So Then What?

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MissCris

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There's been a handful of threads on another forum about different kinds of abuse or manipulation within relationships. And I think that's a very good thing...there are plenty of people who need to recognize what's going on in their current relationship, or know what to avoid in a future one, or even just find answers for what the heck happened in a past relationship.

But if person is currently married, and they've realized that these things are happening within their marriage, either emotional or verbal abuse, or the manipulation...
Then what? Are they just stuck, because God hates divorce? Can they leave? Can it be fixed?
 
I think it can be fixed. I don't think it's beyond help at all. The problem is, that person who is guilty of doing it needs to be willing to fix it. I started recognizing, after my ex and I separated, how manipulative and verbally abusive she was/had been when we were married. She continued to try manipulation and verbal abuse even after we split, but the difference I was I learned to recognize it. Being able to recognize when your spouse is doing it is probably the biggest thing. The more you fall victim to it, the more it becomes normal. Once it is recognized though, and I would have done it had my wife and I stayed together, is to combat it by not falling victim to it. With manipulation, if your spouse is asking you to do something in a way to use you, don't do it, and straight up tell them no. They'll get angry and you'll have an argument, but stick to your guns no matter how hard it is, you'll be a stronger person the more it happens, and they'll start getting the idea that they can't treat you that way. In the case of verbal abuse, don't tear your spouse down, but stand up for yourself. Bring up all the good things you've done.

Now, had my ex and I stayed together and I practiced what I just suggested, it could really go one of two ways. Either she could have been more attracted to that stronger side, and we could have gotten closer, or she could have built up bitterness resented me and we would have ended up divorced anyway. I think the reaction would be different in any case, but never let yourself get torn down by your spouse, because that is a horrible horrible thing, and it's extremely painful. But, yeah, just my two cents of input :)
 
Reality is, abusers have a very, very low rate of change. The primary issue is they deny responsibility. If a person always places blame on others, they never have to change, because its never their fault.
 
Jesus loves you so much that the last thing He would want you to do is suffer abusive, or live a life in bondage. Pray for answers to this also, and He will answer you. He is always with you. If you need to talk, feel free to contact me. I am always willing to help someone in a situation that I myself had to leave many years ago. God Bless You.
 
Leave. Leave now.

That doesn't mean that you are definitely divorcing, but you need to get somewhere safe. Then you need to get some really good counseling from a licensed therapist. I cannot stress to you enough that a pastor (especially of a conservative denomination) is not likely to be your best help right now. The numbers for domestic abuse are higher in conservative denominations that with nonreligious people because of the over-emphasis of submission. And I know too many women who have reached out to their pastoral staff for help just to have (in her words) "Jesus shoved down my throat." In dangerous situations, being told to just trust God and submit is the worst advice you can get. I really encourage you to get out as soon as possible.

The sad truth is that if you don't have a bruise, then the abuse is probably not going to be believed to be as bad as it is, if it is even believed at all. I've had physical abuse survivors tell me that their bodies healed a lot faster than their psyche. Since you have been manipulated for so long, your perspective is probably so skewed that you can't even see how bad the situation is until you extract yourself from it. PTSD is also quite common in mental/emotional/verbal/sexual abuse cases. That means that your brain is not able to fully process what you have endured until it recognizes that you are in a safe place. That's when the flashbacks or that dawning of realization starts to hit you. You need normalcy to contrast with the abuse that you have faced.

I wish I would have been strong enough to have left the monster that I married. My parents and I talked a lot about it this weekend; and I had to ask my mom to stop describing the individual abusive acts that she witnessed (and I can't let myself remember) because they are too ugly, too painful still to see. But when X left me 4.5 years ago, I would not have even described myself as being abused.

No, he did not hit me. The damage was far more precise, almost tactical. The more I heal, the more I realize what a terrible place we we were in. And the more I realize the hell we put my son through. Please, please don't stay another day. You can always go back if you indeed made a mistake or if you both get help. But it's likely to only get worse if you stay.

Yes, God hates divorce. But don't you think you are more precious to Him than that? Your leaving is to save your health, your sanity, and maybe even your life; it's not breaking the marriage covenant. Your spouse already abandoned his vow to love, honor, and cherish you. God hates divorce, but that is only the conclusion of a journey. It's the result of an unhealthy marriage, which is caused by one or both members not walking in His truth by His grace.

