Salvation Not Possible Without Works

[Cassian]

In the context of 2 Cor 1 and 2, the "spiritual man" are the inspired writers of the bible who were given miraculous abilty to receive the word from God and write it down. The "natural man" is one who was NOT endowed with miraculous ability to receive revelations from God.

Eph 3:3,4 "How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)"

So Paul was a "spiritual man", an inspired writer that was endowed with the ability to receive revelations from God and write them down so the natural man could then read and understand. Paul wrote "words." 1 Cor 2:13 "words" inspired writers got from the Holy SPirit and wrote those "words" down.



Who Is the “Natural” Man in 1 Corinthians 2:14?

BY WAYNE JACKSON


“Please explain this passage from First Corinthians. ‘Now the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually judged’ (2:14).”

The passage is a difficult one due to the complexity of the phraseology. Moreover, its obscurity has been further shrouded by considerable theological baggage that is without basis in Scripture.

It is unlikely that one can fully appreciate the instruction of 1 Corinthians 1:18-2:16 without some understanding of the term “wisdom,” as that concept was viewed in Greek culture.

The Greeks vaunted in their alleged wisdom. Herodotus reported that these intellectual sophisticates had the reputation of “pursuing every kind of knowledge” (History IV.77). Celsus (c. A.D. 178), a Greek philosopher who wrote a bitter diatribe against Christianity, characterized the followers of Jesus as those who eschewed wisdom, but who welcomed the senseless and the ignorant (see: Origen, Against Celsus, 6:12-14). The Greeks viewed those outside the pale of Hellenism as “barbarians” (cf. Rom. 1:14).

Also, 1 Corinthians 2:14 must be viewed in the larger context of 1:18-3:23. Within the first three chapters of this book, the apostle uses the noun “wisdom” sixteen times, and the adjective “wise” ten times. Clearly, “wisdom” is a predominate theme in this section of the book.
For example, Paul argues the case that true wisdom is not the “wisdom of the wise” (1:19), the “wisdom of this world,” (1:20; 3:19), or the “wisdom of men” (2:5; cf. “fleshly wisdom,” 2 Cor. 1:12). While this was the sort of “wisdom” of which the Greeks boasted, genuine wisdom (divine wisdom) is embodied in the gospel revelation that pertains to the mission and message of Jesus Christ (1:24,30; 2:7). The person who ignores this body of truth is not wise; he is a fool.

Let us give brief consideration to the material that leads up to 2:14, and Paul’s discussion of the “natural man.”

Christ — the Wisdom and Power of God (1:18-25)

The apostle sets the philosophy of those who are under the spell of worldly wisdom in stark contrast to the disposition of those who yield to Heaven’s redemptive plan, which culminated in the cross. By and large, both Jew and Gentile failed to recognize the true “wisdom of God.” A crucified Messiah was a stumbling block to the Hebrews, and to the Gentile pseudo-intellectuals, the idea of a vicarious sacrifice for sin was sheer foolishness.

Such rebels would be dealt with eventually. In the meantime, any who accepted the “call” of God through the gospel, whether Jew or Gentile, could be saved from sin through the work of Christ, who is the manifestation of the power and wisdom of God.

The Divine Calling (1:26-31)

The Lord’s call to sinful humanity, as made known through the gospel (cf. 2 Thes. 2:14), would not appeal to those who haughtily perceived themselves as wise, mighty, noble, etc. In view of man’s arrogance against the Creator, abject humility is requisite to becoming a Christian.
The Lord’s choice, therefore, of seemingly “weak” and “foolish” things in the plan of redemption was by design; it was and is a test of faith.

Paul’s Credentials at Corinth (2:1-5)

The apostle introduces the circumstances that pertained to himself, as he initially evangelized in Corinth, as evidence of the nature of the gospel system. Paul’s method of presentation (not with eloquence or with human wisdom) and his presence (weakness, fear, much trembling) both were manifestations that the power of the gospel was by the Holy Spirit. Christianity is a divine system.

A Plan Once Hidden, Now Revealed (2:6-13)

Again the apostle draws a distinction between the “wisdom” of the world, which will be rendered powerless, and Heaven’s wisdom. God’s wise plan, as it was secretly worked out across the ages, could not be accessed by human mental ingenuity. This lack of man’s intellectual acumen was evidenced by the fact that the rulers crucified the Lord of glory. Accordingly, one is driven to the conclusion that the divine scheme of things had to be revealed by God’s Spirit, who, being deity himself, knows the “deep” things of the sacred plan.

Paul illustrates the matter. Just as one cannot know the mind of another person, unless revealed by that person, even so, no one can access the “things of God” unless such were made known by his Spirit. The apostle then pinpoints the medium and method of that communication. The medium was Lord’s inspired spokesmen (“which things we speak”); the method was by means of sacred words (“words which . . .the Spirit teaches”).

The Impotence of the Natural Man (2:14-16)

The student is now prepared to identify the “natural man,” in light of the preceding context. The term “natural” (Grk. psuchikos — v. 14a) stands in contrast to “spiritual” (pneumatikos man mentioned in 15a. (Note the adversative particle de that begins verse 15.)

From the context, it is perfectly clear that the “spiritual” person is one who is supernaturally endowed with the Spirit, and thus is qualified to bring those “words” which the Holy Spirit is teaching him (v. 13). Accordingly, the “natural” man is simply the one who does not have access to divine revelation. He relies upon the “wisdom of the world,” hence, knows nothing of the “things of God.” He has no ability to “receive” (i.e., access; a middle voice form suggesting “unto himself”) the sacred truths that issue from the “mind of the Lord” (v. 16).

