God doesn't seem to really care.

[Arcynaculr]

If god really cared about each and every one of us so much, then why did he create us in the first place when he knew that so many would not choose him and end up going to hell? I mean it's just evil to create something that you know will destroy itself... better to not create something at all than create something that will just destroy itself.

Of course if he created something, he would have to let it have free will but if the result of free will is self-destruction then he should not have created anything at all. Then there would be no people suffering in hell. There would never have been anything. All this could have been avoided, if god would have cared enough to restrain himself from creating.

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Just because he knows what people will choose, it doesn't mean they don't have a choice.

John 3:19

"And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil."


We all have a choice

 

[posthuman]

whenever i don't understand God, i assume i'm the one that doesn't have all the facts.

 

[Arcynaculr]

Just because he knows what people will choose, it doesn't mean they don't have a choice.

John 3:19

"And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil."


We all have a choice

I think you missed the point...

 

[Arcynaculr]

whenever i don't understand God, i assume i'm the one that doesn't have all the facts.

How convenient for god.

 

[posthuman]

How convenient for god.

may it always be so, amen!

you do understand how, by definition, the whole God-man relationship works, right?
is God reading for a role in a play you're casting? is He hoping to be win the next election? do you text 888-123-4567 and enter the # for your choice of God and the answer is going to be revealed at the end of the show? will God be voted off the island?

let's not be foolish. if God is God and man is man then it doesn't matter what man "thinks."

 

[T_Laurich]

lets not get into a rabbit hole debate about sovereignty of God... But more so explain why God created man, what God is, and what Gods plans are after this world is all over... What would our time on earth have meant?

I understand to explain sovereignty is to do some great justice in this question that man posed... But lets be more poised... I remember when I was brand new to Christianity, and I knew nothing... To have someone tell me I am foolish and the whole nine yards would be a vast insult and one that could have very drastic consequences...

We must remember many people no matter their age or religious position are still in milk and need to be shown... Just like all of us, a snarky/whitty reply gets no where... Even faced with meaningless questions from pharacy's Jesus always gave a polite and correct answer showing the Truth...

 

[posthuman]

i'm a father now, and i've been one for a while. before i became a father there were things my father did or ways that he acted that i didn't understand, but that i do now, in the other shoes, trying to raise a child. that feeling is like being finding a box of essays from junior high school with red marks all over them and a poor grade, when your hair has turned grey. remembering being mad at the teacher and thinking it was unfair, and now reading them and thinking the teacher was being generous.

God adopts us as sons, like a street urchin near death into a palace. our perspectives change.

 

[posthuman]

what i really mean to say i think, is that understanding God is done with a lot of humility. nothing a proud man has ever said about God has ever made any sense to me.

 

[Arcynaculr]

may it always be so, amen!

you do understand how, by definition, the whole God-man relationship works, right?
is God reading for a role in a play you're casting? is He hoping to be win the next election? do you text 888-123-4567 and enter the # for your choice of God and the answer is going to be revealed at the end of the show? will God be voted off the island?

let's not be foolish. if God is God and man is man then it doesn't matter what man "thinks."

If god does not care what I think, then he is not worth my time. I hoped he (and his followers) would be open to my thoughts and not simply dismiss me as a total fool not even worth listening to.

 

[Arcynaculr]

what i really mean to say i think, is that understanding God is done with a lot of humility. nothing a proud man has ever said about God has ever made any sense to me.

Not proud. Just think a god should respect what he creates if he wants it to respect him in return.

 

[Tintin]

If god does not care what I think, then he is not worth my time. I hoped he (and his followers) would be open to my thoughts and not simply dismiss me as a total fool not even worth listening to.

Goes both ways, bucko! Christians are often treated that way by non-Christians, when it comes to sharing our beliefs. Also, if you had bothered to read any part of the Bible, you'd realise God does care what you think. But that doesn't mean human reasoning ever trumps his perfect Truth.

 

[mystdancer50]

Consider this: let's say that there are two people you truly love and one loves and adores you but the other does not, yet you love them both so deeply that it hurts inside. Would you rather the one that doesn't love you in return not exist?

The greatest gift one can give someone is love freely given. Forced love is not love at all. But love expressed simply because one sees the value and beauty in another and loves them is beautiful. God loves us all because He made us each uniquely and specially and sees our value and beauty. He shows us Himself in the hopes that we would love Him too. But, alas, love is a choice and so some choose to turn from Him and reject Him. Should they cease to exist because of this, simply to ease the conscious of man?

Think of the angel in the movie It's A Wonderful Life. The life of one touches so many others. How bleak would our lives be if we removed those that we felt didn't fit in or didn't accept us or didn't love us. We are all given a choice. Some use that choice to murder babies in the womb. Some use that choice to love others. Some use that choice to abuse or control others. God gives us free will because choosing Him and loving Him is something far more beautiful than we can ever describe.

And to lose that choice would be hideous dictatorship and God is not a dictator.

 

[Arcynaculr]

Goes both ways, bucko! Christians are often treated that way by non-Christians, when it comes to sharing our beliefs. Also, if you had bothered to read any part of the Bible, you'd realise God does care what you think. But that doesn't mean human reasoning ever trumps his perfect Truth.