You are God's daughter. And nobody gets to treat you like crap. Find a friend, a relative, or a woman's shelter. Or somehow get to Dallas, and you can stay with me (not kidding; I've done this before). You are not really stuck, even though your abuser has built an invisible cage around you. The door is unlocked, if you choose to go through it. You are free to leave and get help. I pray the situation can be fixed, but realize that "fixed" might not be what you think it should be.
 
Cristen,

I didn't want to get into it on the other thread, but i feel like i should now. So i'll get right to it. I know where your coming from, I was married to someone for a lot of years who did this same thing that you described your husband doing to you.

Nothing was ever his fault, it was always either mine, or some how i made him do it. So even then it wasn't really his fault.
I wasn't pretty enough, i wasn't thin enough, I wasn't smart, my personality was boring, the way i laughed and talked, ate, sat, slept, you name it and he tore it apart. I could do nothing right, and to him nothing about me was acceptable. And ''if not for him who know's where i would be'' It was like this all day everyday, as soon as he would walk in the door it wouldn't stop until i went to bed, and even then he would keep me up sometimes to argue for hours on end.

He took all my money, my car, anything i had he made sure he had control over it. When he was mad He would throw things at me, break my stuff, get in my face. Sometimes he would push me, or grab my arm and pull on it.

I did leave several times and stay with my family, but my dad would always send me right back after a day or so. Eventually he moved me away from my family and friends.
I felt like i was trapped, and i was. There was no foreseeable way out.
So i stayed and tried to make things work, i talked him into going to counseling, and we went for awhile, but the only thing he would talk about was me and my problems. Obviously that never got anywhere. I talked to him, i got other people to talk to him, other people to pray for him... It never even did a thing. To be honest, it just made him worse. I would pray and get so mad at God because i didn't understand why he wasn't helping me.

One morning things got really out of hand and I ended up at the magistrates office filing for a restraining order for domestic violence.

I remember sitting there thinking, This is my life. This was not supposed to happen. He was supposed to be the one that made things better. I had wanted him to rescue me from my life before.

Anyway, When the police came and arrested him and actually got him out of the house, i went and sold almost everything he and i owned and i left. I started from square one.

It's been 5 years though and i still can't get away from him. I may be physically away from him, but mentally sometimes i'm still right back in that house. I can still hear it when i look in the mirror when i drop something, when i laugh or talk or say something i know he wouldn't like.

I'm not telling you this to discourage you. I tell you this because your already living it and this is the reality of the situation. I wish i could tell you once you leave it will all be butterflies and rainbows.

If you do leave, it's going to be hard and your going to have to work hard to get your life back. It's going to be like starting at square one. However that is the best decision i have ever made. I have a car, money, a life, a job, i can see my family and i can talk to my friends anytime i want.

I'm not going to tell you either way what you should do. I know it's tough and the choice to make is going to be tough.

Can it be fixed? Maybe it can be, Maybe it can't. I do know God can do anything.

Should you stay and try to fix it? If that is what you feel called to do, then do it.
 
Holly,

Thank you for sharing that. It means a lot, and I know it's scary and difficult to do. But I think it's really important for women to realize that abuse doesn't always just mean getting hit or knocked around- words hurt, crush the spirit, control, belittle, and terrify.

That sounds so very similar to where I'm at. Oh, my husband tries to make most of the insults sound like jokes- which is what got me to stay so long. At first, I really and truly believed he was just joking around, although in a fairly mean way. Because I grew up around a family who communicated mainly through one-liners and picking on each other (also not very nice, but nothing like how my husband does it), I was "used to it", basically.

But then it just got worse- before I knew it, everything I did was wrong, subject to ridicule, not the way he would do it. He gives me these things he needs me to do (everything), and if I don't get them done, then I'm lazy. If I do get them done, I did them wrong. Doesn't matter that they get done, I'm wrong no matter what.

All through my day, while he's gone at work, I think of ways to avoid a fight or avoid him giving me that exasperated "you're so stupid or annoying" sigh when he gets home. I try to make sure everything is cleaned up from the kids playing, try to make sure we have whatever he wants for dinner, that the kids are quiet when he's here...I spend so much of my time apologizing and never being forgiven.

And then he'll throw me off balance completely; something that would normally make him angry, he'll ignore or laugh with me about...so I feel like maybe things will be alright. But the next time it happens, he'll shut down completely and give me the silent treatment for hours, stomping around the house or going to lay on the bed like he's just totally defeated. I never know how he's going to react, and I live in fear of it.

