Being raped better than letting women have gun to shoot rapist with?:India and rape

[1still_waters]

India is on the other side now of a very public case of a woman being gang raped. In reply a gun manufacturer has designed a gun for women to defend themselves against a potential rapist.

In India, a new female-friendly handgun has sparked renewed scrutiny over how women can protect themselves from sexual violence.

Made by the state-run Indian Ordnance Factory, the gun is named Nirbheek or "Fearless" in Hindi, a synonym of Nirbhaya, the nickname given to the young woman whose fatal gang rape in December 2012 prompted national outcry. The BBC reports that the .32 caliber, 500-gram revolver comes in a maroon jewelry case and fits in a woman's purse.

While the Nirbheek is billed by its makers as a “valuable contribution to women’s safety," opponents have criticized the product as a dangerous gimmick, adding that the choice of the name shows poor taste.

I'm still trying to get my mind around an apparent attitude that views allowing a woman to be armed, as worse than actually being raped.

Shouldn't women be allowed all options to protect themselves from this violence?

How can someone claim to be pro-women, but then favor a policy that views a woman being raped as less severe than letting a woman carry a gun to actually protect herself from being raped?

Policy seems to be based more on emotions, than what makes sense. If policy is being made mostly on emotions, then it's truly sad that people have MORE emotional outrage over an armed woman, than they do over a woman being raped. Please, someone, tell me, how is that pro-woman?

If a woman can prove she can handle a gun responsibly, and prove she has the mental senses to own, carry, use, then who in their right mind would deny a woman this self-defense option?

Yes I get it, a woman carrying a gun doesn't make one feel all nice. But you know what, a woman being raped should make you feel worse than the prospects of a capable woman owning a gun to protect herself.

So what's it going to be folks?

Are we going to deny capable women a self defense option, simply because it makes us feel bad? Are we going to passively enable their rapist, simply because we have a stigma, and phobia over guns? Or are we going to say no to rapists, and yes to women, and enable capable women another option to protect themselves?



India's Women-Friendly Gun Renews Debate Over Self-Defense Against Rape

 

[Elizabeth619]

I just wanna say... I like my handgun. That is all.

 

[1still_waters]

I just wanna say... I like my handgun. That is all.

Yup and any man who would want to do you harm, should be on the receiving end of that gun.

To think there are people who would rather allow you to be a victim, than allow you to have an option to level the playing field against someone out to harm you.

Honestly, it's a sick, sick, sick, twisted mind that favors giving attackers of women the advantage.

 

[Rachel20]

It's not outrage about a woman handling a gun - Guns are the not the answer or solution to violence.

Violence begets violence.

Is the refusal to allow someone to handle a gun based on emotions? Well, the questin would be how effective is a gun in close combat amongst a group of people?
How effective is it really as a form of self defence. Apparently, a finding suggests a woman in an incident was 12 times more likely to be killed if she was carrying a gun.

Plus we're considering the logistics nightmare of handling gun owners and putting in measures to ensure that they don't fall into wrong hands.

There is no guarantee. As was in the report, the gun is expensive and a quarter of orders for the gun were placed by men. A woman is more likely to be less economically well off than a man, and if both carry a gun, they would go back to the same power equation.

Honestly, I am against guns and the right to bear arms.

However my perspective is influenced by the fact I am a Christian.

 

[PoxEclipse]

Agenda, Agendas, Agendum, Agendums...Agendi?

Anger as ‘handgun for women’ named after Delhi rape victim - Asia - World - The Independent

Binalakshmi Nepram, founder of the Manipur Women Gun Survivors Network, called the gun “an abhorrence to [the Delhi student’s] memory”.

She added: “Our work over the past 10 years has shown that if a woman involved in an incident has a gun on her person she is 12 times more likely to be killed.”

