DRINKING AND THE SCRIPTURES

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#1
Dec 12, 2013
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#1
Notice the following and what the bible teaches the wine and strong drink...

Jesus turned water into wine--> John chapter 2
Paul told Timothy as a (pastor( to take a little wine for the sake of his stomach--> 1st Timothy 5:23
To drink wine with a merry heart--> Ecclesiastes 9:7
That laughter and wine makes the heart merry--> Ecclesiastes 10:19
Give strong drink to those ready to perish--> Proverbs 31:6a
Give wine unto those who are heavy of heart (depressed)--> Proverbs 31:6b

It comes down to the following..

1. Does it cause a weaker brother/sister to stumble or be offended Corinthians
2. Not to be drunk in excess Ephesians
3. Not to be (given) to it as in addicted or have to have it 1st Timothy
4. Being mature about it

There is nothing wrong with any one having a drink of wine and or strong drink as long as it meets the requirements above.
 
P

paulsfam4

Guest
#2
#2
Drink in the bible the word of god ...that's all anyone needs, God wants us to be alert and focused on him.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#3
Dec 12, 2013
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#3
paulsfam4 said:
Drink in the bible the word of god ...that's all anyone needs, God wants us to be alert and focused on him.
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Argue you point with God as all I did was quote direct statements from the bible....go push your opinion elsewhere mi amigo!
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#4
Sep 4, 2013
30,922
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#4
True...........but there are some of us who willingly choose to abstain because Jesus said He would not partake of the fruit of the vine until once again He returned................ :) and that's ok to...........
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#5
Dec 12, 2013
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#5
p_rehbein said:
True...........but there are some of us who willingly choose to abstain because Jesus said He would not partake of the fruit of the vine until once again He returned................ :) and that's ok to...........
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I agree 100% as I don't drink myself bro :)
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#6
Sep 4, 2013
30,922
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#6
Actually, I was thinking about this recently...........and right off hand, I can not remember a Scripture that "defines" STRONG DRINK. You may know of one............

I believe that "wine" is the most often spoken of in Scripture, but it may not be the only. As well there is unfermented wine and fermented wine...............
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#7
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#7
p_rehbein said:
Actually, I was thinking about this recently...........and right off hand, I can not remember a Scripture that "defines" STRONG DRINK. You may know of one............

I believe that "wine" is the most often spoken of in Scripture, but it may not be the only. As well there is unfermented wine and fermented wine...............
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Never really looked into (strong drink) but since it is separated from (wine) in the same verse would seen to indicate it was a little stronger than naturally fermented wine.

Also, it would seem from the context of what is stated in the op that the wine spoken of was either naturally fermented and or fermented as to do the following with just (the fruit of the vine) as in grape juice would seem unlikely.

1. Make the heart merry
2. Get you drunk
3. Lift a sorrowful heart
4. Help the stomach (medicinally?)

Just my thoughts right or wrong...

I know that a little red wine helps with high cholesterol and high blood pressure...like one glass a day so I would (assume) number 4 above is why Paul told Timothy to take a little..
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#8
May 15, 2013
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#8
There's nothing wrong about drinking wine, but it can hinder a person from doing God's will. God want us to remain focus of our actions at all times, and He doesn't want us to depend on natural substance to relieve us from our stress or we will become codependent to these substance and which causes us to turn away from God. God said he will give us a Comforter when we need comfort, but by using natural substance for comfort it will show that we doesn't need Him; it will make the natural our God instead.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#9
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#9
4enlightment said:
There's nothing wrong about drinking wine, but it can hinder a person from doing God's will. God want us to remain focus of our actions at all times, and He doesn't want us to depend on natural substance to relieve us from our stress or we will become codependent to these substance and which causes us to turn away from God. God said he will give us a Comforter when we need comfort, but by using natural substance for comfort it will show that we doesn't need Him; it will make the natural our God instead.
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ONLY if it goes beyond the above listed ACCEPTABLE BOUNDRIES that have been given by God!
As found in the OP!
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#10
#10
Well, ask any alcoholic of which I use to be until the cross of Christ set me free. I realize and understand that not every body that drinks is an alcoholic, But every alcoholic took their first drink and curses the day that the did.

Secondly, Jesus turning the water into wine and the master of the feast said " you have saved the best for last". Any bartender ( as I have known many) will tell you that when a person comes in and orders a drink. They make a good stiff drink, but after they have been there for a while, the bartender can start cutting back almost to the point to where there is just a very small amount of liquor in the drink and the dude can' tell the difference and the bar makes even more money.

Thirdly wine in the bible describes any drink, paste, or jelly that is made from grapes as wine. In fact the famous Greek philosophers describe fermented wine as being mixed with water. Firstly because the didn't have chlorine and a small amount of alcohol would kill the bacteria in the water. Secondly, wine was expensive so it was often watered down. The last description given by the Greeks was that it was 1 part wine and 3 parts water and would take 23 glasses to equal 1 martini.

Strong drink was considered full strength wine or beer or a type of liquor that was made from dates.

