I think that's a good decision,
since you do not believe the whole NT,
and set the revelation spoken by the Son
in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers
against itself.
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since you do not believe the whole NT,
and set the revelation spoken by the Son
in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers
against itself.
F
Funtastic
Guest
So you'd hang onto Mark 7 and eat unclean meat in the Millennium?? The first part of what you quoted was talking about the people who were keeping the extra laws of the Pharisees and also who were keeping the laws of God out of tradition and not from their hearts.
The second part isn't talking about cleansing the unclean animals. Jesus hadn't even died yet so how could that verse be used to prove anything to doing with the dietary laws?. If Jesus taught they could eat anything they wanted, then Peter in Acts would have immediately thought the dream he was given was about the dietary laws being done away with but God had to show Peter 3 times because he didn't understand. Another thing is that when Peter was shown the dream he said "I've never eaten anything unclean" this was some years after Christs death and he was having this discussion with God. He would never have answer to God like that because Peter would have known if it was ever taught.
Mark 7:9 “You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observeyour own traditions!."
In this verse Jesus is teaching to obey God's laws and not mans traditions. How could Jesus say this and then break a commandment verses later???
Mark 7:19 "Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?"
What was considered meat to the Jewish people? Unclean animals were never considered as food so this isn't talking about it. Also who was Jesus talking to? The teaches of the Law. He would have been killed on the spot if he was teaching against God's Laws as back then it was a very serious crime.
Jesus taught in Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
So how could Jesus teach this and then teach against a commandment of God. You're saying that Jesus will be least in the Kingdom of God if you believe this.
The real question is do you?
Rom 7:12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.
1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.
So then you believe that
1) the two principles of Christ's law (Gal 6:2; 1Co 9:21), love of God and love of neighbor, fulfills (encompasses, accomplishes) the Mosaic law (Ro 13:8, 9, 10; Mt 22:40);
2) the Mosaic law with its curse has been set aside because it was weak and useless to make righteous (Heb 7:18-19),
and the NT people of God are no longer commanded to follow the Mosaic laws with their curse for imperfect obedience (Dt 27:26; Gal 3:10), because they are all encompassed in the principles of Christ's law;**
3) the priesthood has changed from the Levites to Melchizedek (Heb 7:11-12),
4) Jesus is the new eternal High Priest of the NT priestly order (Heb 7:17, 21),
5) the Mosaic covenant has been made obsolete (Heb 8:13),
6) the people of God are under a New Covenant (Heb 8:7-12; 2Co 3:6; Heb 8:6, 9:15), inaugurated by the death of Christ (Lk 22:20).
**If I love God, I will not prefer other "gods," nor will I take his name in vain.
If I love my parents, I will not dishonor or neglect them.
If I love my neighbors, I will not steal from them, nor murder them, nor commit adultery with their spouses, nor lust after their possessions.
Love fulfills, encompasses, accomplishes the law.
So then you believe the revelation of the Son spoken in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers in
1) - 6) above?
That's good to know.
And do you believe points 1) - 6) in post #367, above?john832 said:
Yep, but the holy law also has a curse attached for imperfect obedience.
The curse has been removed in the law of Christ (Mt 22:37-39) which fulfills, encompasses, accomplishes the Mosaic law (Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 9. 10) which curses (Dt 27:26) all those under it (Gal 3:10).
The NT people of God are not under the Mosiac law and its curse.
Yep, we establish the law in its proper place, subject to the gospel and the NT revelation spoken by the Son in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers; i.e., as fulfilled, encompassed, accomplished in obedience to the law of Christ (Ro 13:8, 9, 10; Mt 22:40)
Yep, and they are kept in obeying the law of Christ (Mt 22:27-40),
for God's people are no longer under the Mosaic law with its curse for imperfect obedience (Heb 7:18-19).
I believe the above, do you believe points 1) - 6) in post #367, above?
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I do believe that the ten commandments are good and are all good for learning of propper perception but i will not judge a brother for worshiping on a sunday or monday after all the are God's days even His sabbath but i will not condemm anyone for keeping the observance or not but only Christ is the judge .
N
notshaken67
Guest
[h=2]Calling Good Evil and Evil Good[/h]BIBLE MEDITATION:
“Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!” Isaiah 5:20
DEVOTIONAL THOUGHT:
People can become so warped in their thinking that they don’t know the difference between right and wrong.
I was listening to the radio one morning, and they were talking about what scientists want to do with the tissue of aborted babies. They said that some women are thinking about having babies, aborting them, then selling the tissue for research. The scientific community is promoting this propaganda because of the good they say the research will have on the whole of humanity! But what about the whole of humanity that begins in the womb?
People today will play enough tricks on their minds that they will literally approve evil with a good conscience.
Where do you stand on this issue? What is right and what is wrong?
ACTION POINT:
Take some time this morning to read Psalm 139 and ask God to show you His truth.
“Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!” Isaiah 5:20
DEVOTIONAL THOUGHT:
People can become so warped in their thinking that they don’t know the difference between right and wrong.
I was listening to the radio one morning, and they were talking about what scientists want to do with the tissue of aborted babies. They said that some women are thinking about having babies, aborting them, then selling the tissue for research. The scientific community is promoting this propaganda because of the good they say the research will have on the whole of humanity! But what about the whole of humanity that begins in the womb?
