Does water baptism save us

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Elizabeth619

Elizabeth619

Senior Member
#241
Jul 19, 2011
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#241
peacefulbeliever said:
Now come the sarcastic remarks . . . I really don't like it when a thread turns that way.
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How is it sarcastic? You said being born of water is being born from the womb. If one is not born from the womb then they are not born of water. If one is not born of water then they cannot be born of spirit. That would mean they will not enter the Kingdom.
That would mean millions of aborted babies are lost, and I am as well since I did not come from a natural birth.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#242
#242
ChosenbyHim said:
No it is not about Jesus. The Lord Jesus Christ did not and does not have any impurities. And he did not have any idols either. Jesus Christ was and is perfect and sinless.
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The I (I will sprinkle) is Jesus

Yes, Jesus is pure. that is why ONLY HE can sprinkle clean water on you
 
Elizabeth619

Elizabeth619

Senior Member
#243
Jul 19, 2011
6,397
109
48
#243
ChosenbyHim said:
No it is not about Jesus. The Lord Jesus Christ did not and does not have any impurities. And he did not have any idols either. Jesus Christ was and is perfect and sinless.
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Where does it say Jesus has impurities?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#244
#244
Elizabeth619 said:
How is it sarcastic? You said being born of water is being born from the womb. If one is not born from the womb then they are not born of water. If one is not born of water then they cannot be born of spirit. That would mean they will not enter the Kingdom.
That would mean millions of aborted babies are lost, and I am as well since I did not come from a natural birth.
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1. You were still born of water.
2. As for those who died in the womb, Did they ever receive a soul? or was it a shell which was still born?
 
D

Daley

Guest
#245
#245
"That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water BY THE WORD." (Eph 5:26) The water is the word of God. Only God's word and his Holy Spirit have the power to give us a new birth, but physical water itself is powerless. Baptism merely symbolizes that we have died (buried) to our old way of life, and live (raised up) to a new life governed by the Spirit and not the flesh, but it symbolizes something that has already occurred; it isn't the water that will make us new inside.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#246
Jul 31, 2013
37,426
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#246
SeaBass said:
If the new birth consists of physical birth, then Jesus is telling Nicodemus he "must be physically born" as if Jesus could not figure out he was already physically born. The word "must"....how can you command, instruct someone to be physically born when they already are?
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now you sound just like Nicodemus! :)


SeaBass said:
"Must be born again"

"Again" implies one has already been born once (physical birth) so he must be born again (spiritual birth). Jesus is not instructing Nicodemus to be born again physically, they both understood the physical impossibility of that.
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and so we land at v.5-6 - therefore we tell you, what is born of flesh is flesh and what is born of spirit is spirit.
and you say, like Nicodemus,
"how can these things be?"

reading the rest of John chapter 3, i don't see Jesus explaining to Nicodemus about ritual water baptism, but about the mystery of Grace revealed through Christ come in the flesh for the salvation of the world.
 
peacefulbeliever

peacefulbeliever

Senior Member
#249
Feb 21, 2012
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#249
Elizabeth619 said:
So why did Ezekiel prophecy Iwill sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols. 36:25

​This prophecy is about Jesus.
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Yes, the prophecy is regarding Jesus. And we have been washed with "living water" which is by the holy Spirit and can't get much cleaner than that! Being washed by the holy Spirit makes you righteous before God - cleanses you within - gives you the strength to put off the old and put on the new - to walk by the Spirit and not the flesh - enables you to resist the devil and puts a seal upon us - all those good promises! The new birth - being born of the Spirit is being born again by God; being a partaker of the divine nature - water cannot do that.

John 4:10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him and he would have given thee living water.

John 7:38,39 He that believeth on me as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit which they that believe on him should receive for the holy Spirit was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

At the well, why didn't Jesus just pour some water on her and baptize her if water baptism saves?

Jesus Christ baptizes in holy Spirit.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#250
#250
Elizabeth619 said:
So babies do not have souls now?
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A baby who is still born? (yes, they were still born of water, even though they were born dead) or a baby who is born alive?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#251
#251
Elizabeth619 said:
Many miscarriages do not result in birthing the dead fetus.
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well that would be a different case then.

scripture states God breaths life into a body at birth. that is when the soul is born.
 
ChosenbyHim

ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
#254
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
113
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#254
Elizabeth619 said:
Where does it say Jesus has impurities?
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It doesn't say that.

I must have misunderstood you.

If what you meant is that it is The Lord Jesus who cleanses and washes us. Then that is correct; since He is pure, holy, and perfect.
 
Elizabeth619

Elizabeth619

Senior Member
#255
Jul 19, 2011
6,397
109
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#255
eternally-gratefull said:
well that would be a different case then.

scripture states God breaths life into a body at birth. that is when the soul is born.
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You sure about that? John the Baptist was filled with the spirit when he was still a fetus.
 
peacefulbeliever

peacefulbeliever

Senior Member
#256
Feb 21, 2012
3,794
199
63
#256
Elizabeth619 said:
How is it sarcastic? You said being born of water is being born from the womb. If one is not born from the womb then they are not born of water. If one is not born of water then they cannot be born of spirit. That would mean they will not enter the Kingdom.
That would mean millions of aborted babies are lost, and I am as well since I did not come from a natural birth.
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I can't understand how some of these ridiculous questions come up. Every human being is born from the womb and they are encased in water - that which is born of the flesh is flesh. What is it that is so hard to understand?

"If one is not born of water then they cannot be born of spirit." If one is not born of water - how did they get here? Usually, babies that aborted are fetuses (not to lessen the act of abortion) and are not fully developed. A person born by way of a C-section was born in water. The only way a person can be alive and here is if they were born in water - that which is born of the flesh is flesh.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#258
#258
Elizabeth619 said:
You were the one who asked if they ever received a soul.
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I made a comment, I am not sure we can be sure they did. if they did not. there is nothing to be saved.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#259
#259
Elizabeth619 said:
You sure about that? John the Baptist was filled with the spirit when he was still a fetus.
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Alot of abnormal things happened leading up to Christ.
 
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