Calvinistic Confusion

It is, of course, quite common to hear the view that the “natural” man is the unregenerated sinner who is so enslaved in sin as to be unable to apprehend the gospel of God unless “illuminated” by a direct operation of the Holy Spirit. The sad reality is, it is difficult to locate many scholars who have not been tainted with Calvin’s views of this matter (cf. Institutes of the Christian Religion, Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1975, Vol. I, Bk. II, 19-20). But this theory may be faulted on several grounds.

(1) The theme of this section of Paul’s letter is not “sinner” versus “saint,” or the “unregenerate” in contrast to the “regenerate.” Rather, as we have carefully documented above, the distinction is between “human wisdom” and “divine revelation.”
In the original setting, the “spiritual” man was the one upon whom the gift of “inspiration” was bestowed. In principle, to us it would be the testimony of the Holy Writings (2 Tim. 3:16-17).

On the other hand, then, the “natural” man is the one who seeks whatever union he hopes to gain with the Creator by means of his own arrogant, self-serving intellect. And the kindred descendants of the ancient Greeks are legion.

(2) The language of verse 13 plainly indicates that the “spiritual” person of verse 16 received “words” that the Holy Spirit employed, not some undefined “illumination.” Accordingly, if this text affirms that the Christian today directly receives that which is addressed in this passage, then it must be concluded that God’s children in this age are being given “word” messages from the Spirit personally.
If that is the case, and they should write down these words, would not their words be as binding as those of the apostles? And would not this make the Bible itself virtually obsolete? What do we need with documents two millennia old, if we have a direct, word-by-word pipeline to heaven? Sometimes folks simply do not “think through” the positions they espouse.

(3) Finally, the Calvinist view of this context makes God morally culpable. For instance, note this declaration from A.T. Robertson. This Baptist scholar argued that the “mind of the flesh” does not possess ability “to receive the things of the Spirit untouched by the Spirit. Certainly the initiative comes from God whose Holy Spirit makes it possible for us to accept the things of the Spirit of God” (Word Pictures in the New Testament,Nashville: Broadman, 1931, IV, p. 89).

If this position is true, whose fault is it if the “unregenerate” man never accesses the “things of God”?

In conclusion, then, we must insist that the key to understanding the “natural man,” as discussed by Paul, is to be found in viewing this passage in the light of the broader context of the early portion of his epistle. The Calvinistic assertion with reference to this text reflects both a misunderstanding of the local context, and the general scriptural teaching relative to the work of the Holy Spirit.
https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/643-who-is-the-natural-man-in-1-corinthians-2-14

A very good exegesis.

 

[notuptome]

In the context of 2 Cor 1 and 2, the "spiritual man" are the inspired writers of the bible who were given miraculous abilty to receive the word from God and write it down. The "natural man" is one who was NOT endowed with miraculous ability to receive revelations from God.

Eph 3:3,4 "How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)"

So Paul was a "spiritual man", an inspired writer that was endowed with the ability to receive revelations from God and write them down so the natural man could then read and understand. Paul wrote "words." 1 Cor 2:13 "words" inspired writers got from the Holy SPirit and wrote those "words" down.



Who Is the “Natural” Man in 1 Corinthians 2:14?

BY WAYNE JACKSON


“Please explain this passage from First Corinthians. ‘Now the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually judged’ (2:14).”

The passage is a difficult one due to the complexity of the phraseology. Moreover, its obscurity has been further shrouded by considerable theological baggage that is without basis in Scripture.

It is unlikely that one can fully appreciate the instruction of 1 Corinthians 1:18-2:16 without some understanding of the term “wisdom,” as that concept was viewed in Greek culture.

The Greeks vaunted in their alleged wisdom. Herodotus reported that these intellectual sophisticates had the reputation of “pursuing every kind of knowledge” (History IV.77). Celsus (c. A.D. 178), a Greek philosopher who wrote a bitter diatribe against Christianity, characterized the followers of Jesus as those who eschewed wisdom, but who welcomed the senseless and the ignorant (see: Origen, Against Celsus, 6:12-14). The Greeks viewed those outside the pale of Hellenism as “barbarians” (cf. Rom. 1:14).

Also, 1 Corinthians 2:14 must be viewed in the larger context of 1:18-3:23. Within the first three chapters of this book, the apostle uses the noun “wisdom” sixteen times, and the adjective “wise” ten times. Clearly, “wisdom” is a predominate theme in this section of the book.
For example, Paul argues the case that true wisdom is not the “wisdom of the wise” (1:19), the “wisdom of this world,” (1:20; 3:19), or the “wisdom of men” (2:5; cf. “fleshly wisdom,” 2 Cor. 1:12). While this was the sort of “wisdom” of which the Greeks boasted, genuine wisdom (divine wisdom) is embodied in the gospel revelation that pertains to the mission and message of Jesus Christ (1:24,30; 2:7). The person who ignores this body of truth is not wise; he is a fool.

Let us give brief consideration to the material that leads up to 2:14, and Paul’s discussion of the “natural man.”

Christ — the Wisdom and Power of God (1:18-25)

The apostle sets the philosophy of those who are under the spell of worldly wisdom in stark contrast to the disposition of those who yield to Heaven’s redemptive plan, which culminated in the cross. By and large, both Jew and Gentile failed to recognize the true “wisdom of God.” A crucified Messiah was a stumbling block to the Hebrews, and to the Gentile pseudo-intellectuals, the idea of a vicarious sacrifice for sin was sheer foolishness.

Such rebels would be dealt with eventually. In the meantime, any who accepted the “call” of God through the gospel, whether Jew or Gentile, could be saved from sin through the work of Christ, who is the manifestation of the power and wisdom of God.

