Exactly chubbena my friend. Bestiality is not condemned in the New Testament, so by this same crazy logic, it would be perfectly acceptable.
Anybody buy that line of thinking?
The Sabbath.
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Exactly chubbena my friend. Bestiality is not condemned in the New Testament, so by this same crazy logic, it would be perfectly acceptable.
Anybody buy that line of thinking?
[h=3]Isaiah 66:15-24[/h]Amplified Bible (AMP)Originally Posted by p_rehbeinIf one means "God's REST" will last forever...........then I fully agree. However time will come to an end, thus days will come to an end...........just saying
JesusLives said:
Isaiah 66:23
21st Century King James Version (KJ21)
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And it shall come to pass that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me,” saith the Lord.
I invite you to read the chapter 66 in Isaiah.
...............................
Not for nothing, but your comment has nothing to do with my comment. Do you not know that there is a day of reckoning coming? A day when time will end? The day Jesus returns and Judgment will begin for the unbelievers? Do you believe that there will be "days" in Heaven? Seriously?
................. (goodness) ..............
[SUP]15 [/SUP]For behold, the Lord will come in fire, and His chariots will be like the stormy wind, to render His anger with fierceness, and His rebuke with flames of fire.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]For by fire and by His sword will the Lord execute judgment upon all flesh, and the slain of the Lord will be many.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Those who [attempt to] sanctify themselves and cleanse themselves to enter [and sacrifice to idols] in the gardens, following after [SUP][a][/SUP]one in the midst, eating hog’s flesh and the abomination [creeping things] and the [mouse—their works and their thoughts] shall come to an end together, says the Lord.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For I know their works and their thoughts. And the time is coming when I will gather all nations and tongues, and they will come and see My glory.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]And I will set up a [miraculous] sign among them, and from them I will send survivors to the nations—to Tarshish, Pul (Put), and Lud, who draw the bow, to Tubal and Javan, to the isles and coastlands afar off that have not heard of My fame nor seen My glory. And they will declare and proclaim My glory among the nations.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]And they shall bring all your brethren from all the nations as an offering to the Lord—upon horses and in chariots and in litters and upon mules and upon camels—to My holy mountain Jerusalem, says the Lord, just as the children of Israel bring their cereal offering in a clean vessel to the house of the Lord.
[SUP]21 [/SUP]And I will also take some of them for priests and for Levites, says the Lord.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]For as the new [SUP][b][/SUP]heavens and the new earth which I make shall remain before Me, says the Lord, so shall your offspring and your name remain.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And it shall be that from one New Moon to another New Moon and from one Sabbath to another Sabbath, all flesh shall come to worship before Me, says the Lord.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]And they shall go forth and gaze upon the dead bodies of the [rebellious] men who have stepped over against Me; for their worm shall not die, their fire shall not be quenched, and they shall be an abhorrence to all mankind.
These verses sound as though it is the second coming and a New Heaven and a New Earth. Are you so sure there will be no more time?
Just some questions for you - Do you think God just rested by Himself on the 7th day of creation or do you think Adam and Eve plus the Angels joined Him? Why would God create something bless and sanctify it and make it holy and not continue doing it with Adam and Eve on a weekly basis? Why would it have to be written down when God walked with them in the garden and could lead them by example?
Can we, by our own will and strength, keep His Commandments thereby keeping our own lives?
Or do we come before the Lord in humility and meekness asking for mercy and the gift of life?
I suppose not many know that second one, especially in the OT.
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[TD]I apologize this is so long but man made the change God did not command it. I have nothing against our Catholic brothers and sisters and I believe many will be in heaven but the fact still remains they claim to have made the change. Please take the time to read. My bible says I must obey God rather than man.[/TD]
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Was the Sabbath changed from the seventh day of the week to the first day? Well, yes and no. Let’s deal with the “no” first.
God, “with whom there is no variation or shadow of turning” ( James 1:17 ), does not change ( Malachi 3:6 ). The Israelites received two laws from Moses: the law of Moses, that of ordinances and ceremonies; and the Law of God, embodied in the Ten Commandments, which is an expression of God’s character. If God does not change, neither will His Law. “My covenant I will not break, nor alter the word that has gone out of My lips” ( Psalm 89:34 ). “I know that everything God does will endure forever; nothing can be added to it and nothing taken from it” ( Ecclesiastes 3:14 ). “The works of his hands are faithful and just; all his precepts are trustworthy. They are steadfast for ever and ever, done in faithfulness and uprightness” ( Psalm 111:7 , 8 ).
