Churches of Christ with or without instruments, which is the right way to worship?
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It does not say not to use musical instruments, it says :
Ephesians 5:19 (KJV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
"singing and making melody in your heart" the musical instrument is the "heart".
The command is to all, if you believe that it is a mechanical stringed instrument, then all in your assembly must learn to play a mechanical stringed musical instrument as you cannot worship for someone else.
Ephesians 5:19 (KJV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
"singing and making melody in your heart" the musical instrument is the "heart".
The command is to all, if you believe that it is a mechanical stringed instrument, then all in your assembly must learn to play a mechanical stringed musical instrument as you cannot worship for someone else.
God turned the Israelites over to WORSHIP THE STARRY HOST: That is why David wanted to play instruments in the FIRMAMENT.
The Song of the Drunkard is a pslmos. The Levites performed as soothsayer-sorcerers with instruments in the NOT COMMANDED temple and animal sacrifices.
There are many Biblical and other literature which speaks of "Making the heart strings sing." That means that the Psallo which is never used of audible melody of singing with an instruments, is IN (En, Eis) the Heart. The heart strings are SILENT. The Psallo word as used by the Septuagint translators has no musical content: If you pluck a harp-string to make it twang the Abaddon connection means that you sent fort a singing arrow into the literal heart of an enemy. Paul's use of psallo IN THE HEART should make it clear that they are excluding either the BOW string or the HARP string. We may be in danger when we say that the Spirit OF Christ and Paul were too ignorant to be able to SAY it like performance people want to TWIST IT. ALWAYS the Spirit OF Christ in the prophets makes it clear what NOT to do. Here are the sounds of God driving His enemies into "hell" as Christ warned in Isaiah 30 and many other places.
And I will lay it waste: it shall not be pruned, nor digged; but there shall come up briers and thorns: I
...... will also command the clouds that they rain no rain upon it. Is.5:6
And (they have) the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts:
...... BUT they regard not the work of the Lord, neither consider the operation of his hands. Is 5:12
BUT has this meaning:
1. The Pilot used the operation of his hands playing a video game
2. BUT, he was not considering the operation of his instrument panel.
3. THEREFORE, the plane crashed.
Therefore my people are gone into captivity, because they have no knowledge:
and their honourable men are famished, and their multitude dried up with thirst. Is 5:13
In Amos 8 the people hungered and thirsted for the WORD of God and were taken into captivity:
God said I WILL NOT PASS THIS WAY AGAIN, FOR EVER.
MUSE in the Bible and other literature MEANS "to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter."
ALL instrument SMITING words carry the meaning of a violent attack. Nimrod and modern science knows that music is an emotional attach upon a large part of the population.
pulso I. inf. parag. pulsarier, Lucr. 4, 931), 1, v. freq. a. id., to push, strike, beat (cf.: tundo, ferio, pello).
Of musical instruments: “chordas digitis et pectine eburno,” to strike, play upon, Verg. A. 6, 647: “chelyn,” (harp) Val. Fl. 1, 139: “pectine nervos,” Sil. 5, 463: “cymbala,” Juv. 9, 62.
A. In gen., to urge or drive on, to impel, to set in violent motion, to move, agitate, disturb, disquiet:
C. To drive away, remove, put out of the way
Psalmus , i, m., = psalmos, i. q. psalma,
I. In gen., to play upon a stringed instrument; esp., to play upon the cithara, to sing to the cithara: “psallere saltare elegantius,” Sall. C. 25,
Elego I. to convey away (from the family) by bequest, to bequeath away, Petr. 43, 5; Gai. Inst. 2, 215.
TO RECRUCIFY CHRIST:
Anastatoo (g387) an-as-tat-o'-o; from a der. of 450 (in the sense of removal); prop. to drive out of home, i.e. (by impl.) to disturb (lit. or fig.): - trouble, turn upside down, make an uproar, to stir up, excite, unsettle to excite tumults and seditions in the state to upset, unsettle, minds by disseminating religious error.
Psalmos , ho, twitching or twanging with the fingers, psalmoi toxônE.Ion173 (lyr.); toxêrei psalmôi [toxeusas] Id.HF1064 (lyr.)
Jesus as Spirit guiding Paul into all truth COULD HAVE used the word known by everone:
Anti-psallô , A.play a stringed instrument in accompaniment of song, a. elegois phorminga Ar.Av.218 .
Barbitos , m. (f. in the spurious epistle of Sappho, Ov. H. 15, 8; barbiton -os), a lyre, a lute Latinum, Barbite, carmen,
Psal-tikos A. of or for harp playing, ps. organon a stringed instrument, (of the magadis); andra psaltikên agathon a good harpist, Ael. ap. Ar.Byz.Epit.84.8.
Epi-psallô, A. play the lyre, S.Fr.60, Poll.4.58(Pass.);
b. melesi kai rhuthmois Plu.2.713b; measured motion, time, rhythm
c. sing, tous humnous LXX 2 Ma.1.30 - Then the priests sang the hymns.
MUSIC in the Bible and other literature MEANS "to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter."
Jesus pleads: could you not tarry with me for one hour. Can you REALLY think that "a spirit" told you that God commanded instrumental praise in YOUR happy church of Christ and I INTEND to make certain that YOU do not disobey what "a" spirit told me to do: Sorry, I promised not to do that to you but THAT was THEN and THIS is NOW. Sorry that we have discorded your happy family but our LADIES will help your life-long wife escape you because YOU dared to oppose us. Sorry that up to half of the owners will have to cast themselves our of their synagogue they paid for but we will help you find ANOTHER institution. "Besides, we warned you--like they said to J.W.McGarvey--that you have to get over it or get out.
Apollo, Abaddon or Apollyon is the LEADER of the Muses (Sorcerers in Revelation 18)
ventus , B. Plur., personified as deities, the winds: te, Apollo sancte, fer opem; teque, omnipotens Neptune, invoco; Vosque adeo, Venti! Turpil. ap. Cic. Tusc. 4, 34, 73 (Com. Rel. v. 119 Rib.); Lucr. 5, 1230 (1228); cf. Ov. H. 17 (18), 37.—
spīrĭtus The air: imber et ignis, The breath of a god, inspiration: “ spiritum Phoebus [Apollo, Abaddon, Apollyon] mihi, Phoebus artem Carminis dedit, poetic spirit or inspiration,
The Song of the Drunkard is a pslmos. The Levites performed as soothsayer-sorcerers with instruments in the NOT COMMANDED temple and animal sacrifices.
There are many Biblical and other literature which speaks of "Making the heart strings sing." That means that the Psallo which is never used of audible melody of singing with an instruments, is IN (En, Eis) the Heart. The heart strings are SILENT. The Psallo word as used by the Septuagint translators has no musical content: If you pluck a harp-string to make it twang the Abaddon connection means that you sent fort a singing arrow into the literal heart of an enemy. Paul's use of psallo IN THE HEART should make it clear that they are excluding either the BOW string or the HARP string. We may be in danger when we say that the Spirit OF Christ and Paul were too ignorant to be able to SAY it like performance people want to TWIST IT. ALWAYS the Spirit OF Christ in the prophets makes it clear what NOT to do. Here are the sounds of God driving His enemies into "hell" as Christ warned in Isaiah 30 and many other places.
And I will lay it waste: it shall not be pruned, nor digged; but there shall come up briers and thorns: I
...... will also command the clouds that they rain no rain upon it. Is.5:6
And (they have) the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts:
...... BUT they regard not the work of the Lord, neither consider the operation of his hands. Is 5:12
BUT has this meaning:
1. The Pilot used the operation of his hands playing a video game
2. BUT, he was not considering the operation of his instrument panel.
3. THEREFORE, the plane crashed.
Therefore my people are gone into captivity, because they have no knowledge:
and their honourable men are famished, and their multitude dried up with thirst. Is 5:13
In Amos 8 the people hungered and thirsted for the WORD of God and were taken into captivity:
God said I WILL NOT PASS THIS WAY AGAIN, FOR EVER.
MUSE in the Bible and other literature MEANS "to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter."
ALL instrument SMITING words carry the meaning of a violent attack. Nimrod and modern science knows that music is an emotional attach upon a large part of the population.
pulso I. inf. parag. pulsarier, Lucr. 4, 931), 1, v. freq. a. id., to push, strike, beat (cf.: tundo, ferio, pello).
Of musical instruments: “chordas digitis et pectine eburno,” to strike, play upon, Verg. A. 6, 647: “chelyn,” (harp) Val. Fl. 1, 139: “pectine nervos,” Sil. 5, 463: “cymbala,” Juv. 9, 62.
A. In gen., to urge or drive on, to impel, to set in violent motion, to move, agitate, disturb, disquiet:
C. To drive away, remove, put out of the way
Psalmus , i, m., = psalmos, i. q. psalma,
I. In gen., to play upon a stringed instrument; esp., to play upon the cithara, to sing to the cithara: “psallere saltare elegantius,” Sall. C. 25,
Elego I. to convey away (from the family) by bequest, to bequeath away, Petr. 43, 5; Gai. Inst. 2, 215.
TO RECRUCIFY CHRIST:
Anastatoo (g387) an-as-tat-o'-o; from a der. of 450 (in the sense of removal); prop. to drive out of home, i.e. (by impl.) to disturb (lit. or fig.): - trouble, turn upside down, make an uproar, to stir up, excite, unsettle to excite tumults and seditions in the state to upset, unsettle, minds by disseminating religious error.
Psalmos , ho, twitching or twanging with the fingers, psalmoi toxônE.Ion173 (lyr.); toxêrei psalmôi [toxeusas] Id.HF1064 (lyr.)
Jesus as Spirit guiding Paul into all truth COULD HAVE used the word known by everone:
Anti-psallô , A.play a stringed instrument in accompaniment of song, a. elegois phorminga Ar.Av.218 .
