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Richie see from my angle, it causes me to read and ask in me where God lives to teach me to be wise as a serpent and yet harmless as a dove, even if knowing he is this or that, thanking god to be my axe in god sharp, and turn to God for the answer if needed to be answered or not. Matthew 10:16-20 very enlightening to me, and think this for all that beleive God to trust god for the right words needed, and all it does is draw me closer to trust God deeper, even if my old man gets drawn out. I have the availability to learn from it and trust God deeper. And if I know I sinned against another in my responses. Then I apologize for what?
Not reacting as if l know God as my Savior. For that is what flesh nature does and the enemy wants us to react as if we are the center of attention and God has told us all. As if Jesus said there is another one that comes after me. Him you should listen to "NOT" Now Moises did say this and Christ has come, did and went back home. Leaving us up to beleive or not consciously, and therefore mankind at Judgment will have no excuse period
Now me whenever I am wrong in truth God causes me to stand as this is done in you as well and will be done in svcedbygrace if Savedbygrace is a believer God knoweth, and God I trust:
Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man’s servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
So all in all on that day the goats, will be separated from the sheep, as the analogy given in Matt 25
Can you rest in that, when you can, you can't be enthralled in others accusations, ever
Food fro you to grow deeper
[h=3]Ephesians 3:16-18[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP]that he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man; [SUP]17 [/SUP]that Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, [SUP]18 [/SUP]may be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
For kindness kills and confuses evil to show more evil in confusion over the grace of God to all through Son
Evil cares less what one focuses on, as .long as it is not Christ and Father alone.
Has added much apostasy over the years that sparkles and draws people in and is fools gold not real.
And by standing firm in God's love, Mercy through Son alone. one gets taught truth that sets them free from any and all flesh fighting's.
Galatians 4:29
But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
Nothing Brother is new under the Son (Sun) Ecclesiastes
So stand firm in Col1:21-23 it is done as said in John 19:30 as you already know, so walk in joy of the Lord not in old self, new person you are now in Spirit and truth
Felt the need to tell you, do not know why, just felt it that little still small voice inside all those that believe to help one another in iron sharpens iron
Love to you, God leads
Not reacting as if l know God as my Savior. For that is what flesh nature does and the enemy wants us to react as if we are the center of attention and God has told us all. As if Jesus said there is another one that comes after me. Him you should listen to "NOT" Now Moises did say this and Christ has come, did and went back home. Leaving us up to beleive or not consciously, and therefore mankind at Judgment will have no excuse period
Now me whenever I am wrong in truth God causes me to stand as this is done in you as well and will be done in svcedbygrace if Savedbygrace is a believer God knoweth, and God I trust:
Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man’s servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
So all in all on that day the goats, will be separated from the sheep, as the analogy given in Matt 25
Can you rest in that, when you can, you can't be enthralled in others accusations, ever
Food fro you to grow deeper
[h=3]Ephesians 3:16-18[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP]that he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man; [SUP]17 [/SUP]that Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, [SUP]18 [/SUP]may be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
For kindness kills and confuses evil to show more evil in confusion over the grace of God to all through Son
Evil cares less what one focuses on, as .long as it is not Christ and Father alone.
Has added much apostasy over the years that sparkles and draws people in and is fools gold not real.
And by standing firm in God's love, Mercy through Son alone. one gets taught truth that sets them free from any and all flesh fighting's.
Galatians 4:29
But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
Nothing Brother is new under the Son (Sun) Ecclesiastes
So stand firm in Col1:21-23 it is done as said in John 19:30 as you already know, so walk in joy of the Lord not in old self, new person you are now in Spirit and truth
Felt the need to tell you, do not know why, just felt it that little still small voice inside all those that believe to help one another in iron sharpens iron
Love to you, God leads
Matthew 4:16 the people which sat in darkness saw great light; and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up.
Luke 1:79 to give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.
John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
Luke 1:79 to give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.
John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
I don't see what is the inconvenience of creating evil.
If there is no evil, how could a person do good?
(Matthew 5:46-47)
"For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the pagans so?"
I mean, if all people are created good loving beings, would being good and loving have any sense?
If there is no evil, how could a person do good?
(Matthew 5:46-47)
"For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the pagans so?"
I mean, if all people are created good loving beings, would being good and loving have any sense?
It does, no free will, no choice to beleive or not beleive, and thus if no free will choice then God could not claim love could God?
I mean true love is 1 Cor 13:4-13 is it not and can anyone here in their flesh nature be perfect in this type of Love?
