The Sabbath.

[JaroldRay]

So, how can you say that the need for a sacrifice by the law of the first covenant is still an unfulfilled event? The law of the first covenant is there for those who refuse to walk in the new covenant, which by the way is most of the world of believers. Forget the laws of the first covenant, they lead to the curses of the first covenant, but Christ leads us into new instruction which is better and unrebukable. Gal 3:10 and Rom 13:10. Do not waste your time being a proponent for the first covenant when Messiah gave HIS life for you to be free from bondage of the first covenant and free indeed in the newness of our calling Gal ch 4

 

[Kerry]

What is my righteousness. I meant, the Pharisees would not comb their hair on the Sabbath. Because they might comb out a grain of dirt and that would be considered work. Wow, then how can I be more righteous than they were?

Romans 5

17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.


​If our faith is in the work of the cross we receive the gift of righteousness just as Abraham did.

 

[TaylorTG]

What is my righteousness. I meant, the Pharisees would not comb their hair on the Sabbath. Because they might comb out a grain of dirt and that would be considered work. Wow, then how can I be more righteous than they were?

Romans 5

17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.


​If our faith is in the work of the cross we receive the gift of righteousness just as Abraham did.

Kerry......once we receive the gift of righteousness, we have to stay righteousness in order to truly benefit from the gift.

Simply believing in Christ as the savior of the world isn't righteous. Following in Christ's footsteps is righteous.

How do we follow in Christ's footsteps? By living a life of faith, AKA a life of good-will, righteousness; the Godly traits.



God's grace is a free gift, salvation isn't.

The verse you quoted actually supports a 'faith + good works' salvation mindset. We are made truly righteous by being obedient to God. Believing in God is merely a first step to obedience. Use your practical intelligence.

 

[Kerry]

Kerry......once we receive the gift of righteousness, we have to stay righteousness in order to truly benefit from the gift.

Simply believing in Christ as the savior of the world isn't righteous. Following in Christ's footsteps is righteous.

How do we follow in Christ's footsteps? By living a life of faith, AKA a life of good-will, righteousness; the Godly traits.



God's grace is a free gift, salvation isn't.

The verse you quoted actually supports a 'faith + good works' salvation mindset. We are made truly righteous by being obedient to God. Believing in God is merely a first step to obedience. Use your practical intelligence.

So we out grow the cross? It is only a first step?

 

[Kerry]

Oh, maybe I get it. Its a free gift but after we receive it we must earn it?

 

[RedTent]

So we out grow the cross? It is only a first step?

Christ died for our sins, we are dead to sin, sin does not cause us death through Christ. It is also through Christ we are made righteous, we are given the Holy Spirit and we reject sin.

It is through Christ that we honor the Sabbath. We would have to deny Christ in us to decide not to honor the Sabbath that scripture tells us is a vital part of our walk with the Lord.

 

[Kerry]

Christ died for our sins, we are dead to sin, sin does not cause us death through Christ. It is also through Christ we are made righteous, we are given the Holy Spirit and we reject sin.

It is through Christ that we honor the Sabbath. We would have to deny Christ in us to decide not to honor the Sabbath that scripture tells us is a vital part of our walk with the Lord.

Tent, I love you. But Christ is the Sabbath. Just as He is the Lamb of God. We would have no rest unless Christ died on the cross.

 

[TaylorTG]

So we outgrow the cross? It is only a first step?

We have to live by the cross.


the doctrine of the cross
Matthew 16:24-27

Examine this passage carefully. Christ said: "On judgement day, each man will be judged according to his conduct."

Conduct -----> How one behaves.

This bible verse is a proof that following Christ (not just believing in him) leads to salvation. We follow Christ by taking up our cross, meaning to say: by silent acceptance of trials.





If we truly wish to be united with the divine, then we'll need to prove it by our conduct.

Our conduct is a result of our thoughts concerning God and mankind.

Luke 6:45-46

 

[Kerry]

Yes we will be judge by how strongly our faith is in the cross and not by our works.

 

[TaylorTG]

Yes we will be judge by how strongly our faith is in the cross and not by our works.

*facepalm*

Please.. read my dang posts before you answer them.

 

[Kerry]

*facepalm*

Please.. read my dang posts before you answer them.

I didn't reply to any post. But shimber me timbers, maybe i did.

 

[gotime]

Yes we will be judge by how strongly our faith is in the cross and not by our works.

You will be judged by your works because they reveal your faith or lack of faith.

Rev_20:13 And the sea gave up the dead that were in it; and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Rev_20:12 And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne; and books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of the things which were written in the books, according to their works.

Rev 22:12 Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to render to each man according as his work is.

Rev_14:13 And I heard the voice from heaven saying, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from henceforth: yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors; for their works follow with them.

Jud_1:15 to execute judgment upon all, and to convict all the ungodly of all their works of ungodliness which they have ungodly wrought, and of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

Jas_2:26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, even so faith apart from works is dead.