Barbitos , m. (f. in the spurious epistle of Sappho, Ov. H. 15, 8; barbiton -os), a lyre, a lute Latinum, Barbite, carmen,
Psal-tikos A. of or for harp playing, ps. organon a stringed instrument, (of the magadis); andra psaltikên agathon a good harpist, Ael. ap. Ar.Byz.Epit.84.8.
Epi-psallô, A. play the lyre, S.Fr.60, Poll.4.58(Pass.);
b. melesi kai rhuthmois Plu.2.713b; measured motion, time, rhythm
c. sing, tous humnous LXX 2 Ma.1.30 - Then the priests sang the hymns.
MUSIC in the Bible and other literature MEANS "to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter."
Jesus pleads: could you not tarry with me for one hour. Can you REALLY think that "a spirit" told you that God commanded instrumental praise in YOUR happy church of Christ and I INTEND to make certain that YOU do not disobey what "a" spirit told me to do: Sorry, I promised not to do that to you but THAT was THEN and THIS is NOW. Sorry that we have discorded your happy family but our LADIES will help your life-long wife escape you because YOU dared to oppose us. Sorry that up to half of the owners will have to cast themselves our of their synagogue they paid for but we will help you find ANOTHER institution. "Besides, we warned you--like they said to J.W.McGarvey--that you have to get over it or get out.
Apollo, Abaddon or Apollyon is the LEADER of the Muses (Sorcerers in Revelation 18)
ventus , B. Plur., personified as deities, the winds: te, Apollo sancte, fer opem; teque, omnipotens Neptune, invoco; Vosque adeo, Venti! Turpil. ap. Cic. Tusc. 4, 34, 73 (Com. Rel. v. 119 Rib.); Lucr. 5, 1230 (1228); cf. Ov. H. 17 (18), 37.—
spīrĭtus The air: imber et ignis, The breath of a god, inspiration: “ spiritum Phoebus [Apollo, Abaddon, Apollyon] mihi, Phoebus artem Carminis dedit, poetic spirit or inspiration,
No, I'm in the middle of the house in the middle of a farm in the middle of a 2600 acre forest in the middle of Lewis county in the middle of Tennessee in the middle of my second pot of coffee. And I ain't a gonna leave. Amos is in the middle of the prophets in the middle of the Bible where the Spirit OF Christ defined His future REST (from whatever) both inclusively and exclusively.
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And here we are again. You are curious about whether the word legalist or legalism is found in the bible. You and I both know that those terms are not in the bible. Can you find "lap top computer" or Gigabyte in the word of God? Of course not, they had not one clue how to manufacture a computer chip, yet we find them in a huge number of devices and appliances.
Although a term or item is NOT in the bible does not mean it has never and will never exist. So what exactly is your point? That if we do not perform the act "exactly" as they did, then it is invalid. Where in the NT is it said that we are to do exactly what Jesus did on the occasion of the last supper?
And though the word Legalist and Legalism are not found in the NT, it does not invalidate that it applies to you! Because they didn't have lap top computers does not mean that it is invalid or sinful to use them because we do have them today, or else you wouldn't be in this forum.
And if you are going to say that we should do exactly as they did, show me the songbooks that they used in the NT. Yet you do not practice foot washing as Jesus demonstrated to his disciples. Nor do you use one cup to partake of communion. So tell us all where you get the authority to perform these practices! You don't think holding a hymnal disrupts ones train of thought in worship? Hogwash!
The problem with legalism, and you are a legalist so don't deny it, is that they feel there must be a command of God in order for something to be valid and "legal". Yet you will pick and choose what you prefer to call "legal", and explain away "footwashing", and "one communion cup", and women having their "hair covered" in the assembly with fanciful arguments and rationalizations. How convenient for a legalist to be the final "authority" on what is binding and not binding.
The church of Christ is inconsistent on hundreds of issues: Can a Christian join the military or the police force? Yes or No? Can a church support an orphan's home out of the Sunday offerings? Tell us all, Yes or No? Can elders of the church receive a salary out of the Sunday offerings? Yes or No. And since you insist that it must be commanded or insinuated somewhere in the NT, please provide scriptures to support your answers. But you cannot find scriptures to specifically establish a statement condemning these issues, because THEY AREN'T THERE.
Yet these very issues divide the churches of Christ, while the rest of us look on bemused. Astonished at how you are slaves to your own creed: "Speak where the bible speaks, and be silent where the bible is silent!"
Really? Honestly? Truthfully? Because there are many things which the church of Christ does which have no scriptural authority or precedent, such as: The order of worship, Sunday school and hymnals. Yet they have no problem rationalizing the way in which they do these things, despite the fact that none of them are "declared" or "commanded" specifically in the NT.
So why does the coC do things not even mentioned in the NT, and yet refuse to do many things which ARE mentioned; such as requiring women to cover their heads in the assembly which is declared necessary by Paul..."because of the angels."?? I have not been to a coC yet that requires their women to cover their heads in the assembly.
And Paul concludes his discourse on this subject of head coverings by stating that the APOSTLES have no other practice, NOR HAVE THE CHURCHES OF GOD.
This whole head covering issue is dealt with in 1 Cor 11:1-16. And v2, part of Paul's salutation to the Corinthians says: "2. Now I praise you because you remember me in everything; and hold firmly to the TRADITIONS, JUST AS I DELIVERED THEM TO YOU."
He then goes into the "tradition", if you will, of head coverings in worship, taking a full 16 verses to discuss its importance.
Yet the coC, which insists on speaking where the bible speaks, teaches against this, despite the fact that Paul, in defence of this "practice" or "custom" states that "we", the APOSTLES, have no other "practice" or "custom", "NOR HAVE THE CHURCHES OF GOD." And this was spoken for the benefit of those who might be "contentious" about it.
Best coC answer: "Well this applied to those living then, and has no reference to us today."
Well how convenient, that the legalists conveniently ignore Paul's instruction over continuing this practice, or custom.
The above rebuttal is utter hogwash and fickleness concerning the scriptures. To tell everyone else that unless something is mentioned in the NT, then it is sinful to practice, yet deny practices that ARE there.
So NO, the words legalist and legalism are not in the NT, but that does mean that they should not be in today's language.
If you have trouble with the label of "legalistic", then stop being that way, and praise God for the freedom he has given you in Christ.
And even though we disagree about lots of things I still say God bless you and keep you and may His countenance shine upon you, and give you peace.
Although a term or item is NOT in the bible does not mean it has never and will never exist. So what exactly is your point? That if we do not perform the act "exactly" as they did, then it is invalid. Where in the NT is it said that we are to do exactly what Jesus did on the occasion of the last supper?
And though the word Legalist and Legalism are not found in the NT, it does not invalidate that it applies to you! Because they didn't have lap top computers does not mean that it is invalid or sinful to use them because we do have them today, or else you wouldn't be in this forum.
And if you are going to say that we should do exactly as they did, show me the songbooks that they used in the NT. Yet you do not practice foot washing as Jesus demonstrated to his disciples. Nor do you use one cup to partake of communion. So tell us all where you get the authority to perform these practices! You don't think holding a hymnal disrupts ones train of thought in worship? Hogwash!
The problem with legalism, and you are a legalist so don't deny it, is that they feel there must be a command of God in order for something to be valid and "legal". Yet you will pick and choose what you prefer to call "legal", and explain away "footwashing", and "one communion cup", and women having their "hair covered" in the assembly with fanciful arguments and rationalizations. How convenient for a legalist to be the final "authority" on what is binding and not binding.
The church of Christ is inconsistent on hundreds of issues: Can a Christian join the military or the police force? Yes or No? Can a church support an orphan's home out of the Sunday offerings? Tell us all, Yes or No? Can elders of the church receive a salary out of the Sunday offerings? Yes or No. And since you insist that it must be commanded or insinuated somewhere in the NT, please provide scriptures to support your answers. But you cannot find scriptures to specifically establish a statement condemning these issues, because THEY AREN'T THERE.
Yet these very issues divide the churches of Christ, while the rest of us look on bemused. Astonished at how you are slaves to your own creed: "Speak where the bible speaks, and be silent where the bible is silent!"
Really? Honestly? Truthfully? Because there are many things which the church of Christ does which have no scriptural authority or precedent, such as: The order of worship, Sunday school and hymnals. Yet they have no problem rationalizing the way in which they do these things, despite the fact that none of them are "declared" or "commanded" specifically in the NT.
So why does the coC do things not even mentioned in the NT, and yet refuse to do many things which ARE mentioned; such as requiring women to cover their heads in the assembly which is declared necessary by Paul..."because of the angels."?? I have not been to a coC yet that requires their women to cover their heads in the assembly.
And Paul concludes his discourse on this subject of head coverings by stating that the APOSTLES have no other practice, NOR HAVE THE CHURCHES OF GOD.
This whole head covering issue is dealt with in 1 Cor 11:1-16. And v2, part of Paul's salutation to the Corinthians says: "2. Now I praise you because you remember me in everything; and hold firmly to the TRADITIONS, JUST AS I DELIVERED THEM TO YOU."
He then goes into the "tradition", if you will, of head coverings in worship, taking a full 16 verses to discuss its importance.
Yet the coC, which insists on speaking where the bible speaks, teaches against this, despite the fact that Paul, in defence of this "practice" or "custom" states that "we", the APOSTLES, have no other "practice" or "custom", "NOR HAVE THE CHURCHES OF GOD." And this was spoken for the benefit of those who might be "contentious" about it.
Best coC answer: "Well this applied to those living then, and has no reference to us today."
Well how convenient, that the legalists conveniently ignore Paul's instruction over continuing this practice, or custom.
The above rebuttal is utter hogwash and fickleness concerning the scriptures. To tell everyone else that unless something is mentioned in the NT, then it is sinful to practice, yet deny practices that ARE there.
So NO, the words legalist and legalism are not in the NT, but that does mean that they should not be in today's language.
