It Is satanic Heresy to Deny Eternal Security

[homwardbound]

Why in the world would a Christian "stops asking for more forgiveness when they sin" unless that Christian is desiring to be unforgiven and therefore lost?

Another twist in words works

He died once for all and by this we are forgiven a done deal, since no not one can be perfect in and of themselves ever, Shown well in the first Testament, all the way to this very day, not one can be perfect with or without Law.
[h=3]Hebrews 7:11-12[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[SUP]11 [/SUP]If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? [SUP]12 [/SUP]For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

The new law is the Law of love (liberty) in Christ alone unto Father delivered to Father as perfect, no other way for Father to recieve us except to be seen as perfect. So in Christ this is done

One choice left to beleive or not. Your free choice, so do you or do you not, by having to have works to prove you, to others?
I need none to prove anything, I the I that is dead to flesh nature is alive to God and does as is right in participation with God, in Spirit and truth alone, being used by God in this dead flesh nature held alive by God to do as God desires not as man desires.

 

[homwardbound]

Heb 6:4,5 proves the Hebrew writer is talking about Christians who can fall away. Heb 6:9 the Hebrew writer was expressing his confidence that those Hebrews would not fall away but remain stedfast and faithful.

Start at Heb. 5:11 maybe, and only you and i can decide if we need to be taught all over again. Ask for the whole meat of the word. And God will if God permits and I know if God does not permit this then
I trust God and need no reason why God has not yet or if God ever will, depending on one's motive is why I had those blinders on me, before, then I changed my motive to want nothing more that to be in God's arms safe and secure, and have no motives of selfishness a contrite heart. That is what started in me to start to see and trust God to lead to show me truth thyat has set me free in God. Thank you Jesus

 

[homwardbound]

Before the world began, God predetermined the group Christian was be saved. God never unconditionally predetermined any individual outside of this group to be saved. So anyone in this group and who conditionally REMAINS in this group faithfully till death will be saved, Rev 2:10. Yet I can fall away from this group and become lost. The group remains saved, I am just no longer part of it.

So only those in this group have the promise of salvation, then after they die they will actually receive the fulfillment of this promise. Salvation is a promise, 1 Jn 2:25 and promises are not something yet realized for if it is realized it is no longer a promise. Salvation, life everlasting is in the world to come, Lk 18:30 and not in this life. Finite, corruptible mortals cannot in this life and this world actually possess life eternal, they must change and put on immortality and incorruption first, 1 Cor 15:52ff. Since God's promises are so certain, God sometimes "calleth those things which be not as though they were" (Rom 4:17) therefore Christians are sometimes said to already possess eternal life (past tense) even though eternal life is still a promise to be actually realized in the world to come.

So is God unfair? since we all are born after the similitude of Adam and Eve? He did go to the cross for all or he did not? If God did not then God is not fair to all? And if god diod go to the cross for all, that does not make all saved. Since death can't save can it?
What saves then after the death? The resurrected Christ in Spirit and truth. nothing else

2 Corinthians 5:14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

 

[homwardbound]

The prodigal son spent his money on harlots yet some say he maintained his salvation while doing so...go figure.

I did, not on harlots, on gambling and the sort, still did what could for others as could, and God never let me go, this is what i turned around to and said how, why, I deserve to die
And he said Howard I (God) just love you. That has effected me ever since and I walked away from the ignorance I was caught up in
Go figure it is the kindness of God that teaches a man to say no to unrighteousness

 

[homwardbound]

The group Christian/Saint is preserved but not the individual is not unconditionally preserved separate and apart from this group. So if I fall from this preserved GROUP, I will no longer be preserved/saved.

Please, I think we all,want life, what is this preserved group you are so special in? I want to join, I want life since you are in charge to say who has life and who does not?

I am being rhetorical here friend, how can this be, when he went to the cross for all? How can one body of acclaimed believers be better than another?