Binalakshmi Nepram | openDemocracy

About Binalakshmi Nepram

Binalakshmi Nepram is a writer-activist working towards a disarmament movement in India. Ms Nepram has published several articles and papers relating to armed violence, small arms proliferation, peace processes, women and peace building. She is author of two books, South Asia's Fractured Frontier: Armed Conflict, Narcotics and Small Arms Proliferation in India's Northeast and Meckley, a historical fiction based on the conflict in Manipur. Her forthcoming book India and the Arms Trade Treaty will be published in April 2008. In 2004, Ms Nepram co-founded the Control Arms Foundation of India (CAFI), India's first civil society organization working on conventional disarmament issues. In 2007, in order to help thousands of women who are affected by gun violence in her home-state of Manipur, she launched the Manipuri Women Gun Survivor Network. Ms Nepram was voted as one of the 50 young promising Indians making a difference to society by "The Week" magazine in January 2008.

The shadow of the gun | openDemocracy

We are calling for a restriction on the number of guns per household to one; currently an Indian citizen can procure three weapons per licence. We are also demanding that the permission of two household members, one of whom should be a woman, must be sought while applying for a gun licence.

Besides this work, we also lobby Indian disarmament officials, parliamentarians and think tanks, and network with other NGOs. We have conducted mass awareness programmes such as an essay contest titled "What guns have done to my country?" We also made three films; "Gun Wars and Drug Deaths (2003)", "Gunning for Control (2006)" and "The Story of the Manipuri Women Gun Survivors (2008)" on gun control issues and organized photo exhibitions related to gun violence.

 

[1still_waters]

It's not outrage about a woman handling a gun - Guns are the not the answer or solution to violence.

Violence begets violence.

Is the refusal to allow someone to handle a gun based on emotions? Well, the questin would be how effective is a gun in close combat amongst a group of people?
How effective is it really as a form of self defence. Apparently, a finding suggests a woman in an incident was 12 times more likely to be killed if she was carrying a gun.

Plus we're considering the logistics nightmare of handling gun owners and putting in measures to ensure that they don't fall into wrong hands.

There is no guarantee. As was in the report, the gun is expensive and a quarter of orders for the gun were placed by men. A woman is more likely to be less economically well off than a man, and if both carry a gun, they would go back to the same power equation.

Honestly, I am against guns and the right to bear arms.

However my perspective is influenced by the fact I am a Christian.

No sometimes violence stops a man with a knife to a woman's throat from raping her. In this case a woman used a gun against a stronger man who had a knife to her throat. A gun leveled the playing field where her attacker was 100 pounds heavier than her.

Sheriff: Dead motel robber was going to rape clerk - wistv.com - Columbia, South Carolina |

COLUMBIA, SC (WIS) - A man is dead after the motel clerk he tried to sexually assault and rob early Monday morning fought back and killed him, deputies said.

Investigators say 43-year-old Vincent Carson of Orangeburg entered Days Inn motel at 133 Plumbers Rd. near I-20 and North Main St. sometime before 6:00 a.m.
As the female clerk went into the breakfast room to prepare breakfast, she found Carson waiting inside. The victim said Carson held a knife to her throat and said "this is a robbery."

Investigators said when her attacker slipped the knife into his pants pocket to begin tying her up with plastic ties, the woman pulled a handgun from under her shirt, turned and fired into the man's chest at point blank range.

The victim was about 100 pounds lighter than Carson and stood at least a foot shorter than him, investigators said.

When deputies got to the scene just after 6:00 a.m., they found the suspect unresponsive on the floor. Richland County Coroner Gary Watts said Carson died from a single gunshot to the chest.

Some people would have said this woman shouldn't have had the right to prevent this rape from a man with a knife who was 100 pounds heavier, and a foot taller.

I don't see how that is pro-woman.

 

[Deva_1972]

How on earth would you expect a women to reasonably protect herself then???

 

[1still_waters]

In this news story, a woman was ambushed by a man, tied up around her neck, then dragged. She was able to get to her handgun, shoot him, and escape. Some would say she shouldn't have the right to stop a guy from doing this to her. How is that pro-woman?

Link

Police at the time said Kemp randomly attacked the woman in her driveway, wrapping a canvas strap around her neck. He tried to drag her down her driveway toward his car parked nearby, but she fought back.

Kicking and screaming as she scraped along the ground with the strap tugging at her neck, the woman reached into her purse, where a .22-caliber handgun was concealed inside.