Jas_2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

Jas_2:22 Thou seest that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect;






Tit_1:16 They profess that they know God; but by their works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

2Co_11:15 It is no great thing therefore if his ministers also fashion themselves as ministers of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their works.

We will be judged by our works. So how can we be judged by works which the bible clearly says yet not saved by works which the bible also clearly says?

 

[Kerry]

So you do all these things and that's great. But if not for the cross then what?

 

[TaylorTG]

So you do all these things and that's great. But if not for the cross then what?

KERRY!!!!

Jas_2:26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, even so faith apart from works is dead.

Jas_2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

Jas_2:22 Thou seest that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect;

 

[Jackson123]

Originally Posted by gotime
Jas_2:26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, even so faith apart from works is dead.

Jas_2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

Jas_2:22 Thou seest that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect;
[SUP]
I believe Brother what brother Gotime mean by work here is fruit/ work base on love, not bad work.

Jesus said, branch or human/us can not bear fruit of itself. so if salvation by good work then no body save because no branch able to bear fruit by itself.

Salvation is by abide/ have faith in Jesus then Jesus within our heart bear fruit for us through us.

So work is not produce salvation but salvation produce work
John 15
2[/SUP] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[SUP]3[/SUP] Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[SUP]4[/SUP] Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]5[/SUP] I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

 

[Jackson123]

Originally Posted by gotime
Jas_2:26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, even so faith apart from works is dead.

Jas_2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

Jas_2:22 Thou seest that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect;


I believe what brother Gotime mean by work is good work , a work base on love.
And Jesus call it fruit. If salvation base on work than no body save because Jesus said a branch can not bear fruit of itself.

Mean no body able to produce good work of itself.

A. If salvation by work
B. Nobody able to produce work.

C mean nobody save.

Salvation is by faith, because we have Faith in Jesus then we abide in Jesus than produce salvation + fruit or good work.
So faith produce salvation and work is by product of salvation.

work not producer of salvation.

Jesus is the producer of salvation and work.

To make it simple: Have a faith in Jesus mean abide in Jesus and will produce salvation and work.

To say work produce salvation is like to put a horse behind the cart, not going to move the horse must pull the cart, the cart not pull the horse.

John 15
[SUP]2[/SUP] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[SUP]3[/SUP] Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[SUP]4[/SUP] Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]5[/SUP] I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

 

[RedTent]

Tent, I love you. But Christ is the Sabbath. Just as He is the Lamb of God. We would have no rest unless Christ died on the cross.

God is precise, scripture is precise. Every word of scripture is to be listened to, and each word is truth. The word Sabbath is not the word for Christ. Resting on the Sabbath has to do with being aware that the power of God in our lives is greater than the power we have to do for ourselves. Resting in Christ has to do with Christ taking away the requirements to keep the law to be saved and to be filled with the spirit of Christ.

When we are filled with the righteousness of Christ we want to follow the law. Salvation has come upon us by faith so we can be free from sin and walk in the newness of life, i.e. the obedience which Christ demonstrated.

This means that if we are saved by Christ we want to live by the word of God, all the word. We are free from the death decreed by the law or any obligation to law, but it doesn't make the truth of the law null and void. Through Christ we see the law as a key to freedom in Christ, a holy blessing for us.

 

[chubbena]

You did say both those things. And I agreed with you that it is sad that you think you can keep the commandments.

And yet you still haven't answered the very simple question that I asked.

It is sad that "I can do anything through Christ who strengthens me" for some is just a punch line...oh wait a minute, have I not said that already?
Why does one always suggest that keeping the commandments is not out of love of God when the Christ clearly teaches that all the law and the prophets hang on "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind' and ‘love your neighbor as yourself'?
He does not teach all the law and the prophets are replaced by such, does He?

 

[Laodicea]

It is sad that "I can do anything through Christ who strengthens me" for some is just a punch line...oh wait a minute, have I not said that already?
Why does one always suggest that keeping the commandments is not out of love of God when the Christ clearly teaches that all the law and the prophets hang on "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind' and ‘love your neighbor as yourself'?
He does not teach all the law and the prophets are replaced by such, does He?

He is stuck in a place where any time keeping the commandments is mentioned especially the sabbath he says the same answer all the time. Even though people tell him that we keep the law through Christ and out of love. People have to continue to feed him milk.

 

[chubbena]

If you love me you will keep my commands.

Not, if you love me work really hard at the law.

Why the distinction? Because of the Holy Spirit and how christianity works.

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

In contrast;

Galatians 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

One could search the word yoke in the scripture to see what the Christ is referring to in Matthew 11:28.

If this verse is about the Sabbath, which according to some who oppose the observing of such is not, why one does not obey by laying down His burden and rest on the Sabbath rather than using it as an excuse not to is intriguing.