,,

Do you think the devil know more bile than the children of God ? Why or Why Not
Matthew 8:29
And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#72
Only one has been begotten of God Daniel.

He is the imrah or the Word of the Lord in the OT. Memrah.

And the hebrews knew Him as such.

Proverbs 30

King James Version (KJV)


4 Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind inhis fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?

 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,144
613
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Alabama
#73
Were the angels sons of God in the heavens before Jesus came ?

Is so why were they not called only begotten Son ?
"Sons of God" is a term that is exclusively applied to man, never to angels.
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
8,015
1,604
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#74



Do you think the devil know more bile than the children of God ? Why or Why Not
Matthew 8:29
And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?
yes legion knew exactly who he was after the temptation,,,,
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#75
Sons of God is a term that is exclusively applied to man, never to angels.
hmmm my bible does not tell me that it tell me angels are also called sons of God

Job 1:6
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.


Job 38:1-7

King James Version (KJV)

38 Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
2 Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?
3 Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
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#76
Originally Posted by stonesoffire
It was temptation and Yeshua had not eaten anything....was in a weak state, and He answers all questionings with scripture.

Our pattern.

Satan knew who He was.
if that was so all one would need do to conger up the devil is to go without eating for 40 days,,shhh,,, don't tell the satanist!
Don't put words in my post. Forgetful? or need glasses?
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,144
613
113
70
Alabama
#77


hmmm my bible does not tell me that it tell me angels are also called sons of God

Job 1:6
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.


Job 38:1-7

King James Version (KJV)

38 Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
2 Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?
3 Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

How do you come to the conclusion that this is talking about angels when the text does not tell us this?
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#78
How do you come to the conclusion that this is talking about angels when the text does not tell us this?

Were men around to see when God created the earth ?

Who are the morning stars ?

Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding
When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?


 
Oct 14, 2013
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#79
yes legion knew exactly who he was after the temptation,,,,

Why did Herod want to kill Jesus ?
Why did God warn the wise men ?
What do you wunderstan by revelation 12 the woman and the man child,
 
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Oct 14, 2013
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#80
yes legion knew exactly who he was after the temptation,,,,
[h=3]Matthew 2:13[/h]King James Version (KJV)

13 And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Josephin a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.


What spirit was working in herod to give the order to kill all the babies ?