In an amazing reaction as she struggled, the woman pulled the gun out, pointed it over her shoulder and squeezed the trigger twice. One bullet struck Kemp in the stomach.

Wounded, Kemp let go of the strap and staggered away. Neighbors heard him shout, "Help me! Help me!" Kemp collapsed onto the ground a few doors away as the woman ran into her house to call police.
Officers arrested Kemp on suspicion of attempted rape, attempted robbery and attempted kidnapping, and called for an ambulance. Kemp was taken to a hospital, where he died.

 

[1still_waters]

In this story a convicted sex offender and rapist tried breaking into the place where a woman lived. She was able to prevent a possible sexual assault by fatally shooting him. Some would say the woman shouldn't have the right to prevent her own sexual assault with a gun.
Link

Accused Rapist Shot, Killed by Victim
By: Heartland News
CAPE GIRARDEAU, Mo. - No charges will be filed against the Cape Girardeau woman who shot and killed a registered sex offender trying to break back into her home. Ronnie Preyer, 47, of Jackson died seven hours after being shot in the chest.
Cape Girardeau County prosecuting attorney Morley Swingle tells Heartland News that Preyer is the same man who raped the 57-year-old woman on Saturday, October 25th.
Swingle says she shot Preyer as he broke through her basement door into her kitchen around 2:15 Halloween morning.
Swingle says he will not charge the woman with any crime.
Cape County Coroner John Clifton says he agrees with Mr. Swingle and plans to rule Preyer's death a justifiable homicide.

 

[PoxEclipse]

GUNS (Virtual State of the Union 2013)

[video=youtube;_T-F_zfoDqI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_T-F_zfoDqI[/video]

 

[1still_waters]

In this news story a sex offender was a threat to two women, and an armed citizen was able to prevent harm to them.
Link

A Brighton man shot and killed a 44-year-old registered sex offender who attacked two women in their home early this morning, officials said.

According to Dist. Atty. Gen. Mike Dunavant, David Fleming charged into the home of two women at about 3 a.m.
Fleming bound the women but one escaped and ran to a nearby home. Dunavant said Fleming, who lived in Munford, intended to rape the women.
The woman who escaped went to the nearby home of Keith Ingram for help, Dunavant said.
Ingram, carrying a .40-caliber handgun, ran to the house and found Fleming attacking the other woman, officials said.
When Fleming tried to attack Ingram, Dunavant said Ingram shot Fleming once.
Tipton County Sheriff’s deputies and Brighton Police officers found Fleming dead on the front porch of the home.
Fleming had been convicted of attempted rape in Tipton County. He’s listed on the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation’s sex-offender registry.
Dunavant said Ingram has no criminal record and has a permit to carry the handgun.
The women who were attacked were treated at Baptist Memorial Hospital-Tipton.
TBI officials are assisting with the case. The Shelby County Medical Examiner will conduct an autopsy. Investigators took statements from several witnesses today. The shooting is still under investigation.

 

[MidniteWelder]

Violence begets violence.

That's right, their own violence will be turned back to them.
Perhaps they shouldn't have tried to begat violence huh?

Things may be different in your country, but in America a free citizen has the same rights and authority as a cop when witnessing a felony.
An attack which threatens personal harm and places ones life in danger -is....a felony in progress.
Many people in America exercise their common right to bear a firearm...simply
Because it's just too difficult to carry a cop around.
And many women would much prefer to take their chances and have the option to carry a gun and not need to use it.
Than to be denied that Right and one day wish they had it.
Having a firearm is a Right-
Not a privilege
Not to be controlled taxed, issued a license for or that right infringed or encroached upon in any way shape or form of the matter.
And sometimes the only way to assert that right to defend ones own property, affects, and right to life without trespass.....
Is to have the means to defend said right immediately.

While your stance is understood, as a Christian and the mutual love for humanity as a whole....
...The truth of the matter is we're living in a fallen world. As much as we'd like to rely on peoples good nature to not harm others, when another person makes the bad choice to deprive another of their God given rights, (Life being the main right I would say) then trying to argue with them or wait for the police to arrive when response time is 2 minutes at best often does not prevent or stop a crime in progress...in the moment...while it is happening.