God gave His Law to the Israelites at Mt. Sinai. Amid thunder and lightning, a thick cloud covered the mountain, and a trumpet blasted. Smoke billowed up as from a furnace and the whole mountain shook as the trumpet grew louder and louder. Moses led the Israelites out of their camp to meet with God, and every one of them trembled. Then God spoke ( Exodus 19:16-19 , 20:1 ). If this Law were to be changed, it would be reasonable to expect God Himself to announce it, and give reasons for its alteration, amid the same amount of ceremony. Yet there is no indication in Scripture of such an announcement.
[h=2]What About the New Testament?[/h]
In the New Testament, the seventh day of the week is called the Sabbath; it is mentioned 58 times. The first day of the week is mentioned eight times. It is simply called the first day of the week, and it is always differentiated from the Sabbath. This in itself is evidence for the continued validity of the seventh-day Sabbath.
The gospel writers record Jesus and the apostles going to the synagogue on Sabbath as their “custom” ( Luke 4:16 ). Jesus said, “I have kept My Father’s commandments” ( John 15:10 ). The women who went to anoint His body after his death “rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment” ( Luke 23:56 ). Nearly all of the incidents reported of the apostles’ preaching occurred on the seventh-day Sabbath. Of all the accusations the Jews made against the apostles, never once did they accuse the apostles of breaking the Sabbath.
Some teach that after Christ’s death and resurrection, the Old Testament law was done away with and a new covenant took its place. But Jesus Himself said, “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” ( Matthew 5:17 , 18 ). The law of Moses, which foreshadowed Christ’s sacrifice, was indeed made irrelevant, but Paul maintains that the Law of God is to be kept, though we now be under grace. “Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid; yea, we establish the law” ( Romans 3:31 ).
[h=2]How It Happened...[/h]
Yet for nearly 2,000 years now, millions of Christians have worshiped on Sunday. So was the Sabbath changed from the seventh to the first day of the week? Let’s look at the “yes” now.
“The Son of Man is Lord also of the Sabbath” ( Luke 6:5 ). Here Jesus staked His claim and forbade anyone to meddle with the Sabbath. Yet He knew there would be those who would claim the power to change God’s Law. Through Daniel he warned of just such a man. Describing a “little horn power” ( Daniel 7:8 ), Daniel says, “He will speak against the Most High and oppress his saints and try to change the set times and the laws” ( Daniel 7:25 ). Paul made a similar prediction: “Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God, or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God” ( 2 Thessalonians 2:3 , 4 , 7 ).
Paul warned that this blasphemy was already at work, and that it would come not from an outside influence, but from within the church ( 2 Thessalonians 2:7 , Acts 20:28-30 ). Sure enough, not long after Paul’s day, apostasy appeared in the church.
About 100 years before Christianity, Egyptian Mithraists introduced the festival of Sunday, dedicated to worshiping the sun, into the Roman Empire. Later, as Christianity grew, church leaders wished to increase the numbers of the church. In order to make the gospel more attractive to non-Christians, pagan customs were incorporated into the church’s ceremonies. The custom of Sunday worship was welcomed by Christians who desired to differentiate themselves from the Jews, whom they hated because of the Jews’ rejection of the Savior. The first day of the week began to be recognized as both a religious and civil holiday. By the end of the second century, Christians considered it sinful to work on Sunday.
The Roman emperor Constantine, a former sun-worshiper, professed conversion to Christianity, though his subsequent actions suggest the “conversion” was more of a political move than a genuine heart change. Constantine named himself Bishop of the Catholic Church and enacted the first civil law regarding Sunday observance in A.D. 321.
Instead of the humble lives of persecution and self-sacrifice led by the apostles, church leaders now exalted themselves to the place of God. “This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world” ( 1 John 4:3 ).
[h=2]The Catechism[/h]
Recall the ceremony with which God made known His Law, containing the blessing of the seventh-day Sabbath, by which all humanity is to be judged. Contrast this with the unannounced, unnoticed anticlimax with which the church gradually adopted Sunday at the command of “Christian” emperors and Roman bishops. And these freely admit that they made the change from Sabbath to Sunday.