 

[homwardbound]

Wow Homwardbound you are the steady eddy on this thread. God bless your patience on this and continual diligent guidance on this thread. I would have given up long ago. God Bless!

Thank you, yet please if or if not being sharpened, give God all the thanks and credit for what you learn about in trusting God above mankind. Can you imagine Noah building an Ark, and it had not rained a day as of yet on earth. The people that were about to be flooded, calling him a Lunatic, and cursing him. And he just did not fight back or act arrogant as if one was better than the other.
Or as Moses who stood in Faith all the way for God's deliverance. Ever wonder where they got their swords? Why from the drowned Egyptians that were drowned as well as those that were in Noah's day, drowned out for the self, which God detests, hates, and the only thing holding God back today is the blood of Son, just as in the day of Moses in Exodus 4, where God who can't stand evil, and not having trust in God complete as Christ showed us. Zeporrah Moses's wife did waht and threw the blood on Moses and what did God do? Left him alone.

Even from day one God clothed Adam and Eve, shed blood first to do this. And Abel and Cain, Abel's sacrifice accepted Cain's not
Abel's sacrifice was blood, Wow And so Christ's is the final sacrifice and the final shedding of blood, where Father now can live in us to teach us right from wrong in agreement not as I must or else I die. I do in agreement and thankfulness to God for having on us all undeserved Mercy. that is just overwhelming to me, knowing what I deserve period.
thank you. just taking the stand and testifyng to our Lord's unfathomable love to all
Matthew 9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

 

[newbirth]

Please, I think we all,want life, what is this preserved group you are so special in? I want to join, I want life since you are in charge to say who has life and who does not?

I am being rhetorical here friend, how can this be, when he went to the cross for all? How can one body of acclaimed believers be better than another?

this guy once bought a box of food he ate the box also because he paid for it too.
but really he calls it his bride the church....

 

[homwardbound]

Acts 16:30ff

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.
33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washedtheir stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.
34 And he brought them up into his house, and set food before them, and rejoiced greatly, with all his house, having believed in God.

I reiterate the point that nowhere ever was the jailer commanded to "believe only"

When the jailer was commanded to believe in verse 31, it was not until verse 32 the jailer was told what to believe > the word of the Lord. It was after he was told what to believe (word of the Lord) that he was baptized. So the jailer in verse 32 was told "the word of the Lord" and the word of the Lord includes baptism, Mk 16:16.



Who is arguing Christ does not save? Christ does save but saves those that obey Him, Heb 5:9.

Works are nothing more than the after effect in one being saved by Faith in Christ, nothing more, and yes proves that one's Faith is real, a tree is always identified by its fruit

Now when you did me good, knowing I can't repay you for that good. With that type of motive,that fruit is identified as pure from God. For that type of action is from God doing it without any expectation in return. If have the expectation it will eventually show up, and the others you helped will see why you helped for a return and they will spew out at you in disgust, thinking you did what you did in love, when you did as the man in Luke 16 did
This is not about you in particular just to be clear. We all know who we are, do we not? I have been guilty and pray not to ever be that again, and so i trust god to keep me aware, wise as a serpent and harmless as a dove. i pray this as wel, for you and all who beleive and all that come to belief here today, thank you Jesus
Luke 16 a good read in unrighteous mammon

 

[homwardbound]

That was about Atwood's assumptions on things he has no knowlege of. And you're right, he should make no such assumptions. But since you brought it up, let me go on to say that when people interlace their scriptures with unprovoked personal attacks, that tells me they are speaking from the flesh and not the Spirit. And since the Spirit and the flesh are at odds with each other, that makes them and their testimony highly suspect.

Well from your view point has Atwood attacked and or I? If so please show me where? And I will repent to you personally. that is the only forgiveness that I see from scripture is left is to not flaunt anything to anothher that is between God and me that you are not at peace in. Romans 14 has set in me this deep fact to us all, anyway please tell me and show me. I have no intention to harm any other that Christ has died for

 

[homwardbound]

IF IF IF one is in this preserved group Christian/Saint they will be preserved. But one can fall away from this preserved group and be come "unpreserved"/lost.