The Divine Calling (1:26-31)

The Lord’s call to sinful humanity, as made known through the gospel (cf. 2 Thes. 2:14), would not appeal to those who haughtily perceived themselves as wise, mighty, noble, etc. In view of man’s arrogance against the Creator, abject humility is requisite to becoming a Christian.
The Lord’s choice, therefore, of seemingly “weak” and “foolish” things in the plan of redemption was by design; it was and is a test of faith.

Paul’s Credentials at Corinth (2:1-5)

The apostle introduces the circumstances that pertained to himself, as he initially evangelized in Corinth, as evidence of the nature of the gospel system. Paul’s method of presentation (not with eloquence or with human wisdom) and his presence (weakness, fear, much trembling) both were manifestations that the power of the gospel was by the Holy Spirit. Christianity is a divine system.

A Plan Once Hidden, Now Revealed (2:6-13)

Again the apostle draws a distinction between the “wisdom” of the world, which will be rendered powerless, and Heaven’s wisdom. God’s wise plan, as it was secretly worked out across the ages, could not be accessed by human mental ingenuity. This lack of man’s intellectual acumen was evidenced by the fact that the rulers crucified the Lord of glory. Accordingly, one is driven to the conclusion that the divine scheme of things had to be revealed by God’s Spirit, who, being deity himself, knows the “deep” things of the sacred plan.

Paul illustrates the matter. Just as one cannot know the mind of another person, unless revealed by that person, even so, no one can access the “things of God” unless such were made known by his Spirit. The apostle then pinpoints the medium and method of that communication. The medium was Lord’s inspired spokesmen (“which things we speak”); the method was by means of sacred words (“words which . . .the Spirit teaches”).

The Impotence of the Natural Man (2:14-16)

The student is now prepared to identify the “natural man,” in light of the preceding context. The term “natural” (Grk. psuchikos — v. 14a) stands in contrast to “spiritual” (pneumatikos man mentioned in 15a. (Note the adversative particle de that begins verse 15.)

From the context, it is perfectly clear that the “spiritual” person is one who is supernaturally endowed with the Spirit, and thus is qualified to bring those “words” which the Holy Spirit is teaching him (v. 13). Accordingly, the “natural” man is simply the one who does not have access to divine revelation. He relies upon the “wisdom of the world,” hence, knows nothing of the “things of God.” He has no ability to “receive” (i.e., access; a middle voice form suggesting “unto himself”) the sacred truths that issue from the “mind of the Lord” (v. 16).

Calvinistic Confusion

It is, of course, quite common to hear the view that the “natural” man is the unregenerated sinner who is so enslaved in sin as to be unable to apprehend the gospel of God unless “illuminated” by a direct operation of the Holy Spirit. The sad reality is, it is difficult to locate many scholars who have not been tainted with Calvin’s views of this matter (cf. Institutes of the Christian Religion, Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1975, Vol. I, Bk. II, 19-20). But this theory may be faulted on several grounds.

(1) The theme of this section of Paul’s letter is not “sinner” versus “saint,” or the “unregenerate” in contrast to the “regenerate.” Rather, as we have carefully documented above, the distinction is between “human wisdom” and “divine revelation.”
In the original setting, the “spiritual” man was the one upon whom the gift of “inspiration” was bestowed. In principle, to us it would be the testimony of the Holy Writings (2 Tim. 3:16-17).

On the other hand, then, the “natural” man is the one who seeks whatever union he hopes to gain with the Creator by means of his own arrogant, self-serving intellect. And the kindred descendants of the ancient Greeks are legion.

(2) The language of verse 13 plainly indicates that the “spiritual” person of verse 16 received “words” that the Holy Spirit employed, not some undefined “illumination.” Accordingly, if this text affirms that the Christian today directly receives that which is addressed in this passage, then it must be concluded that God’s children in this age are being given “word” messages from the Spirit personally.
If that is the case, and they should write down these words, would not their words be as binding as those of the apostles? And would not this make the Bible itself virtually obsolete? What do we need with documents two millennia old, if we have a direct, word-by-word pipeline to heaven? Sometimes folks simply do not “think through” the positions they espouse.

(3) Finally, the Calvinist view of this context makes God morally culpable. For instance, note this declaration from A.T. Robertson. This Baptist scholar argued that the “mind of the flesh” does not possess ability “to receive the things of the Spirit untouched by the Spirit. Certainly the initiative comes from God whose Holy Spirit makes it possible for us to accept the things of the Spirit of God” (Word Pictures in the New Testament,Nashville: Broadman, 1931, IV, p. 89).

If this position is true, whose fault is it if the “unregenerate” man never accesses the “things of God”?

In conclusion, then, we must insist that the key to understanding the “natural man,” as discussed by Paul, is to be found in viewing this passage in the light of the broader context of the early portion of his epistle. The Calvinistic assertion with reference to this text reflects both a misunderstanding of the local context, and the general scriptural teaching relative to the work of the Holy Spirit.
https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/643-who-is-the-natural-man-in-1-corinthians-2-14

Pathetic.

Those who are born again are Spiritual. Those who are unregenerate are natural. The natural man does not have the Holy Spirit within him to lead into the truth of Gods word.

Framing this in a more abstract context is just plain misleading. You are attempting to avoid responsibility for hearing the scriptures. Blaming Calvinism is really a desperate measure to justify poor exegesis.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[SeaBass]

Pathetic.

Those who are born again are Spiritual. Those who are unregenerate are natural. The natural man does not have the Holy Spirit within him to lead into the truth of Gods word.