In the Convert’s Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, we read:
God instructed Moses to construct the earthly sanctuary, all its furniture, and the ark according to “the pattern” he was shown. ( Exodus 25:9 , 40 ) The ark was called the “ark of the covenant” ( Numbers 10:33 , Deuteronomy 10:8 , Hebrews 9:4 ), and the “ark of the testimony” ( Exodus 25:22 ), because in it Moses placed the tablets of stone on which God wrote His Law. ( Exodus 25:16 , 31:18 ) John, in Revelation 11:19 , describes the scene before him when “the temple of God was opened in Heaven.” John saw the ark of the covenant in the heavenly sanctuary. David wrote, “Your word, O Lord, is eternal; it stands firm in the heavens” ( Psalm 119:89 ). It is safe to assume that God’s Law remains, contained within the ark of the covenant in the heavenly sanctuary.
When God says, “The seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God” (Exodus 20:10), that ends all controversy. We cannot change God’s Word for our own convenience. “But if serving the Lord seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve” (Joshua 24:15).
- Emily Thomsen
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[TD]I apologize this is so long but man made the change God did not command it. I have nothing against our Catholic brothers and sisters and I believe many will be in heaven but the fact still remains they claim to have made the change. Please take the time to read. My bible says I must obey God rather than man.[/TD]
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| [h=1]Catholic Church Admits They Made the Change[/h] |
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God, “with whom there is no variation or shadow of turning” ( James 1:17 ), does not change ( Malachi 3:6 ). The Israelites received two laws from Moses: the law of Moses, that of ordinances and ceremonies; and the Law of God, embodied in the Ten Commandments, which is an expression of God’s character. If God does not change, neither will His Law. “My covenant I will not break, nor alter the word that has gone out of My lips” ( Psalm 89:34 ). “I know that everything God does will endure forever; nothing can be added to it and nothing taken from it” ( Ecclesiastes 3:14 ). “The works of his hands are faithful and just; all his precepts are trustworthy. They are steadfast for ever and ever, done in faithfulness and uprightness” ( Psalm 111:7 , 8 ).
God gave His Law to the Israelites at Mt. Sinai. Amid thunder and lightning, a thick cloud covered the mountain, and a trumpet blasted. Smoke billowed up as from a furnace and the whole mountain shook as the trumpet grew louder and louder. Moses led the Israelites out of their camp to meet with God, and every one of them trembled. Then God spoke ( Exodus 19:16-19 , 20:1 ). If this Law were to be changed, it would be reasonable to expect God Himself to announce it, and give reasons for its alteration, amid the same amount of ceremony. Yet there is no indication in Scripture of such an announcement.
[h=2]What About the New Testament?[/h]
In the New Testament, the seventh day of the week is called the Sabbath; it is mentioned 58 times. The first day of the week is mentioned eight times. It is simply called the first day of the week, and it is always differentiated from the Sabbath. This in itself is evidence for the continued validity of the seventh-day Sabbath.
The gospel writers record Jesus and the apostles going to the synagogue on Sabbath as their “custom” ( Luke 4:16 ). Jesus said, “I have kept My Father’s commandments” ( John 15:10 ). The women who went to anoint His body after his death “rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment” ( Luke 23:56 ). Nearly all of the incidents reported of the apostles’ preaching occurred on the seventh-day Sabbath. Of all the accusations the Jews made against the apostles, never once did they accuse the apostles of breaking the Sabbath.
Some teach that after Christ’s death and resurrection, the Old Testament law was done away with and a new covenant took its place. But Jesus Himself said, “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” ( Matthew 5:17 , 18 ). The law of Moses, which foreshadowed Christ’s sacrifice, was indeed made irrelevant, but Paul maintains that the Law of God is to be kept, though we now be under grace. “Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid; yea, we establish the law” ( Romans 3:31 ).
[h=2]How It Happened...[/h]
Yet for nearly 2,000 years now, millions of Christians have worshiped on Sunday. So was the Sabbath changed from the seventh to the first day of the week? Let’s look at the “yes” now.
“The Son of Man is Lord also of the Sabbath” ( Luke 6:5 ). Here Jesus staked His claim and forbade anyone to meddle with the Sabbath. Yet He knew there would be those who would claim the power to change God’s Law. Through Daniel he warned of just such a man. Describing a “little horn power” ( Daniel 7:8 ), Daniel says, “He will speak against the Most High and oppress his saints and try to change the set times and the laws” ( Daniel 7:25 ). Paul made a similar prediction: “Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God, or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God” ( 2 Thessalonians 2:3 , 4 , 7 ).