Yes, and I have been trying to be open to what you think. but so far I haven't got much from you besides "god is perfect and we can't understand so don't even try to" ...

Rather discouraging.

 

[biscuit]

Not proud. Just think a god should respect what he creates if he wants it to respect him in return.

He can give you everything you want in life, provided that you seek and worship Him, accordingly. You just need to initiate the relationship and take the initiative See how simple that was !! These are bad times for many people because they stopped seeking Him. I reached out to the Lord in 2004 and weather the recession crisis with no complications. Actually, 2008 to the present are the best years of my life, and I can thank my Lord & Savior for it because I reached out to Him, got saved and received the Holy Ghost.

 

[mystdancer50]

God, being God, could do many things. He could create a utopia of bland worshipers who have no free will and serve only Him with no concept of what love and sacrifice and life really mean. He could pour out blessings on us all and spoil us literally rotten, until we are so foul that there is no satisfaction to be had. He could let us live the wild life with no consequences and do whatever we want whenever we want. Why doesn't He? Because He knows better than we do what is best for us. His thoughts are above ours and His ways are above ours and, thus, we should learn to ask not, "Why not this or that, God?" but rather, "What greater blessings could You give to me than all that You already have?"

We tread a dangerous ground when we act like Job's "friends" and wife. Recall that Job had to ultimately sacrifice for them in order for them to be spared. God knows tomorrow. We only see today.

 

[doseofreality]

If god really cared about each and every one of us so much, then why did he create us in the first place when he knew that so many would not choose him and end up going to hell? I mean it's just evil to create something that you know will destroy itself... better to not create something at all than create something that will just destroy itself.

Of course if he created something, he would have to let it have free will but if the result of free will is self-destruction then he should not have created anything at all. Then there would be no people suffering in hell. There would never have been anything. All this could have been avoided, if god would have cared enough to restrain himself from creating.

May i ask what you hope to accomplish here?
All you are arguing for is that God is not acting how you think he should act....but this is a silly argument to present to christians or to anyone because who are we to question God (Book of Job). "His ways are higher than our ways" and other such passages will be quoted.
So what if God doesn't care about us....he's God and can do whatever he wants, you can choose to not worship him.
Better yet, you can chose not to believe at all then your whole argument becomes a moot point.

 

[Arcynaculr]

Consider this: let's say that there are two people you truly love and one loves and adores you but the other does not, yet you love them both so deeply that it hurts inside. Would you rather the one that doesn't love you in return not exist?

The greatest gift one can give someone is love freely given. Forced love is not love at all. But love expressed simply because one sees the value and beauty in another and loves them is beautiful. God loves us all because He made us each uniquely and specially and sees our value and beauty. He shows us Himself in the hopes that we would love Him too. But, alas, love is a choice and so some choose to turn from Him and reject Him. Should they cease to exist because of this, simply to ease the conscious of man?

Think of the angel in the movie It's A Wonderful Life. The life of one touches so many others. How bleak would our lives be if we removed those that we felt didn't fit in or didn't accept us or didn't love us. We are all given a choice. Some use that choice to murder babies in the womb. Some use that choice to love others. Some use that choice to abuse or control others. God gives us free will because choosing Him and loving Him is something far more beautiful than we can ever describe.

And to lose that choice would be hideous dictatorship and God is not a dictator.

Well yes I see. but of course if no one was ever created then all that would be irrelevant because... well... nothing ever existed to even have a life or choice or anything. We would not be supressed because you can't supress what does not exist...

Also, what if someone is murdered at 20 and had not accepted god but if they had lived to 23 then they would have accepted god at 23... do they go to hell when they would have accepted god if only they had lived a bit longer?

 

[doseofreality]

He can give you everything you want in life, provided that you seek and worship Him, accordingly. You just need to initiate the relationship and take the initiative See how simple that was !! These are bad times for many people because they stopped seeking Him. I reached out to the Lord in 2004 and weather the recession crisis with no complications. Actually, 2008 to the present are the best years of my life, and I can thank my Lord & Savior for it because I reached out to Him, got saved and received the Holy Ghost.

Are you really implying that the economic recession was brought about because americans stopped seeking God? and that you were spared "complications" because you got saved?

Im sorry but you are just flat out wrong here.

 

[mystdancer50]

Well yes I see. but of course if no one was ever created then all that would be irrelevant because... well... nothing ever existed to even have a life or choice or anything. We would not be supressed because you can't supress what does not exist...

Also, what if someone is murdered at 20 and had not accepted god but if they had lived to 23 then they would have accepted god at 23... do they go to hell when they would have accepted god if only they had lived a bit longer?

I am not God so I cannot answer this with authority of where that soul would end up. Consider this, though: one must have Christ in their heart in order to be forgiven. So, when the person was murdered and they cried out, "Lord Jesus, please save me!" is that considered repentance? Would they then be in heaven? God knows the heart. It is dangerous to consider these kinds of 'what ifs' and put oneself or another in the place of God to determine the ultimate destination of a soul.

I do know that God is a merciful and just God and He can see into that person's 23 repentance. Does He take that into account? I would say yes, but then, once again, I am not God and never pretend to be.

As to the first part of your response: circle talk does nothing to solve your quandaries. I never said that no one would exist, for there are those that have chosen Him, so where you got that logic from my statement, I don't know.