If you have trouble with the label of "legalistic", then stop being that way, and praise God for the freedom he has given you in Christ.
And even though we disagree about lots of things I still say God bless you and keep you and may His countenance shine upon you, and give you peace.
Jesus commanded and Paul explained the Lord's Supper (when you come together and that was once a week) as SHOWING FORTH the death of Jesus. In fact, the Lord's upper is the only concept of PREACHING in an established congrgation. When we preach that Jesus died for our sins and defined the assembly as "teaching that which He commanded to be taught" (Prophetic type in Isaiah 58 which OUTLAWS seeking our own pleasure or speaking our own ways as how to RESTORE THE OLD PATHS, a non-legalists simply has nothing to add.
If the preacher missed in Jesus' list of gifts insists that you pay him to speak that which he has written and refuse to preach the death of Jesus Christ which silences us as the Lord's Supper, what shall we say. The LAW was imposed because of instrumental idolatry at Mount Sinai where people refused to hear the Covenant of Grace and rose up to worship the Egyptian triad which WAS legalism.
INSTRUMENTALISTS: The LAW OF SILENCE which allows individuals to make up for God's lack was in fact invented by INSTRUMENTALISTS which declared their opinion as becoming THE LAW OF CHRIST. If you object then mean like J.W.McGarvey was told "to get over it or get out."
HISTORIC CHURCH OF CHRIST: The Law of Silence flaunted by Eve in the Garden of Eden and defined in Scripture from end to end and endorsed by all historic scholars and founders of denominations. That is what is used when peaceable churches (not Churches of Christ) told those who violated Scripture and the historic understanding that YOU CANNOT IMPOSE something not required. Especially when sowing of discord still made the instrument profitable even if many members left.
A Sectarian is one who IMPOSES and can never be the one IMPOSED UPON.
A Legalist is one who DOES something by the works of human hands in houses built by human hands and defines that as WORSHIP.
To their credit most churches of Christ do not make much of a issue of musical performers until the first LAW OFSILENCE PEOPLE plot as they say "to infiltrate and divert" or transistion YOUR property and family into the Instrumental Sectarian census. I have watched it for my alert 83 years and that is a fact. The internet is filled with hatred against people who REFUSE to begin doing what they have NEVER done with direct commands, approved examples and necessary inferences if you grasp that a Christian is a Disciple is a Student and the only resource is "that which Jesus commanded to be taught and observed." A Church of Christ is built upon or educated by the Prophets and Apostles and that simply does not leave any Roles or Doles for performing musician.
The FACTS of the Word cannot be interpreted by saying that someone is a something: I look at the black text on brown paper and it still says that rhetoric, singing, playing, acting or dancing are by DEFINITION Legalistic: they must all be performed by exact rules learned by HARD WORK of their human hands.
Legalism is well defined in the Bible. Jesus defined the Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites: in Ezekiel 33 names rhetoricians, singers and instrument players. Legalism defines in great detail the RULES of rhetoric, singing and playing instruments.
The Israelites at Mount Sinai rose up to PLAY: That means acting, singing, playing instruments and dancing. Works includes Composing a song or poem which intends to trump or assist God. Songs must follow a very strict rule and must be performed by one of the most WORKS-INTENSIVE craft in the world. Religious music is highly honed so that it creates a MOOD or a physical response. It is always rehearsed and people HIRE people to PERFORM the WORK of a musical worship minister (an oxymoron since Jesus said that worship is IN the Spirit as a PLACE as it lies DORMANT and gives attention (the unique worship concept) to the WORD of God. Logos is the OPPOSITE of all of the legalistic performance roles of Inventing self-reference stories (Gallup says mostly fabricated), PERFORMING RHETORIC as the primary meaning of hypocrite, Clapping or Waving as the WORKS of human hands. Singing takes a lot of skill learning the LAWS of "four part Fanny." Sitting and listening to a Word-devoid makes Sunday one of the most stressful days of the Week.
Paul commanded that we understand the WILL [thelēma] of Christ so that we can SPEAK that which is written: Speak is the opposite of SING.
Plat. Laws 2.657b all this lapse of time are the compositions of Isis. Hence, as I said, if one could by any means succeed in grasping no principle [Nomos , ho, (nemō) b. in VT, of the law of God, “en tō nomō Kuriou to thelēma autou” ] of correctness in tune, one might then with confidence reduce them to legal form and prescription, since the tendency of pleasure and pain to indulge constantly in fresh music has, after all, no very great power to corrupt choric forms that are consecrated, by merely scoffing at them as antiquated. In Egypt, at any rate, it seems to have had no such power of corrupting,—
The BEAST in Revelation is defined as a NEW FORM OF MUSIC OR DRAMA. Plato understood the human works problem
If the preacher missed in Jesus' list of gifts insists that you pay him to speak that which he has written and refuse to preach the death of Jesus Christ which silences us as the Lord's Supper, what shall we say. The LAW was imposed because of instrumental idolatry at Mount Sinai where people refused to hear the Covenant of Grace and rose up to worship the Egyptian triad which WAS legalism.
INSTRUMENTALISTS: The LAW OF SILENCE which allows individuals to make up for God's lack was in fact invented by INSTRUMENTALISTS which declared their opinion as becoming THE LAW OF CHRIST. If you object then mean like J.W.McGarvey was told "to get over it or get out."
HISTORIC CHURCH OF CHRIST: The Law of Silence flaunted by Eve in the Garden of Eden and defined in Scripture from end to end and endorsed by all historic scholars and founders of denominations. That is what is used when peaceable churches (not Churches of Christ) told those who violated Scripture and the historic understanding that YOU CANNOT IMPOSE something not required. Especially when sowing of discord still made the instrument profitable even if many members left.
A Sectarian is one who IMPOSES and can never be the one IMPOSED UPON.
A Legalist is one who DOES something by the works of human hands in houses built by human hands and defines that as WORSHIP.
To their credit most churches of Christ do not make much of a issue of musical performers until the first LAW OFSILENCE PEOPLE plot as they say "to infiltrate and divert" or transistion YOUR property and family into the Instrumental Sectarian census. I have watched it for my alert 83 years and that is a fact. The internet is filled with hatred against people who REFUSE to begin doing what they have NEVER done with direct commands, approved examples and necessary inferences if you grasp that a Christian is a Disciple is a Student and the only resource is "that which Jesus commanded to be taught and observed." A Church of Christ is built upon or educated by the Prophets and Apostles and that simply does not leave any Roles or Doles for performing musician.
The FACTS of the Word cannot be interpreted by saying that someone is a something: I look at the black text on brown paper and it still says that rhetoric, singing, playing, acting or dancing are by DEFINITION Legalistic: they must all be performed by exact rules learned by HARD WORK of their human hands.
Legalism is well defined in the Bible. Jesus defined the Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites: in Ezekiel 33 names rhetoricians, singers and instrument players. Legalism defines in great detail the RULES of rhetoric, singing and playing instruments.
The Israelites at Mount Sinai rose up to PLAY: That means acting, singing, playing instruments and dancing. Works includes Composing a song or poem which intends to trump or assist God. Songs must follow a very strict rule and must be performed by one of the most WORKS-INTENSIVE craft in the world. Religious music is highly honed so that it creates a MOOD or a physical response. It is always rehearsed and people HIRE people to PERFORM the WORK of a musical worship minister (an oxymoron since Jesus said that worship is IN the Spirit as a PLACE as it lies DORMANT and gives attention (the unique worship concept) to the WORD of God. Logos is the OPPOSITE of all of the legalistic performance roles of Inventing self-reference stories (Gallup says mostly fabricated), PERFORMING RHETORIC as the primary meaning of hypocrite, Clapping or Waving as the WORKS of human hands. Singing takes a lot of skill learning the LAWS of "four part Fanny." Sitting and listening to a Word-devoid makes Sunday one of the most stressful days of the Week.
Paul commanded that we understand the WILL [thelēma] of Christ so that we can SPEAK that which is written: Speak is the opposite of SING.
Plat. Laws 2.657b all this lapse of time are the compositions of Isis. Hence, as I said, if one could by any means succeed in grasping no principle [Nomos , ho, (nemō) b. in VT, of the law of God, “en tō nomō Kuriou to thelēma autou” ] of correctness in tune, one might then with confidence reduce them to legal form and prescription, since the tendency of pleasure and pain to indulge constantly in fresh music has, after all, no very great power to corrupt choric forms that are consecrated, by merely scoffing at them as antiquated. In Egypt, at any rate, it seems to have had no such power of corrupting,—
The BEAST in Revelation is defined as a NEW FORM OF MUSIC OR DRAMA. Plato understood the human works problem
1Corinthians 11:2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things,
and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.
paradidōmi hoi paradedomenoi theoi the traditional gods, Din.1.94; “hē oikia . . egkekōmiasmenē paradedotai hēmin” Pl.Chrm.157e; dogmati paradothēnai to be embodied in a decree, D.C.57.20. b.teach doctrine, Ev.Luc.1.2, Sor.1.124, M.Ant.1.8,
para-dosis , eōs, hē 2. transmission of legends, doctrines, etc., tradition, “didaskaliakai p.” Pl.Lg.803a; “
3. that which is handed down or bequeathed, tradition, doctrine, teaching, “hē p. tōnpresbuterōn” Ev.Matt.15.2, Ev.Marc.7.3,
1Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, ethelō [the Will of god]
that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
1Corinthians 11:4 Every man praying or prophesying, [prophēteuōn]
having his head covered, dishonoureth his head.
By having his head uncovered he acknowledged that he had nothing of his own to say as Jesus had nothing to say other than what the One God the Father breathed (spirit) into him. Hebrews 12 says that if you don't come before Him in reverence and godly fear then remember Nadab and Abihu: God is a consuming fire.