Not until prohibition here in the U.S. was grape juice separated from the term wine.


Where am I, fourthly or fifthly or sixthly any way. Your children are watching you and who knows that first drink may spur an alcoholic. If you play with a snake your gonna get bit one way or another. Best to just leave it alone and get drunk in the Spirit.

There is no high like the Most High. Amen
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#11
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#11
Kerry said:
Well, ask any alcoholic of which I use to be until the cross of Christ set me free. I realize and understand that not every body that drinks is an alcoholic, But every alcoholic took their first drink and curses the day that the did.

Secondly, Jesus turning the water into wine and the master of the feast said " you have saved the best for last". Any bartender ( as I have known many) will tell you that when a person comes in and orders a drink. They make a good stiff drink, but after they have been there for a while, the bartender can start cutting back almost to the point to where there is just a very small amount of liquor in the drink and the dude can' tell the difference and the bar makes even more money.

Thirdly wine in the bible describes any drink, paste, or jelly that is made from grapes as wine. In fact the famous Greek philosophers describe fermented wine as being mixed with water. Firstly because the didn't have chlorine and a small amount of alcohol would kill the bacteria in the water. Secondly, wine was expensive so it was often watered down. The last description given by the Greeks was that it was 1 part wine and 3 parts water and would take 23 glasses to equal 1 martini.

Strong drink was considered full strength wine or beer or a type of liquor that was made from dates.

Not until prohibition here in the U.S. was grape juice separated from the term wine.


Where am I, fourthly or fifthly or sixthly any way. Your children are watching you and who knows that first drink may spur an alcoholic. If you play with a snake your gonna get bit one way or another. Best to just leave it alone and get drunk in the Spirit.

There is no high like the Most High. Amen
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Good opinion and show me the bolded in scripture!
Also denies the obvious of the text given and applies 21st century practices to 1st century A.D.
 
3

3Scoreand10

Guest
#12
#12
It seems that some who forbid drinking wine or strong drink, have no problem going to the doctor and getting drugs to calm their nerves or help them sleep when a glass of wine would work bettter and is a natrual product, not a chemical with its side affects.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#13
Dec 12, 2013
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#13
3Scoreand10 said:
It seems that some who forbid drinking wine or strong drink, have no problem going to the doctor and getting drugs to calm their nerves or help them sleep when a glass of wine would work bettter and is a natrual product, not a chemical with its side affects.
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No doubt and just because some people have a problem with wine and or strong drink does not change the acceptable boundaries as given by God in the OP.
 
4enlightment

4enlightment

Banned
#15
May 15, 2013
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#15
dcontroversal said:
ONLY if it goes beyond the above listed ACCEPTABLE BOUNDRIES that have been given by God!
As found in the OP!
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Ephesians 5:18
Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit,

1 Timothy 5:23
Stop drinking only water, and use a little wine because of your stomach and your frequent illnesses.

1 Peter 5:8
Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.

Proverbs 4:16
For they cannot rest until they do evil; they are robbed of sleep till they make someone stumble.

Matthew 26:40
Then he returned to his disciples and found them sleeping. “Couldn’t you men keep watch with me for one hour?” he asked Peter.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#16
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#16
4enlightment said:
Ephesians 5:18
Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit,

1 Timothy 5:23
Stop drinking only water, and use a little wine because of your stomach and your frequent illnesses.

1 Peter 5:8
Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.Proverbs 4:16
For they cannot rest until they do evil; they are robbed of sleep till they make someone stumble.Matthew 26:40
Then he returned to his disciples and found them sleeping. “Couldn’t you men keep watch with me for one hour?” he asked Peter.
Click to expand...


The three underlined are taken out of context and do not apply to the OP...

The first two I covered under the OP...

It comes down to the following..

1. Does it cause a weaker brother/sister to stumble or be offended Corinthians
2. Not to be drunk in excess Ephesians
3. Not to be (given) to it as in addicted or have to have it 1st Timothy
4. Being mature about it

Sober=Right Minded as applied to the CONTEXT that you ripped ONE VERSE out of to PROVE something that has not been proven!
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#17
#17
dcontroversal said:
Good opinion and show me the bolded in scripture!
Also denies the obvious of the text given and applies 21st century practices to 1st century A.D.
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Ephesians 5:17

Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.
18 And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;
19 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#18
#18
Herod , when his heart was merry with wine told the girl that danced. Ask what you will up to half my kingdom. She said give me the head of John the baptist. That snake bites hard.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#19
Dec 12, 2013
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#19
Kerry said:
Ephesians 5:17

Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.
18 And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;
19 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
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I don't see the word drunk anywhere in the context concerning THE SPIRIT!.....the word FILLED, but not drunk and this still rejects the INSPIRED ACCECTPABLE BOUNDRIES GIVEN BY GOD!
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#20
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#20
Kerry said:
Herod , when his heart was merry with wine told the girl that danced. Ask what you will up to half my kingdom. She said give me the head of John the baptist. That snake bites hard.
Click to expand...
That was Herod--->a lost man and is un-applicable within the frame work of the original OP as applied unto God's people!
 
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