Paul warned that this blasphemy was already at work, and that it would come not from an outside influence, but from within the church ( 2 Thessalonians 2:7 , Acts 20:28-30 ). Sure enough, not long after Paul’s day, apostasy appeared in the church.
About 100 years before Christianity, Egyptian Mithraists introduced the festival of Sunday, dedicated to worshiping the sun, into the Roman Empire. Later, as Christianity grew, church leaders wished to increase the numbers of the church. In order to make the gospel more attractive to non-Christians, pagan customs were incorporated into the church’s ceremonies. The custom of Sunday worship was welcomed by Christians who desired to differentiate themselves from the Jews, whom they hated because of the Jews’ rejection of the Savior. The first day of the week began to be recognized as both a religious and civil holiday. By the end of the second century, Christians considered it sinful to work on Sunday.
The Roman emperor Constantine, a former sun-worshiper, professed conversion to Christianity, though his subsequent actions suggest the “conversion” was more of a political move than a genuine heart change. Constantine named himself Bishop of the Catholic Church and enacted the first civil law regarding Sunday observance in A.D. 321.
On the venerable day of the sun let the magistrate and people residing in cities rest, and let all workshops be closed. In the country however, persons engaged in agricultural work may freely and lawfully continue their pursuits; because it often happens that another day is not so suitable for grain growing or for vine planting; lest by neglecting the proper moment for such operations the bounty of heaven should be lost. —Schaff’s History of the Christian Church, vol. III, chap. 75.
Note that Constantine’s law did not even mention Sabbath but referred to the mandated rest day as a “the venerable day of the sun.” And how kind he was to allow people to observe it as it was convenient. Contrast this with God’s command to observe the Sabbath “even during the plowing season and harvest” (
Exodus 34:21
)! Perhaps the church leaders noticed this laxity as well, for just four years later, in A.D. 325, Pope Sylvester officially named Sunday “the Lord’s Day,” and in A.D. 338, Eusebius, the court bishop of Constantine, wrote, “All things whatsoever that it was the duty to do on the Sabbath (the seventh day of the week) we (Constantine, Eusebius, and other bishops) have transferred to the Lord’s Day (the first day of the week) as more appropriately belonging to it.”Instead of the humble lives of persecution and self-sacrifice led by the apostles, church leaders now exalted themselves to the place of God. “This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world” ( 1 John 4:3 ).
[h=2]The Catechism[/h]
Recall the ceremony with which God made known His Law, containing the blessing of the seventh-day Sabbath, by which all humanity is to be judged. Contrast this with the unannounced, unnoticed anticlimax with which the church gradually adopted Sunday at the command of “Christian” emperors and Roman bishops. And these freely admit that they made the change from Sabbath to Sunday.
In the Convert’s Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, we read:
Q. Which is the Sabbath day?
A. Saturday is the Sabbath day.
Q. Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
A. We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea, (AD 336) transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday….
Q. Why did the Catholic Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
A. The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday, because Christ rose from the dead on a Sunday, and the Holy Ghost descended upon the Apostles on a Sunday.
Q. By what authority did the Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
A. The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday by the plenitude of that divine power which Jesus Christ bestowed upon her!
—Rev. Peter Geiermann, C.SS.R., (1946), p. 50.
In
Catholic Christian Instructed,
A. Saturday is the Sabbath day.
Q. Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
A. We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea, (AD 336) transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday….
Q. Why did the Catholic Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
A. The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday, because Christ rose from the dead on a Sunday, and the Holy Ghost descended upon the Apostles on a Sunday.
Q. By what authority did the Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
A. The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday by the plenitude of that divine power which Jesus Christ bestowed upon her!
—Rev. Peter Geiermann, C.SS.R., (1946), p. 50.
Q. Has the [Catholic] church power to make any alterations in the commandments of God?
A. ...Instead of the seventh day, and other festivals appointed by the old law, the church has prescribed the Sundays and holy days to be set apart for God’s worship; and these we are now obliged to keep in consequence of God’s commandment, instead of the ancient Sabbath.
