Hate Your Family?

[Richie_2uk]

Hate Your Family?​

​

[FONT=&quot]On a Local radio discussion show, there was someone who called herself a Christian. Her name was Rebekah. She was brought up as a Christian. She had attended Bible colleges and been on some mission trips. But after growing doubt and a series of life events, she had given up on her faith. Today she is an atheist. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]She was asked “how did Jesus disappoint you?” Today’s verse was one reason she gave for questioning Jesus’ worthiness as a holy man. On a surface reading, why wouldn’t she? What kind of holy man would tell people to hate their parents, siblings, spouse… even their own children? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]But this same man taught love for God, neighbours and even enemies (Matthew 5: 44, Matthew 22: 37-40) He loved children (Mark 10: 13-16), and as he was dying made sure his mother would be cared for (John 19: 26-27) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]If he was a man of hate, he wasn’t a very good at it. Jesus’ talk about ‘hating’ one’s family should be understood in the context of comparison – no one is to compete with our love and devotion for Jesus. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The meaning of the word hate in the original language was ‘to love less’ Large crowds were following Jesus at this time (Luke 14: 25) But Jesus wasn’t after numbers. He sought radically committed disciples who would give him complete allegiance. He was heading to a Roman cross and warned that his disciples would face trouble. To persevere, they needed to count the cost of following him (Luke 14: 27-33). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Christians are people who have given ownership of their lives to Jesus above all others – Even family. The question for both atheist and believer is whether this radical demand was warranted. The early Christians thought so and bought change “all over the world” by following him (Acts 17: 6). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]How do you consult Jesus in your decision making? What does it mean for you to love Jesus above all others?[/FONT]

 

[Cycel]

Hate Your Family?​

On a Local radio discussion show, there was someone who called herself a Christian. Her name was Rebekah. She was brought up as a Christian. She had attended Bible colleges and been on some mission trips. But after growing doubt and a series of life events, she had given up on her faith. Today she is an atheist.

She was asked “how did Jesus disappoint you?” Today’s verse was one reason she gave for questioning Jesus’ worthiness as a holy man. On a surface reading, why wouldn’t she? What kind of holy man would tell people to hate their parents, siblings, spouse… even their own children?

But this same man taught love for God, neighbours and even enemies (Matthew 5: 44, Matthew 22: 37-40) He loved children (Mark 10: 13-16), and as he was dying made sure his mother would be cared for (John 19: 26-27)

If he was a man of hate, he wasn’t a very good at it. Jesus’ talk about ‘hating’ one’s family should be understood in the context of comparison – no one is to compete with our love and devotion for Jesus.

The meaning of the word hate in the original language was ‘to love less’ Large crowds were following Jesus at this time (Luke 14: 25) But Jesus wasn’t after numbers. He sought radically committed disciples who would give him complete allegiance. He was heading to a Roman cross and warned that his disciples would face trouble. To persevere, they needed to count the cost of following him (Luke 14: 27-33).

Christians are people who have given ownership of their lives to Jesus above all others – Even family. The question for both atheist and believer is whether this radical demand was warranted. The early Christians thought so and bought change “all over the world” by following him (Acts 17: 6).

How do you consult Jesus in your decision making? What does it mean for you to love Jesus above all others?

It's something of an enigma, isn't it? Why would Jesus say, "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple"?(Luke 14:26)

It doesn't matter how many quotes you can find of Jesus teaching love, this one passage remains a fly in the ointment. What does it really mean? Either Jesus never said this, or he did say it and perhaps this hints that maybe, just maybe, there is something else to Jesus that people don't understand.

 

[Spokenpassage]

It's something of an enigma, isn't it? Why would Jesus say, "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple"?(Luke 14:26)

It doesn't matter how many quotes you can find of Jesus teaching love, this one passage remains a fly in the ointment. What does it really mean? Either Jesus never said this, or he did say it and perhaps this hints that maybe, just maybe, there is something else to Jesus that people don't understand.

The Greek word for hate in this verse is 'miseo' which means, I hate, detest, love less, or esteem less. So in this verse, it's meaning love less,, it's pretty clear.