Framing this in a more abstract context is just plain misleading. You are attempting to avoid responsibility for hearing the scriptures. Blaming Calvinism is really a desperate measure to justify poor exegesis.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

The spiritual men, the inspired writers of the bible wrote down the revelations they received from the Holy Spirit so us natural men can read and understand. God's word was reveled by the end of the first century with John writing Revelation. So there are no spiritual men today endowed with the miraculous to receive revelations from God. We are all natural men, as the Ephesians, who could read and understand the writings of Paul Eph 3:3,4

Finally, the Calvinist view of this context makes God morally culpable. For instance, note this declaration from A.T. Robertson. This Baptist scholar argued that the “mind of the flesh” does not possess ability “to receive the things of the Spirit untouched by the Spirit. Certainly the initiative comes from God whose Holy Spirit makes it possible for us to accept the things of the Spirit of God” (Word Pictures in the New Testament,Nashville: Broadman, 1931, IV, p. 89).

If this position is true, whose fault is it if the “unregenerate” man never accesses the “things of God”?

 

[mailmandan]

Positive. the errant "faith only" concept was originated in the Reformation, 1500 years after the Gospel was given.

The gospel is the good news of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who believes.. (Romans 1:16). The gospel is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish as a prerequisite for salvation. It simply sets forth Christ crucified, buried and risen as the Savior of all who believe (trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of their salvation). Faith alone did not originate in the reformation.

• Clement of Rome: "We also, being called through God's will in Christ Jesus, are not justified through ourselves, neither through our own wisdom or understanding, or piety, or works which we have done in holiness or heart, but through faith" (Epistle to Corinthians).
• Ignatius: "His cross, and his death, and his resurrection, and the faith which is through him, are my unpolluted muniments; and in these, through your prayers, I am willing to be justified (Epistle to Philadelphians). Note: "muniments" are title deeds, documents giving evidence of legal ownership of something.
• Polycarp: "I know that through grace you are saved, not of works, but by the will of God, through Jesus Christ (Epistle of Philippians).
• Justin Martyr: "No longer by the blood of goats and of sheep, or by the ashes of a heifer...are sins purged, but by faith, through the blood of Christ and his death, who died on this very account (Dialogue with Trypho). "God gave his own Son the ransom for us...for what, save his righteousness, could cover our sins. In whom was it possible that we, transgressors and ungodly as we were, could be justified, save in the Son of God alone? ...O unexpected benefit, that the transgression of many should be hidden in one righteous Person and that the righteousness of One should justify many transgressors" (Letter to Diognetus).
• Ireneus: "Through the obedience of one man who first was born from the Virgin, many should be justified and receive salvation.
• Athanasius: "Not by these (i.e. human efforts) but by faith, a man is justified as was Abraham.
• Basil: "This is the true and perfect glorying in God, when a man is not lifted up on account of his own righteousness, but has known himself to be wanting in true righteousness and to be justified by faith alone in Christ."
• Ambrose: "Without the works of the law, to an ungodly man, that is to say, a Gentile, believing in Christ, his "faith is imputed for righteousness" as also it was to Abraham."
• Origen: "Through faith, without the works of the law, the dying thief was justified, because...the Lord inquired not what he had previously wrought, nor yet waited for his performance of some work after he should have believe; but...he took him unto himself for a companion, justified through his confession alone."
• Jerome: "When an ungodly man is converted, God justified him through faith alone, not on account of good works which he possessed not."
• Chrysostom: "What then did God do? He made (says Paul) a righteous Person (Christ) to be a sinner, in order that he might make sinners righteous...it is the righteousness of God, when we are justified, not by works...but by grace, where all sin is made to vanish away."
• Chrysostom: "Again, they said that he who adhered to Faith alone was cursed, but he shows that he who adhered to Faith alone, is blessed."
• Augustine: "Grace is give to you, not wages paid to you...it is called grace because it is given gratuitously. By no precedent merits did you buy what you have received. The sinner therefore received this grace first, that his sins should be forgiven him...good works follow after a justified person; they do not go before in order that he may be justified...good works, following after justification, show what a man has received."
• Augustine: "Now, having duly considered and weighed all these circumstances and testimonies, we conclude that a man is not justified by the precepts of a holy life, but by faith in Jesus Christ,--in a word, not by the law of works, but by the law of faith; not by the letter, but by the spirit; not by the merits of deeds, but by free grace."
• Anselm: "Do you believe that you cannot be saved but by the death of Christ? Go, then, and ...put all your confidence in this death alone. If God shall say to you, "You are a sinner", say to him, "I place the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between me and my sin."
• Bernard of Clairvaux: "Shall not all our righteousness turn out to be mere unrighteousness and deficiency? What, then, shall it be concerning our sins, when not even our righteousness can answer for itself? Wherefore...let us flee, with all humility to Mercy which alone can save our souls...whoever hungers and thirsts after righteousness, let him believe in thee, who "justified the ungodly"; and thus, being justified by faith alone, he shall have peace with God."

 

[Cassian]

mailmandan,

The gospel is the good news of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who believes.. (Romans 1:16). The gospel is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish as a prerequisite for salvation. It simply sets forth Christ crucified, buried and risen as the Savior of all who believe (trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of their salvation). Faith alone did not originate in the reformation.

The believing in the work of Christ who was the Savior of the world, is called "justification by faith". Justification means to be put into a correct relationship with God.
The misunderstanding of Luther is that all works in his mind were the same. Yet Paul NEVER states this. He separates the works of the law, which is always refering to what Christ did for us because we could not keep the law perfectly in order to save ourselves. As opposed to works of faith.

Justification does not mean we are saved. It is the beginning because One at minimum must be in favor with God. Belief in scripture is an active, ongoing, present tense condition. It is never static, but dynamic.

Most of those citations are speaking about justification, not being saved by faith alone. The phrase in reformation theology of "faith alone" is referencing being saved. It is Luther's misunderstanding of Galations that has forever resulted in a mass confusion in Protestantism. Along with the fact, that underneath is his acceptance of the Anselmian Satisfaction Theory of atonement. His was a legal proclamation that one was declared "not guilty" and forever saved upon belief/justified.