He's not been physically violent with me when he's angry, aside from throwing things in my vicinity a few times- but when he's just "playing", he'll do something that hurts me, and then tell me that wouldn't have happened if I "hadn't moved" or "hadn't turned at the wrong time" or whatever.

I don't know if he'd ever escalate to worse than that...but isn't that bad enough?
Why am I still here?
 
Criss, I'm sorry this has happened to you. It sounds like you're walking on eggshells all the time.

I hope you have a place to go to get out of this situation.

I'll be praying for you.
 
MissCris said:
There's been a handful of threads on another forum about different kinds of abuse or manipulation within relationships. And I think that's a very good thing...there are plenty of people who need to recognize what's going on in their current relationship, or know what to avoid in a future one, or even just find answers for what the heck happened in a past relationship.

But if person is currently married, and they've realized that these things are happening within their marriage, either emotional or verbal abuse, or the manipulation...
Then what? Are they just stuck, because God hates divorce? Can they leave? Can it be fixed?
Click to expand...

Any thing can be fixed with God in the lead. There is much divorce today and mis leading to not get divorced and or get divorced
Proverbs 21:9 It is better to live in the corner of an attic than with a crabby woman in a lovely home
Proverbs 25:24 It is better to live in a corner of an attic than in a beautiful home with a cranky, quarrelsome woman.

I think it can go either way as a man, not just a woman. No matter what, we are to live in peace from God though.
And it all depends on what is actually happening, is their physical abuse, or is it leading that way?
There is a time for everything, a time to stay, a time to run, a time for each and all things, read Ecclesiastes, and understand to hear from God our creator. Not the Tyrant presented as by so many.
God loves all and is a Merciful God, but that doe not mean we are to be doormats either.
Praying God shows you what to say and do in this matter as in Matthew
[h=3]Matthew 10:16-20[/h]Living Bible (TLB)

[SUP]16 [/SUP]“I am sending you out as sheep among wolves. Be as wary as serpents and harmless as doves. [SUP]17 [/SUP]But beware! For you will be arrested and tried, and whipped in the synagogues. [SUP]18 [/SUP]Yes, and you must stand trial before governors and kings for my sake. This will give you the opportunity to tell them about me, yes, to witness to the world.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]“When you are arrested, don’t worry about what to say at your trial, for you will be given the right words at the right time. [SUP]20 [/SUP]For it won’t be you doing the talking—it will be the Spirit of your heavenly Father speaking through you!

So presently update that saying to you as you go in this world be ready in season and out of season to give an account for your joy in the Father, Son and Holy Ghost in spite of any and all adversities you are going through
A mighty oak tree was once a small nut that stood it's ground.



 
If you have ever been in an abusive situation, one of the reasons that you stay is because you don't want to divorce or otherwise end the relationship. The abuser know that and is preying upon it.

Everyone who is posting about God hating divorce, divorce being wrong, or "just stay and trust God" needs to stop. It is the opposite of helpful.

MissCris is already well-versed in scripture. Her default is to stay. She (and every other abused man or woman) needs to know that it's okay to get out and get help. If she chooses to pursue divorce, that is her right and her decision. By the way, God says he hates divorce, but He omitted it from the "thou shalt not"s for a reason.

Thank you, NodMyHead for sharing your story and telling even the parts that are difficult to be heard. I'm so sorry that you are on this journey, too.
 
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MissCris said:
Holly,

Thank you for sharing that. It means a lot, and I know it's scary and difficult to do. But I think it's really important for women to realize that abuse doesn't always just mean getting hit or knocked around- words hurt, crush the spirit, control, belittle, and terrify.

That sounds so very similar to where I'm at. Oh, my husband tries to make most of the insults sound like jokes- which is what got me to stay so long. At first, I really and truly believed he was just joking around, although in a fairly mean way. Because I grew up around a family who communicated mainly through one-liners and picking on each other (also not very nice, but nothing like how my husband does it), I was "used to it", basically.

But then it just got worse- before I knew it, everything I did was wrong, subject to ridicule, not the way he would do it. He gives me these things he needs me to do (everything), and if I don't get them done, then I'm lazy. If I do get them done, I did them wrong. Doesn't matter that they get done, I'm wrong no matter what.