Prophesying ot preaching under the influence of the Holy Spirit included only those men upon whom an apostle had ordained to take HIS Word into "all the province" as at Ephesus.
prophēt-euō II.expound, interpret, preach, under the influence of the Holy Spirit, Ev.Luc.1.67, Ev.Jo.11.51, Act.Ap.2.17, 19.6, 1 Ep.Cor. 11.4, 13.9,
However, the Mad Women in Corinth were well noted because many were just out of paganism where they may have served at the temple of Apollo (Abaddon, Apollyon). Paul wants the men and everyone to be quiet and peaceful "so that all may be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth." This would prove that there is ONE GOD the Father and ONE MEDIATOR between man and God, the man Jesus Christ.
The Uncovered prophesiers of Corinth would sing, play, dance and whatever it took to drive the men into mania so that they could pick their pockets. Being UNCOVERED for men or women meant that they were not in subjection to the Will of God which Paul delievered as ORDINANCES: they were not traditions in the NOMOS or legalism sense.
1Corinthians 11:5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth [prophēteuousa]
.....with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head:
.....for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
The Prophesying or speaking in tongues compared to lifeless instruments which Jesus did not need and will not tolerate: when Jesus delivered Peter's PART he said that it must not be private interpreted meaning further expounded because they would prove that they were not in subjection.
Prophesying as almost a 100% female practice is:
prophēt-euō A to be a prophētēs or interpreter of the gods, “manteueo, Moisa, prophateusō d' egō” Pi. l.c.; tis prophēteuei theou; who is his interpreter? E.Ion 413; “hoi prophēteuontes tou hirou” Hdt.7.111;
---mant-euomai , divine, prophesy, with the dead, 2. generally, presage, forebode, surmise, of presentiment, OPPOSITE. knowledge, II. consult an oracle, seek divinations, Pi.O.7.31, Hdt.1.46, 4.172, etc.; “en Delphoisi” I [Oracle of Abaddon or Apollyon]
.
---Mousa , II. mousa, as Appellat., music, song, “m. stugera” [DAUGHTERS] A.Eu.308 (anap.); “euphamos” Id.Supp.695 (lyr.); “kanakhan . . theias antiluron mousas” S.Tr.643 (
Peter laid down the ORDANCE or Divine tradition if you wish:
1Peter 4:11 If any man speak,
Let him speak as the oracles of God;
.....I If any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth:
that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
The uncovered prophesiers would be women (almost always in the text) who were not ashamed to PERFORM by singing, clapping, playing instruments and waving unholy ARMS instead of turning up holy PALMS as if reading the Word (watch the Muslims)
1Corinthians 11:6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn:
.....but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
1Corinthians 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, philoneikos eager for strife
we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.
We have no custom in any church that a man pretend to be a prophet instead of teaching that which has been taught by inspired Prophets and Apostles.
We have no custom permitted in any of the churches of women "prophesiers." Men would bring on wrath or ORGY and the women would always be less than honorable and would cause the School (only) of the Word (only) to become just another pagan worship center.
sunētheia , hē, A.habitual intercourse, acquaintance, intimacy, b. sexual intercourse, X.Cyr.6.1.31 (v.l.); “s. ekhein meta gunaikos” Plu.2.310e; “pros gunaika”
2. of animals, herding together, II. habit, custom, h.Merc.485 (pl.), Hp.VM3, Pl.R. 516a, etc.; pl., phaulai s. bad habits,
consŭētūdo , ĭnis, f. consuesco. interpretemur,” “and sermonis, B. In partic., intercourse in love, in an honorable, and more freq. in a dishonorable sense, a love affair, an amour, love intrique, illicit intercourse,
Sensus
B. To feel, experience (with acc. of the feelin
2. Opinions, doctrines (late Lat.): “sensa et inventa Disarii,” sentiat et voluptatem
1Corinthians 11:17 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.
A mixed-sex Worship Team is the center of the warning of Jude and the Book of Enoch.
and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.
paradidōmi hoi paradedomenoi theoi the traditional gods, Din.1.94; “hē oikia . . egkekōmiasmenē paradedotai hēmin” Pl.Chrm.157e; dogmati paradothēnai to be embodied in a decree, D.C.57.20. b.teach doctrine, Ev.Luc.1.2, Sor.1.124, M.Ant.1.8,
para-dosis , eōs, hē 2. transmission of legends, doctrines, etc., tradition, “didaskaliakai p.” Pl.Lg.803a; “
3. that which is handed down or bequeathed, tradition, doctrine, teaching, “hē p. tōnpresbuterōn” Ev.Matt.15.2, Ev.Marc.7.3,
1Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, ethelō [the Will of god]
that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
1Corinthians 11:4 Every man praying or prophesying, [prophēteuōn]
having his head covered, dishonoureth his head.
By having his head uncovered he acknowledged that he had nothing of his own to say as Jesus had nothing to say other than what the One God the Father breathed (spirit) into him. Hebrews 12 says that if you don't come before Him in reverence and godly fear then remember Nadab and Abihu: God is a consuming fire.
Prophesying ot preaching under the influence of the Holy Spirit included only those men upon whom an apostle had ordained to take HIS Word into "all the province" as at Ephesus.
prophēt-euō II.expound, interpret, preach, under the influence of the Holy Spirit, Ev.Luc.1.67, Ev.Jo.11.51, Act.Ap.2.17, 19.6, 1 Ep.Cor. 11.4, 13.9,
However, the Mad Women in Corinth were well noted because many were just out of paganism where they may have served at the temple of Apollo (Abaddon, Apollyon). Paul wants the men and everyone to be quiet and peaceful "so that all may be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth." This would prove that there is ONE GOD the Father and ONE MEDIATOR between man and God, the man Jesus Christ.
The Uncovered prophesiers of Corinth would sing, play, dance and whatever it took to drive the men into mania so that they could pick their pockets. Being UNCOVERED for men or women meant that they were not in subjection to the Will of God which Paul delievered as ORDINANCES: they were not traditions in the NOMOS or legalism sense.
1Corinthians 11:5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth [prophēteuousa]
.....with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head:
.....for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
The Prophesying or speaking in tongues compared to lifeless instruments which Jesus did not need and will not tolerate: when Jesus delivered Peter's PART he said that it must not be private interpreted meaning further expounded because they would prove that they were not in subjection.
Prophesying as almost a 100% female practice is:
prophēt-euō A to be a prophētēs or interpreter of the gods, “manteueo, Moisa, prophateusō d' egō” Pi. l.c.; tis prophēteuei theou; who is his interpreter? E.Ion 413; “hoi prophēteuontes tou hirou” Hdt.7.111;
---mant-euomai , divine, prophesy, with the dead, 2. generally, presage, forebode, surmise, of presentiment, OPPOSITE. knowledge, II. consult an oracle, seek divinations, Pi.O.7.31, Hdt.1.46, 4.172, etc.; “en Delphoisi” I [Oracle of Abaddon or Apollyon]
.
---Mousa , II. mousa, as Appellat., music, song, “m. stugera” [DAUGHTERS] A.Eu.308 (anap.); “euphamos” Id.Supp.695 (lyr.); “kanakhan . . theias antiluron mousas” S.Tr.643 (
Peter laid down the ORDANCE or Divine tradition if you wish:
1Peter 4:11 If any man speak,
Let him speak as the oracles of God;
.....I If any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth:
that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
The uncovered prophesiers would be women (almost always in the text) who were not ashamed to PERFORM by singing, clapping, playing instruments and waving unholy ARMS instead of turning up holy PALMS as if reading the Word (watch the Muslims)
1Corinthians 11:6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn:
.....but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
1Corinthians 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, philoneikos eager for strife
we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.
We have no custom in any church that a man pretend to be a prophet instead of teaching that which has been taught by inspired Prophets and Apostles.
We have no custom permitted in any of the churches of women "prophesiers." Men would bring on wrath or ORGY and the women would always be less than honorable and would cause the School (only) of the Word (only) to become just another pagan worship center.
sunētheia , hē, A.habitual intercourse, acquaintance, intimacy, b. sexual intercourse, X.Cyr.6.1.31 (v.l.); “s. ekhein meta gunaikos” Plu.2.310e; “pros gunaika”
2. of animals, herding together, II. habit, custom, h.Merc.485 (pl.), Hp.VM3, Pl.R. 516a, etc.; pl., phaulai s. bad habits,
consŭētūdo , ĭnis, f. consuesco. interpretemur,” “and sermonis, B. In partic., intercourse in love, in an honorable, and more freq. in a dishonorable sense, a love affair, an amour, love intrique, illicit intercourse,
Sensus
B. To feel, experience (with acc. of the feelin
2. Opinions, doctrines (late Lat.): “sensa et inventa Disarii,” sentiat et voluptatem
1Corinthians 11:17 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.
A mixed-sex Worship Team is the center of the warning of Jude and the Book of Enoch.
There is no such command! I think Jesus is unhappy with this fixation. If you don't want instruments, then it is good that you do not use them. I would also like to take this time to say that if you think instrumental music is displeasing to God then I am sure that you are not using it outside of church. I never really understood how members of the Church of Christ (of which I am a member) could complain about instruments in service and then go outside and turn country, classical, rock, etc, on in their car. If God doesn't like it, then he doesn't like it.
if you just read what is said in the scripture itself, the Word is clear. the command is to rejoice!
Rejoice evermore
(1 Thessalonians 5:16)
now Christ said that ALL that is written in the Psalms of Him must be fulfilled:
And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures.
(Luke 24:44-45)
wonderful!
now what do the Psalms say of Him?
I will also praise thee with the psaltery, even thy truth, O my God:
unto thee will I sing with the harp, O thou Holy One of Israel.
My lips shall greatly rejoice when I sing unto thee; and my soul, which thou hast redeemed.
My tongue also shall talk of thy righteousness all the day long:
for they are confounded, for they are brought unto shame, that seek my hurt.