Only in Spirit and truth can one, taking no credit in doing this to themselves, praising and thanking God for this. We can rest and thus as resting we do this type of love to all, you think? Oh wait a minute thus therefore there is no more thinking about this, why
2 Corinthians 10:5 casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
I mean true love is 1 Cor 13:4-13 is it not and can anyone here in their flesh nature be perfect in this type of Love?
Only in Spirit and truth can one, taking no credit in doing this to themselves, praising and thanking God for this. We can rest and thus as resting we do this type of love to all, you think? Oh wait a minute thus therefore there is no more thinking about this, why
2 Corinthians 10:5 casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
It was the lack of fully trusting God in what God says as truth, and the enemy, expected for Adam and Eve to die immediately. Underestimated the love of God in God's Mercy. And Lucifer at war ever since trying to gain God's light back through him as if it is his light to begin with, selfishness in wanting to play God and be God, as what all first born from the womb have in the flesh nature, and need to be born again in Spirit and truth.
Today this truth is provided by our Father through the Son's resurrection in Spirit and truth to us, death was need first to reclaim us back to life forever in Spirit for now. One day in the flesh as well. Right now redeemed in Spirit and truth.
Which today is the way and God is looking for those that:
John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
Today this truth is provided by our Father through the Son's resurrection in Spirit and truth to us, death was need first to reclaim us back to life forever in Spirit for now. One day in the flesh as well. Right now redeemed in Spirit and truth.
Which today is the way and God is looking for those that:
John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
It really matters not does it? This world regardless is what it is, now that is a fact jack. And God in his love and Mercy through Son redeemed all those that decide tro beleive God and strive to know God to enter God's rest will, provided they do not give up.
Now that is the eternal issue at hand above whether God created Evil or God. God is righteous period, and no matter what if God says God created evil or not. god is still righteopus either way.
for the one's that trust God all in all, no doubt. God is the only one good, period. We can't be, but we can be made partakers as Chirst was a partaker in God' righteousness in trust to God no matter what, even unto death
Now that is the eternal issue at hand above whether God created Evil or God. God is righteous period, and no matter what if God says God created evil or not. god is still righteopus either way.
for the one's that trust God all in all, no doubt. God is the only one good, period. We can't be, but we can be made partakers as Chirst was a partaker in God' righteousness in trust to God no matter what, even unto death
dcontroversal , good to hear from you
that started in from the serpent you think? Doubt was created and has been being that ever since, by Doubt we come up short
And Christ got frustrated when he said to his disciples how long, before you see this Faith in my Father, no doubt
I guarantee if Moses did not have the Faith without a doubt the Red Sea would have not parted
God is awesome and does love us all. Today is the day to repent and quit questioning God, and stay trusting God in all things whether good or bad, maybe?
that started in from the serpent you think? Doubt was created and has been being that ever since, by Doubt we come up short
And Christ got frustrated when he said to his disciples how long, before you see this Faith in my Father, no doubt
I guarantee if Moses did not have the Faith without a doubt the Red Sea would have not parted
God is awesome and does love us all. Today is the day to repent and quit questioning God, and stay trusting God in all things whether good or bad, maybe?
Homwardbound: Your thoughts about evil, using scripture as a base are very interesting, but they do not answer the question of who created evil. It is an important question, it answers if God created all things. We are not to decide on the answer to this even based on using other unrelated scripture to reason with. God will tell us directly and plainly. We are to humbly bow before the words of the Lord. If scripture disagrees, we are to search until we find the right answer, because scripture reflects God and is truth. The scriptures that apply have been posted here, that what God created is good, that there was darkness and evil on the first day of creation before God added good, and that God created evil as it says in Isaiah. We must listen to all these scriptures.
I found your O.P. question to be well presented and interesting with a nice start on research.
One consideration I would like to offer is:
When God first creates mankind,He gives them power and authority.
Who's power and what authority did God give mankind? God gave man God's own power and authority on earth to be free to choose!
Man was rampant in the creation of evil and with every evil created with the power given by man from God, the influence of that energy passed from generation to generation, growing stronger with each reinforcement.
It is WE who create evil, often every day, reinforcing the evils of yesteryear's. Oh that we might let the works of our lives give more of our spirit to God then to Satan!
This is just what I know for your consideration in your study, be blessed
One consideration I would like to offer is:
When God first creates mankind,He gives them power and authority.
Who's power and what authority did God give mankind? God gave man God's own power and authority on earth to be free to choose!