 

[Richie_2uk]

What does it really mean? Either Jesus never said this, or he did say it and perhaps this hints that maybe, just maybe, there is something else to Jesus that people don't understand.

I think I will go with that people don't fully understand. rather than your statement of whether Jesus said it or not. or something about Jesus that we don't understand. People can say something that could cause doubt. So I would be careful what you say and perhaps how you say it too. We will never understand Jesus' love. We will never understand many things in the bible. and I rather admit to someone that I don't understand, and that I will seek understanding From God. rather stating something that could doubt in specially new Christians.

Perhaps you didn't mean it how it was said. But this is were we as Christians has to be careful; in what we say, and how we say things. Jesus said and quoted and stated things, and we should accept what he says. its up to us, to approach Jesus by faith to seek understand in what he says. rather rely on our own thoughts.

 

[Richie_2uk]

The Greek word for hate in this verse is 'miseo' which means, I hate, detest, love less, or esteem less. So in this verse, it's meaning love less,, it's pretty clear.

yep true, But didn't I quote that in the op?

 

[Spokenpassage]

yep true, But didn't I quote that in the op?

I don't think he got it.

 

[Richie_2uk]

I don't think he got it.

well it's what happens when perhaps people don't read the full thread. Not saying he did or not. but in this case, maybe, maybe he may have not read it through. but its all good. God bless

 

[breno785au]

My father has not yet accepted myself being a christian. He has said many harsh things out of his misunderstanding, is becoming more and more distant but I still choose Christ over him even if our relationship has to crumble. I believe this is an example of what Jesus was talking about.

 

[Sirk]

Jesus was instructing his disciples that they needed to think about and count the cost of being his disciple. Take note of the metaphor immediately following Jesus' controversial statement.

 

[MrHonest]

Yeah thats why I love The Word its all crazy talk about how we can never save ourselves, leave behind the world, ignore our wants, and seek the invisible... its offensive. God has awesome mysteries for those who seek Him. I LOVE IT. Christ crucifies is where our salvation is. In Jesus' name.

 

[Billyd]

Matthew 10:37 puts it a little gentler. It says "He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me". The word loveth is translated from the Greek Word [SIZE=+1]filevw [/SIZE]Phileo. It is the word for love that means:

1. to approve of
2. to like
3. sanction
4. to treat affectionately or kindly, to welcome, befriend

In my words you must put Jesus first.

I won't go there but the same principle was shown in the story of Jacob, Rachel and Leah in Genesis 29.

 

[okeyxyz]

Jesus definitely said these words, but the question is: Did you understand them? People get the meanings of scriptures wrong because they depend on modern day usage of words to evaluate these ancient writings.

The words "love" and "hate" in the bible is not as we use them today. The way love is used in scriptures implies: to choose, to prefer, to join with, and hate is the opposite meaning, ie: to not choose, to not prefer, to not join with. So where the bible records:

34“Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35“For I came to SET A MAN AGAINST HIS FATHER, AND A DAUGHTER AGAINST HER MOTHER, AND A DAUGHTER-IN-LAW AGAINST HER MOTHER-IN-LAW; 36and A MAN’S ENEMIES WILL BE THE MEMBERS OF HIS HOUSEHOLD.37“He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. 38“And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. 39“He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it.

The command is: To depend on(love, choose, prefer, join to) God for your salvation, not your human traditions and constructs of family and society? Once again, love and hate is not as we use them today.

 

[Billyd]

The Greek word for hate in this verse is 'miseo' which means, I hate, detest, love less, or esteem less. So in this verse, it's meaning love less,, it's pretty clear.

I agree with your definition. I would like to know your source. Mine (Strong's) doesn't include love less or esteem less.

 

[Jda016]

Hate Your Family?​

On a Local radio discussion show, there was someone who called herself a Christian. Her name was Rebekah. She was brought up as a Christian. She had attended Bible colleges and been on some mission trips. But after growing doubt and a series of life events, she had given up on her faith. Today she is an atheist.