All through my day, while he's gone at work, I think of ways to avoid a fight or avoid him giving me that exasperated "you're so stupid or annoying" sigh when he gets home. I try to make sure everything is cleaned up from the kids playing, try to make sure we have whatever he wants for dinner, that the kids are quiet when he's here...I spend so much of my time apologizing and never being forgiven.

And then he'll throw me off balance completely; something that would normally make him angry, he'll ignore or laugh with me about...so I feel like maybe things will be alright. But the next time it happens, he'll shut down completely and give me the silent treatment for hours, stomping around the house or going to lay on the bed like he's just totally defeated. I never know how he's going to react, and I live in fear of it.

He's not been physically violent with me when he's angry, aside from throwing things in my vicinity a few times- but when he's just "playing", he'll do something that hurts me, and then tell me that wouldn't have happened if I "hadn't moved" or "hadn't turned at the wrong time" or whatever.

I don't know if he'd ever escalate to worse than that...but isn't that bad enough?
Why am I still here?
Click to expand...

You are there still, because of what you have been taught to value as in the Family that has been started and want peace in it?
You have not gotten it and have by trying allowed the behavior of ridicule, and in allowing it, it gets worse automatically in the flesh of us all this is how flesh is lead that way.
Okay I personally do not know of two people that think exactly alike, nor do I know of anyone that does not have battles as you have described, whether it is past, present or future, you are not alone in this.
I call it the Battle for control in all Marriages, there is a battle for this.
Some just succumb to it and do as you have tried to be pleasing as you have said.

For him to be the way he is being I can say there is a battle that is going on in his head, that you know nothing of, and he is taking that out on you.
Is he a claiming believer in Christ?
If he is, is he having a battle of the flesh that he does not like that he has not confessed?
I know in my own Marriage I did and was angry a lot, until God caused in me what I felt strong in the need of to be gone.
I learned to confess this struggle to my wife and got free, from the tribulation that was going on in me, always was amazed at her no condemnation attitude, which is what deeply helped set me free in Father, Son and Holy Ghost
Maybe ask God for the right words for him to feel free to confess anything to you without the fear of condemnation from you, and you do the same back, start the communication forsake the fear that has gotten in the way.
Are you ready and please don't go to him as if you think he is hiding something, let God bring it forward through you, for if you believe God then this will be from God through you without condemnation as you have been feeling yourself.
You know, from the Bible discussion forums how easily others take offense to protect themselves, even when no offense is meant by another or even is meant, matters not that a lot of times is flesh fighting flesh and is a battle for control.
God will give you the right words at the right time with such logic that no opponents can reply, but to accept the truth and repent and see that truth to love as God does
Praying for this to be as when it does happen even you yourself will be surprised by this and have been
Praying for you and Husband to see past the pain, and be free to communicate truth to one another, whether bad or good and accept one another as each of you are, and if do I know things will change for the better
Can you hang out long enough for God to do the speaking through you?
 
MissCris said:
Holly,

Thank you for sharing that. It means a lot, and I know it's scary and difficult to do. But I think it's really important for women to realize that abuse doesn't always just mean getting hit or knocked around- words hurt, crush the spirit, control, belittle, and terrify.

That sounds so very similar to where I'm at. Oh, my husband tries to make most of the insults sound like jokes- which is what got me to stay so long. At first, I really and truly believed he was just joking around, although in a fairly mean way. Because I grew up around a family who communicated mainly through one-liners and picking on each other (also not very nice, but nothing like how my husband does it), I was "used to it", basically.

But then it just got worse- before I knew it, everything I did was wrong, subject to ridicule, not the way he would do it. He gives me these things he needs me to do (everything), and if I don't get them done, then I'm lazy. If I do get them done, I did them wrong. Doesn't matter that they get done, I'm wrong no matter what.

All through my day, while he's gone at work, I think of ways to avoid a fight or avoid him giving me that exasperated "you're so stupid or annoying" sigh when he gets home. I try to make sure everything is cleaned up from the kids playing, try to make sure we have whatever he wants for dinner, that the kids are quiet when he's here...I spend so much of my time apologizing and never being forgiven.

And then he'll throw me off balance completely; something that would normally make him angry, he'll ignore or laugh with me about...so I feel like maybe things will be alright. But the next time it happens, he'll shut down completely and give me the silent treatment for hours, stomping around the house or going to lay on the bed like he's just totally defeated. I never know how he's going to react, and I live in fear of it.

