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Now the choice is clear do we follow our own thought patterns on what we imagine things should be ? I think not ! , now the thought pattern and precepts should be the Holy Word we follow because of Christ thanks be to Him to the glory og the Father , and if any is confused still in this matter i beseech you that you re evaluate where you are in christ and discern Hiis blood that you may be afreshed and not condemmed through deception of the devil in wich distorts all things good from God in order to destroy your vision of hope wich is salvation our faith un wich we believe , be stern steadfast wearing the armor of God that you resist the enemy .
G
deuteronomy22 5 says a women shall not wear that witch pertaineth unto a man neither shall a man put on womens clothing for all that do so are a abomination unto the Lord what I believe this is saying is that if a man has owned the clothes are has wore them they are mans not that if you buy mens clothing and be the first to wear them but you being a women should act accordingly as women do in the bible hope this helps best of luck
If something is called an 'abomination' that's not a good thing. I also think the tendency toward society being comfortable with women wearing manly clothes and having no gender distinction in the clothing is a bad thing.
I'm thinking of something I read recently from Philo, the Jewish philosopher in Alexandria who was a bit of a apologeticist for Judaism. His thinking was that transgendered (eunuchs who acted like girls), transvestites, and homosexuals should all be put to death. He considered it all to be part of the same thing.
In addition to theology, asthetically, it's just unappealing to see a man trying to dress up like a woman. Maybe not everyone agrees, but I suspect a large enough percent of males feel that way. There are transvestites and transgendered out there trying to dress really 'sexy.' What's the motivation of the person dressing? If they happen to pull it off, is it to stir up lust from men until they look a little closer and see the Adam's able, the big forehead, and the large hands, think 'ewww gross'?
The Bible also warns that 'malakos' will not inherit the kingdom of God. I suppose we could take that to refer to a catamite in a homosexual act, but from studying a little about the word in Greek, I suspect it would have been used to refer to cross-dressers as well. They did have them back then.
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Sorry I dont mean to be cryptic or anything lol..ill give an example, one person that comes to mind is ellen degeneres (because we have a tv at work and it always happens to be on at lunchtime) and whenever I see her I always feel an uneasiness and disgust on the inside, I believe im discerning she has a perversive spirit influencing her. So in my understanding cross dressing is an abomination because its a perversion and God hates perversion.
There's a huge difference in a woman wearing a mans shirt bc it's comfortable and a women choosing to wear men's clothing so she looks like a man. I've seen women bind their breasts so they don't appear feminine at all. I normally wear men's sweatshirts in the winter because they do fit me better yet one can still clearly tell I'm a women. That isn't cross dressing, but when you intentionally dress in a way to fools others that you're not the gender God made you then there lies the problem.
Society may may have changed but The bible doesn't. No one has the right to try to make the scriptures fit society when society should fit scripture.
Society may may have changed but The bible doesn't. No one has the right to try to make the scriptures fit society when society should fit scripture.
Y
8 And it shall come to pass in the day of the LORD’s sacrifice, that I will punish the princes, and the king’s children, and all such as are clothed with strange apparel.
(Zeph 1:8 KJV)
9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; 10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.
(1Tim 2:9-10 KJV)
(Zeph 1:8 KJV)
9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; 10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.
(1Tim 2:9-10 KJV)
S
There's a big difference between putting on daddies sweatshirt cuz it's comfortable and trying to present yourself as something other than you are. We are all given burdens to bear. Some of it is generational and some of it the fruit of what we have nurtured in our heart. The point is that we are to offer our bodies as living sacrifices which is your spiritual act of worship and this is what is pleasing to God.
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
ef·fem·i·nate [i fémmənət]
adj
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="class: DEFINITION"]1. [/TD]
[TD="class: DEFINITION"]offensive term: an offensive term used to describe a man whose behavior, appearance [as in a cross dresser], or speech is considered to be similar to that traditionally associated with women or girls [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Pro 23:7 For as he [the man] thinketh in his heart, so is he: Eat and drink, saith he to thee; but his heart is not with thee.
Dan 4:16 Let his heart be changed from man's, and let a beast's heart be given unto him; and let seven times pass over him.
Mat 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.
Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
Sin, I believe, is a spirit.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Joh 8:23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
Joh 8:38 I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father.
Joh 8:39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Point being, as the spirit is within the person, so is the person.
Even as the spirit of God changes a man, causing him both to will and do of His good pleasure, in like manner, there are various demonic or evil spirits that will cause a person to think, speak, and act like it is.
The name of the spirit defines what it is.
1Ki 22:22 And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.
Eze 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and [to] keep my judgments, and do them.
Amo 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?
1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
ef·fem·i·nate [i fémmənət]
adj
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="class: DEFINITION"]1. [/TD]
[TD="class: DEFINITION"]offensive term: an offensive term used to describe a man whose behavior, appearance [as in a cross dresser], or speech is considered to be similar to that traditionally associated with women or girls [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Pro 23:7 For as he [the man] thinketh in his heart, so is he: Eat and drink, saith he to thee; but his heart is not with thee.
Dan 4:16 Let his heart be changed from man's, and let a beast's heart be given unto him; and let seven times pass over him.
Mat 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.
Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
Sin, I believe, is a spirit.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Joh 8:23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
Joh 8:38 I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father.
Joh 8:39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Point being, as the spirit is within the person, so is the person.