An unarmed person places themselves at a higher chance of being a victim, not just to a perpetrator but also a victim .

As well perhaps it would be good for you to know that when our country was first being settled as one that is free from dictatorship type rule:
almost every man by the age of 18, was a Patriot, an attorney, and a Marksmen.
That firearm you may be against in your own mind, actually helps to ensure your own rights against tyranny of those who wish to control you and use bodily harm to do it.
I find it wise not to leave ones own rights in the discretion of or in the hands of others. Because as we know, there's just a lot of ignorant not so educated people in the world that we run into everyday.

The only rights you have, are the ones you exercise and are willing to defend. That's it.

 

[Elizabeth619]

How on earth would you expect a women to reasonably protect herself then???

According to Joe Biden a woman should pee on the rapist. He says that will make the rape stop.

Yes, he really said that.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

What you're omitting Rachel is that violence also stops violence. For example, if a murderer is trying to murder you and you kill them in self-defense, they can no longer murder you or anyone else hence their violence is stopped. See how this works?

Don't confuse self-defense with seeking revenge. The former is a moral response while the latter perpetuates violence. Jesus said to buy a sword (e.g. arm yourself) but he also said to turn the other check (not seek revenge).

Guns in the hands of the law abiding bring accountability to criminals; protection for one's self, loved ones, and the innocent; and also an opportunity to exercise responsibility.

I am for the human right to self defense and the Constitutional right to bear arms for the law abiding and my position is influenced because I'm a Christian. BUT, it is within the Christian worldview and Christian context that I make this assertion.

Read this for more information: Biblical Self-Defense: What does the Bible say about self-defense? Bible study about self-defense questions: Can a Christian own a gun? What do the Scriptures say about using lethal force for self-protection?

It's not outrage about a woman handling a gun - Guns are the not the answer or solution to violence.

Violence begets violence.

Is the refusal to allow someone to handle a gun based on emotions? Well, the questin would be how effective is a gun in close combat amongst a group of people?
How effective is it really as a form of self defence. Apparently, a finding suggests a woman in an incident was 12 times more likely to be killed if she was carrying a gun.

Plus we're considering the logistics nightmare of handling gun owners and putting in measures to ensure that they don't fall into wrong hands.

There is no guarantee. As was in the report, the gun is expensive and a quarter of orders for the gun were placed by men. A woman is more likely to be less economically well off than a man, and if both carry a gun, they would go back to the same power equation.

Honestly, I am against guns and the right to bear arms.

However my perspective is influenced by the fact I am a Christian.

 

[kayem77]

I would get one of those special guns. I'm not a super fan of guns, especially automatic guns, but I do believe people should have the right to defend themselves.

 

[Misty77]

As a survivor of sexual assault and now as a carrier of a concealed handgun license, I approve this thread.

Thank you, 1still_waters!!

 

[Elizabeth619]

Honestly, I am against guns and the right to bear arms.

However my perspective is influenced by the fact I am a Christian.

I support guns and the right to bear arms, and my perspective is influenced by the fact I am a Christian.

 

[jimmydiggs]

My mother is super liberal, kind of a feminazi (would make Misty77 look like a patriarch ), and she had been very anti-guns for a long time. Two years ago her and her co-workers received a death threat from someone my mother had to deliver a notice of being fired (she works in HR). After that, she decided concealed carry wasn't as bad as dieing unnecessarily.

 

[Deva_1972]

According to Joe Biden a woman should pee on the rapist. He says that will make the rape stop.

Yes, he really said that.

HAHAHAHAHA!!! wow, just wow...smh

 

[jimmydiggs]

In this story a convicted sex offender and rapist tried breaking into the place where a woman lived. She was able to prevent a possible sexual assault by fatally shooting him. Some would say the woman shouldn't have the right to prevent her own sexual assault with a gun.
Link

Dude. I go to school at SEMO in Cape Girardeau. I never heard of this.

EDIT: Now I see, it's from 2008.