He's not been physically violent with me when he's angry, aside from throwing things in my vicinity a few times- but when he's just "playing", he'll do something that hurts me, and then tell me that wouldn't have happened if I "hadn't moved" or "hadn't turned at the wrong time" or whatever.

I don't know if he'd ever escalate to worse than that...but isn't that bad enough?
Why am I still here?
Click to expand...

Cristen,

That's exactly the way it started for me as well. Making jokes. Also the "just playing" around thing too. That is so funny, because he would say the same thing. Well if you woukdn't have moved that way...or if you would or wouldn't have just done this or that!
My family is just like that too, so i didn't even see a problem at first. I was "used to it" as well.

I'm not saying your husband will esculate into violence, but i am saying that things started off exactly like your describing. To the tee. Especially the unpredictable mood swings.

I can get why you stay, you have kids. That's their dad. It's hard to just walk out. There are so many variables to the situation. So many what if's.
It's not just a... You pack your bags and leave. If it were that simple more people would get out of abusive situations.

I'm so sorry this is happening to you. I really am. I truly feel where your at.
 
Homeward the real issue i have with people who think like you is you, in a sense, are continuing the mistreatment of these women by your own advice. The typical person that say a victims place is to stay and take it always assumes that the victim has sat around doing nothing about it. Reality is, by the time a woman begins voicing their concerns or questions publicly they are exasperated by years of trying to make things right. By doing everything they know of to make the situation better. Often times they do this in silence, without any help as they rarely talk about it to anyone during this phase.
I know more of Cristens story than most here. I assure you she has done everything she knows. She has stayed out of the idea that it is the right thing to do. But she is finally realizing that subjecting herself and her children to abuse is wrong and not at all what God intended for marriage. If she chooses to leave i am 100% in support of her doing so as she has been treated poorly for a long time now and no amount of effort has changed it.
Also, very few abusers fight in their heads over their behavior. That's the problem with abusers. They don't battle in their heads over it because they don't see themselves as doing anything wrong. Perhaps you were one of the minority. Or perhaps you weren't really abusive and therefore didn't have the same sort of reasoning as a genuinely abusive person.
The reality is, telling people to stay in an abusive relationship only ends up doing two things. 1) it encourages the abusers behavior by not providing consequence and keeping their victim in their grasp. 2) it leads to the victims spirit being broken at the hands of evil. Both of these things are in direct opposition to what God desires for a person in marriage or any close relationship.
Quite honestly the number of 'Christian' men who abuse their women in any form is appalling. And they do so without conscious. And often feel justified do to the wrong teachings of a mans role in marriage according to the bible. This is fueled more by the relentless persistence that a person needs to stay in marriage through all things. True, divorce should always be a last option. But sometimes it ends up being the only option.
So with that in mind, i say that next time a woman (or man) is suffering abuse at the hands of the person who has promised to love them as Christ loves the church, rather than accusing them of not doing enough and misusing scripture to support this attitude, you not have such an accusing tone. Perhaps looking more into the reality of abusers and victims before chiming in. Maybe learn more about what the person has or hasn't done before adopting an attitude that they have done nothing. Consider not letting the abusers behavior off the hook for their behavior.
Cristen has 'hung out' many years already. She does not need someone questioning her, or downplaying the abuse to make it sound like the poor innocent misunderstood abuser isn't really to blame. She needs men and women of God who aren't afraid to stand up against evil, instead of wrongly using scripture to condone it. By encouraging this evil and encouraging someone to remain a victim. I am behind you, Cristen, if you leave. And i see others here are supporting this decision as well. I know you have stayed and tried to make things work and nothing has changed. So you do what you know needs to be done. For yoruself, your children and your future. Ignore the naysayers that make your abuser out to be the victim.
 