This finite static condition of ones salvation has led to the idea that one is saved/justified and that what follows from that faith, namely works does not save. It simply shows men the fruit of ones salvation and what man does "sanctification" does not change the status of his justification. It is pure Anselmianism.

Several of those citations are actually refering to Christ reconciliation of the world, the work in which we are to believe in order to be justified by faith in the work of Christ.

 

[78jon]

Accept Jesus as your saviour and you will be saved from your sins. Geez, I tried reading the posts and wow it got complicated. I'm not necessarily up to date on what the criteria is for seeing "salvation" though.

 

[konroh]

Cassian, you are showing the classic example of knowing too much making the simple too complex. Just reading the book of Galatians one will never get the idea that Paul is trying just to speak against trying to be saved by doing works of the OT Law, sure that was the context in which he was speaking, but Paul clearly contrasts faith with any good works one tries to do to be saved, the OT law, or being good, or zealous. We live by and through Christ.

How sad that Christians read Galatians, and Romans and Titus, and miss the clear truth "not by works of righteousness ... He saved us" No work of any kind saves. Faith saved Abraham, faith saves us.

 

[Shava]

Cassian, you are showing the classic example of knowing too much making the simple too complex. Just reading the book of Galatians one will never get the idea that Paul is trying just to speak against trying to be saved by doing works of the OT Law, sure that was the context in which he was speaking, but Paul clearly contrasts faith with any good works one tries to do to be saved, the OT law, or being good, or zealous. We live by and through Christ.

How sad that Christians read Galatians, and Romans and Titus, and miss the clear truth "not by works of righteousness ... He saved us" No work of any kind saves. Faith saved Abraham, faith saves us.

So what you're saying is that we are saved the same way as Abraham? If that is what you're saying, then you're wrong. When we believe and are baptized, then we are saved Mark 16:16 He that believeth" AND IS" BAPTIZED shall be saved, so faith alone will not save you. Some people use John 3:16 but forget the fact that 5 verses below in John 3:22 comes baptism, so John 3:16 doesn't mean that believing alone saves you, because if you look just 5 verses below baptism comes into play, this is what happens when people skim the bible instead of reading all of it to understand what's really being said.

 

[mailmandan]

The misunderstanding of Luther is that all works in his mind were the same. Yet Paul NEVER states this. He separates the works of the law, which is always refering to what Christ did for us because we could not keep the law perfectly in order to save ourselves. As opposed to works of faith.

Paul said that we are not justified by works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ (Galatians 2:16). He also said, But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works (Romans 4:5-6). Again he said, who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began (2 Timothy 1:9). Once again he said, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit (Titus 3:5). I'm not seeing where Paul specified that we are saved by works of faith, just not works of the law. When it comes to the moral aspect of the law, which good works could a Christian accomplish that are completely detached from the two great commandments (Matthew 22:37-40) which are found in the law of Moses? (Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18)

Justification does not mean we are saved.

The word justified means to render righteous; to declare, pronounce, one to be righteous. Justified by faith (Romans 5:1) does not mean we are still lost, but saved.

It is the beginning because One at minimum must be in favor with God. Belief in scripture is an active, ongoing, present tense condition. It is never static, but dynamic.

Belief is ongoing but we are still saved the moment that we believe (Acts 10:43; 16:31; Romans 1:16).

Most of those citations are speaking about justification, not being saved by faith alone.

The word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith in "Christ alone" conveys the message that Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not on the merits of our works. It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony* James here is discussing the proof of faith (I will show you my faith by my works - (James 2:18) not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3). Works bear out the justification that comes by faith.

The phrase in reformation theology of "faith alone" is referencing being saved. It is Luther's misunderstanding of Galations that has forever resulted in a mass confusion in Protestantism. Along with the fact, that underneath is his acceptance of the Anselmian Satisfaction Theory of atonement. His was a legal proclamation that one was declared "not guilty" and forever saved upon belief/justified.

Man is saved through faith and not by works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; 2 Timothy 1:9; Titus 3:5) yet genuine faith is substantiated and confirmed by good works (James 2:14-24). This is the balance that gets out of balance.

This finite static condition of ones salvation has led to the idea that one is saved/justified and that what follows from that faith, namely works does not save. It simply shows men the fruit of ones salvation and what man does "sanctification" does not change the status of his justification. It is pure Anselmianism.

Faith is the root and works are the fruit of salvation. No fruit demonstrates no root.

Several of those citations are actually refering to Christ reconciliation of the world, the work in which we are to believe in order to be justified by faith in the work of Christ.

Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus (Romans 3:24).

 

[BradC]

Those who continue to believe in a work based salvation are occupied with the flesh and the carnality of man. They have to compare others with the what they believe the scripture teaches but it involves the flesh and knowing them that way. This is why works is important for them in understanding salvation of the soul. As mailmandan has brought out so beautifully in his response to Cassian that a man is justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus (Rom 3:24).

READ THIS AGAIN 'The word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith in "Christ alone" conveys the message that Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not on the merits of our works. It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony* James here is discussing the proof of faith (I will show you my faith by my works - (James 2:18) not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3). Works bear out the justification that comes by faith.

I would like to add a few things to this great paragraph above, that the first fruit of the sinner's life is when he believed and God imputed and put on the sinner's account over (60) specific things through faith without the believer even realizing what God had done. If any wants, I will start a thread and mention them with chapter and verse with all the verbs associated. It all was imputed to the believing sinner the moment he agreed with the gospel and believed and it is all that is needed to inherit eternal life. What God wants to do through that vessel He has redeemed is to bear the fruit of that salvation by working out what He has imputed within the soul of the believer. He wants the believer to grow in grace and knowledge of Christ and how to walk by faith in the promises of God. He wants him to know that if he falls he will not be utterly cast down for God is able to make him stand. God wants him to know and realize through trials, persecutions and testings that He will never leave him or forsake him at anytime and there is nothing that he could do or that could happen to him that would separate him from the love that God has for him. No man, religion or ungodly influence will be able to pluck him out of the Father's or the Son's hand, which will always uphold him in God's righteousness (Isaiah 41:10).