Even as the spirit of God changes a man, causing him both to will and do of His good pleasure, in like manner, there are various demonic or evil spirits that will cause a person to think, speak, and act like it is.
The name of the spirit defines what it is.
1Ki 22:22 And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.
Eze 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and [to] keep my judgments, and do them.
Amo 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?
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Let me remind everyone that women never wore pants until recently and guys used to wear tights...just saying. Wearing clothes of the opposite sex is not a bad thing...they are only deemed clothes for the opposite sex by cultural standards...Men in Ireland wear kilts. Why is it women can wear a suit and jeans without a problem but men in dresses? They used to wear dresses when they were little. I know this because my grandfather has dress suits as a child. I've seen his pictures. People, please stop making verses mean what they don't mean.
A
It troubles me that some Christians are quick to call something sin when that may not "always" be the case in every circumstance of a topic, such as cross dressing - there's only ONE verse on the subject in the entire Bible, located in the Old Covenant, surrounded by other passages that were intended for that specific time.
In Deuteronomy, the abomination part of the act of "wearing what pertains to the other gender" was likely either related to sexual promiscuity of surrounding peoples, or to coming in contact with sexual fluids on garments from a member of the opposite sex. I've already explained that in every other instance of sexuality, Tow`ebah is tied to improper sexual relations / fluid exchange with another person.
Jumping forward to today.... if it is a shame for you to cross dress, don't do it. If it is a shame for you to simply "see" a cross dresser, not engaged in any other sexual activity or promiscuity, then turn your head. But you may want to do the same thing at the neighborhood swimming pool when moms and daughters are out wearing one and two piece swim suits, revealing their bodies in a way that was unheard of in the presence of men of the Bible. We give a pass to the women and daughters (who are obviously presenting as women) but then criticize a man who covers much more of his body but still happens to be wearing a girl's t-shirt or pants. Really?
Another thread made the point about people being quick to say "I disagree with you so you're automatically presumed in sin. I don't care about your reasons, I don't care about your body shape or medical issues, I don't care about your conviction, repent or be lost." Does that attitude help or hurt in reaching the lost?
Thank you for pointing this out. When Paul says "nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind" shall inherit the Kingdom, this is also used by some to say if a man simply looks or presents feminine then he is in sin. This was not the intent of the passage. Effeminate is Malakos (the submissive receiver in a homosexual act - a catamite) and abusers with mankind is Arsenokoites (the dominant one performing the act). The two words are oppositely paired to discuss an act of sexual promiscuity, not appearances. A cross dresser of the day could have also been a catamite, but the passage never states this was the case every time.
In Deuteronomy, the abomination part of the act of "wearing what pertains to the other gender" was likely either related to sexual promiscuity of surrounding peoples, or to coming in contact with sexual fluids on garments from a member of the opposite sex. I've already explained that in every other instance of sexuality, Tow`ebah is tied to improper sexual relations / fluid exchange with another person.
Jumping forward to today.... if it is a shame for you to cross dress, don't do it. If it is a shame for you to simply "see" a cross dresser, not engaged in any other sexual activity or promiscuity, then turn your head. But you may want to do the same thing at the neighborhood swimming pool when moms and daughters are out wearing one and two piece swim suits, revealing their bodies in a way that was unheard of in the presence of men of the Bible. We give a pass to the women and daughters (who are obviously presenting as women) but then criticize a man who covers much more of his body but still happens to be wearing a girl's t-shirt or pants. Really?
Another thread made the point about people being quick to say "I disagree with you so you're automatically presumed in sin. I don't care about your reasons, I don't care about your body shape or medical issues, I don't care about your conviction, repent or be lost." Does that attitude help or hurt in reaching the lost?
Thank you for pointing this out. When Paul says "nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind" shall inherit the Kingdom, this is also used by some to say if a man simply looks or presents feminine then he is in sin. This was not the intent of the passage. Effeminate is Malakos (the submissive receiver in a homosexual act - a catamite) and abusers with mankind is Arsenokoites (the dominant one performing the act). The two words are oppositely paired to discuss an act of sexual promiscuity, not appearances. A cross dresser of the day could have also been a catamite, but the passage never states this was the case every time.
A
The trouble some here are having is when a man tries to present as a woman by wearing women's clothes. The women don't seem to care either way, but the men are quick to call it sin, witchcraft, perversion, etc. May I remind those men that not all cross dressers do so to try and attract other men, any more than all women get up in the morning and make themselves attractive for the sole purpose of pleasing men, or shop for new outfits for the sole purpose of pleasing men, or get their hair and nails done for the sole purpose of pleasing men.
There's also a difference between a masculine burly dude showing up in a pink dress and someone less masculine wearing more neutral women's clothes. If it's proper and non-tacky, you won't even notice a cross dresser is wearing clothes of the opposite sex from a distance. What's improper is calling yourself out in a crowd in which the cross dressing becomes an aggressive way to catch attention and then "feed the fire" of confusion. I don't experience that when I'm out in public.... most people don't even glance and instead go about their lives. Isn't that the way it should be?
There's also a difference between a masculine burly dude showing up in a pink dress and someone less masculine wearing more neutral women's clothes. If it's proper and non-tacky, you won't even notice a cross dresser is wearing clothes of the opposite sex from a distance. What's improper is calling yourself out in a crowd in which the cross dressing becomes an aggressive way to catch attention and then "feed the fire" of confusion. I don't experience that when I'm out in public.... most people don't even glance and instead go about their lives. Isn't that the way it should be?