(Psalm 71:22-24)
who else is it that redeems our souls? it is Christ Jesus! so this Psalm speaks of Him which we are commanded to rejoice over. that same Lord has said that all that is written of Him in the Psalms must come to pass.
can anyone not see that this Psalm says "sing with the harp" ?
even more, because you lie and say it is detestable and unholy to make a joyful sound before Him, see how the one called "after God's own heart" says he will sing with music to the HOLY ONE ?
we could look at Psalms and discuss rejoicing for the next 5 years easily, i hope we do!
let's just see one more for now:
Praise ye the LORD. Sing unto the LORD a new song,
and his praise in the congregation of saints.
Let Israel rejoice in him that made him: let the children of Zion be joyful in their King.
Let them praise his name in the dance: let them sing praises unto him with the timbrel and harp.
For the LORD taketh pleasure in his people:
he will beautify the meek with salvation.
Let the saints be joyful in glory: let them sing aloud upon their beds.
Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a twoedged sword in their hand;
To execute vengeance upon the heathen, and punishments upon the people;
To bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron;
To execute upon them the judgment written:
this honour have all his saints.
Praise ye the LORD.
(Psalm 149)
now what is written in the Psalms of Christ must be fulfilled. the Lord Himself says it!
who is it that "beautifies the meek with salvation" ?
who is it that is the LORD?? none other but our salvation, Christ Jesus!
so this Psalm also speaks of Him.
what is the instruction?
"praise His name in the dance"
"sing praises unto Him with the timbrel and the harp"
you can quote the 5th alternate definition of a 3rd simile as it is used out of context in a pagan poet's ode to diana of the ephesians all day and all night.
me and my house will look to the Word of God, where the Spirit makes all things plain to the children of God, and we will rejoice in Him!
Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice.
(Philippians 4:4)
you want to do a "word study" ?
i suggest you go study up on what it means to rejoice, and how it can be done.
we rejoice, YOU REJOICE!
i see your condemnation and i return to you this cup of JOY!!
now i hope you don't spend another day looking for obscure references to condemnation. the JOY of the LORD is your strength, walk in it!
Rejoice evermore
(1 Thessalonians 5:16)
now Christ said that ALL that is written in the Psalms of Him must be fulfilled:
And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures.
(Luke 24:44-45)
wonderful!
now what do the Psalms say of Him?
I will also praise thee with the psaltery, even thy truth, O my God:
unto thee will I sing with the harp, O thou Holy One of Israel.
My lips shall greatly rejoice when I sing unto thee; and my soul, which thou hast redeemed.
My tongue also shall talk of thy righteousness all the day long:
for they are confounded, for they are brought unto shame, that seek my hurt.
(Psalm 71:22-24)
who else is it that redeems our souls? it is Christ Jesus! so this Psalm speaks of Him which we are commanded to rejoice over. that same Lord has said that all that is written of Him in the Psalms must come to pass.
can anyone not see that this Psalm says "sing with the harp" ?
even more, because you lie and say it is detestable and unholy to make a joyful sound before Him, see how the one called "after God's own heart" says he will sing with music to the HOLY ONE ?
we could look at Psalms and discuss rejoicing for the next 5 years easily, i hope we do!
let's just see one more for now:
Praise ye the LORD. Sing unto the LORD a new song,
and his praise in the congregation of saints.
Let Israel rejoice in him that made him: let the children of Zion be joyful in their King.
Let them praise his name in the dance: let them sing praises unto him with the timbrel and harp.
For the LORD taketh pleasure in his people:
he will beautify the meek with salvation.
Let the saints be joyful in glory: let them sing aloud upon their beds.
Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a twoedged sword in their hand;
To execute vengeance upon the heathen, and punishments upon the people;
To bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron;
To execute upon them the judgment written:
this honour have all his saints.
Praise ye the LORD.
(Psalm 149)
now what is written in the Psalms of Christ must be fulfilled. the Lord Himself says it!
who is it that "beautifies the meek with salvation" ?
who is it that is the LORD?? none other but our salvation, Christ Jesus!
so this Psalm also speaks of Him.
what is the instruction?
"praise His name in the dance"
"sing praises unto Him with the timbrel and the harp"
you can quote the 5th alternate definition of a 3rd simile as it is used out of context in a pagan poet's ode to diana of the ephesians all day and all night.
me and my house will look to the Word of God, where the Spirit makes all things plain to the children of God, and we will rejoice in Him!
Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice.
(Philippians 4:4)
you want to do a "word study" ?
i suggest you go study up on what it means to rejoice, and how it can be done.
we rejoice, YOU REJOICE!
i see your condemnation and i return to you this cup of JOY!!
now i hope you don't spend another day looking for obscure references to condemnation. the JOY of the LORD is your strength, walk in it!
BUT, not as an act of worship which except for a tiny number will NOT show up pay for musical performance replacing the School of the Word.
Quote: "1Th 5:16 Rejoice evermore."
Context means: a greeting on arriving or leaving: not a musical performance silencing the Word of christ
Charis or Grace: 1. at meeting, hail, welcome (esp. in the morning, acc. to D.C.69.18, c2. at leavetaking, fare-thee-well, Od.5.205, 13.59, 15.151; “khaire poll' ōdelphe
CONTEXT:
1Th 5:7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
1Th 5:8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.
nēphō , to be sober, drink no wine,“oute ti gar n. oute liēn methuō” [used in "fluted down with wine]
methuō 2. of persons, to be intoxicated with passion, pride, etc., “hupo tēsAphroditēs” X.Smp.8.21; “hupotruphēs”
kat-auleô , A. charm [sorcery] by flute-playing, tinos phobôi I will flute to you on a ghastly flute, E.HF871 (troch.):--Pass., of persons, methuôn kai katauloumenos drinking wine to the strains of theflute, Pl.R.561c; k. pros chelônidos psophon to be played to on the flute with lyre accompaniment, P to be piped down, ridiculed, “gelōmenoi kai -oumenoi”
Jesus cast the minstrels and crowd DOWN especially when they ridiculed them
tru^ph-ē , hē, (thruptō) A.softness, delicacy, daintiness, malthakia
II. luxuriousness, wantonness, “tōn gunaikōn
1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath,
org-aō II. of men, like sphrigaō, swell with lust, wax wanton, be rampant, Ar.Lys.1113, Av. 462 (where the Sch. explains it epithumētikōsekhō) ; “ho ep' aphrodisioismainomenos . . orgōn” 2. generally, to be eager or ready, to be excited, “Lakedaimoniōn orgōntōn emellon peirasesthai” Th.4.108 ; orgōntes krinein judge under the influence of passion, [The laded burden or self pleasure]
LATIN: com-mŏvĕoA. To remove from a place, to carry away,
to move or carry about the sacred utensils, images, etc., for religious use,
"if I put my instruments (artifices, tricks, etc.) in motion,}
cornū , A. (Acc. to I. A.) To move, drive back, distodge, refute, horn or b. A bugle-horn, a horn, trumpet(cornua —In a sarcastic double sense with a.: dum tendit citharam noster,
Paul wants the men and women to be silent "so that all might be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth."
Only mature males ordained by Christ were prophesiers in that they could interpret the WORD Paul delivered by this special gift.
Paul excludes the women or women-type prophesyin as an ORGY.
“hoep' aphrodisiois mainomenos . .orgōn”
From Mount Sinai onward the PLAY in instrumental rejoicing LED to sexual abuse see Romans 1. Therefore the Aphrodite (Venus, Lucifer) type of prophesying
WORKS in the most extreme sense is even among solemn instrumental churches which have been invaded by what they boast of as Rock and Roll. Therefore, LEGALISM is prohibited by Paul in several places:
Aphrodis-ios , a, on, also os, on D.H.2.24, Luc.Am.12, Ael.NA1.2:—A.belonging to the goddess of love, “ergon” 2. festival of Aphrodite, “A. agein” Id.HG5.4 II. Aphrodisia, ta, sexual pleasures,
Pindar, Nemean, 9 Muses, we will go in victory procession from Apollo's [Abaddon, Apollyon] shrine in Sicyon to newly-founded Aetna, where the doors flung open wide are overwhelmed by guests, at the prosperous home of Chromius. Make a sweet song of verses!...[6] There is a saying among men: a noble deed when it is accomplished should not be buried silently in the ground; and divine song is suited to boasting. But we will wake the shouting lyre and the flute in honor of the very pinnacle of horse-contests, which Adrastus established for Phoebus [Apollo] by the streams of the Asopus. Father Zeus, I pray that I may celebrate this excellence by the favor of the Graces, and excel many poets in honoring victory [Nike] with my verses, [55] throwing my shaft nearest of all to the mark of the Muses.
[13] And now, with the music of flute and lyre alike I have come to land with Diagoras, singing the sea-child of Aphrodite [Zoe] and bride of Helios [Sun god], Rhodes, [15] so that I may praise this straight-fighting, tremendous man who had himself crowned beside the Alpheus and near Castalia, as a recompense for his boxing,
An organ as a musical instrument is a machine for doing hard work:
ergon”1. in Il. mostly of works or deeds of war, “polemēia, “ei soi Muson ge hēdion kalein (feeble, effeminate] Kuprogenous” [Mother Goddess] Sol.26 ; “Aphroditēs” h.Ven.1 ; also “teknōn [Craftsmen, sorcerers Rev 18] es e.”4. deed, action, “erg' andrōnte theōn te” Od.1.338 ; “theskela e. [impure religion.]