—The Catholic Christian Instructed in the Sacraments, Sacrifices, Ceremonies, and Observances of the Church By Way of Question and Answer, RT Rev. Dr. Challoner, p. 204.
In
An Abridgment of the Christian Doctrine,
A. ...Instead of the seventh day, and other festivals appointed by the old law, the church has prescribed the Sundays and holy days to be set apart for God’s worship; and these we are now obliged to keep in consequence of God’s commandment, instead of the ancient Sabbath.
—The Catholic Christian Instructed in the Sacraments, Sacrifices, Ceremonies, and Observances of the Church By Way of Question and Answer, RT Rev. Dr. Challoner, p. 204.
Q. How prove you that the church hath power to command feasts and holy days?
A. By the very act of changing the Sabbath into Sunday, which Protestants allow of; and therefore they fondly contradict themselves, by keeping Sunday strictly, and breaking most other feasts commanded by the same church.
Q. How prove you that?
A. Because by keeping Sunday, they acknowledge the church’s power to ordain feasts, and to command them under sin; and by not keeping the rest [of the feasts] by her commanded, they again deny, in fact, the same power.
–Rev. Henry Tuberville, D.D. (R.C.), (1833), page 58.
In
A Doctrinal Catechism,
A. By the very act of changing the Sabbath into Sunday, which Protestants allow of; and therefore they fondly contradict themselves, by keeping Sunday strictly, and breaking most other feasts commanded by the same church.
Q. How prove you that?
A. Because by keeping Sunday, they acknowledge the church’s power to ordain feasts, and to command them under sin; and by not keeping the rest [of the feasts] by her commanded, they again deny, in fact, the same power.
–Rev. Henry Tuberville, D.D. (R.C.), (1833), page 58.
Q. Have you any other way of proving that the Church has power to institute festivals of precept?
A. Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her. She could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday the seventh day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority.
–Rev. Stephen Keenan, (1851), p. 174.
In the
Catechism of the Council of Trent,
A. Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her. She could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday the seventh day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority.
–Rev. Stephen Keenan, (1851), p. 174.
The Church of God has thought it well to transfer the celebration and observance of the Sabbath to Sunday!
–p 402, second revised edition (English), 1937. (First published in 1566)
In the
Augsburg Confession,
–p 402, second revised edition (English), 1937. (First published in 1566)
They [the Catholics] allege the Sabbath changed into Sunday, the Lord’s day, contrary to the decalogue, as it appears; neither is there any example more boasted of than the changing of the Sabbath day. Great, they say, is the power and authority of the church, since it dispensed with one of the ten commandments.
—Art. 28.
God warned that a blasphemous power would “seek to change times and laws,”
and the Catholic Church openly admits doing it, even boasts about it. In a sermon at the Council of Trent in 1562, the Archbishop of Reggia, Caspar del Fossa, claimed that the Catholic Church’s whole authority is based upon the fact that they changed the Sabbath to Sunday.
Does this not fulfill the prophecies of Daniel and Paul?—Art. 28.
“For centuries millions of Christians have gathered to worship God on the first day of the week. Graciously He has accepted this worship. He has poured out His blessings upon Christian people as they have sought to serve Him. However, as one searches the Scriptures, he is forced to recognize that Sunday is not a day of God’s appointment… It has no foundation in Scripture, but has arisen entirely as a result of custom,” says Frank H. Yost, Ph.D. in The Early Christian Sabbath.
Let us ask the question again: Was the Sabbath changed from the seventh day of the week to the first? The Bible is clear: “And God blessed the seventh day and made it holy” (
Genesis 2:3
). “Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy” (
Exodus 20:11
). If God intended for another day to become the Sabbath, He must have removed the blessing from the seventh day and placed it on the day which was to replace it. But when God bestows a blessing, it is forever. “…You, O Lord, have blessed it, and it will be blessed forever” (
1 Chronicles 17:27
). “I have received a command to bless; He has blessed, and I cannot change it” (
Numbers 23:20
). Your birthday, a memorial of your birth, can’t be changed, though you may celebrate it on a different day. Neither can the Sabbath, a memorial of creation (
Exodus 20:11
), be changed, though some may celebrate it on a different day.God instructed Moses to construct the earthly sanctuary, all its furniture, and the ark according to “the pattern” he was shown. ( Exodus 25:9 , 40 ) The ark was called the “ark of the covenant” ( Numbers 10:33 , Deuteronomy 10:8 , Hebrews 9:4 ), and the “ark of the testimony” ( Exodus 25:22 ), because in it Moses placed the tablets of stone on which God wrote His Law. ( Exodus 25:16 , 31:18 ) John, in Revelation 11:19 , describes the scene before him when “the temple of God was opened in Heaven.” John saw the ark of the covenant in the heavenly sanctuary. David wrote, “Your word, O Lord, is eternal; it stands firm in the heavens” ( Psalm 119:89 ). It is safe to assume that God’s Law remains, contained within the ark of the covenant in the heavenly sanctuary.