 

[Elin]

i have read some of your posts and qiite frankly, you are the one who doesn't seem to understand

Are you sure about that?

 

[Elin]

you have a smart mouth. Too bad you can't back it up by scripture.

What is a smart mouth to one man is wisdom to another.

Your error is so fundamentally deep that the whole NT would have to be exegeted for you.
And even then, you wouldn't see it, because you are blind.
I can't fix that.

I have neither the time nor the inclination to unravel and sort out all your errors.

I will leave it to the very competent responders on this thread to do it, if they so choose.

But suffice it to say, you preach a false, twice-condemned gospel (Gal 1:6-9).

 

[Cassian]

Cassian, you are showing the classic example of knowing too much making the simple too complex. Just reading the book of Galatians one will never get the idea that Paul is trying just to speak against trying to be saved by doing works of the OT Law, sure that was the context in which he was speaking, but Paul clearly contrasts faith with any good works one tries to do to be saved, the OT law, or being good, or zealous. We live by and through Christ.

How sad that Christians read Galatians, and Romans and Titus, and miss the clear truth "not by works of righteousness ... He saved us" No work of any kind saves. Faith saved Abraham, faith saves us.

I was with you in your first paragraph, but then when you tried to summarize it you missed the whole thing.

What Christ did, He did for the world, for all of mankind. Christ saved the world from death and sin. Man lost life through the condemnation of Adam Gen 3:19, Rom 5:12. Christ gave life to the world, Rom 5:18, I Cor 15:12-22, This is what the reconciliation of Christ accomplished, II Cor 5:18-19, Rom 3:23-25, Col 1:20, Heb 2:14-17. This is the Gift of salvation that is given to every human being, the world.

We could not do this WORK to save ourselves from the fall. God had a purpose in creating man. That purpose was lost when man lost life. Why would God desire to have a relationship with a creature that would simply be dissolved by death.
Because we could not do this work, God simply requires that we believe that He did do this work. In Believing that He did justifies us by our faith. However, being justified does not save anyone. Simply believing, is the same belief James says Satan has. I can assure you that Satan knows he has been defeated by Christ.

It is the living of that faith, or through our faith that saves us. You cannot be saved without fulfilling the purpose of why God created you. He is not going to do the work for you. You will give an account of your works, not your faith.
Why? Why not faith? Because faith of itself has no content. It is the works of faith that saves. Without the works faith is dead and we cannot be saved by a dead faith. Faith and works in our salvation cannot be separated. Works is not anterior to faith, but is the content of faith.

Maybe an analogy might help.
I'm sure all of you have seen these large "air balloons" that fire rescue teams use to absorb the falls of people jumping from heights. Now, hopefully you have seen film of these working and saw that people can fall great distances without any harm or minimal harm.
Now, you are caught in a fire on the 7th floor and the window is your only escape. The rescue team has placed a ballong below. YOu can say you have faith that it works, but if at that moment you lose faith, or you just don't think it will work for you, you don't jump and perish.
Obviously, only faith did not save you. You must put action into your faith. Actually doing it would build on your initial faith. But faith only is a dead faith.

 

[Elin]

The gospel is the good news of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who believes.. (Romans 1:16). The gospel is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish as a prerequisite for salvation. It simply sets forth Christ crucified, buried and risen as the Savior of all who believe (trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of their salvation). Faith alone did not originate in the reformation.

• Clement of Rome: "We also, being called through God's will in Christ Jesus, are not justified through ourselves, neither through our own wisdom or understanding, or piety, or works which we have done in holiness or heart, but through faith" (Epistle to Corinthians).
• Ignatius: "His cross, and his death, and his resurrection, and the faith which is through him, are my unpolluted muniments; and in these, through your prayers, I am willing to be justified (Epistle to Philadelphians). Note: "muniments" are title deeds, documents giving evidence of legal ownership of something.
• Polycarp: "I know that through grace you are saved, not of works, but by the will of God, through Jesus Christ (Epistle of Philippians).
• Justin Martyr: "No longer by the blood of goats and of sheep, or by the ashes of a heifer...are sins purged, but by faith, through the blood of Christ and his death, who died on this very account (Dialogue with Trypho). "God gave his own Son the ransom for us...for what, save his righteousness, could cover our sins. In whom was it possible that we, transgressors and ungodly as we were, could be justified, save in the Son of God alone? ...O unexpected benefit, that the transgression of many should be hidden in one righteous Person and that the righteousness of One should justify many transgressors" (Letter to Diognetus).
• Ireneus: "Through the obedience of one man who first was born from the Virgin, many should be justified and receive salvation.
• Athanasius: "Not by these (i.e. human efforts) but by faith, a man is justified as was Abraham.
• Basil: "This is the true and perfect glorying in God, when a man is not lifted up on account of his own righteousness, but has known himself to be wanting in true righteousness and to be justified by faith alone in Christ."
• Ambrose: "Without the works of the law, to an ungodly man, that is to say, a Gentile, believing in Christ, his "faith is imputed for righteousness" as also it was to Abraham."
• Origen: "Through faith, without the works of the law, the dying thief was justified, because...the Lord inquired not what he had previously wrought, nor yet waited for his performance of some work after he should have believe; but...he took him unto himself for a companion, justified through his confession alone."
• Jerome: "When an ungodly man is converted, God justified him through faith alone, not on account of good works which he possessed not."
• Chrysostom: "What then did God do? He made (says Paul) a righteous Person (Christ) to be a sinner, in order that he might make sinners righteous...it is the righteousness of God, when we are justified, not by works...but by grace, where all sin is made to vanish away."
• Chrysostom: "Again, they said that he who adhered to Faith alone was cursed, but he shows that he who adhered to Faith alone, is blessed."
• Augustine: "Grace is give to you, not wages paid to you...it is called grace because it is given gratuitously. By no precedent merits did you buy what you have received. The sinner therefore received this grace first, that his sins should be forgiven him...good works follow after a justified person; they do not go before in order that he may be justified...good works, following after justification, show what a man has received."
• Augustine: "Now, having duly considered and weighed all these circumstances and testimonies, we conclude that a man is not justified by the precepts of a holy life, but by faith in Jesus Christ,--in a word, not by the law of works, but by the law of faith; not by the letter, but by the spirit; not by the merits of deeds, but by free grace."
• Anselm: "Do you believe that you cannot be saved but by the death of Christ? Go, then, and ...put all your confidence in this death alone. If God shall say to you, "You are a sinner", say to him, "I place the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between me and my sin."
• Bernard of Clairvaux: "Shall not all our righteousness turn out to be mere unrighteousness and deficiency? What, then, shall it be concerning our sins, when not even our righteousness can answer for itself? Wherefore...let us flee, with all humility to Mercy which alone can save our souls...whoever hungers and thirsts after righteousness, let him believe in thee, who "justified the ungodly"; and thus, being justified by faith alone, he shall have peace with God."