People today will play enough tricks on their minds that they will literally approve evil with a good conscience.
Where do you stand on this issue? What is right and what is wrong?
ACTION POINT:
Take some time this morning to read Psalm 139 and ask God to show you His truth.
1) Yes
2) Yes
3) Yes
4) Yes
5) Depends on your definition of "obsolete"
6) Depends on your definition of "under"
And yes to your last question.
You are completely ignoring the fact that the Ten Commandments are Christ's Law...
Exo 20:1 And God spoke all these words, saying:
Exo 20:2 "I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
This was the One who became Christ speaking. He then goes on to say...
Mat 5:17 "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.
Mat 5:18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 19:17 So He said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments."
So help me out here, did the way to life change? Not that I can see...
Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.
You also seem to not be able to grasp the fact that the Two Great Commandments support or hold up ALL of the Law and the Prophets...
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
You read this as...
"These two commandments destroyed all the Law and the Prophets."
Wherein Paul disagrees...
Rom 13:9 For the commandments, "YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY," "YOU SHALL NOT MURDER," "YOU SHALL NOT STEAL," "YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS," "YOU SHALL NOT COVET," and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."
He shows here that Love Your Neighbor is the summing up of the Commandments.
You say we are free from the Law whereas Paul says we are free from sin...
Rom 6:22 But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life.
I gotta go with Paul on this one.
And this is a blatant pulling out of context...
Heb 7:18 For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness,
Heb 7:19 for the law made nothing perfect; on the other hand, there is the bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.
Notice it is not plural as in Commandments? What is is referring to? What is the former...
Heb 7:13 For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has officiated at the altar.
Heb 7:14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood.
Heb 7:15 And it is yet far more evident if, in the likeness of Melchizedek, there arises another priest
Heb 7:16 who has come, not according to the law of a fleshly commandment, but according to the power of an endless life.
The specific Commandment that a Priest must be of the tribe of Levi to be a Priest.
The Priesthood has been changed back (Heb 7:12) to the Melchizidec Priesthood.
Heb 7:17 For He testifies: "YOU ARE A PRIEST FOREVER ACCORDING TO THE ORDER OF MELCHIZEDEK."
Yes and that is the subject of Hebrews 7 which anyone can discover if they simply read it.
Yes He is, again. He was the High Priest prior to the Levitical Priesthood.
Yep, the Covenant is becoming obsolete. The Law on the other hand is the foundation of the New Covenant...
Heb 8:10 FOR THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS IN THEIR MIND AND WRITE THEM ON THEIR HEARTS; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.
Same Laws, different heart. The New Covenant is about a change in heart of the people. You would have us to believe that because the poeple under the Old Covenant were unable to do what God asked, God changed the Law. The reality is that because the people could nto do what God asked, He changed teh heart of the people so that they could.
This was prophesied by Moses (Moses was a prophet)...
Deu 30:6 And the LORD your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your descendants, to love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, that you may live.
Same chapter...
Deu 30:1 "Now it shall come to pass, when all these things come upon you, the blessing and the curse which I have set before you, and you call them to mind among all the nations where the LORD your God drives you,
Deu 30:2 and you return to the LORD your God and obey His voice, according to all that I command you today, you and your children, with all your heart and with all your soul,
God will give the people the heart to obey, not do away with the law because they were at fault. (Heb 8:8)
Deu 30:3 that the LORD your God will bring you back from captivity, and have compassion on you, and gather you again from all the nations where the LORD your God has scattered you.
6) the people of God are under a New Covenant (Heb 8:7-12; 2Co 3:6; Heb 8:6, 9:15), inaugurated by the death of Christ (Lk 22:20).[/quote]
Yes they are, they have God's Law written in their hearts and minds...
Heb 8:10 FOR THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS IN THEIR MIND AND WRITE THEM ON THEIR HEARTS; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.
Instead of changing the Law, God is in the business of changing people.
That sounds real good, problem is that is not how it works...
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:15 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do.
Rom 7:16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man.
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.
At least that is not how it worked for Paul. Now you may be more righteous than Paul and you don't have the same problems he had but I do.
Yes I believe the Revelation of the Son, I believe ALL of it...
Mat 5:17 "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.
Mat 5:18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 19:17 So He said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments."
Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one tittle of the law to fail.
Joh 14:15 "If you love Me, keep My commandments.
Joh 14:21 He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him."
Joh 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."
Rom 7:12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.
1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.
1Jn 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1Jn 2:4 He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn 3:22 And whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do those things that are pleasing in His sight.
1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments.
1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.
2Jn 1:6 This is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the commandment, that as you have heard from the beginning, you should walk in it.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.
Now which of the above passages do you discount?
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Hebrews 7 shows that the law has been changed. The New Testament believer is not under the law.
M
MidniteWelder
Guest
Jesus told the New Testament believer to follow the Law.
So who's right in this case?
Jesus or Paul?
C
chubbena
Guest
5)That would be the Greek definition.
6) Subject to all its regulations/obligations and penalties.
So do you believe 5) and 6) also?
I am happy to hear these things.