When God says, “The seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God” (Exodus 20:10), that ends all controversy. We cannot change God’s Word for our own convenience. “But if serving the Lord seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve” (Joshua 24:15).
- Emily Thomsen
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C
chubbena
Guest
Follow the same line of thinking, if one's mother tongue is not Hebrew, Aramic nor Greek nothing should apply - including salvation....
C
chubbena
Guest
Here we go again with the equation of "keeping His commandments" = "using one's own strength". Thus "breaking His commandments" = "humility and meekness"?
Not many know that second one, although God spoke through Moses and the prophets many times that He is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and abundant in loving kindness and truth, and the psalmists praise Him about that in the OT, how sad.
And who has said that by our own strength we can keep His Commandments? How many times has this been posted?
Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
I would like to have a nickel for every time I have posted this...
Heb 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Heb 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
And this...
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
1Jn 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1Jn 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
Now tell me Gramps, what happens to someone who breaks a Commandment? Let's just say the 9th one for instance?
How about an answer? What happens if I break the 9th Commandment?
[h=3]Jeremiah 17:27[/h]Good News Translation (GNT)
27 But they must obey me and observe the Sabbath as a sacred day. They must not carry any load through the gates of Jerusalem on that day, for if they do, I will set the gates of Jerusalem on fire. Fire will burn down the palaces of Jerusalem, and no one will be able to put it out.”
[h=3]John 5:5-14[/h]English Standard Version (ESV)
5 One man was there who had been an invalid for thirty-eight years. 6 When Jesus saw him lying there and knew that he had already been there a long time, he said to him, “Do you want to be healed?” 7 The sick man answered him, “Sir, I have no one to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up, and while I am going another steps down before me.”8 Jesus said to him, “Get up, take up your bed, and walk.” 9 And at once the man was healed, and he took up his bed and walked.
Conclusion sabbath day changed otherwise the gates of Jerusalem would of been burnt down, enough said
Since we break the first one all the time what should we expect to happen?
Did not Jehovah say with their lips they serve Me but their hearts are far from Me?
Honor what ever day you choose but honor it to the Lord. Do not condemn another because he honors another day.
Be led of the Holy Spirit. God's grace covers all our sins.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
The passage from Jeremiah is in the context of what?
Jer 17:20 And say unto them, Hear ye the word of the LORD, ye kings of Judah, and all Judah, and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, that enter in by these gates:
Jer 17:21 Thus saith the LORD; Take heed to yourselves, and bear no burden on the sabbath day, nor bring it in by the gates of Jerusalem;
Jer 17:22 Neither carry forth a burden out of your houses on the sabbath day, neither do ye any work, but hallow ye the sabbath day, as I commanded your fathers.
Jer 17:23 But they obeyed not, neither inclined their ear, but made their neck stiff, that they might not hear, nor receive instruction.
Jer 17:24 And it shall come to pass, if ye diligently hearken unto me, saith the LORD, to bring in no burden through the gates of this city on the sabbath day, but hallow the sabbath day, to do no work therein;
Jer 17:25 Then shall there enter into the gates of this city kings and princes sitting upon the throne of David, riding in chariots and on horses, they, and their princes, the men of Judah, and the inhabitants of Jerusalem: and this city shall remain for ever.
Jer 17:26 And they shall come from the cities of Judah, and from the places about Jerusalem, and from the land of Benjamin, and from the plain, and from the mountains, and from the south, bringing burnt offerings, and sacrifices, and meat offerings, and incense, and bringing sacrifices of praise, unto the house of the LORD.
Jer 17:27 But if ye will not hearken unto me to hallow the sabbath day, and not to bear a burden, even entering in at the gates of Jerusalem on the sabbath day; then will I kindle a fire in the gates thereof, and it shall devour the palaces of Jerusalem, and it shall not be quenched.
