God doesn't seem to really care.

[homwardbound]

We need to clarify then what exactly we are attempting to prove.
The claim brought up was that God has not been proven nor disproven.

the historical evidence you have presented may indeed prove that certain events were foretold or even that someone had the gift of prophecy. This has no bearing on the cause of these events and cannot be used as proof for a transcendent deity.

Do you not beleive the Miracles done, the sick healed, the dead raised back to life and many more the people fed over five thousand, and the left overs
It is recorded and reported and this is the longest ever run told events that took place over two thousand years ago
Okay then to each their own, praying for you

 

[homwardbound]

This seems like a subjective endeavor though. Don't you infer human emotion and sense of love onto determining whether God loves us. Maybe God loves us but not in a "human" type of love thus why there is pain, hunger, suffering, death.

Christ was plain truth, that he is not of this world, his kingdom is in Heaven and Peter cut off Malcus's ear and Christ restored that ear and willingly went to the cross. What love that is not of this world, beyond Human comprehension
2 Corinthians 2:14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place.
Colossians 2:15 and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

 

[homwardbound]

You are inferring a cause when the cause may be unknown. Lets say no one else has the gift of prophecy, only Isaiah.
How was he able to predict future events?
Do you know the cause?

Yes God the creator of all, by Belief in God as is in many Saints

 

[homwardbound]

You are assuming that because the bible or even a god says it, it must be true...

And yes, i suppose all of humans' discussing about god could very well be in vain... but we seem compelled to do it anyway lol just in case it warrants something...

Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you are a doubter or a seed planter to cause doubt as what the serpent did to Adam and
Eve. Reveal thyself thank you

 

[homwardbound]

Yes i see what you mean... well, all i can say, is if we cannot relate to this gods' idea of "love" then how much in his image are we actually made? For that would seem to say: "not very much".

Plus if this gods' love is that estranged then we can't be sure of an afterlife or anything so this god might as well not exist.

Born of the flesh is not in God's image, it is the knowledge of right and wrong, being born selfish in the flesh
If not born again in the Spirit of God one can't even understand as you do not yet, because you do not believe God as you have said
So do you believe or not?
John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

 

[homwardbound]

The prophecy may have come from a god, or it may not have. To say it did come from a god, specifically the exact one the bible describes, is an assumption.

There may be proof of a prophecy, not of where the prophecy came from.

Also, there is no proof the god of the bible (or any god) is always honest either.

Why do you need proof, proof in all the miracles was and is proof enough. We are left with one choice to believe or not. No more proof is to be given that has past tense been done and shown by the many witnesses if the resurrected Christ.
I am praying for you, to come to terms, Love you deeper than you obviously know by all your posts

 

[homwardbound]

So you assume that because some things about your religion are accurate then it must all be accurate?

God is love beyond your understanding, if you want to know God, truthfully and not for self gain, God will reveal himself and have Mercy on you. But if you have not the right Motive God reserves the right to not reveal himself to you. God is against selfishness, and was not selfish at all in giving his Son to us and for us, to redeem us to life in the Spirit of God by the resurredctiomn of Son
It is so simle tha tit is hard, because no flesh can comprehend not being selfish

 

[homwardbound]

You believe God is sovereign right?
That everything is controlled by God and nothing can thwart His divine plan.

This implies that it was Gods purpose for Eve to be tempted, for sin to enter the world, for us to be born guilty, and for many to reject salvation or never have the chance to choose.

Follow the logic, its not as simple as you make it out to be.

Without the free choice, God could not claim love, for we would nothing more than puppets

 

[homwardbound]

Genesis 1:26-28

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

Yet you have chosen unbelief is this true at least you said this in another post did you not?
Thank you

 

[RickyZ]

Interesting... but i can honestly say im not sure why im here (think i said it before) and if that answer does not satisfy, well, sorry, its the only honest one i have.

My intent on posting that link wasn't to ask why you are here, but to say don't let bickering saints dissuade you from God.

I hear what you're saying in this thread. Going back to your original post; my parents created 3 children, one of whom is an absolute bum who at the age of 53 still lives with and off of them. My 88 year old mother recently broke her hip doing his dishes. Yet they rally around this kid as if producing him was the greatest thing they ever did. Is that maybe how God looks at us? With unconditional love no matter how badly we screw Him or ourselves? He's marching straight to hell yet they cling to him in hopes that he'll change and turn from it. While I don't agree with what's going on there, it is still an example and lesson of God's unconditional love for us even amidst our self destruction.

They even highlight your point about whether God should have created us, knowing we would turn from Him. My father let slip one time that he wishes he'd never had any of us because of the trouble we've caused him. And yet if he hadn't, his life would be void of any meaning or direction. Maybe there's an answer for you, that yes even tho many of us whom He has created will turn to our own destruction, there's still a value in us none the less that He pursues and gains love thru. And wasn't that the whole point in our creation, the generation of value and love in the universe, even if some of it turns sour?

 

[homwardbound]

I do not know for sure what is not accurate. but some things seem very unlikely, for example: gods love for us and sin as reason for death.
Those have not been proved. The very existence of your god has not been proved. Only certain events have been proved.

Is there a way to prove the existence and, more importantly, the nature and intentions of your god?

If there is no possible way to prove that... then I will not be making any assumptions but sticking to the probability that they can't be proved because they are not accurate. Not saying they are not accurate, just saying they probably are not. If the odds can be shifted to, "they probably are accurate", then I will go with that.