Man was rampant in the creation of evil and with every evil created with the power given by man from God, the influence of that energy passed from generation to generation, growing stronger with each reinforcement.
It is WE who create evil, often every day, reinforcing the evils of yesteryear's. Oh that we might let the works of our lives give more of our spirit to God then to Satan!
This is just what I know for your consideration in your study, be blessed
This is from Did God create evil?
At first it might seem that if God created all things, then evil must have been
created by God. However, evil is not a “thing” like a rock or electricity. You
cannot have a jar of evil. Evil has no existence of its own; it is really the
absence of good. For example, holes are real but they only exist in something
else. We call the absence of dirt a hole, but it cannot be separated from the
dirt. So when God created, it is true that all He created was good. One of the
good things God made was creatures who had the freedom to choose good. In order
to have a real choice, God had to allow there to be something besides good to
choose. So, God allowed these free angels and humans to choose good or reject
good (evil). When a bad relationship exists between two good things we call that
evil, but it does not become a “thing” that required God to create
it.
Perhaps a further illustration will help. If a person is asked, “Does
cold exist?” the answer would likely be “yes.” However, this is incorrect. Cold
does not exist. Cold is the absence of heat. Similarly, darkness does not exist;
it is the absence of light. Evil is the absence of good, or better, evil is the
absence of God. God did not have to create evil, but rather only allow for the
absence of good.
God did not create evil, but He does allow evil. If God
had not allowed for the possibility of evil, both mankind and angels would be
serving God out of obligation, not choice. He did not want “robots” that simply
did what He wanted them to do because of their “programming.” God allowed for
the possibility of evil so that we could genuinely have a free will and choose
whether or not we wanted to serve Him.
As finite human beings, we can
never fully understand an infinite God (Romans 11:33-34). Sometimes we think we
understand why God is doing something, only to find out later that it was for a
different purpose than we originally thought. God looks at things from a holy,
eternal perspective. We look at things from a sinful, earthly, and temporal
perspective. Why did God put man on earth knowing that Adam and Eve would sin
and therefore bring evil, death, and suffering on all mankind? Why didn’t He
just create us all and leave us in heaven where we would be perfect and without
suffering? These questions cannot be adequately answered this side of eternity.
What we can know is whatever God does is holy and perfect and ultimately will
glorify Him. God allowed for the possibility of evil in order to give us a true
choice in regards to whether we worship Him. God did not create evil, but He
allowed it. If He had not allowed evil, we would be worshipping Him out of
obligation, not by a choice of our own will.
*
This goes back to my original drive-by posting - That God creates evil in the sense that it only exists in His absence.
created by God. However, evil is not a “thing” like a rock or electricity. You
cannot have a jar of evil. Evil has no existence of its own; it is really the
absence of good. For example, holes are real but they only exist in something
else. We call the absence of dirt a hole, but it cannot be separated from the
dirt. So when God created, it is true that all He created was good. One of the
good things God made was creatures who had the freedom to choose good. In order
to have a real choice, God had to allow there to be something besides good to
choose. So, God allowed these free angels and humans to choose good or reject
good (evil). When a bad relationship exists between two good things we call that
evil, but it does not become a “thing” that required God to create
it.
Perhaps a further illustration will help. If a person is asked, “Does
cold exist?” the answer would likely be “yes.” However, this is incorrect. Cold
does not exist. Cold is the absence of heat. Similarly, darkness does not exist;
it is the absence of light. Evil is the absence of good, or better, evil is the
absence of God. God did not have to create evil, but rather only allow for the
absence of good.
God did not create evil, but He does allow evil. If God
had not allowed for the possibility of evil, both mankind and angels would be
serving God out of obligation, not choice. He did not want “robots” that simply
did what He wanted them to do because of their “programming.” God allowed for
the possibility of evil so that we could genuinely have a free will and choose
whether or not we wanted to serve Him.
As finite human beings, we can
never fully understand an infinite God (Romans 11:33-34). Sometimes we think we
understand why God is doing something, only to find out later that it was for a
different purpose than we originally thought. God looks at things from a holy,
eternal perspective. We look at things from a sinful, earthly, and temporal
perspective. Why did God put man on earth knowing that Adam and Eve would sin
and therefore bring evil, death, and suffering on all mankind? Why didn’t He
just create us all and leave us in heaven where we would be perfect and without
suffering? These questions cannot be adequately answered this side of eternity.
