Lord, Lord. I never knew you

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shad

Guest
#2
We are called to preach Christ and Him crucified. Christ died as me and for me and was judged for all sin. For it pleased the Father to bruise the Son on our behalf / Is 58:10. That is the finished work of the cross and that is what we are to preach. Many preachers have repentance backwards. When we hear the message of Christ crucified, we come under conviction and that conviction turns us to Christ and we believe by faith and are born again through grace and regenerated through mercy. We are not born again because of any repentance on our part, we are born again because Christ died for me and as me and I believe. We are turned to the Lord and the Holy Spirit comes and indwells us at that point and we are born of the incorruptible seed of God's word / 1Pt 1:23. We are turned to the Lord as a totally depraved person, dead in trespasses and sins and with a deceitful and desperately wicked heart. In that state how can we possibly even know how to repent of sin. We are dead but we receive grace through faith and God resurrects us in the newness of life / Rom 6:4.

After we are born again we now can repent and put away the flesh and put away the sins of the old man Adam. We have turned to Christ and now He has a plan to turn us from the old man by having us put on the new man. If you think you can repent of all your sins and then believe upon Christ to be born again, you can't do it and you will spend the rest of your life trying. When you believe upon Christ, He cleanses you from all sin, He gives you a gift of His righteousness and puts the Holy Spirit in you. Now that you are cleansed from sin, He can convict you when you do sin so that you can confess it to God to be forgiven and remain clean. You must first believe upon Christ and His blood for the remission of sins and then you are quickened by the word through the Holy Spirit and granted repentance through grace to turn from any sin in your life. Every single believer has sin problems after they are born again and they have to be renewed in their mind by growing in grace and knowledge of Christ / 2Pt 3:18.

Preaching Christ and Him crucified is what makes the demons tremble. To preach the resurrection of Christ reveals Satan's defeat and our victory over sin and death. To preach the ascension of Christ places the believer in a seated position, in heavenly places in Christ / Eph 2:6.
 
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Phoenix

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#3
Amen shad.
 
Oct 17, 2009
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#4
Either way, the point is that we still must make a choice to follow Christ's example if we want to call ourselves Christians.

Otherwise it's just smoke and mirrors.
 
Jan 8, 2009
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Jan 8, 2009
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#6
I'm not sure what his up and down diagram representing the life of a believer is supposed to be either. If we are saved by grace through faith in Christ alone, then it is not an up and down graph of perfection it is a flat-line of 100% perfection in Christ's holiness and righteousness which He accomplished for us on the cross.
 
Oct 17, 2009
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#7
Salvation--the changing of our hearts--is a free gift.

But discipleship, following Christ's example of love and giving, can be an incredibly difficult task.
 
Jan 8, 2009
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#8


One leads to the other I would think , with persistence and over time.
 
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Phoenix

Guest
#9
Paul washer is right on these things.
To many people just say I believe and thats it. that is not it truly truly just as the prodigal son sought his father so must we seek it if we truly are called.
We are bound to stumble and fall. saying that it is 100 percent perfection means you have not really looked at how it is for a christian
 
Apr 23, 2009
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#10
Paul washer is right on these things.
To many people just say I believe and thats it. that is not it truly truly just as the prodigal son sought his father so must we seek it if we truly are called.
We are bound to stumble and fall. saying that it is 100 percent perfection means you have not really looked at how it is for a christian
Yes I agree Paul Washer is correct, he sheds the light on the fact that most people that believe they are saved truly are not.
 
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shad

Guest
#11
If there is one specific strategy of the devil that he would like to accomplish in the believers heart, it is to put a seed of doubt and skepticism concerning God's salvation that comes by grace through faith. If the devil was successful in doing this, the believer would doubt their salvation every time they sinned or had a sinful thought. If he was successful he would be able to condemn the heart of the believer and tell him that he is not fit for the kingdom of God. If he was successful he would convince the believer of having no fruit and how can you truly be saved with no fruit to show for it. If he was successful he would be able to deceive the heart and mind of the believer that you need more than grace to save you, you need to repent and show the fruit of that repentance. If the devil was to be really successful he would have ministers of righteousness preaching this stuff in pulpits all over the world to convince people that believing in the cross and blood of Christ is not enough to save you and cleanse you from all sin.

Is that the kind of gospel that we want to preach to the masses of sinners that are in the world? Don't we want to preach the glorious gospel of Christ that removes the wrath and condemnation of God when we believe in the finished work of Christ? Do we want people to have the good news that God can forgive and cleanse them through what Christ did on the cross by taking their sin and being judged in their place? Don't we want people to know that they can be reconciled to God through Jesus Christ and that God does not impute any of their sins or trespasses unto them? If anyone has made a profession and received Christ we are to build them up in Christ and minister grace and never condemn them. We are to impart Christ no matter what and let Christ plow up the fallow ground of their heart so that they can receive the incorruptible seed of His word.

It is only pride in the heart of man that preaches anything but Christ and Him crucified. The whole counsel of God is to be communicated and submitted to Christ and Him crucified. It was not repentance that saved Noah and the 8 souls in the ark, it was that Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord / Gen 6:8. Think about what some of these preachers today would preach to Lot, his wife and family, who lived in Sodom and was being vexed by the filthy conversation of the wicked. They would tell him to repent and that their is no fruit of your salvation in Sodom. They would tell you that Lot only made a profession of faith but was not truly saved. However, the Holy Scriptures, that is inspired of God, would disagree with them because the scriptures reported that Lot was a just and righteous man / 2Pt 2:7,8 and that came from Peter in the NT. I say this to all those NT preachers that we have today that are so quick to judge according to the outward appearance of fruit.