Lk 22 why make supplication that his "faith fail not"? Failing faith is IMPOSSIBLE if ES were true.

God showed us all that in the first Chosen, they could not be perfect ever in and of themselves. now if anyone could, t5hen Christ came in vain to redeem us.
So as Joey would say in "Friends" "how you dong" I am not I am in need 24/7, whether I sin or not

 

[homwardbound]

Truth is presented in parables. And there is no truth to the fact one can live in sin/spend money on harlots and maintain his salvation.

"How you doing"
[h=3]Romans 2[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

2 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. [SUP]2 [/SUP]But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things. [SUP]3 [/SUP]And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

 

[homwardbound]

Jude 1:1 is one verse "Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

Preservation is IN JESUS CHRIST and no individual is unconditionally preserved outside of Christ before the world began by a random choice of God.

Does God desire, want all to be saved? Will God force it? If god did then all would be saved, and no free choice to choose would be in place, and we would just be puppets, Go figure, what is up with this great contrast? No works can't be saved, works one thinks they can and can't proven through out the first Testament, and especially in the second before the cross of Christ in Matthew 19 about the rich man who obeyed all the Law from childhood on and knew he was not perfect, wanted to be and could not give up this world to be perfect. Can any of you?
What a great congruity, be perfect yet can't? Be perfect yet can't
So this verse is either true or false God makes you perfect in trusting God or not?

Colossians 1:22 in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

So either you are made this by belief or you are not?
Maybe time to give up and enter his courts with thanksgiving and praise? Can anyone say Thank you Father and Son, Thank you from the bottom of their heart in appreciation?

 

[RickyZ]

Well from your view point has Atwood attacked and or I? If so please show me where? And I will repent to you personally. that is the only forgiveness that I see from scripture is left is to not flaunt anything to anothher that is between God and me that you are not at peace in. Romans 14 has set in me this deep fact to us all, anyway please tell me and show me. I have no intention to harm any other that Christ has died for

Those comments were aimed at Atwood. You are doing fine my friend, and God bless you for wanting to make peace. Blessed are the peacemakers!

 

[homwardbound]

Atwood, please look closely at John 10:27-29. Christ says my sheep hear my voice and FOLLOW ME. So who are those who He will never cast out? Those that FOLLOW HIM. IT IS CONDITIONAL. Also, it says no one will be able to snatch them out of my Father's hand, but it doesn't say we can't withdraw ourselves and stop following Christ on our own choosing.

Do you work for your salvation? The first chosen did this and pissed God off many times trying to do it on their interpretation and not by Trust to Father no matter what as Abraham did Noah did, and many of the Saints from the First Testament did, as shown Hebrews 11

It is by Faith in god through Son that one is saved by Father through Son, it is done and not of works lest any man boast, Sorry you do not seem to see this. praying God show you and trust if God does not

 

[svedbygrace]

Jude 1:1 is one verse "Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

Preservation is IN JESUS CHRIST and no individual is unconditionally preserved outside of Christ before the world began by a random choice of God.

Jude 1:1 does not say what you said here:

The group Christian/Saint is preserved but not the individual is not unconditionally preserved separate and apart from this group. So if I fall from this preserved GROUP, I will no longer be preserved/saved.

Where is the verse that says that ?

 

[homwardbound]

this guy once bought a box of food he ate the box also because he paid for it too.
but really he calls it his bride the church....