She was asked “how did Jesus disappoint you?” Today’s verse was one reason she gave for questioning Jesus’ worthiness as a holy man. On a surface reading, why wouldn’t she? What kind of holy man would tell people to hate their parents, siblings, spouse… even their own children?

But this same man taught love for God, neighbours and even enemies (Matthew 5: 44, Matthew 22: 37-40) He loved children (Mark 10: 13-16), and as he was dying made sure his mother would be cared for (John 19: 26-27)

If he was a man of hate, he wasn’t a very good at it. Jesus’ talk about ‘hating’ one’s family should be understood in the context of comparison – no one is to compete with our love and devotion for Jesus.

The meaning of the word hate in the original language was ‘to love less’ Large crowds were following Jesus at this time (Luke 14: 25) But Jesus wasn’t after numbers. He sought radically committed disciples who would give him complete allegiance. He was heading to a Roman cross and warned that his disciples would face trouble. To persevere, they needed to count the cost of following him (Luke 14: 27-33).

Christians are people who have given ownership of their lives to Jesus above all others – Even family. The question for both atheist and believer is whether this radical demand was warranted. The early Christians thought so and bought change “all over the world” by following him (Acts 17: 6).

How do you consult Jesus in your decision making? What does it mean for you to love Jesus above all others?

It always amazes me how people will take a scripture like this and then say something like, "ah Hah! Jesus was inconsistent! He can't be trusted!"

All one has to do is look into a matter to find the true meaning like the original word in Greek.

I think sometimes people just don't want to understand and remain ignorant.

 

[nl]

It's something of an enigma, isn't it? Why would Jesus say, "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple"?(Luke 14:26)...

Matthew Henry (1662-1714) and others have taught this refers to comparative love. Love for God-Jesus must be comparatively greater than love for the near relations of a traditional family even to the point of being willing to forsake family entirely. Some contemporary cultures would essentially require that if one of their members becomes a Christian. It may be an evidence of demonic spiritual influences (and the truth of Christianity) that no religion seems to generate such aversions and emotional rejections at times as Christianity.

Jesus says some hard things. As that passage in Luke 14 continues, Jesus says that we must be willing to bear a cross, pay a high cost, and forsake all to be a disciple (genuine disciple).

Doctrines of "easy believism" in many times and places have "lowered the bar" for becoming a Christian. "Believe and receive" seems too simple and it is. Jesus "raised the bar" with his words to a large crowd in that Luke 14 passage. Jesus wants more than a momentary "leap of faith". Jesus wants ongoing discipleship and commitment even if the earthly cost is high.

So likewise, whoever of you does not forsake all that he has cannot be My disciple. (Luke 14:33)​

 

[Richie_2uk]

It always amazes me how people will take a scripture like this and then say something like, "ah Hah! Jesus was inconsistent! He can't be trusted!"

All one has to do is look into a matter to find the true meaning like the original word in Greek.

I think sometimes people just don't want to understand and remain ignorant.

I don't remember saying that Jesus can't be trusted, If so? were?

 

[Cycel]

The Greek word for hate in this verse is 'miseo' which means, I hate, detest, love less, or esteem less. So in this verse, it's meaning love less,, it's pretty clear.

That's one way of writing off the difficulty, but I'd suspect there is much more to it than this. If it doesn't really mean hate, as we think of 'hate', then why don't all the translators just change the wording?

 

[Spokenpassage]

That's one way of writing off the difficulty, but I'd suspect there is much more to it than this. If it doesn't really mean hate, as we think of 'hate', then why don't all the translators just change the wording?

It's not really difficulty. There is different understandings of words throughout the bible. Like the word 'know' or 'knew' doesn't always mean knowledge, but a personal relation with someone. Like Adam knew his wife and she conceived...

 

[notuptome]

So I am expected to believe that this woman believes that Jesus taught that we are to hate our parents? The proper understanding if anyone had taken the time to teach her is that we are to love the Lord so much and with such sincere effort as to make our natural love for our family by comparison seem like hate.

Look at all the strife due to lack of discipleship.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Jda016]

I don't remember saying that Jesus can't be trusted, If so? were?

I wasn't referring to you Richie, but to the woman you talked about.