The "prophesying" that Paul always silences.
mainomai , fut. of Bacchic frenzy, “mainomenos Diōnusos” Il.6.132;
to be mad with wine, Od. 18.406, 21.298; “memēnotes hupo tou potou” Luc.DDeor.18.2; of Bacchic frenzy,
Hom. Od. 18.394 And so Eurymachus struck a cup-bearer on the right hand, and the wine-jug fell to the ground with a clang, and the bearer groaned, and fell backwards in the dust. ...But now we are brawling about beggars, nor shall there be any joy in our rich feast, since worse things prevail.” [405] Then among them spoke the strong and mighty Telemachus: “Strange sirs, ye are mad, and no longer hide that ye have eaten and drunk; some god surely is moving you
THE INSTEAD-OF is that men and women be silent so "that we might all be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. The POINT is that there is ONE MEDIATOR and He doesn't get paid. Ordained PROPHETS "teach the WORD as it has been taught by the gift of Christ. Paul silences "prophesiers" meaning self-speakers, singers and instrument players. No one will be convinced once they have taken the fork in the road says many ancient texts.
BUT (instead of) to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
Quote: "1Th 5:16 Rejoice evermore."
Context means: a greeting on arriving or leaving: not a musical performance silencing the Word of christ
Charis or Grace: 1. at meeting, hail, welcome (esp. in the morning, acc. to D.C.69.18, c2. at leavetaking, fare-thee-well, Od.5.205, 13.59, 15.151; “khaire poll' ōdelphe
CONTEXT:
1Th 5:7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
1Th 5:8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.
nēphō , to be sober, drink no wine,“oute ti gar n. oute liēn methuō” [used in "fluted down with wine]
methuō 2. of persons, to be intoxicated with passion, pride, etc., “hupo tēsAphroditēs” X.Smp.8.21; “hupotruphēs”
kat-auleô , A. charm [sorcery] by flute-playing, tinos phobôi I will flute to you on a ghastly flute, E.HF871 (troch.):--Pass., of persons, methuôn kai katauloumenos drinking wine to the strains of theflute, Pl.R.561c; k. pros chelônidos psophon to be played to on the flute with lyre accompaniment, P to be piped down, ridiculed, “gelōmenoi kai -oumenoi”
Jesus cast the minstrels and crowd DOWN especially when they ridiculed them
tru^ph-ē , hē, (thruptō) A.softness, delicacy, daintiness, malthakia
II. luxuriousness, wantonness, “tōn gunaikōn
1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath,
org-aō II. of men, like sphrigaō, swell with lust, wax wanton, be rampant, Ar.Lys.1113, Av. 462 (where the Sch. explains it epithumētikōsekhō) ; “ho ep' aphrodisioismainomenos . . orgōn” 2. generally, to be eager or ready, to be excited, “Lakedaimoniōn orgōntōn emellon peirasesthai” Th.4.108 ; orgōntes krinein judge under the influence of passion, [The laded burden or self pleasure]
LATIN: com-mŏvĕoA. To remove from a place, to carry away,
to move or carry about the sacred utensils, images, etc., for religious use,
"if I put my instruments (artifices, tricks, etc.) in motion,}
cornū , A. (Acc. to I. A.) To move, drive back, distodge, refute, horn or b. A bugle-horn, a horn, trumpet(cornua —In a sarcastic double sense with a.: dum tendit citharam noster,
Paul wants the men and women to be silent "so that all might be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth."
Only mature males ordained by Christ were prophesiers in that they could interpret the WORD Paul delivered by this special gift.
Paul excludes the women or women-type prophesyin as an ORGY.
“hoep' aphrodisiois mainomenos . .orgōn”
From Mount Sinai onward the PLAY in instrumental rejoicing LED to sexual abuse see Romans 1. Therefore the Aphrodite (Venus, Lucifer) type of prophesying
WORKS in the most extreme sense is even among solemn instrumental churches which have been invaded by what they boast of as Rock and Roll. Therefore, LEGALISM is prohibited by Paul in several places:
Aphrodis-ios , a, on, also os, on D.H.2.24, Luc.Am.12, Ael.NA1.2:—A.belonging to the goddess of love, “ergon” 2. festival of Aphrodite, “A. agein” Id.HG5.4 II. Aphrodisia, ta, sexual pleasures,
Pindar, Nemean, 9 Muses, we will go in victory procession from Apollo's [Abaddon, Apollyon] shrine in Sicyon to newly-founded Aetna, where the doors flung open wide are overwhelmed by guests, at the prosperous home of Chromius. Make a sweet song of verses!...[6] There is a saying among men: a noble deed when it is accomplished should not be buried silently in the ground; and divine song is suited to boasting. But we will wake the shouting lyre and the flute in honor of the very pinnacle of horse-contests, which Adrastus established for Phoebus [Apollo] by the streams of the Asopus. Father Zeus, I pray that I may celebrate this excellence by the favor of the Graces, and excel many poets in honoring victory [Nike] with my verses, [55] throwing my shaft nearest of all to the mark of the Muses.
[13] And now, with the music of flute and lyre alike I have come to land with Diagoras, singing the sea-child of Aphrodite [Zoe] and bride of Helios [Sun god], Rhodes, [15] so that I may praise this straight-fighting, tremendous man who had himself crowned beside the Alpheus and near Castalia, as a recompense for his boxing,
An organ as a musical instrument is a machine for doing hard work:
ergon”1. in Il. mostly of works or deeds of war, “polemēia, “ei soi Muson ge hēdion kalein (feeble, effeminate] Kuprogenous” [Mother Goddess] Sol.26 ; “Aphroditēs” h.Ven.1 ; also “teknōn [Craftsmen, sorcerers Rev 18] es e.”4. deed, action, “erg' andrōnte theōn te” Od.1.338 ; “theskela e. [impure religion.]
The "prophesying" that Paul always silences.
mainomai , fut. of Bacchic frenzy, “mainomenos Diōnusos” Il.6.132;
to be mad with wine, Od. 18.406, 21.298; “memēnotes hupo tou potou” Luc.DDeor.18.2; of Bacchic frenzy,
Hom. Od. 18.394 And so Eurymachus struck a cup-bearer on the right hand, and the wine-jug fell to the ground with a clang, and the bearer groaned, and fell backwards in the dust. ...But now we are brawling about beggars, nor shall there be any joy in our rich feast, since worse things prevail.” [405] Then among them spoke the strong and mighty Telemachus: “Strange sirs, ye are mad, and no longer hide that ye have eaten and drunk; some god surely is moving you
THE INSTEAD-OF is that men and women be silent so "that we might all be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. The POINT is that there is ONE MEDIATOR and He doesn't get paid. Ordained PROPHETS "teach the WORD as it has been taught by the gift of Christ. Paul silences "prophesiers" meaning self-speakers, singers and instrument players. No one will be convinced once they have taken the fork in the road says many ancient texts.
BUT (instead of) to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice.
(Philippians 4:4)
Chairo (g5463) khah'ee-ro; a prim. verb; to be "cheer"ful, i.e. calmly happy or well-off; impers. espec. as salutation (on meeting or parting), be well: - farewell, be glad, God speed, greeting, hail, joy (-fully), rejoice.
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="width: 30%"] And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. Phil 4:7[/TD]
[TD="width: 30%"] And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Col.3:15[/TD]
[TD="width: 40%"] Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. Eph 5:17[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 303"] Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue,[/TD]
[TD="width: 302"] Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teachingand admonishingone another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs,
[/TD]
[TD="width: 329"] And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; [Methuo in the literature is always "getting fluted down with wine.]
BUT be filled with the Spirit; [Word] Eph 5:18 Speakingto yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, [Inspired Text]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 303"] and if there be any praise, think on these things. Phil 4:8 Think is: Logizomai (g3049) log-id'-zom-ahee; mid. from 3056; to take an inventory, i.e. estimate (lit. or fig.): - conclude, (ac-) count (of), / despise, esteem, impute, lay, number, reason, reckon, suppose, think (on).
Logikos (g3050) log-ik-os'; from 3056; rational ("logical"): - reasonable, of the word.
[/TD]
[TD="width: 302"] singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. Col. 3:16 With Grace IN our hearts
Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?
Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
[/TD]
[TD="width: 329"] singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; Eph 5:19 is the same as with melody in our hearts: neither are "music" but the nature of speech.
The Word or Logos is the Regulative Principle: it is opposite of rhetoric, singing, playing, acting and especially opposite of PATHOS or "what happened to me on the way to church this morning.
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 303"] Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you. Phil 4:9[/TD]
[TD="width: 302"] And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him. Col. 3:17[/TD]
[TD="width: 329"] Giving thanks always for all things untoGod and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; Eph 5:20[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
That gives you 167 hours left in the week: Jesus asked "could you not tarry with me for one hour?" Apparently the answer is no whether people use machines or "virtual" machines called ORGANUM.
Jeremiah 51:39 In their heat I will make their feasts, and I will make them drunken, that they may rejoice, and sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the LORD.
Jeremiah 51:40 I will bring them down like lambs to the slaughter, like rams with he goats.
Matthew 26:38 Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me.
Matthew 26:40 And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour
1 Peter 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
1 Peter 5:9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
(Philippians 4:4)
Chairo (g5463) khah'ee-ro; a prim. verb; to be "cheer"ful, i.e. calmly happy or well-off; impers. espec. as salutation (on meeting or parting), be well: - farewell, be glad, God speed, greeting, hail, joy (-fully), rejoice.
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="width: 30%"] And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. Phil 4:7[/TD]
[TD="width: 30%"] And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Col.3:15[/TD]
[TD="width: 40%"] Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. Eph 5:17[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 303"] Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue,[/TD]
[TD="width: 302"] Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teachingand admonishingone another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs,
[/TD]
[TD="width: 329"] And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; [Methuo in the literature is always "getting fluted down with wine.]
BUT be filled with the Spirit; [Word] Eph 5:18 Speakingto yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, [Inspired Text]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 303"] and if there be any praise, think on these things. Phil 4:8 Think is: Logizomai (g3049) log-id'-zom-ahee; mid. from 3056; to take an inventory, i.e. estimate (lit. or fig.): - conclude, (ac-) count (of), / despise, esteem, impute, lay, number, reason, reckon, suppose, think (on).
Logikos (g3050) log-ik-os'; from 3056; rational ("logical"): - reasonable, of the word.