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Ugly said:
Homeward the real issue i have with people who think like you is you, in a sense, are continuing the mistreatment of these women by your own advice. The typical person that say a victims place is to stay and take it always assumes that the victim has sat around doing nothing about it. Reality is, by the time a woman begins voicing their concerns or questions publicly they are exasperated by years of trying to make things right. By doing everything they know of to make the situation better. Often times they do this in silence, without any help as they rarely talk about it to anyone during this phase.
I know more of Cristens story than most here. I assure you she has done everything she knows. She has stayed out of the idea that it is the right thing to do. But she is finally realizing that subjecting herself and her children to abuse is wrong and not at all what God intended for marriage. If she chooses to leave i am 100% in support of her doing so as she has been treated poorly for a long time now and no amount of effort has changed it.
Also, very few abusers fight in their heads over their behavior. That's the problem with abusers. They don't battle in their heads over it because they don't see themselves as doing anything wrong. Perhaps you were one of the minority. Or perhaps you weren't really abusive and therefore didn't have the same sort of reasoning as a genuinely abusive person.
The reality is, telling people to stay in an abusive relationship only ends up doing two things. 1) it encourages the abusers behavior by not providing consequence and keeping their victim in their grasp. 2) it leads to the victims spirit being broken at the hands of evil. Both of these things are in direct opposition to what God desires for a person in marriage or any close relationship.
Quite honestly the number of 'Christian' men who abuse their women in any form is appalling. And they do so without conscious. And often feel justified do to the wrong teachings of a mans role in marriage according to the bible. This is fueled more by the relentless persistence that a person needs to stay in marriage through all things. True, divorce should always be a last option. But sometimes it ends up being the only option.
So with that in mind, i say that next time a woman (or man) is suffering abuse at the hands of the person who has promised to love them as Christ loves the church, rather than accusing them of not doing enough and misusing scripture to support this attitude, you not have such an accusing tone. Perhaps looking more into the reality of abusers and victims before chiming in. Maybe learn more about what the person has or hasn't done before adopting an attitude that they have done nothing. Consider not letting the abusers behavior off the hook for their behavior.
Cristen has 'hung out' many years already. She does not need someone questioning her, or downplaying the abuse to make it sound like the poor innocent misunderstood abuser isn't really to blame. She needs men and women of God who aren't afraid to stand up against evil, instead of wrongly using scripture to condone it. By encouraging this evil and encouraging someone to remain a victim. I am behind you, Cristen, if you leave. And i see others here are supporting this decision as well. I know you have stayed and tried to make things work and nothing has changed. So you do what you know needs to be done. For yoruself, your children and your future. Ignore the naysayers that make your abuser out to be the victim.
Click to expand...

^^What he said!!
 
Ugly said:
Homeward the real issue i have with people who think like you is you, in a sense, are continuing the mistreatment of these women by your own advice. The typical person that say a victims place is to stay and take it always assumes that the victim has sat around doing nothing about it. Reality is, by the time a woman begins voicing their concerns or questions publicly they are exasperated by years of trying to make things right. By doing everything they know of to make the situation better. Often times they do this in silence, without any help as they rarely talk about it to anyone during this phase.
I know more of Cristens story than most here. I assure you she has done everything she knows. She has stayed out of the idea that it is the right thing to do. But she is finally realizing that subjecting herself and her children to abuse is wrong and not at all what God intended for marriage. If she chooses to leave i am 100% in support of her doing so as she has been treated poorly for a long time now and no amount of effort has changed it.
Also, very few abusers fight in their heads over their behavior. That's the problem with abusers. They don't battle in their heads over it because they don't see themselves as doing anything wrong. Perhaps you were one of the minority. Or perhaps you weren't really abusive and therefore didn't have the same sort of reasoning as a genuinely abusive person.
The reality is, telling people to stay in an abusive relationship only ends up doing two things. 1) it encourages the abusers behavior by not providing consequence and keeping their victim in their grasp. 2) it leads to the victims spirit being broken at the hands of evil. Both of these things are in direct opposition to what God desires for a person in marriage or any close relationship.
Quite honestly the number of 'Christian' men who abuse their women in any form is appalling. And they do so without conscious. And often feel justified do to the wrong teachings of a mans role in marriage according to the bible. This is fueled more by the relentless persistence that a person needs to stay in marriage through all things. True, divorce should always be a last option. But sometimes it ends up being the only option.
So with that in mind, i say that next time a woman (or man) is suffering abuse at the hands of the person who has promised to love them as Christ loves the church, rather than accusing them of not doing enough and misusing scripture to support this attitude, you not have such an accusing tone. Perhaps looking more into the reality of abusers and victims before chiming in. Maybe learn more about what the person has or hasn't done before adopting an attitude that they have done nothing. Consider not letting the abusers behavior off the hook for their behavior.
Cristen has 'hung out' many years already. She does not need someone questioning her, or downplaying the abuse to make it sound like the poor innocent misunderstood abuser isn't really to blame. She needs men and women of God who aren't afraid to stand up against evil, instead of wrongly using scripture to condone it. By encouraging this evil and encouraging someone to remain a victim. I am behind you, Cristen, if you leave. And i see others here are supporting this decision as well. I know you have stayed and tried to make things work and nothing has changed. So you do what you know needs to be done. For yoruself, your children and your future. Ignore the naysayers that make your abuser out to be the victim.
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You misunderstood me and did not ever say to stay or to go. I said my peace about it, I am not by any means a legalist, sorry you mistook what I said and meant no offense whatsowever
 