What we can know is whatever God does is holy and perfect and ultimately will
glorify Him. God allowed for the possibility of evil in order to give us a true
choice in regards to whether we worship Him. God did not create evil, but He
allowed it. If He had not allowed evil, we would be worshipping Him out of
obligation, not by a choice of our own will.
*
This goes back to my original drive-by posting - That God creates evil in the sense that it only exists in His absence.
Last edited:
Your reasoning does not stand up to scripture. Even the very first verses of Genesis disproves it, for on that day God created what in Hebrew is "owr", transcribed light. It wasn't until the fourth day God created what gave off light, this light was spiritual only. This light was added to the darkness that was already there. Scripture tells us that God is spirit, so God creates spiritual things as well as physical. The word "owr" means the goodness of God.
Also, if we say that evil is only the absence of good, then we are ignoring scripture that says God created evil. The only way that could be would be a mistranslation of the original verse.
Also, if we say that evil is only the absence of good, then we are ignoring scripture that says God created evil. The only way that could be would be a mistranslation of the original verse.
Thank you, listening and hearing and only wanting to be led by God not man, yet hear all, and give all to God to straighten it out as God sees fit to do.
what i see is, Lucifer as he was. Was wanting to be God, and God saw this. God's light was shinning through Lucifer amazingly. And Lucifer was gaining knowledge from God about all things there in Heaven daily asking and daily receiving answers from God the creator of all. Satan gained much knowledge, not wisdom, knowledge that he used against God in not telling those angels the truth in where he got the answers that he used to convince those angels he is God, when he is not.
So God is God's infinite wisdom, came down here and made earth, and mankind he put in it and called it good, and excited took Lucifer on a trip and showed him mankind God had made, all excited in this, God's light that shined through Lucifer now no more shined as bright as it had before mankind was made by God
And the angels saw this, and asked Lucifer about this. Lucifer afraid to lose his stance as God; took upon himself to destroy mankind. For Lucifer heard God tell Adam there is only one tree to not eat from, and if do you will die.
So Lucifer perceived he could get that full bright light back and keep those angels convinced and gain more in the thought of all I got to do is get Adam to eat, and then they will live no more.
So Satan in the form of the serpent managed to deceive Eve unto Adam and they both ate and ran and hid.
Now Lucifer, Satan was expecting death to them as is what God said would be, knowing God does not lie.
And to Lucifer's surprise, death to this flesh did not occur yet, but would still come, but God put Mercy in place and clothed them, protecting them in the blood of that sacrifice from Satan killing them at this point in life.
Now Satan is really mad, what does Satan do next?
Causes Cain to kill Abel why?
Genesis 3:15, Satan heard there was a redeemer coming, and Satan set out to stop this, in Satan's Knowledge to use that he got from God, is out to steal, kill and destroy, and be God
So now do you see why God says; to walk by trust in God, and does not hand out knowledge as did, to be used against him.
Why wisdom is Faith to trust God and not abuse God? Or go after God in the tower of Babel days and God separated them. Was it not Nimrod who led building this tower to climb up there and wanted to kill God.
Was not the battle with the Egyptians and God actually between Satan and God? God Sister is sovereign.
You see by the time our redeemer came to this earth Jesus Christ, Satan was very confused in whom the savior is and where he was coming from and knew him not. Always on the look out to stop this Savior.
So convinced in his knowledge and encouraged the death of Christ to stop God's kingdom from being here on fallen earth mankind. Only to Satan's demise. Christ is RISEN, and took the keys from the Devil to Heaven and hell. Christ preached to the captives in prison, for their sins and released all those who believed Christ as who Christ is and what he just did, at the cross for them, making them perfect in Father's sight to be set free.
And so Christ took captivity captive, and the Devil is judged, stripped naked, is defeated, and God has won,
Leaving one thing left for us to beleive or not believe, since when we are first born, we are born of the flesh and need new life in Spirit and truth, and that is given to us by the resurrected Christ after we see we are made perfect by Christ's death, we thus are presented to Father as perfect to get new life from Father in Spirit and truth, and thus walk as Christ walked in total dependency on Father to be led to do from Father as Christ did, while here on earth to show us how to walk, and it was and is by Faith in Father alone.
So i know you beleive Sister, but how deep is that belief, are you still depending on God by what you do or not do? or are you depending on Gos by Son's perfectly finished work for you to see the new life, Father freely has given you and is bringing you up to see the finality of the cross of Son?