These preachers that go around judging believers as to whether they are truly saved based upon whether they have a changed life, do not understand the righteousness of God's grace that comes to the lost soul through the sacrifice of Christ. If it was based upon a changed life then you would have to say that the Mormons and their converts that have a changed life must be regenerated. Regeneration had nothing to do with a changed life but has to do with the impartation of a new life through Christ that needs grace and mercy from God and to be taught the word of God every day. They need the fellowship of other believers who are receiving grace and walking by faith in the promises of God. Solomon backslid for years, Abraham backslid for years, David backslid, Israel backslid, Peter backslid and none of them produced any fruit whatsoever during their backslidden state. Do we write them off and count them with the heathen because they produced no fruit?
 

jjkg

Senior Member
May 25, 2005
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#12
If there is one specific strategy of the devil that he would like to accomplish in the believers heart, it is to put a seed of doubt and skepticism concerning God's salvation that comes by grace through faith.
I believe another great strategy of Satan is to have those who are really not saved believing that they are.
 
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shad

Guest
#15
I believe another great strategy of Satan is to have those who are really not saved believing that they are.
Perhaps they are the ones that go around preaching this stuff as ministers of righteousness through an angel of light / 2Cor 11:14,15 with a counterfeit gospel, preaching another Jesus and receiving another spirit / 2Cor 11:3,4, Gal 1:6,7. We are made righteous by faith through the sacrifice of Christ and not by exhibiting some kind of fruit through a changed life. Tell me, where is the evidence of a changed life when you give a cup of cold water in the name of the disciple and Jesus Christ rewards you for that / Mt 10:40-42? And don't forget this passage of scripture;

Mt 25:35-40 For I was an hungered, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
36Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
37Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungered, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

Think of what this is saying. Jesus was hungry, He was thirsty, a stranger, naked, sick, and in prison. And a righteous man met his needs, not even knowing or discerning that it was Christ he was ministering to. The righteous man saw no fruit or evidence that it was Christ but he still ministered to the least. Christ came to serve and to minster, to seek and save the lost and to heal the sick.

Here is a righteous man doing these things unto Christ and not even realizing it. The only evidence or fruit that we will ever see is when Jesus Christ rewards that righteous man, not on the earth for men to see but at the judgment seat of Christ. And there are some that would judge him to be rejected by God because they could not see his fruit.

And don't forget Mt 6:4-21. I don't want to be around any preacher that does not preach the grace of God and does not preach Christ and Him crucified because that man's labor is in vain. He is not building on the foundation of the finished work that has already been laid.
 
Apr 23, 2009
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#16
If there is one specific strategy of the devil that he would like to accomplish in the believers heart, it is to put a seed of doubt and skepticism concerning God's salvation that comes by grace through faith.
I believe another great strategy of Satan is to have those who are really not saved believing that they are.
Perhaps they are the ones that go around preaching this stuff as ministers of righteousness through an angel of light / 2Cor 11:14,15 with a counterfeit gospel, preaching another Jesus and receiving another spirit / 2Cor 11:3,4, Gal 1:6,7. We are made righteous by faith through the sacrifice of Christ and not by exhibiting some kind of fruit through a changed life. Tell me, where is the evidence of a changed life when you give a cup of cold water in the name of the disciple and Jesus Christ rewards you for that / Mt 10:40-42? And don't forget this passage of scripture;
The emboldened portion of your post is true and untrue. We are saved by grace through faith. however if we are saved our fruits will testify of that salvation, and if we are not saved our fruits will also testify of faithlessness. We must know what the grace of God is to preach it correct. It is the grace of God that reconciles us to Himself through Jesus, and empowers us to overcome sin. The grace of God is not a immunity to judgment no matter how we live our lives.
 
Jan 8, 2009
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#17
These preachers that go around judging believers as to whether they are truly saved based upon whether they have a changed life, do not understand the righteousness of God's grace that comes to the lost soul through the sacrifice of Christ.
Agreed. The focus is all wrong. Particularly when you see videos where Paul Washer says that a person must seek God or they go to hell. He doesn't seem to understand the Gospel. It is disgusting. Beware of preachers in neat tidy suits.
 
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Phoenix

Guest
#18
Wow i can really see that a lot of people here do not like to be confronted. Truly truly i say to you test yourselves to see if you are in the faith.
 
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roaringkitten

Guest
#19
"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matthew 7:21-23

The deadly pitfall of these people in Matthew 7:21-23 was that they believed another gospel by NOT doing the will of the Father. Another gospel that mixed in self righteousness!(ie:Lordship salvation, good works, etc) These people failed to understand Galatians 2:16; 2:21; 3:1-3, Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 11:6, Titus 3:5, etc....An example that faith cannot be mixed with works for salvation:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." Ephesians 2:8-9

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work." Romans 11:6


Doing the "will of the Father" cannot be mixed with self righteousness. "And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day." John 6:40.

If you trust in Jesus and partly in yourself, you came to the wrong Jesus and were deceived....People either trust Him 100% or will perish in the lake of fire...
 
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Definition_Christ

Guest
#20
Matthew 7:23
And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Whoa..... You mean Jesus didn't say "I knew you, than you backslide and turned away from me and now I don't know you" ????????????
 
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