Albert Barnes understood...
Bear no burden on the sabbath day - Apparently the Sabbath day was kept negligently. The country people were in the habit of coming to Jerusalem on the Sabbath to attend the temple service, but mingled traffic with their devotions, bringing the produce of their fields and gardens with them for disposal. The people of Jerusalem for their part took Jer_17:22 their wares to the gates, and carried on a brisk traffic there with the villagers. Both parties seem to have abstained from manual labor, but did not consider that buying and selling were prohibited by the fourth commandment.
They were doing business on the Sabbath, buying and selling...
Neh 10:31 And if the people of the land bring ware or any victuals on the sabbath day to sell, that we would not buy it of them on the sabbath, or on the holy day: and that we would leave the seventh year, and the exaction of every debt.
Same problem, same context.
John Gill has this...
neither do ye any work; any servile work, any kind of manufacture, either within doors or without; or exercise any kind of trade, or barter and merchandise, or do any sort of worldly business; nothing but what was of mere necessity, for the preservation of life; see Exo_20:10;
Matthew Henry...
I. How the sabbath is to be sanctified, and what is the law concerning it, Jer_17:21, Jer_17:11. 1. They must rest from their worldly employment on the sabbath day, must do no servile work. They must bear no burden into the city nor out of it, into their houses nor out of them; husbandmen's burdens of corn must not be carried in, nor manure carried out; nor must tradesmen's burdens of wares or merchandises be imported or exported. There must not a loaded horse, or cart, or wagon, be seen on the sabbath day either in the streets or in the roads; the porters must not ply on that day, nor must the servants be suffered to fetch in provisions or fuel. It is a day of rest, and must not be made a day of labour, unless in case of necessity.
Why is it so hard to take a day off from business and work? I am very thankful for the Sabbath. A day in which I am commanded to rest, relax, attend chruch services, worship God and have a Feast day with my family.
***Sarcasm alert*** Oh the unbearable burden of keeping the Sabbath. ***End sarcasm alert***
ah a burden as a load of trouble on your back ? or a burden as a load of pain or a sin that you may not speak about until the sabbath is over ? notice my two questions here.
lets re-read John 5:5-14
English Standard Version (ESV)
5 One man was there who had been an invalid for thirty-eight years. 6 When Jesus saw him lying there and knew that he had already been there a long time, he said to him, “Do you want to be healed?” 7 The sick man answered him, “Sir, I have no one to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up, and while I am going another steps down before me.”8 Jesus said to him, “Get up, take up your bed, and walk.” 9 And at once the man was healed, and he took up his bed and walked.
the sickman had a burden and then he was told to carry his load
lets re-read John 5:5-14
English Standard Version (ESV)
5 One man was there who had been an invalid for thirty-eight years. 6 When Jesus saw him lying there and knew that he had already been there a long time, he said to him, “Do you want to be healed?” 7 The sick man answered him, “Sir, I have no one to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up, and while I am going another steps down before me.”8 Jesus said to him, “Get up, take up your bed, and walk.” 9 And at once the man was healed, and he took up his bed and walked.
the sickman had a burden and then he was told to carry his load
C
chubbena
Guest
That is when one goes by the letter of the law - which it's never meant to be now and then.
C
chubbena
Guest
That's great. If this applies to Matthew then no one should ever again use the following verse to support the theory that "Jesus is my Sabbath" replaces the physical Sabbath.
Matthew 11:28
"Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.
well some people do see Jesus as the sabbath simply because one of the passages says in the bible if you don't obey the sabbath the fire will not be put out
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it seems that Rachel is not able to, doesn't want to or refuses to answer the questions that I posed to her.
if you can produce versus in scripture to backup sunday as the lords day please share.
in scripture almost definitely refers to sunday instead of the sabbath...?
John was in a vision about the day of the lord, no mention what day of the week
the day of the lord is dark and dreadful.
Woe unto you that desire the day of the Lord! to what end is it for you? the day of the Lord is darkness, and not light.
Amos 5:18
in scripture almost definitely refers to sunday instead of the sabbath...?
John was in a vision about the day of the lord, no mention what day of the week
the day of the lord is dark and dreadful.
Woe unto you that desire the day of the Lord! to what end is it for you? the day of the Lord is darkness, and not light.
Amos 5:18
R