Was God not honest when he told Adam that if he ate from that tree he would die. God had Mercy on him and clothed him first sacrifice yet Adam died didn't he?
And today we have a high priest that lives forever, Christ Jesus in the order of Melchisadek
So you don't need life?

 

[homwardbound]

Haha what other logic is there

Ok so what i get from that is that there is an illusion of choice because no matter what we choose God's will is done.
This is actually starting to be discovered in neuroscience, our subconscious brain knows what we will do a few seconds before our conscious brain "decides" what to do. We think we have free-choice but our genes, environment, and internal preferences mostly dictate everything we do.
Thus if God made us, then He already hard-wired us to be more susceptible to some things rather than others. Giving credence to the illusion of choice.

Spiritual, that goes far beyond Human reasoning that you do not see yet, but you will get your conscious choice to choose if you have not already

 

[homwardbound]

You know there is such a thing as coincidence.

And just because your religion is different from all the rest does not automatically make it completely accurate.
Also, i have never experienced anything from god. I was raised in a christian home, god never helped me or answered me or proved himself to me at all. He seemed to ignore me. Is it cuz the god of the bible is a liar or cuz he does not exist? Or possibly some other reason...

And you don't blame the people, Satan got you to blame God as to the bad things that happened as if God according to their claim did this to you. When it was not God at all. It is the selfish flesh, but claimed to b ein God beleive, and they did not, which happens a lot
Romans 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

 

[homwardbound]

Ok you are contrasting human logic with God's logic, however, you learn God's logic through the Bible making it the "Bibles logic", the bible was written by humans so its still human logic just with different premises.

Now everything you say is tied to this statement "God is the absolute reality" . How do you know that is true?
When did you learn this truth?
What evidence convinced you?
How did you come to know how to define God? to know what his attributes were?

How do you not know, except by your conscious choice to not believe?
I know by belief, and does not need to be prooven, proof is in the pudding as I have suffered like Job and not denied nor will deny God, the creator of all

 

[Arcynaculr]

Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you are a doubter or a seed planter to cause doubt as what the serpent did to Adam and
Eve. Reveal thyself thank you

Yes i am a doubter, but i dont intend to "plant" any "seeds". I'm just trying to explain how i see things.

But can anyone tell me something that i have not heard before? That is the question.

 

[homwardbound]

Or you could just let them live forever, however they want, and occassionally help with expanding their living area, while you go off and try to make sonething better... Or just entertain yourself some other way lol i dont know what gods do for entertainment (maybe dont need it) but we may be their entertainment...

If you were God and saw the people you created stomp on other people and not care, how would you react, would you kill them all and start over and not give free will, thus we be puppets and not truly love?
HMM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! God saw this and written in the time of Noah about what I just wrote and he regretted making man because of the evil, yet found grace with Noah. Yet God did n ot wipe out all did he. And eventually came with his Son and they killed the Son. Yet that was only to evil's demise and made an open spectacle over them
2 Corinthians 2:14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place.
Colossians 2:15 and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it

 

[Arcynaculr]

So do you believe or not?

I'm still on the fence. but leaning heavily towards not.

 

[homwardbound]

All the books of the bible were written by Jews with exception of Luke i think. So naturally they would know their own history and would have access to the old scrolls and previous writings. In this way the newer writings should build on the older ones with the authors sharing a similar worldview thus resulting in a consistency in the overall bible.
Also during the canonization process, books that were not consistent would not be picked, so its not as amazing as you might think.

So then are you saying there is no God? And if there is no God (creator) then how did this world in all its amazing resources with Sun and Moon get made? Just a big bang theory?
You know in your being there is a God that you seem to be denying and the only one proof that is here to stay is through the Bible, and no man can comprehend it and yes there are errors from man as in rewriting, interpreting and so on and so forth yet it the Spirit of God that brings forth the truth that sets one free, in Father through Son's finished work for us to be presented perfect before Father and receive the new life in the Spirit that he came to give us through the resurrected Christ
For God can not be worshiped in the flesh

John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.


John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

So throuigh the cross starting at the death we die to our own flesh in our minds and be renewed to the new life thought in Spirit
Romans 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[Toska]

I'm still on the fence. but leaning heavily towards not.

Can I ask why? What is holding you back? You have been given so many answers by so many people. Are you still having trouble with the part about having to have faith? Or is there something else that is causing you to lean towards not believing?

 

[homwardbound]

Coincidence that some stuff went right for your religion and not others.
Well there is no proof the differences are correct.
And until something solid can shift the probability of the accuracy of any god, i am inclined to not follow or trust anything any religion says.

but none of the participants of this religion seem capable of offering anything solid. and i guess thats the point. you have to go on "faith" cuz there is nothing completely solid about your religion...

Believing in the one true living God is not religion, It is a personal relationship with nand through the Savior, Christ Jesus, where we are presented to God
Colossians 1:22 in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

That is what is so amazing about God, he loves us this much, and we will receive if we believe, but if we do not how can we receive? Your choice, kind of like a commercial, try it you will like it if you can wait and once you taste, you can't eat just one
Best steak and water I have ever eaten and drank, lots of regrets at first, bur after lasting through none now.
I gave up what I wanted now for what I knew I needed in the long run, and that is a gift from God called life everlasting, even when the body is destroyed, The Soul lives on and not destroyed. the God of this world, evil can only destroy the body but not the soul

Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.