Are these contradictions?

[doseofreality]

The use of the word murder doesn't make anything clearer here. Surely the word murder means nothing if it does not mean an unjustified and unlawful killing. So in order to make the comparison, you would have to argue that the potential killing was unjustified and unlawful, and on what grounds and standards.

Another philosophical question at play is this: given that Abraham did not, in fact, kill Isaac, did he a) actually sin at all, and b) given that he followed all the actions optimally required to result in the death of Isaac, but that outcome still failed to occur, was it EVER actually possible to Abraham to kill Isaac, and therefore sin? Therefore, c) is 'temptation' (or testing) with precisely a zero possibility of resulting in sin actually 'temptation', even at the raw semantic level?

God clearly states to "sacrifice" (kill) Isaac. You argue that because God commanded it, that makes it justified and lawful.
This actually continues throughout the OT, the idea that killing is wrong unless it is commanded or permitted by God.
That is dangerous thinking, do not radical muslims follow the same line of thinking?
Why condemn them when they are doing the exact same thing the people of the OT did?

There is a contradiction here:
Today if God spoke to a christian and told them to sacrifice their child, they would most likely not obey because killing is wrong and the NT says to "test the spirits to know what is true". Obviously God would not tell us to sin, it must be Satan deceiving us correct?
However, Abraham did not question whether this was God. Maybe because at this point the Law had not yet been given.
Yet God is the same yesterday, today and forever? Not quite.

 

[nathan3]

God clearly states to "sacrifice" (kill) Isaac. You argue that because God commanded it, that makes it justified and lawful.
This actually continues throughout the OT, the idea that killing is wrong unless it is commanded or permitted by God.
That is dangerous thinking, do not radical muslims follow the same line of thinking?
Why condemn them when they are doing the exact same thing the people of the OT did?

There is a contradiction here:
Today if God spoke to a christian and told them to sacrifice their child, they would most likely not obey because killing is wrong and the NT says to "test the spirits to know what is true". Obviously God would not tell us to sin, it must be Satan deceiving us correct?
However, Abraham did not question whether this was God. Maybe because at this point the Law had not yet been given.
Yet God is the same yesterday, today and forever? Not quite.

The Bible dose not teach anyone to do what your saying. Abraham never killed his son. And when the heathen did so in the past, God was 100% against it as He is today. .

People seem to be killing their children all their own today; don't you think ? They don't even need look any farther but to the atheistic left for approval & help doing it.

People have no one to blame but themselves, you can't blame anyone else for it.

 

[mystdancer50]

I agree that one is still responsible for their actions if they have a choice. Yet my point is God still must bear some of the responsibility.

God took all the responsibility. He sent His only Son to die on the cross for our sins. Really. What more do you want Him to do?

The picture of Abraham and Isaac, by the way, was God foreshadowing what He would ultimately do with Jesus for us. The difference? He doesn't make us pay the price He Himself paid. He stopped Abraham from sacrificing Isaac AND He then provided the sacrifice Himself. Responsibility taken there, too.

Be very careful what you accuse God of. Do not be fooled. God will not be mocked. What men and women sow, that they themselves will reap. Jesus took all of our sins upon Him, who was not a sinner, so that we could be saved from our choices and the selfish acts of rebellion we act out against our just and loving Creator. And you say that God must bear some responsibility? I think you really need to study the Bible more so you can see that the only ones refusing to take responsibility are the people most responsible: us.

 

[RedTent]

We can find many contradictions in the bible if we set our heart on making God prove Himself. I once spent over three months of at least four hours a day because God told me to keep His commandments, and also that the Law of Moses was obsolete. I did that because I knew that God was eternal, that it was important that I learn from God, that God's thoughts could be trusted as absolutely correct, and all scripture was from God both OT and NT. Therefore, I knew it was important I understood from how God thought.

When we read scripture enough to thoroughly understand that God is for justice, love, contentment and for all the fruits of the spirit then we can understand these seeming contradictions better.

 

[fredjames]

Peace be with you beloved ones of CHRIST, and let us not remain believing in contradiction found in the HOLY BIBLE because they are there for unbelievers, 'who see and see but they cannot see and who hear and hear but they cannot hear', but yet to believers whose eyes are opened by the LIVING GOD, 'by Grace through Faith' to listen and pay attention to CHRIST, continue to believe in the HOLY SPIRIT, the anointing placed in us, as our Helper and Teacher, who inspired these Holy Scriptures and patiently wait for the answers and share freely them, which is given in simple explanation, 'hid to the wise and prudent and shown only to the ordinary', give to others for their building and edification.

1. Genesis 22;1 - the Truth is, GOD did not use evil to tempt/'test' Abraham but HE personally tempted/'tested'' Abraham's faith, written for our witnessing today, that in the written New Testament, Abraham is our 'Father of faith', practices towards oneself and on to others.