Excellent post!

Seems even the "norm" doesn't even support their contra-NT doctrine.

 

[Elin]

There is NO past tense finitely. You possess it, but you do not have a title to it.

Baloney!

To "possess" is to make one's own, to own.

It is being held for you at the end and you will inherit it IF you are faithful.

Hogwash!

Our inheritance is guaranteed (Eph 1:14).

Those who are born again do persevere in faith,

because it is God who works in them to will and to do according to his good purpose (Php 2:13),

it is God who carries on to completion the good work he began in them (Php 1:6).

Those who do not persevere in faith were never born again in the first place.

There is NEVER a past tense in a believers life regarding his faith or salvation.

Hogwash!

That is found nowhere in the Bible.

What is found in the Bible is that we have been saved (past tense) by grace through faith (Eph 2:8).

What is found in the Bible is that we have been marked (past tense) in Christ with a seal, the Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance (Eph 1:14).

What is found in the Bible is that we have been given (past tense) to Jesus by the Father, from whose hand and Jesus' hand we cannot be snatched (Jn 10:28-29).

You likewise do not know or understand the Scriptures well enough to represent them correctly.
You preach a false, twice-condemned gospel (Gal 1:6-9).

 

[Cassian]

Paul said that we are not justified by works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ (Galatians 2:16). He also said, But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works (Romans 4:5-6). Again he said, who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began (2 Timothy 1:9). Once again he said, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit (Titus 3:5). I'm not seeing where Paul specified that we are saved by works of faith, just not works of the law. When it comes to the moral aspect of the law, which good works could a Christian accomplish that are completely detached from the two great commandments (Matthew 22:37-40) which are found in the law of Moses? (Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18)

this is an excellent explanation of being justified by faith.

The word justified means to render righteous; to declare, pronounce, one to be righteous. Justified by faith (Romans 5:1) does not mean we are still lost, but saved.

It means neither. It does mean to be made righteous, or to be put into a correct relationship. However it does not mean we are saved. Simply entering into Christ whice we do by repentance and baptism does not even save us. We were saved by Christ in order to fulfill our purpose of being created.
We have entered into a covenant relationship. Each side has obligations and commitments to meet. An example. if you signed a contract to work for someone. Signing the contract only means you have a job and that job must be fulfilled by withever it is you must do. I can assure you that if you don't keep your commitment to do the work, the contract is broken and you will be fired. You cannot sign a contract and sit down in a chair for the next 40 years and do nothing.

Belief is ongoing but we are still saved the moment that we believe (Acts 10:43; 16:31; Romans 1:16).

Yes, you take possession of your salvation. But the conditions must be met. If they are not, you are no longer being saved. Very simple to understand. You take possession but you do not inherit that promise until the end. I Pet 1:3-5. It all depends on your faith. No works, means no faith. No faith, means no salvation.

The word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith in "Christ alone" conveys the message that

Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not on the merits of our works.
It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony* James here is discussing the proof of faith (I will show you my faith by my works - (James 2:18) not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3). Works bear out the justification that comes by faith.

that is correct. But if one does not keep up the works, the faith becomes dead. We are not saved by being faithless, or unfaithful. We have broken our commitment to Christ to do what He commands of us.

Man is saved through faith and not by works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; 2 Timothy 1:9; Titus 3:5) yet genuine faith is substantiated and confirmed by good works (James 2:14-24). This is the balance that gets out of balance.

Why is it that so many are confused over this issue. It had never been an issue, never even had a false teaching regarding it until the Reformation.
Part of the confusion is that Calvin differed with Luther completely on this same issue. Because of Predestination being the foundation of his theological system, faith becomes merely an activator of predestination, thus once activated, a believer obviously cannot be lost if one is predestined to be saved.
Now, I see so-called Arminians trying to employ the theory of OSAS into an understanding that recognizes man's free will in his response to God.

Faith is the root and works are the fruit of salvation. No fruit demonstrates no root.

which means no salvation. The sower parable here would be a good example. The two middle examples are of believers who started, but were overwhelmed by the cares of this world and succumbed to the world, lost faith and died.

Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus (Romans 3:24).