Your free choice and just love you, it is all I know anymore, the unfathomable loive of God that when i walked in flesh I could never grasp, trying to though over and over, until I gave up and God said to me in that little still voice, THANK YOU. Now I (God) can do it for you, through you as my Son Jesus did. Life changed and has been ever since changing in the truth of God just love you and all people period. The sooner one gets this, the deeper one loves back in response to all
what i see is, Lucifer as he was. Was wanting to be God, and God saw this. God's light was shinning through Lucifer amazingly. And Lucifer was gaining knowledge from God about all things there in Heaven daily asking and daily receiving answers from God the creator of all. Satan gained much knowledge, not wisdom, knowledge that he used against God in not telling those angels the truth in where he got the answers that he used to convince those angels he is God, when he is not.
So God is God's infinite wisdom, came down here and made earth, and mankind he put in it and called it good, and excited took Lucifer on a trip and showed him mankind God had made, all excited in this, God's light that shined through Lucifer now no more shined as bright as it had before mankind was made by God
And the angels saw this, and asked Lucifer about this. Lucifer afraid to lose his stance as God; took upon himself to destroy mankind. For Lucifer heard God tell Adam there is only one tree to not eat from, and if do you will die.
So Lucifer perceived he could get that full bright light back and keep those angels convinced and gain more in the thought of all I got to do is get Adam to eat, and then they will live no more.
So Satan in the form of the serpent managed to deceive Eve unto Adam and they both ate and ran and hid.
Now Lucifer, Satan was expecting death to them as is what God said would be, knowing God does not lie.
And to Lucifer's surprise, death to this flesh did not occur yet, but would still come, but God put Mercy in place and clothed them, protecting them in the blood of that sacrifice from Satan killing them at this point in life.
Now Satan is really mad, what does Satan do next?
Causes Cain to kill Abel why?
Genesis 3:15, Satan heard there was a redeemer coming, and Satan set out to stop this, in Satan's Knowledge to use that he got from God, is out to steal, kill and destroy, and be God
So now do you see why God says; to walk by trust in God, and does not hand out knowledge as did, to be used against him.
Why wisdom is Faith to trust God and not abuse God? Or go after God in the tower of Babel days and God separated them. Was it not Nimrod who led building this tower to climb up there and wanted to kill God.
Was not the battle with the Egyptians and God actually between Satan and God? God Sister is sovereign.
You see by the time our redeemer came to this earth Jesus Christ, Satan was very confused in whom the savior is and where he was coming from and knew him not. Always on the look out to stop this Savior.
So convinced in his knowledge and encouraged the death of Christ to stop God's kingdom from being here on fallen earth mankind. Only to Satan's demise. Christ is RISEN, and took the keys from the Devil to Heaven and hell. Christ preached to the captives in prison, for their sins and released all those who believed Christ as who Christ is and what he just did, at the cross for them, making them perfect in Father's sight to be set free.
And so Christ took captivity captive, and the Devil is judged, stripped naked, is defeated, and God has won,
Leaving one thing left for us to beleive or not believe, since when we are first born, we are born of the flesh and need new life in Spirit and truth, and that is given to us by the resurrected Christ after we see we are made perfect by Christ's death, we thus are presented to Father as perfect to get new life from Father in Spirit and truth, and thus walk as Christ walked in total dependency on Father to be led to do from Father as Christ did, while here on earth to show us how to walk, and it was and is by Faith in Father alone.
So i know you beleive Sister, but how deep is that belief, are you still depending on God by what you do or not do? or are you depending on Gos by Son's perfectly finished work for you to see the new life, Father freely has given you and is bringing you up to see the finality of the cross of Son?
Your free choice and just love you, it is all I know anymore, the unfathomable loive of God that when i walked in flesh I could never grasp, trying to though over and over, until I gave up and God said to me in that little still voice, THANK YOU. Now I (God) can do it for you, through you as my Son Jesus did. Life changed and has been ever since changing in the truth of God just love you and all people period. The sooner one gets this, the deeper one loves back in response to all
Whether God created the evil that is here or there or did not. No matter evil is here and the light (God) overtakes the darkness (evil). The absence of light leaves darkness, turn on the light and the darkness is overcome
The light is Christ as he told the First Chosen he is the light
The light that kept there lamp lit when they had run out of oil to keep it lit and without the earthly oil it stayed lit, and they refused to beleive.
The light is Christ as he told the First Chosen he is the light
The light that kept there lamp lit when they had run out of oil to keep it lit and without the earthly oil it stayed lit, and they refused to beleive.