[/TD]
[TD="width: 302"] singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. Col. 3:16 With Grace IN our hearts
Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?
Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
[/TD]
[TD="width: 329"] singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; Eph 5:19 is the same as with melody in our hearts: neither are "music" but the nature of speech.
The Word or Logos is the Regulative Principle: it is opposite of rhetoric, singing, playing, acting and especially opposite of PATHOS or "what happened to me on the way to church this morning.
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 303"] Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you. Phil 4:9[/TD]
[TD="width: 302"] And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him. Col. 3:17[/TD]
[TD="width: 329"] Giving thanks always for all things untoGod and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; Eph 5:20[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
That gives you 167 hours left in the week: Jesus asked "could you not tarry with me for one hour?" Apparently the answer is no whether people use machines or "virtual" machines called ORGANUM.
Jeremiah 51:39 In their heat I will make their feasts, and I will make them drunken, that they may rejoice, and sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the LORD.
Jeremiah 51:40 I will bring them down like lambs to the slaughter, like rams with he goats.
Matthew 26:38 Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me.
Matthew 26:40 And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour
1 Peter 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
1 Peter 5:9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
o so then the apostle is urging us to be greeting or giving salutations perpetually?
i should read this "always be arriving or leaving" ?
(pretty sure you're doing exegesis wrong)
this is the context:
16 Rejoice evermore.
17 Pray without ceasing.
18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
19 Quench not the Spirit.
20 Despise not prophesyings.
21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.
could you specifically point out which 'context' means we are instructed to "greet evermore" ?
i should read this "always be arriving or leaving" ?
(pretty sure you're doing exegesis wrong)
this is the context:
16 Rejoice evermore.
17 Pray without ceasing.
18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
19 Quench not the Spirit.
20 Despise not prophesyings.
21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.
could you specifically point out which 'context' means we are instructed to "greet evermore" ?
U
I visited a CofC once or twice thanks to a Christian woman I had a crush on. Long story. That is not what I will talk about here.
Yes I saw that CofC does not have any music instruments. They will sing and praise. They clapped their hands for some songs. I noticed they are very different than other mainstream Christian denominations or even non-denominations around my hometown that they DO use music instruments. My brother did play his instrument as well at a non-denomination Christian church.
I understand this would be a plus side for Deaf people because they would not understand the words. However, they DO want to feel the music. Hence, they would actually prefer instruments than song itself with voices! Strange world. Anyway,
Something struck in my head a good question for CofC members. No offense. I do know that CofC members will say that, "Oh! That is part of Old Testament!" Many of you pointed in NT it is okay to use. I knew that. Now, when a CofC member says it is a sin in OT. Then would 10 Commandments be sinful? Jesus said in NT, "Keep my Commandments..." many times! Some examples are found in John 14:15, John 14:21, and John 15:10.
Whoa! Those three verses you say are in New Testaments!? Welcome to the real Christianity, CofC brothers and sisters.
Now, back to that woman.. darn, I really liked her who is from Denver Colorado.. ahh.. Oh well! Wink.
Yes I saw that CofC does not have any music instruments. They will sing and praise. They clapped their hands for some songs. I noticed they are very different than other mainstream Christian denominations or even non-denominations around my hometown that they DO use music instruments. My brother did play his instrument as well at a non-denomination Christian church.
I understand this would be a plus side for Deaf people because they would not understand the words. However, they DO want to feel the music. Hence, they would actually prefer instruments than song itself with voices! Strange world. Anyway,
Something struck in my head a good question for CofC members. No offense. I do know that CofC members will say that, "Oh! That is part of Old Testament!" Many of you pointed in NT it is okay to use. I knew that. Now, when a CofC member says it is a sin in OT. Then would 10 Commandments be sinful? Jesus said in NT, "Keep my Commandments..." many times! Some examples are found in John 14:15, John 14:21, and John 15:10.
Whoa! Those three verses you say are in New Testaments!? Welcome to the real Christianity, CofC brothers and sisters.
Now, back to that woman.. darn, I really liked her who is from Denver Colorado.. ahh.. Oh well! Wink.
G5463 Chairo For a whole list of the way grace is used:
Greek Lexicon :: G5463 (KJV)
Titus 2:10 Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things.
Titus 2:11 For the grace [5465] of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Titus 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Greek Lexicon :: G5463 (KJV)
Titus 2:10 Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things.
Titus 2:11 For the grace [5465] of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Titus 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
i honestly don't care one whit how the pagan Greeks rejoiced.
let's see how king David, whom God loves, goes about rejoicing:
And David spake to the chief of the Levites to appoint their brethren to be the singers with instruments of musick, psalteries and harps and cymbals, sounding, by lifting up the voice with joy.
(1 Chronicles 15:16)
wow! David commanded the priests, even the same ones singing with joy to God as they brought the Ark of the Covenant to its tent, to use musical instruments! look at this!
So the singers, Heman, Asaph, and Ethan, were appointed to sound with cymbals of brass
(1 Chronicles 15:19)
they sang and played cymbals at the same time!
it doesn't even end there!
So David, and the elders of Israel, and the captains over thousands, went to bring up the ark of the covenant of the Lord out of the house of Obed-edom with joy.
(1 Chronicles 15:25)
the WORD OF GOD says this was how they went out with JOY!!
was there ever greater wickedness??
Thus all Israel brought up the ark of the covenant of theLord with shouting, and with sound of the cornet, and with trumpets, and with cymbals, making a noise with psalteries and harps.
(1 Chronicles 15:28)
the whole nation joined in!
surely the Lord of Hosts, who does not change, expressed how displeased He was?
let's see what God's prophet told David after the dedication, where David had given his first Psalm:
Then Nathan said unto David, Do all that is in thine heart; for God is with thee.
(1 Chronicles 17:2)
goodness. that was unexpected. perhaps Ksublett, you are dead wrong about what God thinks of music.
reading on in 1 Chronicles 17, we find that the Word of the Lord came to Nathan, instructing him to tell David not to build a temple, and then the Lord goes on to say:
Now therefore thus shalt thou say unto my servant David, Thus saith the Lord of hosts, I took thee from the sheepcote, even from following the sheep, that thou shouldest be ruler over my people Israel: and I have been with thee whithersoever thou hast walked, and have cut off all thine enemies from before thee, and have made thee a name like the name of the great men that are in the earth. Also I will ordain a place for my people Israel, and will plant them, and they shall dwell in their place, and shall be moved no more; neither shall the children of wickedness waste them any more, as at the beginning, and since the time that I commanded judges to be over my people Israel. Moreover I will subdue all thine enemies. Furthermore I tell thee that the Lord will build thee an house.
(1 Chronicles 17:7-10)
can you believe that? David had the priests themselves rejoice with all kinds of instruments as they sang, not just that one time, but set up certain Levites (read this in 1 Chronicles 16:37-43) to be in charge of music perpetually in the service of the Lord, even providing instruments "for those that should make a sound" (1 Chronicles 16:42) - that is, any Israelite worshiping at the temple who wished to worship with music - and what was the Lord God's reaction?
the Lord God called David His servant. that means David was doing the will of God.
the Lord God said He has been with David all this time. whithersoever he had walked. this means God did not forsake David when he praised him with a harp.
The Lord God said He would bless Israel. this means that the worship they had offered up was acceptable.
we can study roman poetry dedicated to pagan idols, or we can study the Word of God.
apparently one comes to very different conclusions depending on what one devotes their time to.
let's see how king David, whom God loves, goes about rejoicing:
And David spake to the chief of the Levites to appoint their brethren to be the singers with instruments of musick, psalteries and harps and cymbals, sounding, by lifting up the voice with joy.
(1 Chronicles 15:16)
wow! David commanded the priests, even the same ones singing with joy to God as they brought the Ark of the Covenant to its tent, to use musical instruments! look at this!
So the singers, Heman, Asaph, and Ethan, were appointed to sound with cymbals of brass
(1 Chronicles 15:19)
they sang and played cymbals at the same time!
it doesn't even end there!
So David, and the elders of Israel, and the captains over thousands, went to bring up the ark of the covenant of the Lord out of the house of Obed-edom with joy.
(1 Chronicles 15:25)
the WORD OF GOD says this was how they went out with JOY!!
was there ever greater wickedness??
Thus all Israel brought up the ark of the covenant of theLord with shouting, and with sound of the cornet, and with trumpets, and with cymbals, making a noise with psalteries and harps.
(1 Chronicles 15:28)
the whole nation joined in!
surely the Lord of Hosts, who does not change, expressed how displeased He was?
let's see what God's prophet told David after the dedication, where David had given his first Psalm:
Then Nathan said unto David, Do all that is in thine heart; for God is with thee.
(1 Chronicles 17:2)
goodness. that was unexpected. perhaps Ksublett, you are dead wrong about what God thinks of music.
reading on in 1 Chronicles 17, we find that the Word of the Lord came to Nathan, instructing him to tell David not to build a temple, and then the Lord goes on to say:
Now therefore thus shalt thou say unto my servant David, Thus saith the Lord of hosts, I took thee from the sheepcote, even from following the sheep, that thou shouldest be ruler over my people Israel: and I have been with thee whithersoever thou hast walked, and have cut off all thine enemies from before thee, and have made thee a name like the name of the great men that are in the earth. Also I will ordain a place for my people Israel, and will plant them, and they shall dwell in their place, and shall be moved no more; neither shall the children of wickedness waste them any more, as at the beginning, and since the time that I commanded judges to be over my people Israel. Moreover I will subdue all thine enemies. Furthermore I tell thee that the Lord will build thee an house.
(1 Chronicles 17:7-10)
can you believe that? David had the priests themselves rejoice with all kinds of instruments as they sang, not just that one time, but set up certain Levites (read this in 1 Chronicles 16:37-43) to be in charge of music perpetually in the service of the Lord, even providing instruments "for those that should make a sound" (1 Chronicles 16:42) - that is, any Israelite worshiping at the temple who wished to worship with music - and what was the Lord God's reaction?
the Lord God called David His servant. that means David was doing the will of God.
the Lord God said He has been with David all this time. whithersoever he had walked. this means God did not forsake David when he praised him with a harp.