2. James 1;13 - Biblical evil is present in this world and it's ruler demands to CHRIST for us to be tested and the LORD forbid him and we are protected from them, when GOD is facing us because of CHRIST and when we are on HIS side through CHRIST, HIS SON and the HOLY SPIRIT of the Holy Scripture.
"HE does not use evil to tempt/test anyone but we are tempted/tested by our own selfish feelings and desires.............................." It is when HE turns HIS back on us in HIS wrath and all darkness break loose. The enemies who were afraid of us, now have courage to attack us with all might in vengeance ('A thief only comes to rob, kill and destroy but................')
'It is written from the beginning of creation itself, during HIS absents, when HE has already handed over to man all things, together with HIS commandments and instructions of awareness to faithfulness and deceits and to rule in HIS image, in order for the Good benefits for all others and peace, all these that are evil and then their wicked manifestation and their wicked products come to play and at the end of all these, HE finally gets the insults and blames.'

3. Exodus 32;14 - The LORD repented/'relented' [Relent - abandon or mitigate a severe or harsh attitude, especially by finally yielding to a request. (of Moses HIS servant for the ignorant Israel and now of LORD JESUS CHRIST for the ignorant church until today)]

4. Numbers 23;19 - This is how this passage is read and understood, that the LIVING GOD is not a carnal man who would repent/'change HIS mind', even in anger, on the things HE has promised to fulfill (for HIS people because of the promise HE made to Abraham and proclaimed them by the Prophets and fulfilled them through the MESSIAH and the HOLY SPIRIT that brings birth to the New Covenant).

As`CHRIST proves HIS Words of the FATHER, which is 'still the same yesterday, today, tomorrow and forever and ever, Amen', in our believes, there is no contradictions to Grace and Truth of CHRIST, but there is in our change of a carnal 'self' mind turning from faithfulness to the HOLY SPIRIT, placed as our Teacher of HIS inspired and written Holy Scriptures in the HOLY BIBLE.

May GOD the FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST forgive and bless all who remain in ignorance, to be transformed in order to worship the FATHER who is SPIRIT, in spirit and truth.

All-Honor, All-Praise and All-Glory be to our GOD, the FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST, forever and ever, Amen.

 

[BELIEVE]

Peace be with you beloved ones of CHRIST, and let us not remain believing in contradiction found in the HOLY BIBLE because they are there for unbelievers, 'who see and see but they cannot see and who hear and hear but they cannot hear', but yet to believers whose eyes are opened by the LIVING GOD, 'by Grace through Faith' to listen and pay attention to CHRIST, continue to believe in the HOLY SPIRIT, the anointing placed in us, as our Helper and Teacher, who inspired these Holy Scriptures and patiently wait for the answers and share freely them, which is given in simple explanation, 'hid to the wise and prudent and shown only to the ordinary', give to others for their building and edification.

1. Genesis 22;1 - the Truth is, GOD did not use evil to tempt/'test' Abraham but HE personally tempted/'tested'' Abraham's faith, written for our witnessing today, that in the written New Testament, Abraham is our 'Father of faith', practices towards oneself and on to others.

2. James 1;13 - Biblical evil is present in this world and it's ruler demands to CHRIST for us to be tested and the LORD forbid him and we are protected from them, when GOD is facing us because of CHRIST and when we are on HIS side through CHRIST, HIS SON and the HOLY SPIRIT of the Holy Scripture.
"HE does not use evil to tempt/test anyone but we are tempted/tested by our own selfish feelings and desires.............................." It is when HE turns HIS back on us in HIS wrath and all darkness break loose. The enemies who were afraid of us, now have courage to attack us with all might in vengeance ('A thief only comes to rob, kill and destroy but................')
'It is written from the beginning of creation itself, during HIS absents, when HE has already handed over to man all things, together with HIS commandments and instructions of awareness to faithfulness and deceits and to rule in HIS image, in order for the Good benefits for all others and peace, all these that are evil and then their wicked manifestation and their wicked products come to play and at the end of all these, HE finally gets the insults and blames.'

3. Exodus 32;14 - The LORD repented/'relented' [Relent - abandon or mitigate a severe or harsh attitude, especially by finally yielding to a request. (of Moses HIS servant for the ignorant Israel and now of LORD JESUS CHRIST for the ignorant church until today)]

4. Numbers 23;19 - This is how this passage is read and understood, that the LIVING GOD is not a carnal man who would repent/'change HIS mind', even in anger, on the things HE has promised to fulfill (for HIS people because of the promise HE made to Abraham and proclaimed them by the Prophets and fulfilled them through the MESSIAH and the HOLY SPIRIT that brings birth to the New Covenant).