[/quuote] this is NOT refering to believers. This is refering to what Christ did for the world. You need to take the next two verses along with this. Christ was reconciling the world back to God. This is wholly a different "justificatioin" taking place. Another one is II Cor 5:18-19 which has Christ reconciling thej world back to God, but also shows the reason why in vs 21, Paul exhorts his listeners to be reconciled to God. That is the Justification by faith, that a person does which then reconciled him to God.
There are two reconciliations taking place.
One: Christ to God.
Second: Man to God.
Without the former, the latter is impossible.

 

[Shava]

What does God use to judge us?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

What does God use to judge us?

the law

the penalty of sin (breaking the law) is death.

 

[just-me]

What does God use to judge us?

Al of His words

Deuteronomy 8:1-3 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP]All the commandments which I command thee this day shall ye observe to do, that ye may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the LORD sware unto your fathers.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]And thou shalt remember all the way which the LORD thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, and to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or no.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna, which thou knewest not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live.

 

[SeaBass]

The gospel is the good news of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who believes.. (Romans 1:16). The gospel is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish as a prerequisite for salvation. It simply sets forth Christ crucified, buried and risen as the Savior of all who believe (trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of their salvation). Faith alone did not originate in the reformation.

You posted "The gospel is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish as a prerequisite for salvation"

2 Thess 1:8 "In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ"

Must one believe to be saved, Jn 8:24? Repent, Lk 13:3,5? Confess, Mt 10:32,33? Be baptized, Mk 16:16? Yes, one must do these "rituals" or whatever you would like to call them for the unbeliever, the impenitent, the denier of Christ who is lost in his unforgiven sins cannot be saved without doing this ""ritual".


Jn 14:15 If ye love me Keep my commandments. Christ's commandments are a code of law that one must obey in order to love Christ, to keep from being a lawbreaker. John said transgression of the law is sin, so not keeping "law of code" is sin.

EPh 2:10; 1 Jn 3:17 Matt 25:32ff - AFTER one becomes a Christian, he must do good works to maintain his salvation. The Christian cannot go thru his life doing evil, unrighteous works and expect to be saved.

• Clement of Rome: "We also, being called through God's will in Christ Jesus, are not justified through ourselves, neither through our own wisdom or understanding, or piety, or works which we have done in holiness or heart, but through faith" (Epistle to Corinthians).
• Ignatius: "His cross, and his death, and his resurrection, and the faith which is through him, are my unpolluted muniments; and in these, through your prayers, I am willing to be justified (Epistle to Philadelphians). Note: "muniments" are title deeds, documents giving evidence of legal ownership of something.
• Polycarp: "I know that through grace you are saved, not of works, but by the will of God, through Jesus Christ (Epistle of Philippians).
• Justin Martyr: "No longer by the blood of goats and of sheep, or by the ashes of a heifer...are sins purged, but by faith, through the blood of Christ and his death, who died on this very account (Dialogue with Trypho). "God gave his own Son the ransom for us...for what, save his righteousness, could cover our sins. In whom was it possible that we, transgressors and ungodly as we were, could be justified, save in the Son of God alone? ...O unexpected benefit, that the transgression of many should be hidden in one righteous Person and that the righteousness of One should justify many transgressors" (Letter to Diognetus).
• Ireneus: "Through the obedience of one man who first was born from the Virgin, many should be justified and receive salvation.
• Athanasius: "Not by these (i.e. human efforts) but by faith, a man is justified as was Abraham.
• Basil: "This is the true and perfect glorying in God, when a man is not lifted up on account of his own righteousness, but has known himself to be wanting in true righteousness and to be justified by faith alone in Christ."
• Ambrose: "Without the works of the law, to an ungodly man, that is to say, a Gentile, believing in Christ, his "faith is imputed for righteousness" as also it was to Abraham."
• Origen: "Through faith, without the works of the law, the dying thief was justified, because...the Lord inquired not what he had previously wrought, nor yet waited for his performance of some work after he should have believe; but...he took him unto himself for a companion, justified through his confession alone."
• Jerome: "When an ungodly man is converted, God justified him through faith alone, not on account of good works which he possessed not."
• Chrysostom: "What then did God do? He made (says Paul) a righteous Person (Christ) to be a sinner, in order that he might make sinners righteous...it is the righteousness of God, when we are justified, not by works...but by grace, where all sin is made to vanish away."
• Chrysostom: "Again, they said that he who adhered to Faith alone was cursed, but he shows that he who adhered to Faith alone, is blessed."
• Augustine: "Grace is give to you, not wages paid to you...it is called grace because it is given gratuitously. By no precedent merits did you buy what you have received. The sinner therefore received this grace first, that his sins should be forgiven him...good works follow after a justified person; they do not go before in order that he may be justified...good works, following after justification, show what a man has received."
• Augustine: "Now, having duly considered and weighed all these circumstances and testimonies, we conclude that a man is not justified by the precepts of a holy life, but by faith in Jesus Christ,--in a word, not by the law of works, but by the law of faith; not by the letter, but by the spirit; not by the merits of deeds, but by free grace."
• Anselm: "Do you believe that you cannot be saved but by the death of Christ? Go, then, and ...put all your confidence in this death alone. If God shall say to you, "You are a sinner", say to him, "I place the death of our Lord Jesus Christ between me and my sin."
• Bernard of Clairvaux: "Shall not all our righteousness turn out to be mere unrighteousness and deficiency? What, then, shall it be concerning our sins, when not even our righteousness can answer for itself? Wherefore...let us flee, with all humility to Mercy which alone can save our souls...whoever hungers and thirsts after righteousness, let him believe in thee, who "justified the ungodly"; and thus, being justified by faith alone, he shall have peace with God."

You quoted many false teachers here. Show me from the BIBLE where Christ or one of His apostles said salvation comes by a dead faith only.