MissCris said:


Oh, my husband tries to make most of the insults sound like jokes- which is what got me to stay so long. At first, I really and truly believed he was just joking around, although in a fairly mean way. Because I grew up around a family who communicated mainly through one-liners and picking on each other (also not very nice, but nothing like how my husband does it), I was "used to it", basically.

But then it just got worse- before I knew it, everything I did was wrong, subject to ridicule, not the way he would do it. He gives me these things he needs me to do (everything), and if I don't get them done, then I'm lazy. If I do get them done, I did them wrong. Doesn't matter that they get done, I'm wrong no matter what.



And then he'll throw me off balance completely; something that would normally make him angry, he'll ignore or laugh with me about...so I feel like maybe things will be alright. But the next time it happens, he'll shut down completely and give me the silent treatment for hours, stomping around the house or going to lay on the bed like he's just totally defeated. I never know how he's going to react, and I live in fear of it.


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NodMyHeadLikeYeah said:
Cristen,

That's exactly the way it started for me as well. Making jokes. Also the "just playing" around thing too. That is so funny, because he would say the same thing. Well if you woukdn't have moved that way...or if you would or wouldn't have just done this or that!
My family is just like that too, so i didn't even see a problem at first. I was "used to it" as well.

I'm not saying your husband will esculate into violence, but i am saying that things started off exactly like your describing. To the tee. Especially the unpredictable mood swings.
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It is so easy to be convinced that you are the one doing something wrong, isn't it? Having your words and actions twisted into things you never said or did. I wonder sometimes whether they ever heard a thing you really said the way you really said it. Your brain and spirit can become so fatigued that you begin to believe/accept it all because you truly care about them. The heart wants what the heart wants, even when the gut knows better.

They are so sweet, charming and funny in the beginning and quickly capture your heart, but the moment you don't do exactly what they want you to, the mood darkens and the venom comes flowing out of their mouths. And you are just supposed to pretend it never happened and forgive, forgive, and forgive again.

God bless you, Holly and Cristen. I really needed to read these things.

God can really shake up our lives, can't He? It hurts, but at this moment I'm giving thanks for it because I know what remains is of Him.

Praying for you, ladies. Father, bring healing to us all, even those who bring this pain about.
 
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GROUNDS FOR SEPARATION
Are there situations that may justify separation or possibly divorce from a marriage mate even if that one has not committed fornication? Yes, but in such a case, a Christian is not free to pursue a third party with a view to remarriage. (Matthew 5:32) The Bible, while making allowances for such separation, stipulates that the one departing should “remain unmarried or else make up again.” (1 Corinthians 7:11) What are some extreme situations that may make a separation seem advisable?
Well, the family may become destitute because of the gross laziness and bad habits of the husband. He may gamble away the family’s income or use it to support an addiction to drugs or alcohol. The Bible states: “If anyone does not provide for . . . members of his household, he has disowned the faith and is worse than a person without faith.” (1 Timothy 5:8) If such a man refuses to change his ways, perhaps even financing his vices by taking money that his wife earns, the wife may choose to protect her welfare and that of her children by obtaining a legal separation.
Such legal action may also be considered if a spouse is extremely violent toward the partner, perhaps repeatedly beating that one to the extent that health and even life are in danger. Additionally, if a spouse constantly tries to force a marriage mate to break God’s commands in some way, the threatened mate may also consider separation, especially if matters reach the point where spiritual life is endangered. The partner at risk may conclude that the only way to “obey God as ruler rather than men” is to obtain a legal separation.—Acts 5:29.
In all cases of extreme spousal abuse, no one should put pressure on the innocent mate either to separate or to stay with the other. While mature friends may offer support and Bible-based counsel, these cannot know all the details of what goes on between a husband and wife. Only God can see that. “We shall all stand before the judgment seat of God.”—Romans 14:10.
 