As`CHRIST proves HIS Words of the FATHER, which is 'still the same yesterday, today, tomorrow and forever and ever, Amen', in our believes, there is no contradictions to Grace and Truth of CHRIST, but there is in our change of a carnal 'self' mind turning from faithfulness to the HOLY SPIRIT, placed as our Teacher of HIS inspired and written Holy Scriptures in the HOLY BIBLE.

May GOD the FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST forgive and bless all who remain in ignorance, to be transformed in order to worship the FATHER who is SPIRIT, in spirit and truth.

All-Honor, All-Praise and All-Glory be to our GOD, the FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST, forever and ever, Amen.

amen brother fredjames amen

much love and god bless brother

 

[Mark51]

It is not possible that Jehovah himself tries us with adversity. When experiencing any kind of affliction or adversity, a person would be wrong in concluding that Jehovah God is trying to induce him to commit sin. We should not say: “I am being tried by God.” Jehovah is not trying to induce us to commit sin but is sure to help us and give us the strength needed to endure trials if we remain steadfast in faith. (Philippians 4:13) God is holy, so he does not place us in circumstances that would weaken our resistance to wrongdoing. If we get ourselves into an unholy situation and commit some sin, we should not blame him, “for with evil things God cannot be tried nor does he himself try anyone.” Though Jehovah may permit a trial to discipline us for our good, he does not try us with evil intent. (Hebrews 12:7-11) Satan may tempt us to do wrong, but God can deliver us from that wicked one.-Matthew 6:13.

We need to be prayerful because a certain situation may give rise to a wrong desire that could induce us to sin. James says: “Each one is tried by being drawn out and enticed by his own desire.” If we do not dismiss a wrong desire, ‘it becomes fertile,’ is nurtured in the heart, and “gives birth to sin.” When sin is accomplished, it “brings forth death.” Obviously, we need to guard our hearts and resist sinful inclinations. (Proverbs 4:23) Cain was warned that sin was about to overcome him, but he did not resist.-Genesis 4:4-8.

Rich or poor, we can be happy only if we endure our trials. (James 1:12-15) If we endure trials with our faith intact, we can be pronounced happy, for there is joy in doing what is right in God’s sight. By clinging to their faith unto death, spirit-begotten Christians receive “the crown of life,” immortality in the heavens. (Revelation 2:10; 1　Corinthians 15:50) If we have earthly hopes and maintain our faith in God, we can look forward to everlasting life on a paradise earth.-Luke 23:43; Romans 6:23.

The “crown” (life itself) is promised to all spirit-begotten Christians who continue loving Jehovah, who prove to be his real friends. This love is shown by obedience to God’s commands. (1　John 5:3; contrast with Romans 1:28-32.) God, through Christ, causes the Christian’s trials to work together to perfect his servants, if they endure these steadfastly, uncomplainingly and, with his help, triumphantly down till death.-Romans 8:28; 1　Peter 5:10.

 

[followjja]

Please don't make fun of me just because I corrected you. I don't know the Hebrew term or its meaning any better than the average person, so I Googled it and came up with that result. I'm no expert, which is why I leaned on the expertise of the citation.

My argument still stands -- even if we grant that the word "tempt" here means "test", the context of the story still makes it a temptation that just also happens to be a test. God commanded Abraham to do something sinful, and I cited an objective definition that backs up my assertion that this would constitute "tempting".

Have you considered the possibility that it is just a "story"? God would not tell anyone to murder his son. Or would he?

 

[posthuman]

Have you considered the possibility that it is just a "story"? God would not tell anyone to murder his son. Or would he?

have you considered that the faith of Abraham, and the reason God saw fit to make you and i aware of this "story" -
is to believe and obey the Lord regardless of how our fallible human logic reacts to His instruction?

 

[john832]

God commanded Abraham to murder his son. Is that fact in contention? I thought that was well-established. If God also commanded us not to murder, then it's not "fuzz-zee logic" but rather a contradiction. It only becomes fuzzy if you're trying to obscure what the bible says in order to hide the contradiction.

Whoa there big guy, He commanded Abraham to sacrifice His son. God has the authority to do just that. He did it to His own Son.

by the way, this was a type of the Father and Christ only the antitype went all the way.

 

[followjja]

have you considered that the faith of Abraham, and the reason God saw fit to make you and i aware of this "story" -
is to believe and obey the Lord regardless of how our fallible human logic reacts to His instruction?

NO

Haven't you read Jesus words in the 4 gospels? Killing is wrong, physical violence against anyone is wrong, IF and that is a BIG IF, you believe the Sermon on the Mount in Matt ch 5-7, and the Sermon on the Plain in Luke ch 6.

I realize that Abraham never heard Jesus' teaching on this subject, do you think slicing the throat a someone who is not guilty of a capital crime is OK?