Man will do just about anything to not die and yet die in his sins that he does not believe Christ to have taken away, so he can move on into the new life in Chirst in Spirit and truth. At the resurrected Christ, is what you and others might be missing not seeing the whole cross, only seeing the death, a half sham Gospel, where there is no life only death. And one goes out to be all they can be, hoping for Mercy and never receiving it. Being caught up in trying to be perfect in their own flesh, when no flesh willo please God but Christ's and that is done over and out. Then came the resurrected Christ in Spirit and truth to give us that new life in Spirit and truth by his resurrection, for our new life more abundantly as he said he came to do in John 10:10
John 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

 

[Alligator]

Do you work for your salvation? The first chosen did this and pissed God off many times trying to do it on their interpretation and not by Trust to Father no matter what as Abraham did Noah did, and many of the Saints from the First Testament did, as shown Hebrews 11

It is by Faith in god through Son that one is saved by Father through Son, it is done and not of works lest any man boast, Sorry you do not seem to see this. praying God show you and trust if God does not

all I ever hear from you people is trust in God, trust in God, trust in God, AS IF I DON'T? That's not even the issue. I do for my salvation whatever God asks me to do. You can call it what you want. I know you are familiar with the parable of the talents. This parable shows the danger of doing nothing.

 

[homwardbound]

Those comments were aimed at Atwood. You are doing fine my friend, and God bless you for wanting to make peace. Blessed are the peacemakers!

Thank you and not sure about another, yet for some reason you are offended anhd praying for peace between the two9 of you
The armor of god Brother in Eph 6 is God's Armor, and not mine or Atwoods or anyone else's. I pray we all put it on in appreciation to have a participation in God 's Love to us all, not to fight back at accusations to walk humbly in spite of anyone loesews flesh attitudes for we ahve had them ourselves, have we not? And could be riled up again in an instant yes or no.

So I see this scriptures below as to us all not just to the disciples in that day. And that the courts and synagogues is this world, every where we go in this world as that. To be ready to give an account for your joy in and out of season
[h=3]Matthew 10:16-20[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)


[SUP]16 [/SUP]Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. [SUP]17 [/SUP]But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues; [SUP]18 [/SUP]and ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. [SUP]19 [/SUP]But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. [SUP]20 [/SUP]For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

 

[homwardbound]

all I ever hear from you people is trust in God, trust in God, trust in God, AS IF I DON'T? That's not even the issue. I do for my salvation whatever God asks me to do. You can call it what you want. I know you are familiar with the parable of the talents. This parable shows the danger of doing nothing.

Yes and never said you do not believe and am not fighting you, just sharing with you the difference in stress and rest
Are you familiar with before the cross and after the cross. What is the transition in this before and after
Is before under Law and Christ fulfilling it why?
And in before under Law are we condemned to death, not being able to be perfect to go to heaven?
Read why the disciples asked Christ after they watched that rich man walk away sad who obeyed the law from birth on, who could not give up his worldly possession to be perfect and go there?
The Disciples finally got and were annihilated and ask How then can anyone go to Heaven then read it in Matt 19
Also remember this they had also heard if your hand sins, cut it off, better for part of you to go to heaven than all of you go to hell. This was said about Adultery, just look at another and thus think it, you have sinned, gouge out that eye(s), oh and while you are at it if under the Law cut out thy tongues as well
So now maybe you might see what Christ came to do, fulfill all the Law and Prophets concerning him, to die for you and thus give you new life when you finally move past the death, and agree with and in thankfulness thank God and ask for the new life in Spirit and truth, given at the resurrected Christ
I think by what you just stated here you have and got it just not yet seeing fully
[h=3]Philippians 3:10-11[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[SUP]10 [/SUP]that I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; [SUP]11 [/SUP]if by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

 

[homwardbound]

all I ever hear from you people is trust in God, trust in God, trust in God, AS IF I DON'T? That's not even the issue. I do for my salvation whatever God asks me to do. You can call it what you want. I know you are familiar with the parable of the talents. This parable shows the danger of doing nothing.

If one does not start in repentance, how will he ever come to know it is all God and none of them? And when they do come to the end of the energy of self and waive their white flag to God in "I" give up "I" can't then is when one sees the new life in Spirit and truth and does much more than ever done, this time with a joy, freed from stress and worry, thanking God so deeply they can't help but to express this amazing salvation in all honor to God for it