The Lord God said He would bless Israel. this means that the worship they had offered up was acceptable.
we can study roman poetry dedicated to pagan idols, or we can study the Word of God.
apparently one comes to very different conclusions depending on what one devotes their time to.
Sorry bout that but the Old Testament does not command instruments: it was after musical idolatry at Mount Sinai that the Spirit OF Christ defined the church, ekklesia, Qahal or synagogue. God abandoned the Jacob-Cursed Levites to worship the starry host because God had abandoned them to DO THAT (Acts 7)
The assembly for the godly people was
INCLUSIVE of Rest, Reading and Rehearsing the Word of God (only)
EXCLUSIVE of vocal or instrumental rejoicing which includes rhetoric or self speak.
God did not command the King, kingdom, temple, slaughter of his own animals, the priests or the Levites who are defined as soothsayer-sorcerers. The Church of Christ is defined also in the Prophets where He radically condemns the instruments as the definition of a hypocrite (speaker, singer, instrument player). Take a look at Isaiah 1 and Jeremiah 7 two of MANY proofs that God did not command that to which He ABANDONED people.
The command is to SPEAK that which is written for our learning or Scripture for Comfort.
A christian is a disciple and a disciple attends LEARNING MEANINGS.
SPEAK is the opposite of ODE or Sing and that is a very good thing because god Breathed (spirit) and Jesus spoke without METRON which often means METER. Good thing, because there is nothing in the Bible is metrical and therefore you CANNOT sing it if your life depend on it.
Next time you give your Lecture on How To Dismantle an Atomic Warhead, we might treat you like people treat Jesus and hire a musical worship team for backup music with loud drums.
The assembly for the godly people was
INCLUSIVE of Rest, Reading and Rehearsing the Word of God (only)
EXCLUSIVE of vocal or instrumental rejoicing which includes rhetoric or self speak.
God did not command the King, kingdom, temple, slaughter of his own animals, the priests or the Levites who are defined as soothsayer-sorcerers. The Church of Christ is defined also in the Prophets where He radically condemns the instruments as the definition of a hypocrite (speaker, singer, instrument player). Take a look at Isaiah 1 and Jeremiah 7 two of MANY proofs that God did not command that to which He ABANDONED people.
The command is to SPEAK that which is written for our learning or Scripture for Comfort.
A christian is a disciple and a disciple attends LEARNING MEANINGS.
SPEAK is the opposite of ODE or Sing and that is a very good thing because god Breathed (spirit) and Jesus spoke without METRON which often means METER. Good thing, because there is nothing in the Bible is metrical and therefore you CANNOT sing it if your life depend on it.
Next time you give your Lecture on How To Dismantle an Atomic Warhead, we might treat you like people treat Jesus and hire a musical worship team for backup music with loud drums.
also Hezekiah, who cleansed and restored the temple, did this:
And he set the Levites in the house of the LORD with cymbals, with psalteries, and with harps, according to the commandment of David, and of Gad the king's seer, and Nathan the prophet: for so was the commandment of the LORD by his prophets.
And the Levites stood with the instruments of David, and the priests with the trumpets.
(2 Chronicles 29:25-26)
what does the Word of God say about Hezekiah? wicked king?
he did that which was right in the sight of the LORD, according to all that David his father had done.
(2 Chronicles 29:2)
i'm sorry Ksublett, but i will trust the scripture before i will trust you.
And he set the Levites in the house of the LORD with cymbals, with psalteries, and with harps, according to the commandment of David, and of Gad the king's seer, and Nathan the prophet: for so was the commandment of the LORD by his prophets.
And the Levites stood with the instruments of David, and the priests with the trumpets.
(2 Chronicles 29:25-26)
what does the Word of God say about Hezekiah? wicked king?
he did that which was right in the sight of the LORD, according to all that David his father had done.
(2 Chronicles 29:2)
i'm sorry Ksublett, but i will trust the scripture before i will trust you.
If anyone wants to "worship" like the Jacob-Cursed and God-Abandoned Levites who were soothsayer-sorcerers in a Canaanite-Babylonish sacrificial system then THAT is what God wants you to do. Doing it is no worse than claiming the Monarchy as pattern. The Spirit OF Christ warned about the Lying Pen of the Scribes in relation to the temple but if that is what you want to do then that is exactly what God wants you to do. In all of the instrumental examples "there was no turning back, no turning back" probably because of the expressed image of the One God Almighty.
Amos 5:26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images,
......the star of your god,
......which ye made to yourselves.
Amos 5:27 Therefore will I cause you to go into captivity beyond Damascus,
......saith the LORD, whose name is The God of hosts.
Acts 7:42 Then God turned,
......and gave them up to worship the host of heaven;
...... as it is written in the book of the prophets,
.... ..O ye house of Israel, have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices
.... ..by the space of forty years in the wilderness?
Acts 7:43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch,
......and the star of your god Remphan,
......figures which ye made to worship them:
......and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.
The Levites were an old infant burning priesthood in Egypt and they "brought their abominations with them" and continued to burn infants in Jerusalem, Tyre and Carthage.
Molech . . . Chiun--"Molech" means "king" answering to Mars [BENGEL]; the Sun [JABLONSKI]; Saturn, the same as "Chiun" [MAURER]. The Septuagint translates "Chiun" into Remphan, as Stephen quotes it (Ac 7:42,43). The same god often had different names.
Molech is the Ammonite name; Chiun, the Arabic and Persian name, written also Chevan. In an Arabic lexicon Chiun means "austere"; so astrologers represented Saturn as a planet baleful in his influence. Hence the Phoenicians offered human sacrifices to him, children especially; so idolatrous Israel also. Rimmon was the Syrian name (2Ki 5:18); pronounced as Remvan, or "Remphan," just as Chiun was also Chevan. Molech had the form of a king; Chevan, or Chiun, of a star [GROTIUS]. Remphan was the Egyptian name for Saturn: hence the Septuagint translator of Amos gave the Egyptian name for the Hebrew, being an Egyptian. [HODIUS II, De Bibliorum Textibus Originalibus. 4.115].
Stephen supplies this name. Their place of exile was in fact, as he states, "beyond Babylon," in Halah and Habor by the river Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes (2Ki 17:6; compare here Am 1:5 4:3 6:14). The road to Assyria lay through "Damascus." It is therefore specified, that not merely shall they be carried captives to Damascus, as they had been by Syrian kings (2Ki 10:32,33 13:7),
but, beyond that, to a region whence a return was not so possible as from Damascus.
They were led captive by Satan into idolatry, therefore God caused them to go captive among idolaters. Compare 2Ki 15:29 16:9 Isa 8:4, whence it appears Tiglath-pileser attacked Israel and Damascus at the same time at Ahaz' request (Am 3:1
That's a good pattern: it is the almost 100% pattern of those OF the World for whom Jesus does not even pray because He was sent and send others to seek LOST SPIRITS-pilgrims and sojourners in the world. They don't need a chocolate factory to make them taste good: as soon as they gladly receive that election or infitation they want to be BAPTIZED.
Amos 5:26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images,
......the star of your god,
......which ye made to yourselves.
Amos 5:27 Therefore will I cause you to go into captivity beyond Damascus,
......saith the LORD, whose name is The God of hosts.
Acts 7:42 Then God turned,
......and gave them up to worship the host of heaven;
...... as it is written in the book of the prophets,
.... ..O ye house of Israel, have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices
.... ..by the space of forty years in the wilderness?
Acts 7:43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch,
......and the star of your god Remphan,
......figures which ye made to worship them:
......and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.
The Levites were an old infant burning priesthood in Egypt and they "brought their abominations with them" and continued to burn infants in Jerusalem, Tyre and Carthage.
Molech . . . Chiun--"Molech" means "king" answering to Mars [BENGEL]; the Sun [JABLONSKI]; Saturn, the same as "Chiun" [MAURER]. The Septuagint translates "Chiun" into Remphan, as Stephen quotes it (Ac 7:42,43). The same god often had different names.
Molech is the Ammonite name; Chiun, the Arabic and Persian name, written also Chevan. In an Arabic lexicon Chiun means "austere"; so astrologers represented Saturn as a planet baleful in his influence. Hence the Phoenicians offered human sacrifices to him, children especially; so idolatrous Israel also. Rimmon was the Syrian name (2Ki 5:18); pronounced as Remvan, or "Remphan," just as Chiun was also Chevan. Molech had the form of a king; Chevan, or Chiun, of a star [GROTIUS]. Remphan was the Egyptian name for Saturn: hence the Septuagint translator of Amos gave the Egyptian name for the Hebrew, being an Egyptian. [HODIUS II, De Bibliorum Textibus Originalibus. 4.115].
Stephen supplies this name. Their place of exile was in fact, as he states, "beyond Babylon," in Halah and Habor by the river Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes (2Ki 17:6; compare here Am 1:5 4:3 6:14). The road to Assyria lay through "Damascus." It is therefore specified, that not merely shall they be carried captives to Damascus, as they had been by Syrian kings (2Ki 10:32,33 13:7),
but, beyond that, to a region whence a return was not so possible as from Damascus.
They were led captive by Satan into idolatry, therefore God caused them to go captive among idolaters. Compare 2Ki 15:29 16:9 Isa 8:4, whence it appears Tiglath-pileser attacked Israel and Damascus at the same time at Ahaz' request (Am 3:1
That's a good pattern: it is the almost 100% pattern of those OF the World for whom Jesus does not even pray because He was sent and send others to seek LOST SPIRITS-pilgrims and sojourners in the world. They don't need a chocolate factory to make them taste good: as soon as they gladly receive that election or infitation they want to be BAPTIZED.
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