Basically abuse victims have no rights. And only under extreme physical abuse do you begin to have slight rights. And no one should tell a victim to stop being a victim. Spoken like someone who has never been personally affected.
 
MissCris said: Then what? Are they just stuck, because God hates divorce?
The answers are not easy or one size fits all. God hates divorce. Therefore, divorce should never be a first resort.

You are a woman, so someone will likely quote this:
Wives, in the same way submit yourselves to your own husbands so that, if any of them do not believe the word, they may be won over without words by the behavior of their wives, when they see the purity and reverence of your lives (1 Pe 3:1).


There's no denying it. 1 Pe 3:1 is a very relevant consideration for wives in abusive marriages. However, it's also important to note that the "win without words" approach isn't exclusively about a wife's duty to her husband. Apostle Paul said, "Follow my example, as I follow the example of Christ (1 Co 11:1). What examples did Paul set?


Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings ( 1 Co 9:19-23).


Make it your goal to live a quiet life, minding your own business and working with your hands, just as we instructed you before. Then people who are not Christians will respect the way you live, and you will not need to depend on others (1 The 4:11).


Paul (a man) personally practiced and advised the body of believers (men and women) to practice the "win without words" approach.


Evidently, there are benefits to the "win without words" approach or Peter and Paul would not have suggested it. Unfortunately, the "win without words" approach isn't always successful. Paul himself acknowledged that there's no guarantee that a believing spouse will be able to save their unbelieving mate (1 Co 7:16). So, what if the "win without words" approach isn't successful? Solomon said, There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under the heavens ... a time to be silent and a time to speak (Ec 3:1, 7B).



  • The lips of the righteous know what is acceptable (Pr 10:32A).
  • A person finds joy in giving an apt reply-- and how good is a timely word! (Pr 15:23)
  • A gentle answer deflects anger, but harsh words make tempers flare (Pr 15:1).
  • Kind words are like honey--sweet to the soul and healthy for the body (Pr 16:24).
  • When she speaks, her words are wise, and she gives instructions with kindness (Pr 31:26).
These verses suggest that proper communication is vital for conflict resolution.


Jesus said this about conflict resolution, "If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector (Mat 18:15-17). We normally equate this to seeking Christian counseling.


MissCris said: Can they leave? The Bible does teach about the importance of separating one's self in certain situations.

  • Drive out a scoffer, and strife will go out, and quarreling and abuse will cease (Pr 22:10).
  • Don’t befriend angry people or associate with hot-tempered people, or you will learn to be like them and endanger your soul (Pr 22:24-25).
  • Don’t do as the wicked do, and don’t follow the path of evildoers. Don’t even think about it; don’t go that way. Turn away and keep moving. For evil people can’t sleep until they’ve done their evil deed for the day. They can’t rest until they’ve caused someone to stumble. They eat the food of wickedness and drink the wine of violence! (Pr 4:14-17).



  • Stay away from a fool, for you will not find knowledge on their lips (Pr 14:7).



  • In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers and sisters, to keep away from every believer who is idle and disruptive and does not live according to the teaching you received from us. For you yourselves know how you ought to follow our example. We were not idle when we were with you, nor did we eat anyone’s food without paying for it. On the contrary, we worked night and day, laboring and toiling so that we would not be a burden to any of you. We did this, not because we do not have the right to such help, but in order to offer ourselves as a model for you to imitate. For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: “The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat.” We hear that some among you are idle and disruptive. They are not busy; they are busybodies. Such people we command and urge in the Lord Jesus Christ to settle down and earn the food they eat. And as for you, brothers and sisters, never tire of doing what is good. Take special note of anyone who does not obey our instruction in this letter. Do not associate with them, in order that they may feel ashamed. Yet do not regard them as an enemy, but warn them as you would a fellow believer (2 The 3:6-14).


  • But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God— having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with such people (2 Tim 3:1-5).

MissCris said: Can it be fixed?
As a child, Joyce Meyers was abused by her father. As a result, she learned to be verbally abusive. As an adult, she was verbally abusive and disrespectful to her husband. Long story short, after years of practicing the "won without words" approach to no avail, her husband decided to lovingly and respectfully confront her about her behavior. It worked, and she changed. That's not to say that all spouses are willing to change, but it's possible in some cases.

How Confrontation Totally Changed My Life | thegoodnewsplus.com

Resource:
Blog | Christ-Centered Counseling



May the Lord guide and keep you my dear sister.
 
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